Daycare.com Forum Daycare Forum

Go Back   Daycare.com Forum > Main Category > Daycare Center and Family Home Forum

Daycare Center and Family Home Forum Daycare Center and Family Home owners, Directors, Operators and Assistants should post and ask questions here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #101  
Old 03-07-2013, 05:57 PM
nannyde's Avatar
nannyde nannyde is offline
All powerful, all knowing daycare whisperer
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 7,311
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
I am sure it is different everywhere, but I can attest to the Head Start programs here being high quality. Over the past three years I have conducted ECERS on the same 20 headstart programs. Each year they have significantly improved on their scores and last year were very close to achieving the highest score - 7. They LISTENED to my feedback and took it seriously. They implemented changes neccessary to improve their programs, although they scored well the first time. They, beginning this year, require ALL teachers to have a Bachelor's Degree. These children are leaps and bounds ahead of children who have not had the opportunity to attend quality programs.
A Bachelor's degree in what?
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 03-07-2013, 06:20 PM
Snapdragon's Avatar
Snapdragon Snapdragon is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: SE Virginia
Posts: 87
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meeko View Post
One of my best friends teaches KG. She has told me she is sick of getting kids who can quote their numbers/alphabet/quantum physics........and yet can't sit still, can't share, are rude, bullies, etc etc etc. She has always implored me to pleeeease stick to teaching my daycare kids life skills and not try to be "mini-KG". She wants kids READY to learn...not necessarily already knowing it all (those are the kids who get bored and act out in her class)
Agree. Ready to learn is more important.
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 03-07-2013, 06:31 PM
Meeko's Avatar
Meeko Meeko is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,275
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyslippers View Post
It may be different in your state, but where I am from, Head Start is well-known as an abysmal failure.
Same here. I would never subject my child to Head Start here.
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 03-07-2013, 06:33 PM
Meeko's Avatar
Meeko Meeko is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,275
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
http://reason.org/blog/show/head-sta...federal-presch

my favorite quote about head start.

Steven levitt and stephen dubner concluded in their bestseller freakonomics, based on an extensive regression anlysis, that the federal head start preschool program doesn't work. They write, “instead of spending the day with his own undereducated, overworked mother, the typical head start child spends the day with someone else’s undereducated, overworked mother.”
bingo!
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 03-07-2013, 06:35 PM
Snapdragon's Avatar
Snapdragon Snapdragon is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: SE Virginia
Posts: 87
Default

I think it all boils down to the fact that there is no easy solution. I've observed a "push down" effect with schooling. By that, I mean that children are expected to know so much more academically at a younger age than ever before. Our local public schools have preschool for those who qualify and I have been amazed at how much emphasis is placed on academics as opposed to the priviate preschools my children went to, which focused more on social skills and learning through play. Childhood is short enough and it seems sad that children are pushed at such a young age. Just my 2c.
Reply With Quote
  #106  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:22 PM
LaLa1923's Avatar
LaLa1923 LaLa1923 is offline
mommyof5-and going crazy
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,101
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
Key words are "spend the days with"

Of course they have licensed teachers but the teachers aren't the ones taking care of the kids.

It's like nursing homes... there are nurses there but they aren't the ones doing the hands on care of the residents. The vast majority of the cares are being done by low level workers.


ouch that hurt!
Lol I know you didn't mean it exactly that way. I am a licensed CNA/GNA and often times I knew more than my nurses. They may have gone to school longer but I had the hands on experience. I could chew up a first year and spit them out. I could always spot one.


I think kids need more time to play and be kids.
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:29 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
"He was elected a second term because the MAJORITY do support him."


The majority of WHO?

If you break down who actually voted for him it wasn't the majority of people in this country who are working and paying taxes to pay for all of the agendas he pushes.

That's not me being a meanie, that's statistic and fact.

Sure everyone counts as an individual on some level, but is it fair that people who AREN'T paying for these programs should be able to cast a vote that forces *other* people to??

I guess that can be debated but I personally think it's ridiculous.

Add to that, he may have won the electoral college votes but the popular vote was split literally right down the middle. HALF of this country's people did not believe he was fit to run this country..

HALF.


In the grand scheme of all the elections ever held that is a doozy of a number and shows a severe lack of confidence on a vast amount of American's parts.



And yes, everyone knows everything was George Bush's fault, that's why this country is further in debt than it ever has been 4+ years AFTER Obama came in to fix everything
What about the people that voted for Gore but, Bush won? Gore had THE POPULAR VOTE but, the electoral college elected Bush...now you tell me that's fair. Not so much IMHO. The Electoral College also gave Obama his administration so what is the difference in that?
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:35 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sammie View Post
Because it costs money that we DON'T have!! We are BROKE and in DEBT up to our eyeballs. There is NO MONEY to SPEND on more programs!
Spending on education is the most important program to spend on!
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:40 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Candy View Post
I disagree i went to pre-k. Actually i was in the first pre-k class that my school offered. I don't know what the regular kids learned beacuse they were at a different table from them. But our table was advanced there were only 5 of us. But we did 1st grade work i remember reading a book that was for 4th graders in pre-k. Nobody in my class had trouble sitting still. Im not sure what pre-k classes you have sat in on but they sound bad, unlike any i have ever looked in. Pre-k helps some kids and some it doesn't. I think it depends on the teacher
I agree. My son will be a terror at home but, you put him in his pre k class and he gets full CHARTS of stickers for listening, being a good helper, friend, and is LEARNING what he needs to be prepared for next year. I wouldn't want to deprive him of these lessons his teacher gives him. THOSE ARE PRICELESS.
Reply With Quote
  #110  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:42 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
But why do you think that's necessary?

