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  #1  
Old 08-16-2013, 06:39 AM
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Default Does Anyone Have Preschoolers With Sequencing Issues?

Nearly 3yo DCG needs constant reminders of the next step in our daily routine. She has been with me over 2 years and we are pretty well written in stone how we do things. She has begun to use the toilet but I can't just say "go pee" to her or I would find her in the bathroom standing in front of the toilet.

Today I told her "pull down your pants, sit down and pee" and I walked away to greet another child. I went back to check and she was standing there with her pants down. I then said "sit down and pee" and found her still sitting, and had to do step by step for "pull up your pants, flush the toilet, turn on the water, wash your hands, turn off the water, dry your hands, return to the playroom"

I have photo cues at each station and all the other children just do their thing but she doesn't.

I know toileting is new to her but she is the same with every daily routine. One step at a time and doesn't move on to next step without direct instruction to do so.

She can't handle "get ready to go outside" she needs to be told "get your shoes, get your hat" etc.
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:44 AM
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I have a 3 yr old (June) like that. In my little one's case, it is due to the parent being an EXTREME helicopter parent and not allowing the child to do anything for themselves.

The second the child appears to be pausing or thinking, mom swoops in and assists...

I think the child has simply given up and lost the skills to take cues from peers and predict or recall what happens next....pretty sure they have never HAD to since mom is always right there hovering.....
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:51 AM
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I have a 3 yr old (June) like that. In my little one's case, it is due to the parent being an EXTREME helicopter parent and not allowing the child to do anything for themselves.

The second the child appears to be pausing or thinking, mom swoops in and assists...

I think the child has simply given up and lost the skills to take cues from peers and predict or recall what happens next....pretty sure they have never HAD to since mom is always right there hovering.....
Funny you say that. I actually cut the mom off the other day when she started to answer for the kid when I asked her something. I felt rude but I felt like " I fully expect you at 35 to know the answer- let your 3 year old tell me"
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:00 AM
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Funny you say that. I actually cut the mom off the other day when she started to answer for the kid when I asked her something. I felt rude but I felt like " I fully expect you at 35 to know the answer- let your 3 year old tell me"
I honestly would probably not have come to that conclusion myself if I hadn't had this child since age 12 months. But I have slowly watched the process happen over the last 2 years and have paid attention to what happens when mom and child are here at the same time....

The second the child pauses or shows any kind of hesitation the mom is literally right there... my older daycare kids notice it too.

Somewhere around 2.5 I noticed the child starting to just stop in the middle of something and just sit. Not ask for help, not try, no do anything but just sit (I think they were waiting for mom to swoop in).

Once I waited and waited to see how long the child would sit and do nothing and I have to say, I was floored because they waited for a long time...never once trying or asking myself or peers for help.

I've talked with mom about it and although she recognizes how this behavior is delaying her child, she says she just can't stop. She said she doesn't know what is and isn't appropriate to help or assist.

I've given her TONS of ideas, support and education about it and although she tries for a while, she ends up giving in and going back to her old ways after a day or two.

I just don't have the energy or time to continue supporting/assisting her when she won't even meet me half way.

Is your DCK an only or a first born?
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:08 AM
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A planned only- no desire for more. I think mom is a bit new age parenting when it suits and not at other points. (She also did the bare butt toilet training thing) and fought me when I said diapers or pull-ups until 2 weeks dry. She wanted me to let her be here naked except for light pj bottoms.
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:14 AM
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Yes, I have had a few of these. One is 5 and still struggles with 1 and two step directions...he has obvious delays in cognitive processing and speech (mom doesn't care). One is 4.5 and just careless sometimes--i think his is a stage. I had to walk him through washing his hands yesterday. I forgot to tell him to dry them so he didn't. ::facepalm::

And one I had awhile ago that I think was a product of the helicopter parenting, coupled with extreme anxiety and sensitivity in a family where neither was recognized or respected.

