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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>DCM Not Bringing Enough Milk, What To Do????
Dsquared 04:42 AM 02-07-2011
Hi again,

I'm looking for some more advice please My wife has a DCM who's a teacher. She drops off her 5 month old at 7 and picks him up at 4:30. She's a vegan and only wants her kid to have breast milk (that's fine). She shows up fairly frequently with not enough breast milk for her kid. My wife has told her that she is not bringing enough milk and her respoonse is "yeah, I don't seem to be able to pump enough now that I'm working." She refuses to use formula but doesn't seem to care that ker kid will be hungry and screaming for a long time without anything to eat (not to mention it's annoying for my wife to have a screaming, hungry 5 month old that she can't do anything to help so he just continues to scream).

What should she do? Suggestions welcomed! Thanks.

JD
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Danielle 04:49 AM 02-07-2011
First, are you sure she's not bringing enough? I ask b/c as a LLL leader, I hear moms say their daycare provider says they don't bring enough when they really do. Generally, an ounce an hour is plenty and doesn't increase with age. The baby may just need a pacifier or something else. You also say she's 5 months. She's about old enough for solids (generally I say wait till 6 months). Maybe if the mom truly isn't bringing enough, ask about starting solids. If she's having problems pumping enough. Suggest she contact her local LLL. They will be able to help and LLL is always free.
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juliebug 04:49 AM 02-07-2011
turn the kid away at the door if there is not enought milk/formula. if it is breast milk only and she is not giving you back up formula, ask for formula. if she has back of formula and come with some breast milk but the baby just won't take the formula there isn't much she can do. if she isn't making enought it may take a few days for her to get a supply.

ask her if she can try to pump more during the day or pump on weekends too, that way she can try to incress her supply but i sure if she was pumping enough she would be giving it to you.
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SilverSabre25 04:50 AM 02-07-2011
Your wife needs to tell the DCM that if she isn't able to pump enough milk, she needs to find a way to bump up her supply (long evening nursing sessions, pumping after nursing in the evening/morning/weekends, taking supplements like fenugreek, eating oatmeal, etc--things called "galactalogues") so she can pump enough milk.

If she can't pump enough milk, she's going to HAVE to find a formula she's comfortable feeding him. There ought to be a vegan-friendly formula out there somewhere, but she might have to go with one of the very expensive elemental formulas to get it.

Your wife needs to give the DCM a specific amount (four 6 oz bottles or whatever is reasonable--make sure there's extra if he's extra hungry) of milk that needs brought, and a time frame to achieve this (it's not going to happen overnight--two weeks might be reasonable). If she can't do it, your wife might need to threaten termination due to not being able to properly care for the child while he's in her care.
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Danielle 04:55 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
Your wife needs to tell the DCM that if she isn't able to pump enough milk, she needs to find a way to bump up her supply (long evening nursing sessions, pumping after nursing in the evening/morning/weekends, taking supplements like fenugreek, eating oatmeal, etc--things called "galactalogues") so she can pump enough milk.

If she can't pump enough milk, she's going to HAVE to find a formula she's comfortable feeding him. There ought to be a vegan-friendly formula out there somewhere, but she might have to go with one of the very expensive elemental formulas to get it.

Your wife needs to give the DCM a specific amount (four 6 oz bottles or whatever is reasonable--make sure there's extra if he's extra hungry) of milk that needs brought, and a time frame to achieve this (it's not going to happen overnight--two weeks might be reasonable). If she can't do it, your wife might need to threaten termination due to not being able to properly care for the child while he's in her care.
Four 6 oz bottles is way too much...baby is there 9 1/2 hours, 10 oz is enough.


You can also suggest to your wife to try feeding the baby only two at a time and every 2 hours. The baby may be over eating when fed a big bottle at once. Breastfed babies eat differently than formula fed babies.
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SilverSabre25 05:09 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by Danielle:
Four 6 oz bottles is way too much...baby is there 9 1/2 hours, 10 oz is enough.