Why do you think taxpayers should fork over millions of dollars they don't have to accomplish such a thing?

What's wrong with doing 1st grade work in 1st grade? And reading 4th grade level books in 4th grade?

Where does the opinion come from that younger children being able to perform as an older student is somehow better??


If parents want to instill that level of education at a toddler level then fine, but I don't think the government should be sending the bill for it to taxpayers.
Maybe one of those kids will come up with a way to stop a nuclear bomb from hitting us because of that early education. Just sayin.
Reply With Quote
  #111  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:45 PM
nannyde's Avatar
nannyde nannyde is offline
All powerful, all knowing daycare whisperer
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 7,311
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaLa1923 View Post
ouch that hurt!
Lol I know you didn't mean it exactly that way. I am a licensed CNA/GNA and often times I knew more than my nurses. They may have gone to school longer but I had the hands on experience. I could chew up a first year and spit them out. I could always spot one.


I think kids need more time to play and be kids.
Low level wasn't a slam. I meant lowest level in the hierarchy from top to bottom. Nurses aide is a very very hard job and I respect anyone who can do it well.
Reply With Quote
  #112  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:51 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
Low level wasn't a slam. I meant lowest level in the hierarchy from top to bottom. Nurses aide is a very very hard job and I respect anyone who can do it well.
Thanks Nannyde! My dh is one and they are highly underpaid and underappreciated!!-sorry to veer off topic op!
Reply With Quote
  #113  
Old 03-07-2013, 08:14 PM
sammie's Avatar
sammie sammie is offline
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyslippers View Post
Oh good grief! I can't understand how everything that is wrong with this country - the worst it has been in my lifetime - is the fault of Bush. Obama, God help us, is the POTUS now, and he is making things progressively worse, each day he is in office.

Trying to stanardize preschool and child care is just one more step towards the socialist government he is trying to sneak by the uninformed members of society. Everything in this country is NOT equal. That is why it is important to WORK for what you want in life. We were not founded on the principles that everything will be equal and government mandated.

Parents have the right to choose what type of early childhood program they want their child to attend. If I want my child learning to read at age one, that is my choice. If I want him to carry around a blanket and bake cookies until he is in kindergarten - also my choice. It is important to have the variety of program styles available, so parents can exercise their own free will in determining how they want their chld educated.

Much like universal healthcare, this is just another program that will help the "I don't need to work to live a great life" members of our society keep right on living that way. Once again, when it is all said and done, the quality of care will be sacrificed to make things "equal".

I work hard for my money, so my children can have the best that our country has to offer. I don't work hard so everyone in the country's children can have access to the fruits of my labor. If they want a better life or opportunity - WORK FOR IT!

This preschool plan is just another way for the government to control how we live our lives. I am not interested in that lifestyle. Please let these four years end before this man can do any more damage to the country. And, without a doubt, when the country is a mess after his term ~ it will STILL be Bush's fault.
Reply With Quote
  #114  
Old 03-07-2013, 08:32 PM
sammie's Avatar
sammie sammie is offline
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
Spending on education is the most important program to spend on!
I agree...education is important. My point is where is the money going to come from?????.....what program(s) do you think should be cut to balance the budget, get us out of debt and fund education? We can not continue as a country down the road of spend, spend, spend.....it needs to stop! JMO
Reply With Quote
  #115  
Old 03-07-2013, 08:35 PM
sammie's Avatar
sammie sammie is offline
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
Maybe one of those kids will come up with a way to stop a nuclear bomb from hitting us because of that early education. Just sayin.
Oh brother.........
Reply With Quote
  #116  
Old 03-07-2013, 08:55 PM
sammie's Avatar
sammie sammie is offline
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
I am sure it is different everywhere, but I can attest to the Head Start programs here being high quality. Over the past three years I have conducted ECERS on the same 20 headstart programs. Each year they have significantly improved on their scores and last year were very close to achieving the highest score - 7. They LISTENED to my feedback and took it seriously. They implemented changes neccessary to improve their programs, although they scored well the first time. They, beginning this year, require ALL teachers to have a Bachelor's Degree. These children are leaps and bounds ahead of children who have not had the opportunity to attend quality programs.
A child doesn't necessarly need to attend one of these "programs" to be ready for kindergarten. Where are the parents in all of this?? My 7 yo did not attend preschool. He learned things from his home childcare provider and then I, as his parent, would spend time teaching him things to get him ready for school. During this time I worked outside the home 60+ hours per week but still made it a priority to get my own child ready for school because it was MY responsibility. He is now in 1st grade....he is in a 1st/2nd grade class this year and is doing exceptionally well. He is leaps and bounds ahead of other children who attended one of those "quality programs".
Reply With Quote
  #117  
Old 03-07-2013, 10:22 PM
Starburst's Avatar
Starburst Starburst is offline
Provider in Training
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,410
Default

