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  #1  
Old 12-16-2016, 11:29 PM
Concerned Momma
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Unhappy When To Worry About Daycare

Hi there. Please excuse me if this is a bit long.

I'm having a bit of trouble with my son's home daycare and I'm wondering if it would be possible to get someone else's opinion on whether or not I should worry about the recent events. He's two and has been with them since he was 3 months old. Prior to this he's always been a healthy and happy kid and despite recent events that hasn't changed.

My daycare provider only has her elderly father to help her with the kids since her husband went back to working nights. Recently we had some issues with her father not being able to keep up with the kids and being overwhelmed despite what my provider insists is well within the state's child to adult ratios. When I went to pick up my son my provider had taken her children to classes and left four children including my son with her father. As I pulled up the father was outside checking the mail and my daycare provider was gone. When I asked who was watching the kids he said his son was.

I have never met my daycare provider's brother and he isn't listed on their licensing as a caregiver. When I walked into the house the brother was in the living room watching television and the kids were alone and running around the back room. I was livid and immediately took my son home. No one was harmed and when I talked to my daycare provider the following day she insisted it was only for 60 seconds. When I brought up the concerns that I had regarding her father not being able to care for kids the way he used to and her response was to ask if I wanted to pull my son out of daycare. I was definitely surprised that this was the way she was trying to take the conversation and I'm a little upset that she's mostly nonchalant about the incident. Is it unreasonable to ask her to get more help if she's going to continue to care for other people's children? Is it time to find another childcare provider?
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  #2  
Old 12-17-2016, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
Hi there. Please excuse me if this is a bit long.

I'm having a bit of trouble with my son's home daycare and I'm wondering if it would be possible to get someone else's opinion on whether or not I should worry about the recent events. He's two and has been with them since he was 3 months old. Prior to this he's always been a healthy and happy kid and despite recent events that hasn't changed.

My daycare provider only has her elderly father to help her with the kids since her husband went back to working nights. Recently we had some issues with her father not being able to keep up with the kids and being overwhelmed despite what my provider insists is well within the state's child to adult ratios. When I went to pick up my son my provider had taken her children to classes and left four children including my son with her father. As I pulled up the father was outside checking the mail and my daycare provider was gone. When I asked who was watching the kids he said his son was.

I have never met my daycare provider's brother and he isn't listed on their licensing as a caregiver. When I walked into the house the brother was in the living room watching television and the kids were alone and running around the back room. I was livid and immediately took my son home. No one was harmed and when I talked to my daycare provider the following day she insisted it was only for 60 seconds. When I brought up the concerns that I had regarding her father not being able to care for kids the way he used to and her response was to ask if I wanted to pull my son out of daycare. I was definitely surprised that this was the way she was trying to take the conversation and I'm a little upset that she's mostly nonchalant about the incident. Is it unreasonable to ask her to get more help if she's going to continue to care for other people's children? Is it time to find another childcare provider?
It's time to find a new provider.

If your provider disagrees with your "asessment" of her father's capabilities (or hers) you aren't going to convince her otherwise based on what you see during a few minutes at pick up. Her reaction to your initial mentioning of it says that pretty clearly.

In my state my brother wouldnt be listed on my license if he were approved to be a substitute caregiver but he would have to be approved by the state and the only way a parent would know if he were or weren't would be to ask me so the brother may have been legally allowed as a substitute caregiver.... but youd have to ask her.

How many kids does your provider watch and what state are you in?
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Old 12-17-2016, 08:04 AM
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Default RE: Concerns about daycare

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It's time to find a new provider.

If your provider disagrees with your "asessment" of her father's capabilities (or hers) you aren't going to convince her otherwise based on what you see during a few minutes at pick up. Her reaction to your initial mentioning of it says that pretty clearly.

In my state my brother wouldnt be listed on my license if he were approved to be a substitute caregiver but he would have to be approved by the state and the only way a parent would know if he were or weren't would be to ask me so the brother may have been legally allowed as a substitute caregiver.... but youd have to ask her.