One of the hardest things about this job is watching parents make mistakes
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:43 AM
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Yes, I have had a few of these. One is 5 and still struggles with 1 and two step directions...he has obvious delays in cognitive processing and speech (mom doesn't care). One is 4.5 and just careless sometimes--i think his is a stage. I had to walk him through washing his hands yesterday. I forgot to tell him to dry them so he didn't. ::facepalm::

And one I had awhile ago that I think was a product of the helicopter parenting, coupled with extreme anxiety and sensitivity in a family where neither was recognized or respected.

One of the hardest things about this job is watching parents make mistakes
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:23 AM
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My children with Asperger's need this type of guidance, until something becomes totally routine. Often 15-20 times of going through the whole routine.
Then change something, and watch the meltdown!!!

Could there be developmental delays?
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  #9  
Old 08-16-2013, 11:58 AM
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There are definite delays but according to mom only here. At home she is a MENSA candidate. She is due to start school in 2014 and I have told mom that the time it takes her to master basic skills concerns me since we only have one school year to work on them. Her solution was to send her in rubber boots ;(she can't put her own shoes on.) I told her it is nice summer weather and she needs to be wearing runners so she can pay properly at the park and I was told she refuses to wear anything but her boots but she will send the shoes in her bag.
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Old 08-16-2013, 12:00 PM
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Make a picture chart of your routine then go over it when it is time to switch to a new activity. Same with toileting and hand washing make a picture chart of the steps even use their pictures The do this in preschool special needs classes and it works wonders.
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Old 08-16-2013, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelsj View Post
My children with Asperger's need this type of guidance, until something becomes totally routine. Often 15-20 times of going through the whole routine.
Then change something, and watch the meltdown!!!

Could there be developmental delays?
That's what I was thinking.
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  #12  
Old 08-16-2013, 12:09 PM
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I have sequence photos at my stations. I actually have very little interest in caring for children with significant delays of basic skills that are routine based. I'd be more open if mom accepted my suggestion she see someone but I don't feel like starting from scratch everyday.
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Old 08-16-2013, 02:48 PM
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I have sequence photos at my stations. I actually have very little interest in caring for children with significant delays of basic skills that are routine based. I'd be more open if mom accepted my suggestion she see someone but I don't feel like starting from scratch everyday.
Question... What if its a small sequence. Or a small set of directions. For example, "Sally, please bring me your cup and go sit in the living room". Would she do that??

Another question.... Not counting sequencing, does she follow ANY basic commands??

Does she communicate with you at all? Answer questions you ask her? What if you asked her favorite color would she answer?
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Old 08-16-2013, 03:01 PM
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I have not read all of your responses, but my asst and I were just talking about this. The vast majority of my DCKs are 3 years old.

I think what the issue is that their vocab improves a lot from age 2-3, but their ability to process does not always grow as fast. ALL 6 of my 3 year olds are this way. It drives my asst nuts. It makes me laugh.

I tell her to just keep patient. They will get it and keep trying to get them to do the thinking instead of you doing it for them. Get those little minds started up and running. SOme kids take longer than others.

I have one dck that is SUPER smart, but he can not follow simple directions. WHen he does finally figure out how to follow the directions he takes FOREVER......I just sit and smile and wait wait wait wait...
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:13 PM
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All 5 of my kids are the same age (up to half a year younger), she has been here the longest and our routine is very fixed so I know it is kid particular.

If I say "tidy up and come to the kitchen for lunch" she tidies up and then stands there while every other kid comes running into the kitchen. I have to go get her.

If I say tidy up and then get your shoes to go outside she tidies and then stands there.

If she puts one shoe on she says "I did it!" and will continue repeating that until I acknowledge her and say "good job now put on your other shoe"

She'll put on the other shoe and repeat "I did it" until I say "great now go get your hat"
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:20 PM
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All 5 of my kids are the same age (up to half a year younger), she has been here the longest and our routine is very fixed so I know it is kid particular.

If I say "tidy up and come to the kitchen for lunch" she tidies up and then stands there while every other kid comes running into the kitchen. I have to go get her.

If I say tidy up and then get your shoes to go outside she tidies and then stands there.