We wouldn't even be having this conversation if the government would wise up and realize:
"You know something? Most of the people who are out of a job right now do not have a college education and most of the jobs out there now require a degree. Maybe we should consider putting more effort in retraining people who are on welfare or governement assistance and requiring them to go to school to get funds instead of paying them more money than they would make working full time at McDonald's for watching tv. Maybe that way they can eventually pay for their own child care and health care instead of the government having to pay for it. Who knows? Maybe their kids would be more likely to go to college if they go to college."

Fact: Children are more likely to go to college if their parent's when to college. There are a few exeptions because there are lots of people who are first generation college students and some people who decide not to go to college when their parents went to college, but it does increase the likelihood of them being able to afford it or be motivated to go.
Reply With Quote
  #118  
Old 03-07-2013, 11:46 PM
mom2many's Avatar
mom2many mom2many is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,211
Default

I realize I'm "old school" but since when did having a college degree become the criteria for whether you are smart enough to do a job successfully! It seems that WAY too much emphasis is placed on how much schooling an individual has.

I can ONLY speak from my own personal experience and I feel that all of this "formal" education is absolute nonsense...ESPECIALLY when we are talking about preschoolers! YIKES!!!!!!

My grandfather ran a very successful air conditioning/refrigeration business that he started from ABSOLUTELY nothing with ONLY a 7th grade education. He was forced to drop out of school at age 13 to help out with the family farm. He read books & self taught himself and was worth millions when he sold his business. It was hard work, but he truly lived the American dream!

My oldest son just got hired at Apple computer making over 100 grand a year at age 26 with NO college degree! Their criteria is "how do you think & problem solve & get along with others", which is something that no amount of classroom instruction will ever guarantee teaching an individual! I can proudly say he NEVER attended a preschool or pre k and my father who was a 6th grade teacher, advised me that the BEST thing I could do is to teach him how to play in the "sand box". He went on to public school and was in AP classes from the get go. He took college courses in high school and got straight A's. In college he dappled in music, simply because he loved it.

Interestingly enough this job he just got was not based on any of his college education! Through the interview process, they truly analyzed how he problem solved & MOST importantly "HOW HE GOT ALONG WITH PEOPLE"! Gee, what a novel idea especially coming from the leader in computer technology... Apple Corp.

Glad to get that off my chest... So done with people saying you are not smart without having a professor decide you are! Oh and BTW...I do have a college degree, NOT in ECE, but I have been very successful for 26+ years and LOVE what I do!!!!

Last edited by mom2many; 03-08-2013 at 12:05 AM. Reason: wording
Reply With Quote
  #119  
Old 03-08-2013, 04:31 AM
nannyde's Avatar
nannyde nannyde is offline
All powerful, all knowing daycare whisperer
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 7,311
Default

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...nally-released

Since 1965, taxpayers have spent more than $180 billion on Head Start.[1] Yet, over the decades, this Great Society relic has failed to improve academic outcomes for the children it was designed to help. The third-grade follow-up evaluation is the latest in a growing body of evidence that should urge policymakers to seriously consider Head Start’s future.

Impacts on Cognitive Development. For cognitive development, the third-grade study assessed 11 outcomes for the original three- and four-year-old cohorts. Access to Head Start for each group had no statistically measurable effects on all measures of cognitive ability, including numerous measures of reading, language, and math ability.[6]


Here is the final report: http://www.acf.hhs.gov/sites/default...mary_final.pdf

These impacts on children’s experiences translated into favorable impacts at the end of one year in the domains of children’s cognitive development and health, as well as in parenting practices. There were more significant findings across the measures within these domains for 3-year-olds in that first year (and only the 3-year-old cohort experienced improvements in the social-emotional domain.) Yet, by the end of 1st grade, there were few significant differences between the Head Start group as a whole and the control group as a whole for either cohort.
Reply With Quote
  #120  
Old 03-08-2013, 05:23 AM
Snapdragon's Avatar
Snapdragon Snapdragon is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: SE Virginia
Posts: 87
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2many View Post
I realize I'm "old school" but since when did having a college degree become the criteria for whether you are smart enough to do a job successfully! It seems that WAY too much emphasis is placed on how much schooling an individual has.
Totally agree with your sentiments, and I, too, have a college degree. I can see this might take us in another direction -- with the cost of college being so high and the amount of students who now graduate with debt, perhaps we will return to a more balanced view of the necessity of a college education. There will always be professions that require a degree, of course, but there are many jobs that require plain common sense -- and like your son, problem-solving skills and the ability to work well with others.
Reply With Quote
  #121  
Old 03-08-2013, 05:41 AM
My3cents's Avatar
My3cents My3cents is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 2,844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
I am discussing this thread with hubby.