How many kids does your provider watch and what state are you in?
We live in California. My provider is licensed for up to 12 kids in addition to her own two children. They usually watch 8-12 kids each day.
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Old 12-17-2016, 08:16 AM
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We live in California. My provider is licensed for up to 12 kids in addition to her own two children. They usually watch 8-12 kids each day.
I dont know your relationship with your provider but if it were me, Id welcome a conversation so we can both feel good about our agreement but only you know if you/your provider have that kind of relationship and have the ability to work this out.

Im not saying your concerns arent valid Im just concerned about the reaction from tne provider. She seemed offended according to what you posted.

In my experience these situations either get easily solved (IF both sides are considerate and understanding) or they go bad fast.

I hope you are able to approach her and work through this. Good clients as well as good providers are sometimes hard-to-find.
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  #5  
Old 12-17-2016, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
I have never met my daycare provider's brother and he isn't listed on their licensing as a caregiver. When I walked into the house the brother was in the living room watching television and the kids were alone and running around the back room. I was livid and immediately took my son home. No one was harmed and when I talked to my daycare provider the following day she insisted it was only for 60 seconds. When I brought up the concerns that I had regarding her father not being able to care for kids the way he used to and her response was to ask if I wanted to pull my son out of daycare. I was definitely surprised that this was the way she was trying to take the conversation and I'm a little upset that she's mostly nonchalant about the incident. Is it unreasonable to ask her to get more help if she's going to continue to care for other people's children? Is it time to find another childcare provider?
now, I don't know how you brought it up, as in if you were calm and collected or nervous/anxious and annoyed, and her reaction may have depended on your tone of voice. but if I guess that you were calm and collected, this "take it or leave it" is not a good approach.

probably, yes. the relationship seems to have started cracking.

and I was once locked out by my daughter when I went to get the mail (came back in through garage). it took her all of 15 seconds to lock the door. seriously, mail can wait.
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  #6  
Old 12-18-2016, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
Recently we had some issues with her father not being able to keep up with the kids and being overwhelmed despite what my provider insists is well within the state's child to adult ratios.
I will say, just because she's within legal ratios, doesn't necessarily mean the father can keep up with the children. Everyone's personal limits are different Sounds like maybe she wasn't understanding your true concern or you weren't clear enough? Or it was her way to end the conversation without further discussion.

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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
I have never met my daycare provider's brother and he isn't listed on their licensing as a caregiver.
Never having met the brother would bug me. Did she ever mention the brother may be providing care? As BC said, you should ask her if the brother is allowed to provide care.

When we interviewed at a daycare, we never officially met the provider's husband until the first time he filled in, but she gave us a heads up (told us in interview he can legally fill in for her) so it wasn't a big deal to us.

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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
when I talked to my daycare provider the following day she insisted it was only for 60 seconds.
Seems odd she would downplay it if the brother was legally allowed to provide care... Checking the mail easily could have waited.

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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
Is it unreasonable to ask her to get more help if she's going to continue to care for other people's children? Is it time to find another childcare provider?
Maybe. It depends on how much you like the other aspects of her care or how much this bothers you. I'd consider talking to her about it. If the brother is allowed to care for the children, then it sounds like nothing illegal was done and it's you and the provider's personal opinions at odds here. Wait until your not emotional or worked up about it. Try to be as friendly, but clear, as possible. A good approach is to ask open ended questions and say why you're worried, without necessarily 'telling' her straight out that she should get more help.

FWIW, I've left a DC before for similar reasons, but I didn't feel it was appropriate to bring it up. There were other aspects of the program we weren't crazy about so instead of asking for all these changes, we moved on. Good luck
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  #7  
Old 12-18-2016, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
We live in California. My provider is licensed for up to 12 kids in addition to her own two children. They usually watch 8-12 kids each day.
I used to operate a large family childcare in California. There, my husband and assistants were not listed on my actual license. However, the licensing office had background clearances for each of them and they were all listed in my licensing file. (All were cleared to fill in for me). I'm not sure if parents are given access to that information though.

