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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Child Care Assistance - Do Parents Pay Difference?
Unregistered 08:03 AM 04-03-2016
In your state are fccp allowed to charge parents the difference between your rate and the child care assistance payment?
My state is trying to change the law so that providers must accept only the ccap payment.
My state is trying to change the law so that providers must accept only the ccap payment.
Blackcat31 08:14 AM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
In your state are fccp allowed to charge parents the difference between your rate and the child care assistance payment?
My state is trying to change the law so that providers must accept only the ccap payment.
Some states allow providers to charge the difference and some do not. If you currently take CCAP families and do not want to be limited in accepting what the program pays out then contact Senator Lourey and the other members of the Health, Human Services & Housing Committee in regards to SF 3332.In your state are fccp allowed to charge parents the difference between your rate and the child care assistance payment?
My state is trying to change the law so that providers must accept only the ccap payment.
Senator Nelson introduced the amendment to strike this language. Senator Lourey (who introduced this bill for Dayton) encouraged the committee members to leave it in because it was his goal to get all the Governors proposals through. The vote was 3-7 down party lines with the Republicans voting to remove the language, the Democrats voting to keep it in. It's moving forward to HHS Finance Tuesday (04/05/2016) morning at 8:30am.
Please contact Senator Lourey, who introduced this bill, and share your thoughts with him and the other members of the Health, Human Services & Housing Committee who will be hearing this bill beginning today.
sen.tony.lourey@senate.mn
sen.kathy.sheran@senate.mn
sen.melissa.wiklund@senate.mn
sen.michelle.benson@senate.mn
sen.carla.nelson@senate.mn
sen.sean.nienow@senate.mn
sen.julie.rosen@senate.mn
Sen. Eaton http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/me...emailform.php…
Sen. Hayden
http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/me...emailform.php…
Sen. Hoffman
http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/me...emailform.php…
Sen. Marty http://www.senate.leg.state.mn.us/me...emailform.php…
Thriftylady 08:24 AM 04-03-2016
It seems to be that more and more states are going to where you can't charge the difference. Part of the reason I didn't get licensed in Ohio. The only reason to be is to take subsidy and it just isn't worth it. They told me I can't charge the difference for absences and such. Here they give you a POS machine and the parents scan in and out. If they decided not to attend often, you have a spot you are not getting paid for. It was the same way when I was in Kansas, only all on paper then.
Blackcat31 08:35 AM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by Thriftylady:
It seems to be that more and more states are going to where you can't charge the difference. Part of the reason I didn't get licensed in Ohio. The only reason to be is to take subsidy and it just isn't worth it. They told me I can't charge the difference for absences and such. Here they give you a POS machine and the parents scan in and out. If they decided not to attend often, you have a spot you are not getting paid for. It was the same way when I was in Kansas, only all on paper then.
What other states have recently gone through this?It seems to be that more and more states are going to where you can't charge the difference. Part of the reason I didn't get licensed in Ohio. The only reason to be is to take subsidy and it just isn't worth it. They told me I can't charge the difference for absences and such. Here they give you a POS machine and the parents scan in and out. If they decided not to attend often, you have a spot you are not getting paid for. It was the same way when I was in Kansas, only all on paper then.
I know there has always been some states that allow providers to charge the difference and some that do not but what states have recently made the change to not allowing providers to charge the difference?
Unregistered 08:52 AM 04-03-2016
I am looking for information from providers across the country as to whether or not they are allowed to charge families the difference. I understand that most likely some allow it and some do not.
Thriftylady 11:51 AM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
What other states have recently gone through this?
I know there has always been some states that allow providers to charge the difference and some that do not but what states have recently made the change to not allowing providers to charge the difference?
I don't know if any have changed recently. But on Facebook groups I have seen a lot of providers saying they can't do it. What other states have recently gone through this?
I know there has always been some states that allow providers to charge the difference and some that do not but what states have recently made the change to not allowing providers to charge the difference?
Originally Posted by :
I am looking for information from providers across the country as to whether or not they are allowed to charge families the difference. I understand that most likely some allow it and some do not.
Well from experience, I can tell you Ohio and Kansas do not allow it.I am looking for information from providers across the country as to whether or not they are allowed to charge families the difference. I understand that most likely some allow it and some do not.
Leigh 11:56 AM 04-03-2016
My state allows us to charge the difference to the parents. I can't see them changing it. The state pays significantly less than what I charge. A lot of providers already won't accept kids on assistance, I'm sure that would get a lot worse if we weren't able to charge our full rate.
Thriftylady 11:59 AM 04-03-2016
Wait I am rethinking my answer lol. Ohio does it by county now as far as subsidy. I wonder if the info I got was just my county or state wide in Ohio? Maybe others from Ohio can chime in. I do know that many things in Ohio such as ratios are state done, so I imagine this is also. Who knows. In Kansas, it was state run not county.