When I read him this comment he took a second and then cracked the heck up.
Said - if swimmer enrichment becomes the status quo we are DONE trying for more kids

The look on his face as his brain went there before the words came out was almost too much lol
I was going to read through all the post before responding and I just about blew coffee all over my screen

Happy Friday everyone!!! I don't know if I will get to the end of this one before my morning time is up
Reply With Quote
  #122  
Old 03-08-2013, 05:43 AM
My3cents's Avatar
My3cents My3cents is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 2,844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Candy View Post
I disagree i went to pre-k. Actually i was in the first pre-k class that my school offered. I don't know what the regular kids learned beacuse they were at a different table from them. But our table was advanced there were only 5 of us. But we did 1st grade work i remember reading a book that was for 4th graders in pre-k. Nobody in my class had trouble sitting still. Im not sure what pre-k classes you have sat in on but they sound bad, unlike any i have ever looked in. Pre-k helps some kids and some it doesn't. I think it depends on the teacher
you might have gone to preschool but I doubt it was a pre-k government funded program.
Reply With Quote
  #123  
Old 03-08-2013, 06:05 AM
Meeko's Avatar
Meeko Meeko is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Utah
Posts: 4,275
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2many View Post
I realize I'm "old school" but since when did having a college degree become the criteria for whether you are smart enough to do a job successfully! It seems that WAY too much emphasis is placed on how much schooling an individual has.

I can ONLY speak from my own personal experience and I feel that all of this "formal" education is absolute nonsense...ESPECIALLY when we are talking about preschoolers! YIKES!!!!!!

My grandfather ran a very successful air conditioning/refrigeration business that he started from ABSOLUTELY nothing with ONLY a 7th grade education. He was forced to drop out of school at age 13 to help out with the family farm. He read books & self taught himself and was worth millions when he sold his business. It was hard work, but he truly lived the American dream!

My oldest son just got hired at Apple computer making over 100 grand a year at age 26 with NO college degree! Their criteria is "how do you think & problem solve & get along with others", which is something that no amount of classroom instruction will ever guarantee teaching an individual! I can proudly say he NEVER attended a preschool or pre k and my father who was a 6th grade teacher, advised me that the BEST thing I could do is to teach him how to play in the "sand box". He went on to public school and was in AP classes from the get go. He took college courses in high school and got straight A's. In college he dappled in music, simply because he loved it.

Interestingly enough this job he just got was not based on any of his college education! Through the interview process, they truly analyzed how he problem solved & MOST importantly "HOW HE GOT ALONG WITH PEOPLE"! Gee, what a novel idea especially coming from the leader in computer technology... Apple Corp.

Glad to get that off my chest... So done with people saying you are not smart without having a professor decide you are! Oh and BTW...I do have a college degree, NOT in ECE, but I have been very successful for 26+ years and LOVE what I do!!!!


There is an old man who lives 2 doors down from me. He is 92. The entire neighborhood celebrated his 90th birthday. My kids adore him because he is so fun to listen to to. He left school at 14 to help his mother raise his siblings and joined the marines as soon as he was able to and served in the South Pacific during WW2. He married and raised 6 children with his darling wife (who passed away 4 years ago). He only received a minimal formal education and I think he is one of the wisest, most "educated" men I have ever met.
Reply With Quote
  #124  
Old 03-08-2013, 06:44 AM
MN Mom's Avatar
MN Mom MN Mom is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Over the Rainbow
Posts: 396
Default

Since we are speaking about education...here's an interesting article. The nation typically adopts it's text book use from Texas, so it wouldn't be absurd to think their standard curriculum could be next.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...iculum-system/
Reply With Quote
  #125  
Old 03-08-2013, 06:49 AM
snbauser's Avatar
snbauser snbauser is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,385
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sammie View Post
A child doesn't necessarly need to attend one of these "programs" to be ready for kindergarten. Where are the parents in all of this?? My 7 yo did not attend preschool. He learned things from his home childcare provider and then I, as his parent, would spend time teaching him things to get him ready for school. During this time I worked outside the home 60+ hours per week but still made it a priority to get my own child ready for school because it was MY responsibility. He is now in 1st grade....he is in a 1st/2nd grade class this year and is doing exceptionally well. He is leaps and bounds ahead of other children who attended one of those "quality programs".
I think you hit the nail on the head. For anyone who has been in this profession for any length of time, think about how the children have changed. In many cases parents don't want to do much of anything with their children. They expect us to potty train, discipline, teach self help skills such as dressing, how to use utensils, etc, social skills, manners, etc along with academics. So while a child doesn't necessarily "need" to attend one of these programs, many parents will send their children just because they will not have to do the work with them and it will be free. If we don't participate in the program, then we won't be able to compete with free.