Regardless of what the law is here, if I wasn't 100% comfortable with all the caregivers responsible for my child, I would look for new childcare.
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  #8  
Old 12-18-2016, 07:25 PM
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If you have to ask if you should be worried, then you should be worried. Sounds like you are worried but are looking for validation. You don't need validation. Your gut feeling is always right.
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  #9  
Old 12-21-2016, 08:26 AM
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Do not ignore your gut when it comes to your kids.
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  #10  
Old 12-21-2016, 08:08 PM
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Default Lack of supervision

Quote:
Originally Posted by Concerned Momma View Post
Hi there. Please excuse me if this is a bit long.

I'm having a bit of trouble with my son's home daycare and I'm wondering if it would be possible to get someone else's opinion on whether or not I should worry about the recent events. He's two and has been with them since he was 3 months old. Prior to this he's always been a healthy and happy kid and despite recent events that hasn't changed.

My daycare provider only has her elderly father to help her with the kids since her husband went back to working nights. Recently we had some issues with her father not being able to keep up with the kids and being overwhelmed despite what my provider insists is well within the state's child to adult ratios. When I went to pick up my son my provider had taken her children to classes and left four children including my son with her father. As I pulled up the father was outside checking the mail and my daycare provider was gone. When I asked who was watching the kids he said his son was.

I have never met my daycare provider's brother and he isn't listed on their licensing as a caregiver. When I walked into the house the brother was in the living room watching television and the kids were alone and running around the back room. I was livid and immediately took my son home. No one was harmed and when I talked to my daycare provider the following day she insisted it was only for 60 seconds. When I brought up the concerns that I had regarding her father not being able to care for kids the way he used to and her response was to ask if I wanted to pull my son out of daycare. I was definitely surprised that this was the way she was trying to take the conversation and I'm a little upset that she's mostly nonchalant about the incident. Is it unreasonable to ask her to get more help if she's going to continue to care for other people's children? Is it time to find another childcare provider?
I am newly licensed and was made very clear anyone who is left alone with the kids needs to be approved via background check and have proper training SUIDS, CPR, etc. I was told my husband couldn't even be left alone with the kids if an emergency happened and he was home my approved emergency back up person with proper training would have to come here. The grandpa may have all that but does the brother? Just because he passed a background check does not mean it is okay to leave him alone with the kids. I would ask if the brother had these proper trainings and if not advise not only is that not okay with regulations but also not okay with you! Sounds to me she is absent too often and if you can't schedule your life around your business (within reason) maybe you shouldn't be doing daycare. You pay her to provide a service and she should be there and any subs should be properly trained and introuted to parents in advance in my opinion. Up until April my son was in in home daycares from 8 months-2years old. I had issues with my first one with constantly taking the kids out to walmart and going to the YMCA and placing my son in their care while she worked out. I pay her to engage my child and care for him not run errands and work out the majority days of the week. That's what off time is for in the evenings and weekends. An errand here or there I could understand but it was getting to be too much! People like this need to really evaluate what they are paid to do and yours seems like a similar case. Can't manage her time and is consistently not caring for your child as she is absent. I'd look for care elsewhere immediately.
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Old 12-22-2016, 05:51 AM
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I am newly licensed and was made very clear anyone who is left alone with the kids needs to be approved via background check and have proper training SUIDS, CPR, etc. I was told my husband couldn't even be left alone with the kids if an emergency happened and he was home my approved emergency back up person with proper training would have to come here.
In MN an emergency caregiver does NOT require CPR.

They must only have had a background check and SUIDS/AHT training.

NO other trainings are required for a person (including your husband) to qualify as an emergency caregiver.
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Old 12-22-2016, 08:37 AM
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In MN an emergency caregiver does NOT require CPR.

