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wdmmom 10-27-2011 11:02 AM

I didn't read all of the posts but I have a good idea of how you feel.

I started out low balling competition when I started just to get people in the door and make some money. I just raised rates effective October 1st. It's equivalent to $1.00 per day.

A couple of my families weren't happy but they were seeing the big sticker price of $20.00 a month. When you break it down, it's $5.00 a week, $1.00 per day.

There is never an opportune time to raise rates but cheap doesn't stay cheap forever! Parents need to understand that.

If the going rate in your area is higher and centers are charging 25-50% more than you are, I think you are just fine in raising your rates.

Most people don't take a minute to realize that it costs money to keep your heat turned up all day or the amount of water you use to do dishes, cook and launder or the food you throw away.

If (and that's a big IF) you are willing to negotiate with family 1, offer then $25 per day for the 3 year old and an additional $20 for the 6 year old but that's as low as i would go.

dEHmom 10-27-2011 11:27 AM

One thing came to mind reading a few of the posts here on this thread....

So many times we have been told to get a different job, to not bother with the childcare/daycare because we keep going back to the same convo of how we only make pennies per day compared to what everyone makes outside of daycare/childcare.

But if we all took this advice, how would any parent work? Without us providers, who will watch kids for the first 3-5 yrs of their life? Every mom (or dad) would have to stay home in EVERY family, unless you could afford a live in caregiver. Which I know many people can't.

I love my job too. It's hard, it's a challenge, theres a new thing I learn every day. I love it and wouldn't change it for the world. And I didn't start this just because I had kids and was at home. FTR. This was what I wanted to do, and finally decided I was going to do it.

If you consider what I save, with my 3 children, in daycare costs, And then factor that into my ridiculously low pay, I do pretty well for myself. I'm not rich, I struggle to pay my bills, I have debt, I have car payments, mortgage payments.

Its been said before, but the cost of childcare has not gone up, or down, in forever. Average cost per day for childcare 26 yrs ago? $25/day. Average cost for childcare per day now? $25/day. Why is it everyone else gets to get raises, and cost of living increases? Why isn't it the norm for Daycare rates to go up even $1/year? Because in a 100 years, the average rate of daycare per day would then be $125/day.

I wish people would give up on this garbage about complaining about daycare fees being too high. People are willing to dish out more money and not complain for Mcdonalds then they are for the person they are entrusting with their child. Someone who feeds them, loves them, reads to them, plays with them, and so on.

Unregistered 10-27-2011 11:51 AM

Schedules that vary from week to week
 
It's really challenging to have to accommodate schedules for dcks who have different schedules from week to week. It's even worse to have families expecting that they can change the days and hours that their children attend without clearing it with the provider in advance.

I used to let families switch days around without advanced notice because if they paid for 3 days, then I had to give them 3 days of care, regardless of what days that they had signed on for. That can get complicated and stressful very quickly.

Country Kids 10-27-2011 12:26 PM

I have heard several times at different times about childcare costing back in the 80's and 90's as it does now. Where does everyone live that it cost that much back then. When I first started out 16 years ago I charged $1.50 an hour and was considered average to high. 10 years ago raised it to 1.75 an hour as that was what our state would pay for state paid client. 6 years ago raised it to 2.25 and hour and was considered way high! My present day prices are more than that and averaging close to $25.00 a day and I'm still probably bringing home more than the average chidlcare because I'm charging hourly and have my clients 9-10 hours a day.

So to know that childcare was $25.00 a day 26 years ago when an average person making minimum wage probably only made $25.00 a day before taxes seems pretty extreme. Not saying it wasn't possible but if they are griping about paying it now I can't see them paying it then.

thatdivalady 10-27-2011 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Why should you get minimum wage from me when you also care for other kids?

Right, oil changes are charged by the job...my point was would you like it if they charged for a whole hour of work when it only takes them 20 min?

Ummm...the point is that you are not paying minimum wage...when you calculate it like someone did earlier, you realize that you are not paying even half of minimum wage per hour. Also, daycare providers are always limited to how many children they are allowed to watch, so it's not like they can see extra children to make up for you deducting two days from them.

Oil changes are charged what they are charged, same with daycare. And they do charge you the same regardless of how long it took them to change your oil.

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
It's not a matter of parents don't get it, it's a matter of I only want to pay for 3 days when that is what I need. I do not want to pay for 5 days when I'm not using all of them. I don't care if it's paying to save a spot or not.

Think of it this way...when you go buy a new book in your favorite series, would you like it if you had to buy the whole series just to get the new book? NO. It's a service, you say....well, say you take your car for an oil change that takes 20 mins, would you like the mechanic to say you have to pay for an hour of service because he only counts his "spots" by the hour, and not by what you actually need? NO Why is daycare the one place that thinks you need to pay for 5 days if you're only using 3 of them?