Here we have both Head Start and what is called NCPK which is the North Carolina Pre-Kindergarten program. NCPK is what used to be called More at Four and was run by our school system for those children that qualify either through income, military, or other needs such as mild developmental delays, speech therapy, OT, etc. Now it is run outside of our school system although the school system still does the evaluations for special needs. There are very strict guidelines on how you have to run your program if you want to participate (I looked into it when it was first rolling out but decided against it because of the stringent rules on how I would have to run my program such as not being able to celebrate holidays). It is requred to be a 6 hour program and most places that do participate run wrap around services such as before and after care. So the state pays the center for the 6 hours of NCPK and the parent pays for the b/a care. So as of now those of us that don't participate in NCPK have more of the middle income families that make too much to participate in either HS or NCPK. If/when universal preschool comes about, these parents will be gone as well unless we adapt and join with them.
Reply With Quote
  #126  
Old 03-08-2013, 06:57 AM
sammie's Avatar
sammie sammie is offline
New Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MN Mom View Post
Since we are speaking about education...here's an interesting article. The nation typically adopts it's text book use from Texas, so it wouldn't be absurd to think their standard curriculum could be next.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013...iculum-system/
WOW.....scary!!
Reply With Quote
  #127  
Old 03-08-2013, 07:33 AM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
What about the people that voted for Gore but, Bush won? Gore had THE POPULAR VOTE but, the electoral college elected Bush...now you tell me that's fair. Not so much IMHO. The Electoral College also gave Obama his administration so what is the difference in that?

1. Obama won the electoral college *and* the popular vote the last election (even if it was literally just by a hair.)

2. Since when did I disagree that Gore/Bush was "fair?" Where would such an assumption even come from?? The electoral college system is archaic and broken period. It was adopted to balance the power of votes when people didn't have access to sufficient or reliable information on candidates. Obviously, that's no longer an issue and hasn't been for a very long time. No matter who eeks by taking advantage or it or not it still doesn't change the fact that it doesn't work and nowhere did I argue otherwise. This isn't grade school. I don't argue points in only one direction. I look at the facts.

3. What would it have to do with the price of tea in china even if someone here had brought up the issue of "fairness?" What does Gore/Bush have to do with the issue of universal preschool and Obama's push to start up a program with exact parallels to Head Start?
Reply With Quote
  #128  
Old 03-08-2013, 07:55 AM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
You keep referring to this publicly funded program that didn't work. The only program I know of is Head Start and there are longitudal studies that show that it DOES work. Can you please refer me to some statitistics that give me some proof that pre-k doesn't "work"?
I never said pre-k doesn't work.

What I stated is that an independent council was formed to evaluate HEAD START and declared it in their scathing report - an epic fail.


If you work for them I'm straight shocked you aren't aware of that evaluation and report. It's exactly why they lost vast amounts of funding and why people everywhere liberal and conservative admit it's something the government shouldn't continue to dump tax payer funds into.

I already provided one link to an article written in response to it. Here are a couple others though if you'd like to learn more about what they discovered studying the program from it's origins through to 2009:

http://graceuniversity.edu/iip/2011/07/11-07-30-2/

http://reason.org/news/printer/head-...federal-presch

In the above link, an analysis of the study results:

The study used a gold-standard, random assignment design and had a very large nationally representative sample. This was a well done study.

For students who were randomly assigned to Head Start or not at the age of 4, the researchers collected 19 measures of cognitive impacts at the end of kindergarten and 22 measures when those students finished 1st grade. Of those 41 measures, only 1 was significant and positive. The remaining 40 showed no statistically significant difference. The one significant effect was for receptive vocabulary, which showed no significant advantage for Head Start students after kindergarten but somehow re-emerged at the end of 1st grade.

The study used the more relaxed p< .1 standard for statistical significance, so we could have seen about 4 significant differences by chance alone and only saw 1. That positive effect had an effect size of .09, which is relatively modest.

For students randomly assigned to Head Start or not at the age of 3, the researchers also collected 41 measures of lasting cognitive effects. This time they found 2 statistically significant positive effects and 1 statistically significant negative effect. For the students who began at age 3 they showed a .08 effect size benefit from Head Start in oral comprehension after first grade and a .26 effect size benefit in Spanish vocabulary after kindergarten but a .19 effect size decline in math ability at the end of kindergarten. Again, 38 of the 41 measures of lasting effects showed no difference and the few significant effects, which could be produced by chance, showed mixed results.

It is safe to say from this very rigorous evaluation that Head Start had no lasting effect on the academic preparation of students.



This study and subsequent report came out in 2010. Obama has chosen to completely ignore the results and instead chooses to flat out LIE, continuing to tout benefits it obviously doesn't produce. Not only does he continue to stew in denial (or possibly just arrogance), but now he wants to start up ANOTHER IDENTICAL PROGRAM just like it while continuing to fund the old broken one as well (and under funding proven programs like the much more productive and cost effective DC Scholarship program...)

How is that for Obama's promise of only supporting "evidence-based education policies."

It's absolute madness.
Reply With Quote
  #129  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:04 AM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by My3cents View Post
I was going to read through all the post before responding and I just about blew coffee all over my screen

Happy Friday everyone!!! I don't know if I will get to the end of this one before my morning time is up

You're welcome!
Reply With Quote
  #130  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:16 AM
Cat Herder's Avatar
Cat Herder Cat Herder is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 13,753
Default

I disagree with anything forced upon families.