They must only have had a background check and SUIDS/AHT training.

NO other trainings are required for a person (including your husband) to qualify as an emergency caregiver.
That is interesting! My licensor told me specifically otherwise about it and I wrote it down! My emergency back up is my MIL and she is an ER Trauma nurse on the weekends so she already had everything I needed to be my emergency back up but at my licensing meeting my licensor definitely made it a point about my husband not being able to provide emergency care without CPR, SUIDS & AHT. I will read the rules and regs abut it because my husband does not work in the winter and if there was a true emergency he would be the best asset during the winter time rather than calling my MIL out
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Old 12-22-2016, 09:12 AM
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That is interesting! My licensor told me specifically otherwise about it and I wrote it down! My emergency back up is my MIL and she is an ER Trauma nurse on the weekends so she already had everything I needed to be my emergency back up but at my licensing meeting my licensor definitely made it a point about my husband not being able to provide emergency care without CPR, SUIDS & AHT. I will read the rules and regs abut it because my husband does not work in the winter and if there was a true emergency he would be the best asset during the winter time rather than calling my MIL out
I am a major rule follower....I know the rules/regulations for our state by heart... (I've been known to correct my licensor )

Anyways, here is the written rule:

245A.50 FAMILY CHILD CARE TRAINING REQUIREMENTS.

Subd. 4.Cardiopulmonary resuscitation

(b) A family child care provider is exempt from the CPR training requirement in this subdivision related to any substitute caregiver who provides less than 30 hours of care during any 12-month period.


https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/?id=245A.50


It is important to understand the different definitions of caregivers so that the correct trainings and requirements can be applied.

License Holder: An individual or individuals who have been issued a family child care license to provide family child care. The “License Holder(s)” is/are legally responsible for operation of the child care and following all of the requirements of the license. This means you are also considered the Controlling Individual(s).

Assistant Caregiver: A person who provides care in your licensed family child care home more than 30 times in the period of 12 months. They are not a license holder or a controlling individual. The license holder may or may not be present while the assistant caregiver is providing care.

Substitute Caregiver: A person who provides care in your licensed family child care home less than 30 times in the period of 12 months. The license holder may or may not be present when the substitute caregiver is providing care. This includes emergency caregivers that you have identified to provide care in case of emergency.

Helper: A person at least 13 years of age and less than 18 years of age who assists the provider with the care of the children. They cannot be the provider of care in your absence.

So depending on the capacity in which your husband provides care, he MAY or MAY NOT be required to have specific trainings.

Here is a handy reference sheet that outlines it fairly well:
https://www.co.dakota.mn.us/HealthFa...quirements.pdf
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Old 12-22-2016, 10:36 AM
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Ahhh thank you so much it will come in had for a true emergency that's forsure!
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Old 01-24-2017, 07:59 PM
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In California direct supervision is not required at all times. My license is small so I don't have to have an assistant. And I gotta use the bathroom once in a while you know? I make sure the kids are busy, and my troublesome twosome are separated in playpens, and I go potty. I also go out to open the gate across my driveway at the end of the day so parents don't have to park on the street. I grab the mail while I'm out there doing that.

I wanted you to know regs so that you aren't surprised by similar circumstances at another daycare. You wouldn't find someone you didn't know about taking care of your kids at my house...but you might find me walking out to check the mail and open the gate while they are in the playroom.

Someone with CPR and FIRST AID needs to be onsite at all times....this means somewhere on the property. My 17 year old son (incidentally is on the Sheriff's dept search and rescue team and has more medical training than I do) takes care of a small group when I am ill...but I'm onsite. He doesn't do diapers unless he's paid extra so he brings little ones to me to change them, but he can do the rest and is awesome at it. He is frequently begged for his babysitting services at my client's homes on their date nights.

But, if your provider's response made you uncomfortable, you should certainly find other care. Parents need to go with their gut.
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