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12-15-2015 09:48 AM
Josiegirl Most winters I clear it before opening, then try to bring the dcks into the driveway with me if there is an accumulation during the day. It's a big hassle but I don't want anyone getting stuck in my driveway or falling on ice. I keep the front walk cleared as well as I can, it only takes a minute.

BUT it looks like it'll be a brown Christmas and someone told me yesterday January looks like it's going to be in the 30-40's. Up here in ski country...imagine.

I think out of the 30+ years I've been doing daycare I had 1 dcp who might have shoveled my front walk a couple times. And that includes dcds coming to pick up with plows on the trucks.
12-15-2015 04:33 AM
Play Care Oh, and I want to be very clear about what I am referring to - I am not talking about waiving liabilty if someone is hurt on my property for medical bill. If someone falls and breaks their leg on my property I know I am liable. My liability insurance would cover the costs of their medical bills. I am not referring to that.

I am specifically speaking of being sued for additional damages. Again, waivers aren't bullet proof and any sign of negligence may make them void. In my example of driving the kids, if, heaven forbid, we were hit by a drunk driver, and a child was injured, it might be my insurance that pays out for medical, etc. (maybe the other drivers insurance) but again, I'm specifically speaking to be sued by parents after the fact. My waiver would show that they acknowledge their child would be riding in my car, and had their persmission to do so. Again, if I was negligent (kids not in car seats, or in inappropriate seats) the waiver wouldn't help me. In any case I would rather have it than not.
12-15-2015 03:18 AM
Play Care
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
Do what you want, but when you lose your property you'll know why. Certain things you can't waive away. Like I knew someone who had a sign about their dog. I forgot the wording, but it basically said keep off of their property because the dog will attack you. Someone went on their property and got attacked. The got a cash settlement and the dog was put down. There's a lot of things you can't waive away. (I know that isn't a waiver, but you get the jist.) A judge isn't going to the same logic you do. The judge (if ruling against you) would say you should have hired a service or close for the day if you're not able to clear the space. You can't, and the parents, waive the rights of a minor. Let's say the waiver prevents and injured parent from suing you for their injuries, they can sue for their child(ren)'s injuries. I'm not trying to argue, but this is really a serious matter.
Actually I've received my advice from a lawyer, not the Internet court
There is a difference between a "beware of dog" sign, which is acknowledging you have a dangerous animal on your property, and a waiver. The sign doesn't allow for consent of the other party. It's simply a warning.
There's a reason schools, day cares, etc have waivers. They are not as meaningless as some believe. They won't protect you if you are negligent (i.e.: driving drunk with day care kids in the car) but if you are driving day care kids (with parents written permission and waiver) and are hit by a drunk driver, it offers some protection. Parents can't come back and say "but I didn't know!" Or "she didn't have permission!" That's the exact example I was given by a lawyer.
There are times storms happen during the day care day and I can't safely get out to clear. Legally I can't leave kids inside and be out, so shoveling during nap can't happen. In addition I do contract with a plowing service but he has other clients and isn't always here first. In those cases a waiver would be beneficial. I'm showing that I am making a REASONABLE effort to keep my pathways clear. I do agree that if it's days after a storm (IIRC, it's a 24 hour rule - giving one full day to clear walkways), or I know before opening I can't get cleared I would close because then it would be negligence and the waiver doesn't protect against negligent behavior.
A real life example would be something that happened last year. Forecast was for rain. However during the day, after the children had arrived, it started sleeting, making my driveway a sheet of ice. I did toss some salt out the door but it was not safe for me or the children to be outside. Roads became treacherous, etc. I notified the parents that my driveway conditions were not safe and that while I had the plow company coming to sand the driveway I did not know when he could safely get here to do it. In addition to those measures I do have parents sign a waiver acknowledging that while I do everything possible to keep the driveway and walkway passable, the safety and supervision of the children in my care is the top priority. And that use of the driveway and walkway *during* a storm is at their own risk. It says some other things that I was advised to put in there also. Again, I am making a *reasonable* effort. Now, if anyone had slipped and fell and broke something, my insurance would have paid out. But if they had sued me, would have they have been able to collect? Again, I'd rather have the waiver in that case, than not.

I know people are trying to be helpful but saying waivers are meaningless simply isn't true. They are not bullet proof, and require work, but they can be helpful. In any case I would rather go into court with one than without.
12-14-2015 05:01 PM
Unregistered
Quote:
Originally Posted by Play Care View Post
I don't live in a city or have sidewalks so no time limits here. And as I said it won't stop someone from suing you, it may prevent any awards as they acknowledged they know I'm unable to clear the sidewalks and driveway while adequately caring for/supervising children. I hate to see people advising publicly that waivers are worthless because again, while they won't stop a law suit they may prevent it from getting anywhere or awards being made.
Do what you want, but when you lose your property you'll know why. Certain things you can't waive away. Like I knew someone who had a sign about their dog. I forgot the wording, but it basically said keep off of their property because the dog will attack you. Someone went on their property and got attacked. The got a cash settlement and the dog was put down. There's a lot of things you can't waive away. (I know that isn't a waiver, but you get the jist.) A judge isn't going to the same logic you do. The judge (if ruling against you) would say you should have hired a service or close for the day if you're not able to clear the space. You can't, and the parents, waive the rights of a minor. Let's say the waiver prevents and injured parent from suing you for their injuries, they can sue for their child(ren)'s injuries. I'm not trying to argue, but this is really a serious matter.
12-14-2015 04:52 PM
Ariana
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommiebookworm View Post
I sure miss having hubby's help! He started a new job in June that is 40 miles away. He leaves home around 5 am and returns around 7 pm, so he really isn't able to help during the week.
If my hubs wasn't doing it I would be getting a plow service for sure. You can write off as a business expense as well.
12-14-2015 11:25 AM
Jack Sprat We haven't had enough snow for us to justify a snow blower. My DH, DS or I will shovel before daycare opens. If it snows during the day, then I try to do it quickly at nap or when DS gets home from school he does it. I have a straight shot from our front door to the street, so the parents rarely park in the drive, so I don't worry about it.