If a parent decides to place their child in federally funded public preschool at 3-4 years of age that is what they should get.

If a parent decides they want their child in a private home childcare environment (like mine) then that should be what they get.

Forcing me to function like the federally funded public preschool, against my will, in my private home is a huge problem.

I should have the right to offer the services I choose. Parents should have the right to choose what services they want for their child.
__________________
- Unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal opinion and worth what you paid for them.
Reply With Quote
  #131  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:18 AM
Country Kids's Avatar
Country Kids Country Kids is offline
Nature Lover
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,044
Default

Thank you My Angels foryour original post! I know you said to comment on this and you actually provided a link for that. Interesting how every one is commenting on here though and not the link you so nicely provided for us.

Interesting how we argue back and forth on issues here instead of emailing, writing, facebooking, making phone calls to the people that are in charge of these issues. I guess we are going to solve the whole issue on here instead of in Washington/our states where the leaders of our country/states reside.

My point: If you want something like this solved, take a stand and fight for it! Arguing on here is not going to solve anything.

I do have to say its an interesting subject and interesting points have been made. I think it would be wonderful though if everyone took their points, and contact someone higher up (email, call, write, facebook) and let them know how they feel. Flood their offices and have them see you point. You will never know if it will work unless you try-
Reply With Quote
  #132  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:35 AM
Cat Herder's Avatar
Cat Herder Cat Herder is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 13,753
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post

My point: If you want something like this solved, take a stand and fight for it! Arguing on here is not going to solve anything.

Flood their offices and have them see you point. You will never know if it will work unless you try-
I did send one saying that "creating jobs" by forcing out the very people who have been doing the job well for years, because they don't have (and can't afford) "degrees", does not actually accomplish anything.

Kids come out of high school (dual enrolled with a trade school at tax payer cost) with these new early childhood education "degrees" that do not transfer to actual colleges. They believe they are prepared to do the jobs. It is a laughable "solution". How does this translate to "quality"? They wash out in about a year.

The reply I got was "Thank you for your comments." in an email with a donation button.
__________________
- Unless otherwise stated, all my posts are personal opinion and worth what you paid for them.
Reply With Quote
  #133  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:42 AM
snbauser's Avatar
snbauser snbauser is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,385
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
Thank you My Angels foryour original post! I know you said to comment on this and you actually provided a link for that. Interesting how every one is commenting on here though and not the link you so nicely provided for us.

Interesting how we argue back and forth on issues here instead of emailing, writing, facebooking, making phone calls to the people that are in charge of these issues. I guess we are going to solve the whole issue on here instead of in Washington/our states where the leaders of our country/states reside.

My point: If you want something like this solved, take a stand and fight for it! Arguing on here is not going to solve anything.

I do have to say its an interesting subject and interesting points have been made. I think it would be wonderful though if everyone took their points, and contact someone higher up (email, call, write, facebook) and let them know how they feel. Flood their offices and have them see you point. You will never know if it will work unless you try-
I commented in the link provided as well as here. I think it is very important for everyone to let their voices be heard but it is also important for conversations to happen around it so that everyone is as well informed as they can be.
Reply With Quote
  #134  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:46 AM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
What about that do you have a problem with?

If I want something I buy it.

I don't expect you to buy it. I don't expect my neighbors to buy it. I work, make money, and I buy it myself.

I contribute to charities of my choice and am incredibly generous....but I don't believe I should be forced to buy things some people in this country want that I don't believe are ethical or productive investments, nor things that they refuse to pay for themselves.
I am not trying to be rude and I know this doesn't apply to everyone on public assistance but, I find it sad that sometimes people assume everyone on it just doesn't give a d*** and is not trying to better their lives. There are plenty of hard working people who need help. To say that if you want something, you buy it and you don't expect anyone else to buy it is possibly sending the wrong message that you may not want people to interpret. The wording may not sound as you intended. Now, this is only my opinion but, I find it very unfair to group all people on public assistance as relying on our money to survive. Put yourself in someone else's shoes because you never know if one day it will be YOU relying on this help. A lot of these people are trying to better themselves and just can not find anything. That does not make them bad people. They could be teaching their children the same lessons that we do. You just don't know, none of us do. My last job, that I went through numerous company buyouts and changes through 15 years(my job being illiminated in 2009 and I had no choice but to "settle" for a job where I would never see a pay increase, which I didn't) was full of EXTREMELY HARD WORKING AMERICANS THAT do rely on public assistance to survive. This does not mean that they are not looking for better options because many of them do but, are stuck where they are. Some of these people can not leave a job because they need the medical or like me have been there so long that it is hard to imagine starting over somewhere and giving up all that seniority. I am just asking all of us to consider the opposite side for we never know when these situations may become OUR REALITY.
Reply With Quote
  #135  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:53 AM
Candy's Avatar
Candy Candy is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 209
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
I am not trying to be rude and I know this doesn't apply to everyone on public assistance but, I find it sad that sometimes people assume everyone on it just doesn't give a d*** and is not trying to better their lives. There are plenty of hard working people who need help. To say that if you want something, you buy it and you don't expect anyone else to buy it is possibly sending the wrong message that you may not want people to interpret. The wording may not sound as you intended. Now, this is only my opinion but, I find it very unfair to group all people on public assistance as relying on our money to survive. Put yourself in someone else's shoes because you never know if one day it will be YOU relying on this help. A lot of these people are trying to better themselves and just can not find anything. That does not make them bad people. They could be teaching their children the same lessons that we do. You just don't know, none of us do. My last job, that I went through numerous company buyouts and changes through 15 years(my job being illiminated in 2009 and I had no choice but to "settle" for a job where I would never see a pay increase, which I didn't) was full of EXTREMELY HARD WORKING AMERICANS THAT do rely on public assistance to survive. This does not mean that they are not looking for better options because many of them do but, are stuck where they are. Some of these people can not leave a job because they need the medical or like me have been there so long that it is hard to imagine starting over somewhere and giving up all that seniority. I am just asking all of us to consider the opposite side for we never know when these situations may become OUR REALITY.
Reply With Quote
  #136  
Old 03-08-2013, 08:55 AM
DCMom's Avatar
DCMom DCMom is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 874
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
But at most participation should be optional and there should be no repercussions for providers choosing not to be involved.
But it won't be. In MN, there is legislation introduced (SF 1024) establishing The Department of Early Care and Education.