Actually...you get charged by the hour when you get repairs done to your car. They always quote you their hourly "manual labor rate." Also, I would love it if I only had to pay rent and mortgage for the "days that I am using" the space. I don't watch my cable tv everyday but I sure do get that bill like I do. I just hired a telephone guy to fix my lines and I sure did get charged by the hour and not by how long it actually took.

In my area, if you go part time, you pay more per day than a full time person would pay. And as I stated in another post I come from both sides of the fence -- I had a childcare provider and now I am starting my own center. If you want to only pay for 3 days that's nice, but folks have ratios they have to keep to and that means that you are taking up a spot that a full time person could be using. I paid my daycare provider for 5 days every week even if she did not watch my child everyday because I paid for a spot. Now I understand why most folks do not even allow part time children in their daycare.

Here is the point. If you don't like it, go to another daycare. But arguing about rationalizations is about as productive as complaining about the rates that doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc.

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Think of it this way...when you go buy a new book in your favorite series, would you like it if you had to buy the whole series just to get the new book??

PS: Taking care of precious children, I think, ranks higher than buying a book...

daycare 10-27-2011 12:59 PM

do you really think that is what we do all day? Obviously until you walk a day in the life of a DCP you will learn that there is a heck of a lot more than PLAYING toys all day. every day I have a child in my hands I am risking everything I have. Because parents can blame me for any thing they want. I myself was sued by a family because their child tripped over their own two feet and chipped her two front teeth. It was my fault. She was under my care.... Now does that sound like fun to you??

BTW $15.00 was based off of an 8 hour day. Most kids are here for more than 8 hours, which means that I would actually make about $10.00 an hour or less...

if we took everything into consideration of what we have to do to complete a full day of care, I am sure that the hours would be more like 12+14 hours total....

thatdivalady 10-27-2011 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Entertainment indeed! LOL I'd love to make $15 an hour to stay home and play with kids. LOL

That's hilarious. So would I, but I know it's not going to happen. Maybe you should read the thread that discusses what you are paying for when you send your child to daycare.

"Playing with kids" is not what providers do...

dEHmom 10-27-2011 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by daycare:
do you really think that is what we do all day? Obviously until you walk a day in the life of a DCP you will learn that there is a heck of a lot more than PLAYING toys all day. every day I have a child in my hands I am risking everything I have. Because parents can blame me for any thing they want. I myself was sued by a family because their child tripped over their own two feet and chipped her two front teeth. It was my fault. She was under my care.... Now does that sound like fun to you??

BTW $15.00 was based off of an 8 hour day. Most kids are here for more than 8 hours, which means that I would actually make about $10.00 an hour or less...

if we took everything into consideration of what we have to do to complete a full day of care, I am sure that the hours would be more like 12+14 hours total....

Maybe I'm a slowpoke, or maybe I just spend too much time on daycare stuff, but it seems to me I work more like 18 hours a day, not including weekends. I spend lots of my extra time, shopping (which we can't count towards daycare hours), planning, cleaning, organizing, paperwork, then on weekends I usually hit yard sales, and flea markets and auctions to get those awesome gotta have toys (especially love the ones that I played with as a kid!!!!!!!!) yeesh, maybe I need to learn to drop everything after daycare hours, because if I factored in all the extra hours doing daycare things, I would probably only be making .25 Cents per hour.

daycare 10-27-2011 01:22 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Yes...where I'm from $15 is a lot of money and you'd need a college education to get it. A teacher in my state averages that. A teachers' aide gets under $8 an hour, unless she's a former teacher and then she might get $10 for experience. If you charged me minimum wage to watch my child, I wouldn't be bringing home enough to cover the gas to get to your house. This is why I wouldn't want to pay for days I don't use. I can't afford to. So yes, I'd LOVE to get $15 an hour to stay home and play with kids.

of course it has a lot to do with where you live. I live in the SF bay area. My home is less than 1600 sf and my house payment alone is about $3800.00 month. Wanna take about everything else. Like my $600 month electric bill and $450.00 month water bill. Oh yeah and lets talk about my car registration too because CA just got me on that one again. I have a 2009 suburban and its gonna cost me $632.00 to reg. it this year.

Lets talk gas, it about 3.90+ a gallon.... how does about 10-15 an hour sound now..

daycare 10-27-2011 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by dEHmom:
Maybe I'm a slowpoke, or maybe I just spend too much time on daycare stuff, but it seems to me I work more like 18 hours a day, not including weekends. I spend lots of my extra time, shopping (which we can't count towards daycare hours), planning, cleaning, organizing, paperwork, then on weekends I usually hit yard sales, and flea markets and auctions to get those awesome gotta have toys (especially love the ones that I played with as a kid!!!!!!!!) yeesh, maybe I need to learn to drop everything after daycare hours, because if I factored in all the extra hours doing daycare things, I would probably only be making .25 Cents per hour.

oh do I hear ya on that one....last weekend I had a break down and my husband was floored to see my so upset.

he took me to the beach for the day and made me sign a document that said:

I will not plan for DC while out today
I will not shop for DC
I will not talk about DC
I will not respond to emails from parents about DC
I will not do anything that is DC related for the entire day.

