I'm thinking of expanding my care to include one full time child. I interviewed a family recently with a 6 month old baby. They seem like a great family, had no problems with any of my policies, and (shocker!) didn't try to get me to lower my rate or expand my hours.

I did have one red flag moment, though, when they told me that the baby "cat naps" for 20 minutes or so at a time throughout the day rather than taking a lengthier morning and afternoon nap. Those of you who care for infants - do you ever run into this problem? Are you able to teach them to nap for a longer period of time? I'm not saying that I expect the baby to sleep all day, but I can't have any sort of schedule if I'm constantly waiting for naps to start/end.

I'm wondering if this one thing is enough for me to turn this family away, if I should try it out and see how it goes, or if I should just grin and bear it.

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I say give it a shot. We've been able to turn cat nappers (including our own!) into great sleepers!!

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Those of you who care for infants - do you ever run into this problem? I can't remember the last baby I got where the parents didn't say the baby catnaped. I hear it on every baby pretty much. The 20 minutes is almost universal too. I think it has something to do with the sleep cycle and how they get to light sleep at about the 20 minute mark. If the baby knows he can get an adult to come in and pick them up this is the time when they are the most alert in the cycle to get themselves awake and want the adult.

Are you able to teach them to nap for a longer period of time? Absolutely. Haven't failed once in 17 years of day care. It's pretty easy to do. Whatever schedule you want them on.. put them on that schedule and they will switch.

Babies who have a catnap history are pretty disorganized babies when you get them especially if they are getting close to a year old. Six months is not too bad to do the switch. You will see a lot of frentic behavior in the baby. Because they are only sleeping a bit at a time they don't get DEEP restorative sleep. This affects their peronality and happiness.

Once you get the baby on full morning and afternoon napst they change SO much. You can really tell the difference while they are awake and the sleep pattern.

My policy is NO CAT NAPPING. I put them on our schedule on day one. Babies take a morning nap of 1.5 hours and a p.m. nap of 2.5 hours. The inbetween times are FULL of activity and NO napping.

You will get a few days of crying in the begining but as long as you stick to the schedule and do NOT take the baby out of the bed during nap (unless he poops and needs a change) then you will see it takes about three days before he starts going to 45 min naps... then toward Friday he will be doing the hour and a half. Monday you will have to start over but by the end of the second week he will be sleeping like a baby.

YMMV with newborns. They have to be fed so often that it takes a bit longer to get them onto a schedule.

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Fantastic advice, Nannyde, thank you so much! You've made me feel a bit better.

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I argree with all nannyde said. If baby fusses, I check in frequently to let baby know I am there, rub baby's back to relax them, etc. but I don't pick up baby. I also have soothing music playing to drown out the other kids noise. It helps a lot since most parents keep the house deadly quiet with new babies!

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I do the checks but I don't do the back rubs or soothing music. I don't try to keep the other kids quiet. I don't try to do anything to lull the kid to sleep. Just put them to bed WIDE awake in a pitch black dark room on the same schedule from day one. No swaddling, no blankets, no binkies, no loveys. Just the kid in the bed.

When I go into check I do: no touch, no talk, no eye contact. Just a well being check but no interaction.

Takes a few days to get them into the groove but it buys them a babyhood of good solid DEEP sleep. The rested baby is a happy baby.

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So with infants at not quite 4 mo. how do you get them to adjust? Same way or not quite this young? Also do you put all your infants in the same room? I have one right now that will be 4 months in a few days and will be starting another one that will almost 8 months in a few weeks, so I think their sleeping may be a little different so was curious how you would schedule those ages? thanks

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I did what nanny is suggesting with my own children and my dcbaby who is now 8months old. This is including the no interaction checks. It works.

Great advice Nan!

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Yeah that is great advice. I've been told this also and have never stuck to what the parent's say. Infants always take a morning & afternoon nap, the morning nap being a little shorter than the afternoon one but never less than 1 hr.

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I've done pretty well with the new baby which is almost 4 mo. but seems like in between her 2 long naps she gets fussy and tired and I let her fuss (which I've gotten better at) and she will sometimes fall asleep in the swing for maybe 30 min or so.

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I don't allow any sleeping in swings. If they fall asleep in a swing they will be immediately put on their back in bed. I don't want kids associating motion with sleep.

I don't use swings very much but when I do they are WIDE awake.

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No blanket answer for that. For me a lot depends on the size of the baby. The little scrawny ones need to eat a lot more often so YMMV at four months. The bigger eaters do fine on the schedule by four months. I just make sure they are fed on a schedule so they eat, burp, sit UP for about a half hour or so and have time to poop before nap.

I put them to bed wide awake flat on their backs.