NoMoreJuice! 12:09 PM 04-03-2016
I was a DCF contracted provider in KS for years, but since moving to our new home have not renewed my contract with them, as I have an abundance of private-pay parents. When I was contracted, I charged families receiving subsidy the same amount as private pay, and they paid me the difference.
http://content.dcf.ks.gov/EES/KEESM/...book_03-14.pdf
This is a copy from the DCF handbook, page 19:
DCF does not limit providers to charging the DCF rate. Providers and parents work together on the amount charged and frequency of payment. The parents’ benefit level is based on the DCF subsidy rate, not private pay rate. Providers can charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the same as private pay parents, or parents and providers can negotiate a reduced rate. If parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits choose a provider who charges them the private pay rate, the parent will be responsible for paying the difference. If a provider chooses to charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the private pay rate, the provider should be prepared for parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits to move their children due to cost. Providers may not charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits more than the private pay rate, and are encouraged to offer a discount or a sliding fee scale if they are able to do so. "
http://content.dcf.ks.gov/EES/KEESM/...book_03-14.pdf
This is a copy from the DCF handbook, page 19:
DCF does not limit providers to charging the DCF rate. Providers and parents work together on the amount charged and frequency of payment. The parents’ benefit level is based on the DCF subsidy rate, not private pay rate. Providers can charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the same as private pay parents, or parents and providers can negotiate a reduced rate. If parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits choose a provider who charges them the private pay rate, the parent will be responsible for paying the difference. If a provider chooses to charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the private pay rate, the provider should be prepared for parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits to move their children due to cost. Providers may not charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits more than the private pay rate, and are encouraged to offer a discount or a sliding fee scale if they are able to do so. "
Thriftylady 12:25 PM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by NoMoreJuice!:
I was a DCF contracted provider in KS for years, but since moving to our new home have not renewed my contract with them, as I have an abundance of private-pay parents. When I was contracted, I charged families receiving subsidy the same amount as private pay, and they paid me the difference.
http://content.dcf.ks.gov/EES/KEESM/...book_03-14.pdf
This is a copy from the DCF handbook, page 19:
DCF does not limit providers to charging the DCF rate. Providers and parents work together on the amount charged and frequency of payment. The parents’ benefit level is based on the DCF subsidy rate, not private pay rate. Providers can charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the same as private pay parents, or parents and providers can negotiate a reduced rate. If parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits choose a provider who charges them the private pay rate, the parent will be responsible for paying the difference. If a provider chooses to charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the private pay rate, the provider should be prepared for parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits to move their children due to cost. Providers may not charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits more than the private pay rate, and are encouraged to offer a discount or a sliding fee scale if they are able to do so. "
I seem to remember my contract saying I couldn't. But this was back in 2000. I couldn't charge the state more than private pay, but I didn't get paid for absences and such. I was sure that they told me I couldn't charge over they paid. Now I could charge more for hours over what they allowed.I was a DCF contracted provider in KS for years, but since moving to our new home have not renewed my contract with them, as I have an abundance of private-pay parents. When I was contracted, I charged families receiving subsidy the same amount as private pay, and they paid me the difference.
http://content.dcf.ks.gov/EES/KEESM/...book_03-14.pdf
This is a copy from the DCF handbook, page 19:
DCF does not limit providers to charging the DCF rate. Providers and parents work together on the amount charged and frequency of payment. The parents’ benefit level is based on the DCF subsidy rate, not private pay rate. Providers can charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the same as private pay parents, or parents and providers can negotiate a reduced rate. If parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits choose a provider who charges them the private pay rate, the parent will be responsible for paying the difference. If a provider chooses to charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits the private pay rate, the provider should be prepared for parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits to move their children due to cost. Providers may not charge parents receiving DCF subsidy benefits more than the private pay rate, and are encouraged to offer a discount or a sliding fee scale if they are able to do so. "
NoMoreJuice! 12:48 PM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by Thriftylady:
I seem to remember my contract saying I couldn't. But this was back in 2000. I couldn't charge the state more than private pay, but I didn't get paid for absences and such. I was sure that they told me I couldn't charge over they paid. Now I could charge more for hours over what they allowed.
I'm not doubting your memory, they seem to fiddle with the regs all the time! I hated all their rules and tried very hard to only find private pay families, but there was a great need for assistance in the small town I was in.I seem to remember my contract saying I couldn't. But this was back in 2000. I couldn't charge the state more than private pay, but I didn't get paid for absences and such. I was sure that they told me I couldn't charge over they paid. Now I could charge more for hours over what they allowed.