I guess I didnt realize that I spend so much time always talking and doing things for the DC... Count me in on that $.25.....BUT you know what I love what I do..

I know that might sound like I am Contradicting myself here, but sometimes we get pushed to the edge. But most of the time I love my job.

thatdivalady 10-27-2011 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by daycare:
of course it has a lot to do with where you live. I live in the SF bay area. My home is less than 1600 sf and my house payment alone is about $3800.00 month. Wanna take about everything else. Like my $600 month electric bill and $450.00 month water bill. Oh yeah and lets talk about my car registration too because CA just got me on that one again. I have a 2009 suburban and its gonna cost me $632.00 to reg. it this year.

Lets talk gas, it about 3.90+ a gallon.... how does about 10-15 an hour sound now..

Amen!

I live in PA and I can tell you right now that $15 per hour would land me either out on the street or unable to put gas in my car or unable to pay my phone bill or....well..live. :p

Unregistered 10-27-2011 01:36 PM

It's funny how such well trained individuals, who are so professional with your "clients", can have so much time to involve yourselves in a ridiculous online conversation that's really not going anywhere. You've exerted a lot of pent up energy that could have perhaps been better utilized for your business. Let's get back to work now, ladies.

awestbrook713 10-27-2011 01:48 PM

So the general verdict here is we are under paid for what we do and the time we put into this job.

So how did my day go.....
My 4th mom contacted me about the rates via showing up at my door unannounced. We sat down and we discussed the new rates. I stood firm and didn't back down, thought I had her won over and she then says that her schedule will be changing and she will need me wednesdays for 2 hours will she have to still pay the full $25 for that day? My response "yes" the hours she will need me in the middle of the day and every other week not to mention. She wasn't happy. Then she asks if she is sick and the baby stays home will she have to still pay the full $50 for the two scheduled days? I say "yes" that was kind of the ending point I told her go home think it over but I will expect an answer by december 1st that way if she leaves I can start looking during the month before the rate change.

I also heard from my sister that mom #4 talked to her (they work together) and she told her mom #2 that called me last night is not happy either. Mom #2 is my cousin mom #4 is with another one of my cousins. I know never do daycare for family. Boy am I learning this

I watched the 3 yr old girl whos mom txt me and boy at pick up outside wasn't the only place that was cold.

I have really been dwelling on what she said as far as she did babysitting and would have never thought to charge these rates. I thought of some stuff I would like to bring up at meeting with her and dad and wanted to run them by you guys.

1. $50 a day for two kids after deducting the lower tax amount of 20% leaves me $40 a day. She use to charge me $30 a day for 2 kids ( I won't bring up her old rate but just something I hope she thinks about) How is $10 more than what she use to charge outrageous.

2. $200 a week = $2.50 an hour per child for a 40 hr week, sometimes its more than 40 hrs.

3. $200 is $80 less then the average weekly charge for 2 children age 3 + 6.

kimsdaycare 10-27-2011 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Daycare isn't a subscription.

It kind of is though. If you request a publication to be sent to you, and fail to read every article, you can't expect not to pay for part of it, right? If they could split up that publication into separate parts and sell your unwanted ones individually, then they would charge you according to use. It would likely be at a premium cost as well. If they find it hard to sell those bits and pieces to equal full subscription price they would just stop selling partials, right?

Some providers don't sell partial tuition, or partial subscriptions so to speak. The effort to do so isn't worth the hassle involved.
They will do what works most efficiently for their business.

Also remember, a provider has the right to seek maximum income for the hours she works, just as parents do. You have the option to leave one employer for another if they were unable to pay you as much as the other. Providers may choose the parent whose needs provides the most income.

Being said, I DO allow partial week tuition, but it rarely works out that I get full weeks covered by these clients. I take a loss each and every time.

Ariana 10-27-2011 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
It's funny how such well trained individuals, who are so professional with your "clients", can have so much time to involve yourselves in a ridiculous online conversation that's really not going anywhere. You've exerted a lot of pent up energy that could have perhaps been better utilized for your business. Let's get back to work now, ladies.

It's called a break. I guess we're not entitled to that either right? :rolleyes:

dEHmom 10-27-2011 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Ariana:
It's called a break. I guess we're not entitled to that either right? :rolleyes:

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

We are not entitled to do anything but smile and do as every parent wishes. We are their personal Genie. We all have breaks at different times of the day, and we occasionally have a day off here and there that we choose to spend on a daycare website. Who else loves their job this much that every chance they have they live and breath it?

i typed up a huge response but decided I better bite my tongue.