Eight months... if there are no medical problems .. yes on a schedule and on the same schedule as everybody and their brother.

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Thanks that helps, I definetly have gotten better since all the other infants, I am the pick up if they are fussy and hold if that makes them happy, rock them to sleep, but figured out with the last 2 infants which I did not do that with that I can't do that anymore, I paved some horrible paths for myself in the past, it made my day a nightmare and so stressful at times.
Oh what does YMMV mean sorry don't know the shortcuts to some stuff

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your mileage may vary

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So you let the babies cry it out, just without the reassurances a la Ferber? I sure hope the parents know about this...I'd be PISSED if my provider let my child cry in a strange dark room just for the provider's own convenience. It is possible to get an infant (or child) on to a set schedule, AKA "a well rested, happy baby," without torturing them with loneliness and fear.

Just the humble opinion of a mother and child care provider.

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"So you let the babies cry it out, just without the reassurances a la Ferber? I sure hope the parents know about this...I'd be PISSED if my provider let my child cry in a strange dark room just for the provider's own convenience. It is possible to get an infant (or child) on to a set schedule, AKA "a well rested, happy baby," without torturing them with loneliness and fear.

Just the humble opinion of a mother and child care provider. "

I was wondering that too. I stumbled across these boards since I'm looking for care for my DD when I go back to work in a month. She will be 3 months old by then. Now, at 2 months, she is not on a totally set schedule and it scares me that a provider may just leave her to scream in an unfamiliar place for their convenience. I am working at getting her on a better schedule so the transition will be easier, but posts like that really make me wish that financially I could stay home with her.

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Nan is totally right on! Babies are usually pretty easy to work with when it comes to sleep training. I've had infants who start here and the parents will tell me that the baby "catnaps" and doesn't take long naps. Every one of the infants has gotten onto a sleep schedule and somehow the long afternoon nap works out to be the same time that all of the other kids are napping. Just be consistent with the baby and you'll see that it doesn't usually take much time at all to get the baby sleeping on a schedule

Also, babies that have regular sleep schedules and not catnaps tend to be more cheerful and happy babies. Just my observation!

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I am pretty sure that Nan is totally clear with the parents on what her sleep policies are and if they don't have a problem with it, then what's the big deal? It's dang hard to get everyone settled in for nap time if you are constantly rocking and soothing a baby who is old enough to self sooth. Kids know when a provider is preoccupied with another child and you better believe that they will try to get away with stuff when the provider is trying to calm a baby and get the baby to sleep. Getting children on sleep schedules can really be a good thing for everyone. The babies who learn to get themselves to sleep are usually much happier for it. An 8 month old baby should not need to be rocked to sleep or held while they sleep or anything remotely like that unless there is some sort of medical problem that makes that neccessary.

None of us feel great when we hear a sleepy baby crying because baby is fighting sleep, but we are only making it harder if we get them used to being rocked to sleep or fed to sleep or anything else like that. It's not just for a provider's convenience that a baby may cry for a few minutes before falling asleep. It is for the baby as well. It's for the parents, too, because this may help them to get better quality of sleep from their babies because they'll know that the baby can self sooth. It's for the other dck's because most babies are pretty easily sleep trained, and the crying will last for shorter and shorter time periods and that will make nap time much more calm and peaceful. I admit that it is for the provider as well, because it gives the provider some down time as well.

For the 2nd anonymous poster, if you are concerned about your child's provider letting your child cry it out, then I would suggest talkking to her and finding out how your baby goes to sleep. If you aren't comfortable with how she gets your baby to sleep, then you can decide from there on how you'd like to handle things.

Letting a child cry it out a little (not for a super long time or anything like that!) isn't going to harm the baby. As long as the provider is making sure that the baby is fed, and has a clean diaper and isn't sick, I really feel like letting a baby learn to self sooth is really beneficial. I wish that I would have let my daughter cry it out as an infant, but I went to get her every time she made a peep and as a result, she was a terrible sleeper and never slept through the night (she did 2 times from the day she was born until she turned 6 years old. Not even exaggerating.) She is still a lousy sleeper and she's 14 years old.

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How do you "let" a child cry? What do you mean by that?

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2 month olds need to eat during naptime usually so they would not be on the same "schedule" as the older babies and toddlers. You usually have a feeding cycle to do (feed, burp, sit up for a while) during nap if your nap is 2.5 hours or so. It takes a few months to get them to sleep thru nap but the key is to move the last feeding before nap to be as close to nap as you can do the cycle and then allow time before the kids get up to do the next cycle. Soon enough the time in between the feeding cycle increases and VOILA you have a full napper like the other kids.

I've had a few that slep thru nap from the go but most do not.

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