Now, I have jinxed myself saying we haven't had a lot of snow..
12-14-2015 03:20 AM
Play Care
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
It doesn't protect you. Where I live, there's like time limit for shoveling before you get tickets, I think after two tickets, you get a fine. It's under 24 hours, but I forget the exact number. I either have my husband do it or pay someone locally to do it. Also, they can still sue you for injury.
I don't live in a city or have sidewalks so no time limits here. And as I said it won't stop someone from suing you, it may prevent any awards as they acknowledged they know I'm unable to clear the sidewalks and driveway while adequately caring for/supervising children. I hate to see people advising publicly that waivers are worthless because again, while they won't stop a law suit they may prevent it from getting anywhere or awards being made.
12-13-2015 08:39 AM
MunchkinWrangler The best thing you can do is at night and before you open, and while the kids are outside. Use salt, that helps to at least keep it under control and it prevents icy spots.
12-12-2015 08:31 AM
Unregistered
Quote:
Originally Posted by Play Care View Post
If I can get out to shovel with the kids we do. But mostly I remind parents to wear boots ifs it's snowed during the day as I can't guarentee I'll be able to do it. I will leave the shovel out and they can have at it if they feel inclined

I do have parents sign a waiver acknowledging that use of the driveway and walkway during the winter is at their own risk. While it won't prevent me from being sued to begin with, it may prevent them from getting anything out of it.
It doesn't protect you. Where I live, there's like time limit for shoveling before you get tickets, I think after two tickets, you get a fine. It's under 24 hours, but I forget the exact number. I either have my husband do it or pay someone locally to do it. Also, they can still sue you for injury.
12-12-2015 07:20 AM
nothingwithoutjoy It was too stressful for me to try to get it all cleared before families arrive; it can take me hours. I knew I'd never be able to manage it, so I decided it was well worth it to hire a plow service. (They snow blow/shovel sidewalks, too, and even a path to my chicken coop, though I didn't ask them to do that last.) It's a big expense, but makes a huge difference for my sanity.
12-12-2015 06:35 AM
284878 I hired a plow service for our driveway. Dh does the path before work, then again when he comes home. If he not making home on time and it needs to be cleared, I will call the teen next door.
However, a dcm shows up late while it is snowing and complains that there is an inch of snow in the driveway. Then another day it snowed after dh went to work and part of the path was covered, she complained about that too. my thought was, you lived here all your life, you know it is snowing, why is the snow on the ground surprising you?
12-12-2015 05:34 AM
Pepperth Hubby does it before he leaves for work. If it accumulates much during the day, I may try to get the main entrance cleared with kids help, but it won't get competent cleared until after everybody leaves.
12-11-2015 05:41 PM
finsup My husband does it (snowblower actually) before work and when he gets home if needed. I will put salt down frequently but generally don't get out to shovel. If there's a storm going on, parents realize it's not going to get done. I don't close for weather so its a trade off (all explained ahead of time). One dcd will often do it for me though
12-11-2015 05:09 PM
childcaremom We clear before I open. I will not be able to get out front with the children which means if it snows during the day then it won't get cleared.

I have heated mats for my stairs and entrance so at least that is clear.
12-11-2015 02:44 PM
mommiebookworm I sure miss having hubby's help! He started a new job in June that is 40 miles away. He leaves home around 5 am and returns around 7 pm, so he really isn't able to help during the week.
12-11-2015 11:29 AM
Ariana I also get my husband to do it in the morning and then when he gets home. I can't seem to convince him to buy a snowblower or get a snowplow service to do it so he just uses a shovel. We don't get that much snow so it has worked fine for us in years past. This year I have a child that comes at noon and this will be my first year with a kid that comes in the middle of the day so it will be interesting!
12-11-2015 11:11 AM
Blackcat31
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommiebookworm View Post
How do you handle clearing snow from your driveway and/or sidewalks and stairs when you have a houseful of kids?
I usually have the kids play in the snow while I shovel. I thought about having them help me.
I will shovel if the kids are outside (they do "help" sometimes) but otherwise, my DH plows before I open and will plow and/or shovel again at lunch if need be.

I have a couple golden DCD's that will grab the shovel and clear the walk if necessary at pick up.
12-11-2015 11:10 AM
Play Care If I can get out to shovel with the kids we do. But mostly I remind parents to wear boots ifs it's snowed during the day as I can't guarentee I'll be able to do it. I will leave the shovel out and they can have at it if they feel inclined

I do have parents sign a waiver acknowledging that use of the driveway and walkway during the winter is at their own risk. While it won't prevent me from being sued to begin with, it may prevent them from getting anything out of it.
12-11-2015 10:42 AM
mommiebookworm How do you handle clearing snow from your driveway and/or sidewalks and stairs when you have a houseful of kids?
I usually have the kids play in the snow while I shovel. I thought about having them help me.

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