They want to transfer licensing for family child care and child care centers from DHS to this department.

"....progress of the stage of Minnesota in moving toward a system of universal early education and care for preschool children through the age of five...'

This coupled with the unionization of childcare providers; in that bill states that we would be a collective bargaining unit of the state i.e. employees. I think you can figure out where this is going.
Reply With Quote
  #137  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:31 AM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
I am not trying to be rude and I know this doesn't apply to everyone on public assistance but, I find it sad that sometimes people assume everyone on it just doesn't give a d*** and is not trying to better their lives. There are plenty of hard working people who need help.
You are right about the streotyping of people on assistance but I think that we can safely say that a MAJORITY of recipients ARE the kind of people that don't want to work and don't want to contribute.

If you don't agree with that, ask. Ask anyone to tell you their personal stories/experiences with dealing with families using government assistance.

For every 1 good and productive story of a family using the program as a HAND UP and not a HAND OUT, there are 100 stories on the opposite side.

I've been in this field now for almost 25 years. I have had on average 3-5 families EACH year on assistance. In all my years of providing care for families using assistance, only one...yes ONE family has managed to do the right thing and bring themselves up and out of poverty and dependence on assistance.

I am not saying the intentions of government assistance is wrong just that the program itself is so out of whack and so far off the original intent that something really super drastic NEEDS to happen in order for any changes to happen.

We cannot just continue along the same path we are on and just keep wishing, hoping and praying things will change.

The system needs a complete overhaul.
Reply With Quote
  #138  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:35 AM
MyAngels's Avatar
MyAngels MyAngels is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
Thank you My Angels foryour original post! I know you said to comment on this and you actually provided a link for that. Interesting how every one is commenting on here though and not the link you so nicely provided for us.

Interesting how we argue back and forth on issues here instead of emailing, writing, facebooking, making phone calls to the people that are in charge of these issues. I guess we are going to solve the whole issue on here instead of in Washington/our states where the leaders of our country/states reside.

My point: If you want something like this solved, take a stand and fight for it! Arguing on here is not going to solve anything.

I do have to say its an interesting subject and interesting points have been made. I think it would be wonderful though if everyone took their points, and contact someone higher up (email, call, write, facebook) and let them know how they feel. Flood their offices and have them see you point. You will never know if it will work unless you try-
Good conversation, though, right? Pretty peaceful and respectful overall.

More links to contact your representatives:

http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm

http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/

Don't be put off by the form responses. I get them all the time, and normally get a follow up later that's more specific.

And don't forget to contact your state government as well. It can't hurt, right?
Reply With Quote
  #139  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:43 AM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyAngels View Post
Good conversation, though, right? Pretty peaceful and respectful overall.
More links to contact your representatives:

http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm

http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/

Don't be put off by the form responses. I get them all the time, and normally get a follow up later that's more specific.

And don't forget to contact your state government as well. It can't hurt, right?
I think this thread is EXCELLENT conversation!

I also think it is VERY important to have these kinds of dicussions.

Thank you for posting the original post.
Reply With Quote
  #140  
Old 03-08-2013, 10:07 AM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
You are right about the streotyping of people on assistance but I think that we can safely say that a MAJORITY of recipients ARE the kind of people that don't want to work and don't want to contribute.

If you don't agree with that, ask. Ask anyone to tell you their personal stories/experiences with dealing with families using government assistance.

For every 1 good and productive story of a family using the program as a HAND UP and not a HAND OUT, there are 100 stories on the opposite side.

I've been in this field now for almost 25 years. I have had on average 3-5 families EACH year on assistance. In all my years of providing care for families using assistance, only one...yes ONE family has managed to do the right thing and bring themselves up and out of poverty and dependence on assistance.