Febby 12:56 PM 04-03-2016
Parents pay the difference here. For some reason I was thinking there was a cap on how much the parents can pay to make up the difference, but I'm not finding that in the regs. Maybe I'm mixing KY up with another state.
Thriftylady 01:01 PM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by NoMoreJuice!:
I'm not doubting your memory, they seem to fiddle with the regs all the time! I hated all their rules and tried very hard to only find private pay families, but there was a great need for assistance in the small town I was in.
If they have changed it where you can, it is a great thing! There is a huge need here. Mostly only centers in this area take it. Most home providers are legally unlicensed and no longer can. They used to let unlicensed providers take it here. It really hurts the parents who work nights and weekends. But I know in my county, for home providers to take it we have to go way above and beyond licensing regs to take it. And that is expensive!I'm not doubting your memory, they seem to fiddle with the regs all the time! I hated all their rules and tried very hard to only find private pay families, but there was a great need for assistance in the small town I was in.
As far as the rules changing all the time that is just one reason why I am legally unlicensed. They only reason I see to get that way is to take state subsidy. While I could be full if I did that and have a huge waiting list, it just isn't worth it to me.
nanglgrl 03:03 PM 04-03-2016
You can't charge the difference in Iowa, they do give us 4 absent days a month we can charge for though. We can also charge late pick up/early drop off fees, any parent fees that DHS sets, absent days beyond the 4 a month etc. to the parent when warranted. The state pays close to what a regular provider charges (about $10 less depending on age of the child) at between $110-126 a week. However, most providers who participate in QRS charge closer to $150-175 so there are less "quality" providers who accept state pay. In addition the hassle makes quite a few more providers not take state pay so I think the majority go to centers (who set a cap on how many state pay they accept) or unlicensed providers. The rules are changing though and any unlicensed provider who accepts state pay will basically have to complete the same trainings and have the same unannounced inspections as licensed providers. I'm interested to see how many get licensed vs. how many quit doing daycare vs. how many just stop accepting state pay and how it will already affect these clients who have a hard time finding a provider who accepts state pay. When the state started doing unannounced inspections for registered homes a few years back a lot of provider switched to being unregistered since they don't get inspections.
lovemydaycare0912 03:20 PM 04-03-2016
Where I am they allow us to charge the difference. And if they ever changed that, I would not take parents on subsidy. I charge more than what they pay and I cannot afford to lose that income. It wouldn't be fair to me.
HL0605 04:02 PM 04-03-2016
I'm in Ohio and am not licensed solely because the state requires that you accept state funded clients and not charge the difference. If you do not have an assistance receiving client enrolled they may revoke your license. They pay about 60% of what I charge my clients, so it makes no sense for me to be licensed. This is so completely unfair, it boggles my mind that it really is the law. When I questioned ODJFS about how it could be in my interest to become licensed, I was told that I should take a client who was on assistance (at 60% of my regular fee) because it was "the right thing to do". Why should daycare providers, who make some of the lowest wages of any profession, be the ones to subsidize child care for low income parents? It's crazy to me.
Thriftylady 04:10 PM 04-03-2016
Originally Posted by HL0605:
I'm in Ohio and am not licensed solely because the state requires that you accept state funded clients and not charge the difference. If you do not have an assistance receiving client enrolled they may revoke your license. They pay about 60% of what I charge my clients, so it makes no sense for me to be licensed. This is so completely unfair, it boggles my mind that it really is the law. When I questioned ODJFS about how it could be in my interest to become licensed, I was told that I should take a client who was on assistance (at 60% of my regular fee) because it was "the right thing to do". Why should daycare providers, who make some of the lowest wages of any profession, be the ones to subsidize child care for low income parents? It's crazy to me.
When I had called about it when I was considering opening, they didn't tell me it was required. Glad I didn't go any farther into the process. I guess now we know why there is such a shortage.I'm in Ohio and am not licensed solely because the state requires that you accept state funded clients and not charge the difference. If you do not have an assistance receiving client enrolled they may revoke your license. They pay about 60% of what I charge my clients, so it makes no sense for me to be licensed. This is so completely unfair, it boggles my mind that it really is the law. When I questioned ODJFS about how it could be in my interest to become licensed, I was told that I should take a client who was on assistance (at 60% of my regular fee) because it was "the right thing to do". Why should daycare providers, who make some of the lowest wages of any profession, be the ones to subsidize child care for low income parents? It's crazy to me.
nanglgrl 06:45 AM 04-04-2016
Originally Posted by HL0605:
I'm in Ohio and am not licensed solely because the state requires that you accept state funded clients and not charge the difference. If you do not have an assistance receiving client enrolled they may revoke your license. They pay about 60% of what I charge my clients, so it makes no sense for me to be licensed. This is so completely unfair, it boggles my mind that it really is the law. When I questioned ODJFS about how it could be in my interest to become licensed, I was told that I should take a client who was on assistance (at 60% of my regular fee) because it was "the right thing to do". Why should daycare providers, who make some of the lowest wages of any profession, be the ones to subsidize child care for low income parents? It's crazy to me.