You can also suggest to your wife to try feeding the baby only two at a time and every 2 hours. The baby may be over eating when fed a big bottle at once. Breastfed babies eat differently than formula fed babies.
I knew I was probably wrong. I never gave my DD a bottle; she was (and is still at age 3 ) breastfed.. I pumped for her to have milk while I was at class (attending university full-time) but never needed to be gone for a whole day. I never pay attention to how much milk is in the bottles my dcfamilies sent either 'cause it was always enough.
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countrymom 05:31 AM 02-07-2011
I nursed my dd till she was 3.5 yrs old (I know she was old) nursing babies need to be fed almost every 2 hours. BM doesn't hold them like formula. It may not be alot but they get hungry faster.
give mom some options:
1. bring more milk
2. have formula as back up
3. you have the right to call her when her baby is screaming
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Lilbutterflie 05:56 AM 02-07-2011
I personally would sit down with dcm and discuss the situation. You CANNOT have a hungry baby in your care without a way to feed him/her when your supply is gone! I would say what the previous poster said. She either needs to...

1. Bring more milk (IMO, at least 12 ounces of breastmilk for a 9.5 hr day. This will give you 3 four ounce bottles which would feed every 3 hrs. Some babies I've taken care of at this age would even take up to 15 ounces of breastmilk during a 9 hour period b/c they were eating 5 ounces at a time every 3 hours.)

2. Find a formula that fits in their vegan lifestyle & leave it at daycare for backup

3. Send them away AT THE DOOR if they have not complied with #1 or #2.

I would also warn that if you have to send them away for not providing enough bottles more than once going forward, they will immediately be terminated.
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nannyde 05:36 AM 02-07-2011
There's always going to be someone telling you that what they bring you is plenty and enough. I don't discuss breast milk amounts because the amount the parent brings is often not what the baby presents as needing.

The thing to do is to use up what she brings as the baby needs it and then right when you are done feeding the child the last amount call to have her picked up immediately. You should never have a child in your care who doesn't have any milk available. Not only should you have todays but you need a big reserve in your freezer for back up.

The Mom can either get you stocked up or she can come care for the child when you don't have milk available. Just don't wait until the baby needs it to call her. Call when you are OUT.

I don't do spoon feeding until they hit eight months. I would not offer baby food as an option to a five month old.

Don't let ANYONE fool you into thinking that if they say the WORDS it's enough then it's enough and leave you with a baby that has ALL the signs of a hungry infant. You don't have to have much experience at all to tell hunger in an infant. Just a few months of caring for babies and you will know exactly what it looks like. Don't be told what you are seeing is anything else but what you know.
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Mrs.Ky 05:54 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
There's always going to be someone telling you that what they bring you is plenty and enough. I don't discuss breast milk amounts because the amount the parent brings is often not what the baby presents as needing.

The thing to do is to use up what she brings as the baby needs it and then right when you are done feeding the child the last amount call to have her picked up immediately. You should never have a child in your care who doesn't have any milk available. Not only should you have todays but you need a big reserve in your freezer for back up.

The Mom can either get you stocked up or she can come care for the child when you don't have milk available. Just don't wait until the baby needs it to call her. Call when you are OUT.

I don't do spoon feeding until they hit eight months. I would not offer baby food as an option to a five month old.

Don't let ANYONE fool you into thinking that if they say the WORDS it's enough then it's enough and leave you with a baby that has ALL the signs of a hungry infant. You don't have to have much experience at all to tell hunger in an infant. Just a few months of caring for babies and you will know exactly what it looks like. Don't be told what you are seeing is anything else but what you know.
Wow Nan you dont fed babies baby food til 8 months? That's way to long to make a baby wait doctors recommend 4 to 6 months you start feeding a baby baby food. 2 out of 3 of my own kids where eating table food at 8 months old. I cant image a baby not having jar food at 6 months they would be starving by just eating formula til 8 months old.
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Pammie 04:51 AM 02-07-2011
Call mom at work to have the baby picked up immediately. If mom refuses to come for the baby - start calling dad, emergency contacts, etc.