I agree with this though, I am so lucky i have such wonderful daycare parents, and I'm sorry so many of you on here have had the rotten apples.

daycare 10-27-2011 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by Ariana:
It's called a break. I guess we're not entitled to that either right? :rolleyes:

lol...I just came back from a teacher conference for my HS student.

I told the teacher that I am sorry we are having to meet on these terms....Her response was:

Every time I have a parent that comes to me for a meeting and its about a negative situation, somehow it is always my fault............
I looked at her and said TRUST me, I know how you feel. I experience this every day first hand...

I told her it starts at birth and from the looks of it, it doesn't change.

People who have never done our job could never relate to what we do. So when the unregistered people come on here to poke at us, I laugh.

jen 10-27-2011 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
From the parent perspective, I get that you want to charge by the spot, but that "spot" I'm paying for had better darn well be available every single day if I want to use it for a few hours. It's not a matter of parents don't get it, it's a matter of I only want to pay for 3 days when that is what I need. I do not want to pay for 5 days when I'm not using all of them. I don't care if it's paying to save a spot or not.

Think of it this way...when you go buy a new book in your favorite series, would you like it if you had to buy the whole series just to get the new book? NO. It's a service, you say....well, say you take your car for an oil change that takes 20 mins, would you like the mechanic to say you have to pay for an hour of service because he only counts his "spots" by the hour, and not by what you actually need? NO Why is daycare the one place that thinks you need to pay for 5 days if you're only using 3 of them?

You pay for cable, even if you don't turn on the TV
If you put your child in an anctivity or a sport, you pay even if they miss practice
If you rent your home, you pay even if you travel and are only in it once a month
You pay your health club membership, even if you never go

I could go on...

thatdivalady 10-27-2011 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
It's funny how such well trained individuals, who are so professional with your "clients", can have so much time to involve yourselves in a ridiculous online conversation that's really not going anywhere. You've exerted a lot of pent up energy that could have perhaps been better utilized for your business. Let's get back to work now, ladies.

Nope, we're just finding it hilarious that unregistered people feel like they should be taken seriously...:rolleyes:

But on the other hand, I find it interesting that you clearly have nothing better to do with your time.

Hats off to the daycare providers who provide so much and sometimes receive so little of the respect and consideration along with professionalism that they so rightly deserve!:D

Meeko 10-28-2011 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
From the parent perspective, I get that you want to charge by the spot, but that "spot" I'm paying for had better darn well be available every single day if I want to use it for a few hours. It's not a matter of parents don't get it, it's a matter of I only want to pay for 3 days when that is what I need. I do not want to pay for 5 days when I'm not using all of them. I don't care if it's paying to save a spot or not.

Think of it this way...when you go buy a new book in your favorite series, would you like it if you had to buy the whole series just to get the new book? NO. It's a service, you say....well, say you take your car for an oil change that takes 20 mins, would you like the mechanic to say you have to pay for an hour of service because he only counts his "spots" by the hour, and not by what you actually need? NO Why is daycare the one place that thinks you need to pay for 5 days if you're only using 3 of them?

So...if you go on a two week vacation....do you call your landlord and tell him that as you're actually not going to be USING/NEEDING the home for two weeks...that he's only going to get half the rent that month?

Of course not. If you want the place held open for you, then you'd better pay the whole month's rent.

No different in child care.

And why would you expect a day care to keep a spot open for your child and yet not expect to pay for it?

I tell all my dcp's that they are , essentially, RENTING a place in my day care. Those places have a set price tag. Take it or leave it.

I personally find it insulting when parents think they can haggle the price of day care. If you are hiring a nanny, then talk about the wage.

But group day care has a price set by the provider. Parents have no business asking the provider to take money out of HER pocket to make life easier for THEM, which is what they are doing when asking for discounts.

I wonder how they would feel if their boss at work came to them and said;
"I expect you to do the same exact amount of work, but I want to pay you less for it because it will leave more cash in MY wallet"

Do you go to Walmart and tell the checker that even though the price on the jeans says $19.98... you only want to pay $16.98???? Sorry...set price unless Walmart OFFERS it to you on sale.

Why is it that parents want the best car they can afford, the best phone they can afford, the best laptop they can afford?

Why will they go deeply into debt to make sure they get the best TV on the market..


.....and then look for the cheapest possible day care solution?

Unregistered 10-28-2011 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by Unregistered:
It's funny how such well trained individuals, who are so professional with your "clients", can have so much time to involve yourselves in a ridiculous online conversation that's really not going anywhere. You've exerted a lot of pent up energy that could have perhaps been better utilized for your business. Let's get back to work now, ladies.


If it's so ridiculous, why did you join in; lol. Apparently you have some pent up energy that could have been better utilized for your employment, children..lol?

Hypocrites are entertaining!


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