Because we work with children. For some reason teachers and daycare providers are supposed to sacrifice ourselves for the sake of the children (even if we have our own children who would also have to sacrifice) but pediatric doctors and many other professions can do what they do for the sake of their businesses.I'm in Ohio and am not licensed solely because the state requires that you accept state funded clients and not charge the difference. If you do not have an assistance receiving client enrolled they may revoke your license. They pay about 60% of what I charge my clients, so it makes no sense for me to be licensed. This is so completely unfair, it boggles my mind that it really is the law. When I questioned ODJFS about how it could be in my interest to become licensed, I was told that I should take a client who was on assistance (at 60% of my regular fee) because it was "the right thing to do". Why should daycare providers, who make some of the lowest wages of any profession, be the ones to subsidize child care for low income parents? It's crazy to me.
wonderfullisa 11:04 AM 04-04-2016
I didn't realise that Ohio didn't allow us to charge the difference. Then again, in my county, I was able to RAISE my rates by charging the JFS max.
Because of this, I hadn't looked into those details, much. I knew we weren't allowed to charge state pay more than private, but didn't know it had to be the same. I know we can claim a certain number of absences, so that helps. I just wish an absence wasn't a set 5 hours. I have a weekend kid who is here 9 hours. Five hours of state pay is DRASTICALLY different than nine. :/
Because of this, I hadn't looked into those details, much. I knew we weren't allowed to charge state pay more than private, but didn't know it had to be the same. I know we can claim a certain number of absences, so that helps. I just wish an absence wasn't a set 5 hours. I have a weekend kid who is here 9 hours. Five hours of state pay is DRASTICALLY different than nine. :/
Unregistered 05:18 PM 04-06-2016
I don't know how it works in other states. In NJ, we get paid if they come in at least one day of the month. However, while we can charge the client anything not covered. It's not enforced. Many times, they will agree to pay and then stick you knowing the state will never do anything. Just because you can charge more, doesn't mean you will get it.
Leigh 06:04 PM 04-06-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I don't know how it works in other states. In NJ, we get paid if they come in at least one day of the month. However, while we can charge the client anything not covered. It's not enforced. Many times, they will agree to pay and then stick you knowing the state will never do anything. Just because you can charge more, doesn't mean you will get it.
That's awful. Here, if a parent skips out owing, we can report them to childcare assistance, and their assistance is suspended until they repay us or we agree on a payment plan.I don't know how it works in other states. In NJ, we get paid if they come in at least one day of the month. However, while we can charge the client anything not covered. It's not enforced. Many times, they will agree to pay and then stick you knowing the state will never do anything. Just because you can charge more, doesn't mean you will get it.
Unregistered 07:49 PM 04-06-2016
Originally Posted by Leigh:
That's awful. Here, if a parent skips out owing, we can report them to childcare assistance, and their assistance is suspended until they repay us or we agree on a payment plan.
It's just easier for the state to let them hop to place to place until they find a place that will take them for the fee only.That's awful. Here, if a parent skips out owing, we can report them to childcare assistance, and their assistance is suspended until they repay us or we agree on a payment plan.
Meeko 07:53 PM 04-06-2016
In Utah, we charge what we like.
A subsidy parent must pay any difference in what they get from the state and what we charge.
The only rule is that we cannot charge a state parent more in total cost than we charge self-pay parents.
We get paid in advance on the 1st of each month... through direct deposit from the state.
A subsidy parent must pay any difference in what they get from the state and what we charge.
The only rule is that we cannot charge a state parent more in total cost than we charge self-pay parents.
We get paid in advance on the 1st of each month... through direct deposit from the state.
Unregistered 09:31 AM 04-07-2016
Oregon allows it.
I don't take subsidy. I always have issues with payments, termination and getting paid when they don't give much notice. Ends up in collections. No ty!
I don't take subsidy. I always have issues with payments, termination and getting paid when they don't give much notice. Ends up in collections. No ty!
Unregistered 09:34 AM 04-07-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Oregon allows it.
I don't take subsidy. I always have issues with payments, termination and getting paid when they don't give much notice. Ends up in collections. No ty!
Also - we are allowed 5 sick days per month. They only pay hourly through 62 hours and then they have a part time and full time maximums.Oregon allows it.
I don't take subsidy. I always have issues with payments, termination and getting paid when they don't give much notice. Ends up in collections. No ty!