There's no excuse for a baby screaming from hunger and a provider not having anything to feed him/her. That's abuse in my opinion - both to the baby, and the provider
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Mrs.Ky 04:59 AM 02-07-2011
I had a problem like this also, the DCB I still have now came to me at 3 months and he was a BF baby and my first in daycare he would eat 3 ounces every 2 hours and then cry for more Mom said it was enough for him even thou he was crying she put him on rice cereal at 4 months and he stopped crying after that. Ask Mom to put her on some cereal it will help and maybe even start some stage 1 baby food. I can understand Mom not wantig to do formula and dont push that on her I saw how upset my DCM would get when she thought her baby wasnt getting enough he is now a 25 pound 1 year old healthy and happy.
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lvt77 08:03 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by Pammie:
Call mom at work to have the baby picked up immediately. If mom refuses to come for the baby - start calling dad, emergency contacts, etc.

There's no excuse for a baby screaming from hunger and a provider not having anything to feed him/her. That's abuse in my opinion - both to the baby, and the provider
ditto I agree with pammie on this 100% that is neglect.. and so not fair poor baby.
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Little People 04:54 AM 02-07-2011
I know some other people will jump in on this with some great advice. But I would call the dcm and tell her she will have to come pick up baby when your wife has used up all the BM and baby is hungry and screaming!

I took a 6 week old baby a few weeks ago and this was a nightmare for me. DCM was BF and had 3 weeks to get baby on a bottle & formula (this is what mom wanted). Well first day baby came she would NOT take a bottle and screamed all day, she could not suck on a bottle. Dad came at 4:30 and he told me they were still BF. I was worn out from walking, rocking and listing to a precious baby scream all day.

Second day, baby came and DCM said baby was BF at 5:30am, and by 12:00 I had had enough of this poor baby screaming and not being able to take a bottle. I called dcm and told her I wanted her to come NOW and feed this baby a bottle. It took her till 1:30 to get here and she only worked 20 minutes away When she came in I had a bottle ready for her and handed her the baby and said i want you to feed her a bottle. You can sit on my couch and I need to go give some attention to my other 3 dck's. I came back in 15 minutes and guess what she was doing??? Breast Feeding. I was so upset that i knew better to say anything. I told her she needed to take her home and she did. I waited 2 hours and called her and term her.
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Danielle 04:57 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by Little People:
I know some other people will jump in on this with some great advice. But I would call the dcm and tell her she will have to come pick up baby when your wife has used up all the BM and baby is hungry and screaming!

I took a 6 week old baby a few weeks ago and this was a nightmare for me. DCM was BF and had 3 weeks to get baby on a bottle & formula (this is what mom wanted). Well first day baby came she would NOT take a bottle and screamed all day, she could not suck on a bottle. Dad came at 4:30 and he told me they were still BF. I was worn out from walking, rocking and listing to a precious baby scream all day.

Second day, baby came and DCM said baby was BF at 5:30am, and by 12:00 I had had enough of this poor baby screaming and not being able to take a bottle. I called dcm and told her I wanted her to come NOW and feed this baby a bottle. It took her till 1:30 to get here and she only worked 20 minutes away When she came in I had a bottle ready for her and handed her the baby and said i want you to feed her a bottle. You can sit on my couch and I need to go give some attention to my other 3 dck's. I came back in 15 minutes and guess what she was doing??? Breast Feeding. I was so upset that i knew better to say anything. I told her she needed to take her home and she did. I waited 2 hours and called her and term her.
It's extremely hard for a breastfeeding mother to bottle feed her baby. Baby knows mom has milk and will refuse the bottle. Many moms have to even leave the room for baby to take a bottle from anyone.
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Little People 05:02 AM 02-07-2011
Originally Posted by Danielle:
It's extremely hard for a breastfeeding mother to bottle feed her baby. Baby knows mom has milk and will refuse the bottle. Many moms have to even leave the room for baby to take a bottle from anyone.
They never even started training her to take a bottle. They just brought her to me to train her to a bottle. This mother knew she was returing to work when baby was 6 weeks old. She enrolled with me when baby was 3 weeks old. Her plan was to STOP bf and go to bottles. But it never happened. I was so upset that a mom would bring her precious baby without EVER giving her a bottle. And dads will tell more than moms. Dad said they had tried a few times but with no luck, baby would gag and cry.
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Dsquared 05:03 AM 02-07-2011
Wow, thanks for all the replies ladies! I'll try to find out more specifics about the amount of BM she's bringng with her. As far as the formula, the DCM refuses to give her child formula. That's the problem IMO, there has to be some sort of back up if she's not bringing enough BM or the child is extra hungry ect.
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Live and Learn 02:27 PM 02-09-2011
ok.... I gotta ask....is this the same teacher DCM who doesn't supply enough milk for the infant?
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Dsquared 02:57 PM 02-09-2011
Originally Posted by Live and Learn:
ok.... I gotta ask....is this the same teacher DCM who doesn't supply enough milk for the infant?
Yes. And the same mother who said in her DC interview, "my son is soooo clumsy, he's always falling down." Then on his third day drop off in a very accusatory voice "How did he get this bruise?" Uh, maybe he fell down.