If she puts one shoe on she says "I did it!" and will continue repeating that until I acknowledge her and say "good job now put on your other shoe"

She'll put on the other shoe and repeat "I did it" until I say "great now go get your hat"
is english her first language??
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by canadiancare View Post
All 5 of my kids are the same age (up to half a year younger), she has been here the longest and our routine is very fixed so I know it is kid particular.

If I say "tidy up and come to the kitchen for lunch" she tidies up and then stands there while every other kid comes running into the kitchen. I have to go get her.

If I say tidy up and then get your shoes to go outside she tidies and then stands there.

If she puts one shoe on she says "I did it!" and will continue repeating that until I acknowledge her and say "good job now put on your other shoe"

She'll put on the other shoe and repeat "I did it" until I say "great now go get your hat"
Ok so what I'm getting is that she only completes part one of any instructional pattern. And she should be able to handle more than step one. Gotcha. Well if mom isn't on board for an evaluation I'd say there isn't much yu can do.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:25 PM
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is english her first language??
yes it is

I live in white bread suburbia- all my kids are anglophones with professional, educated parents there are no cultural or economic factors that should affect development.
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Old 08-16-2013, 07:13 PM
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I just wanted to chime in.
I've seen this behavior from kids over the years too and have experienced 2 situations as to the reasons I've seen it happen. One is like BC said, extreme helicopter parenting and the other I've seen is with a child who is very timid and the parents are way too strict with discipline for this child's temperament. Does that make sense? The parents spank and harshly discipline this timid child and she's terrified to give a "wrong" answer or response to anything. It's so sad to watch.
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Old 08-16-2013, 08:11 PM
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I had this kid, but she was 5 instead of 3.

During art, I'd ask what color paper everyone wanted to use. She'd watch all the other kids choose their paper and just sit there. I'd have to prompt her. Get scissors - same scenario. Cut, ask for glue, put your work away, clean up...she would just sit there, and if I refused acknowledge her sitting there, she'd cry. Repeat with every other activity throughout the day.

There were no delays...it was a combo of princess complex and babying parents. I had to get tough with her - you don't finish your work, you miss some of outside time til you do. You don't put on your shoes, you go outside in your socks. You don't go potty by yourself, you might have an accident.

Your girl is younger and you said she has some delays...I don't know if that's appropriate for her. I'd always ask my girl "what are you supposed to be doing now" and she'd tell me exactly - while she sat there. Can your girl do that?
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Old 08-17-2013, 03:46 AM
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No she repeats the question back at me or stays silent and stares at me. I do report cards at the end of June which are basically developmental checklists and red flags. I'm on vacation this week so I will send mom some step by steps to work on for expectations. I won't know if she is really doing it but if she is and there is no improvement maybe she'll see it.
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Old 08-18-2013, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Hunni Bee View Post
I had this kid, but she was 5 instead of 3.

During art, I'd ask what color paper everyone wanted to use. She'd watch all the other kids choose their paper and just sit there. I'd have to prompt her. Get scissors - same scenario. Cut, ask for glue, put your work away, clean up...she would just sit there, and if I refused acknowledge her sitting there, she'd cry. Repeat with every other activity throughout the day.

There were no delays...it was a combo of princess complex and babying parents. I had to get tough with her - you don't finish your work, you miss some of outside time til you do. You don't put on your shoes, you go outside in your socks. You don't go potty by yourself, you might have an accident.

Your girl is younger and you said she has some delays...I don't know if that's appropriate for her. I'd always ask my girl "what are you supposed to be doing now" and she'd tell me exactly - while she sat there. Can your girl do that?
I had the same kid in my kindergarten class one year -- and I agree, I finally just told her it was her choice to sit and do nothing, and we would be moving on without her - but she'd miss something she liked while finished what needed to be done. I agree, as well, that it could easily be language processing, or simply a function of child+parenting. Honestly, if she just stood in the bathroom, I'd leave her there. ANd if she tried to come out of the bathroom I'd say, have you gone to the bathroom yet? You need to go to the bathroom before you leave. Or, have you washed your hands yet? You have to wash hands before you leave.
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