I don't know how you guys do this job......
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Live and Learn 03:06 PM 02-09-2011
Originally Posted by Live and Learn:
ok.... I gotta ask....is this the same teacher DCM who doesn't supply enough milk for the infant?
Oops! I meant to post this in your other thread!!
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Unregistered 10:37 AM 10-27-2016
I am worried about a three monh old in the center I work at. I have asked the mom to bring formula many times and she refuses. So have other staff in my room. The baby finishes all it's breastmilk after six of the nine hours I watch it, it takes a bottle every two hours. Mom has even said she did not nurse since early morning before alarm clock repeatedly. Now she feeds the baby cereal at only three months and says center feeds other baby's so we should feed hers. I feel bad about it and do not want a hungry screaming baby I can not help. Do I do what mom says or stick to the center policy to wait till six months and sitting up in chair? Do I ask manager to call mom to get her and risk being seen as not doing my job?
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laundrymom 10:41 AM 10-27-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I am worried about a three monh old in the center I work at. I have asked the mom to bring formula many times and she refuses. So have other staff in my room. The baby finishes all it's breastmilk after six of the nine hours I watch it, it takes a bottle every two hours. Mom has even said she did not nurse since early morning before alarm clock repeatedly. Now she feeds the baby cereal at only three months and says center feeds other baby's so we should feed hers. I feel bad about it and do not want a hungry screaming baby I can not help. Do I do what mom says or stick to the center policy to wait till six months and sitting up in chair? Do I ask manager to call mom to get her and risk being seen as not doing my job?
I would refer to director and ask her to request pickup. And require ample milk or refuse drop off.
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Blackcat31 11:03 AM 10-27-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I am worried about a three monh old in the center I work at. I have asked the mom to bring formula many times and she refuses. So have other staff in my room. The baby finishes all it's breastmilk after six of the nine hours I watch it, it takes a bottle every two hours. Mom has even said she did not nurse since early morning before alarm clock repeatedly. Now she feeds the baby cereal at only three months and says center feeds other baby's so we should feed hers. I feel bad about it and do not want a hungry screaming baby I can not help. Do I do what mom says or stick to the center policy to wait till six months and sitting up in chair? Do I ask manager to call mom to get her and risk being seen as not doing my job?
What state are you in? Some states have laws about this...and guide caregivers as to what the next steps should be.
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Febby 06:48 PM 10-28-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I am worried about a three monh old in the center I work at. I have asked the mom to bring formula many times and she refuses. So have other staff in my room. The baby finishes all it's breastmilk after six of the nine hours I watch it, it takes a bottle every two hours. Mom has even said she did not nurse since early morning before alarm clock repeatedly. Now she feeds the baby cereal at only three months and says center feeds other baby's so we should feed hers. I feel bad about it and do not want a hungry screaming baby I can not help. Do I do what mom says or stick to the center policy to wait till six months and sitting up in chair? Do I ask manager to call mom to get her and risk being seen as not doing my job?
I wouldn't break center policy without approval from an administrator.

I would let the director (or assistant director or owner or whoever is best for solving problems) know when baby is out and still has a significant amount of time left in care. "Hey, director, Susy is out of milk, but she will probably still be here until 6 and it's only 2:30." If nothing is done, let them know when baby is hungry. "Hey, director, Susy is hungry, but we're out of milk. What would you like me to do?"

If that doesn't resolve the problem, then put in your notice and find a better center to work at. Child care doesn't pay enough to make it worth it to be covering your boss's inability to solve a basic problem.
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