I am not saying the intentions of government assistance is wrong just that the program itself is so out of whack and so far off the original intent that something really super drastic NEEDS to happen in order for any changes to happen.

We cannot just continue along the same path we are on and just keep wishing, hoping and praying things will change.

The system needs a complete overhaul.
But maybe, just maybe this is what Obama is trying to do. By beginning to educate our children at a younger age they may not NEED public assistance as adults. It may just be the difference that is needed. No one will know until it is given a fair chance.
Reply With Quote
  #141  
Old 03-08-2013, 10:11 AM
Crystal's Avatar
Crystal Crystal is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,955
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
I think this thread is EXCELLENT conversation!

I also think it is VERY important to have these kinds of dicussions.

Thank you for posting the original post.
I agree.

I will come back later to specifically answer some of the posts here.

I do think we can all agree that there is definitely an overhaul needed in regards to welfare, education and how government spends money overall though
Reply With Quote
  #142  
Old 03-08-2013, 10:18 AM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
But maybe, just maybe this is what Obama is trying to do. By beginning to educate our children at a younger age they may not NEED public assistance as adults. It may just be the difference that is needed. No one will know until it is given a fair chance.
As I said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The PARENTS need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient NOT educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility IMHO.
Reply With Quote
  #143  
Old 03-08-2013, 10:28 AM
mom2many's Avatar
mom2many mom2many is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: California
Posts: 1,211
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
As I said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The PARENTS need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient NOT educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility IMHO.
Reply With Quote
  #144  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:15 AM
MarinaVanessa's Avatar
MarinaVanessa MarinaVanessa is offline
Family Childcare Home
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Ventura County, CA
Posts: 7,200
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
As I said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The PARENTS need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient NOT educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility IMHO.
I love you BlackCat
Reply With Quote
  #145  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:27 AM
My3cents's Avatar
My3cents My3cents is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 2,844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat Herder View Post
I disagree with anything forced upon families.

If a parent decides to place their child in federally funded public preschool at 3-4 years of age that is what they should get.

If a parent decides they want their child in a private home childcare environment (like mine) then that should be what they get.

Forcing me to function like the federally funded public preschool, against my will, in my private home is a huge problem.

I should have the right to offer the services I choose. Parents should have the right to choose what services they want for their child.
I agree with you but, parents will choose free before they pay out and will put most of us out of business. I feel it won't stop at 4- before you know it, parents will have what educational nursery they want for the unborn child set up and ready while in the thought process of getting pregnant. Today it takes two parents working to make ends meet. Free trumps having to pay out. If not more kids would be home schooled.

As a tax payer I don't want to see my taxes go up anymore. I don't want more programs added. I would like to see programs decreased and more job creation for the average Joe. Jobs that high school students that graduate can go into and make an ok wage. I would like to see true welfare reform before I see Pre-k.
Reply With Quote
  #146  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:33 AM
My3cents's Avatar
My3cents My3cents is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 2,844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
You are right about the streotyping of people on assistance but I think that we can safely say that a MAJORITY of recipients ARE the kind of people that don't want to work and don't want to contribute.

If you don't agree with that, ask. Ask anyone to tell you their personal stories/experiences with dealing with families using government assistance.

For every 1 good and productive story of a family using the program as a HAND UP and not a HAND OUT, there are 100 stories on the opposite side.

I've been in this field now for almost 25 years. I have had on average 3-5 families EACH year on assistance. In all my years of providing care for families using assistance, only one...yes ONE family has managed to do the right thing and bring themselves up and out of poverty and dependence on assistance.

I am not saying the intentions of government assistance is wrong just that the program itself is so out of whack and so far off the original intent that something really super drastic NEEDS to happen in order for any changes to happen.

We cannot just continue along the same path we are on and just keep wishing, hoping and praying things will change.

The system needs a complete overhaul.
Reply With Quote
  #147  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:37 AM
My3cents's Avatar
My3cents My3cents is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 2,844
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
As I said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The PARENTS need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient NOT educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility IMHO.
wish I could double bold that!!!

Did I say I love this I love this!!! Bingo, shazam, bulls eye
Reply With Quote
  #148  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:40 AM
Starburst's Avatar
Starburst Starburst is offline
Provider in Training
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,410
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mom2many View Post
So done with people saying you are not smart without having a professor decide you are! Oh and BTW...I do have a college degree, NOT in ECE, but I have been very successful for 26+ years and LOVE what I do!!!!
I wasn't saying people aren't smart just because they didn't go to college. I was stating that most jobs/businesses now REQUIRE a degree and even if they don't in most cases it doesn't hurt to have one. My mom worked in resturants for over 30 years as a waitress and manager; she got laid off about 2 years ago and still hasn't been able to find a stable job (a few part time temp jobs through friends). She has a bunch of experience and a current food handlers permit, but most of these jobs want people who have taken culenary or business classes. And there are also many jobs now that are being out sourced to other countries or computers.
Reply With Quote
  #149  
Old 03-08-2013, 11:56 AM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starburst View Post
I wasn't saying people aren't smart just because they didn't go to college. I was stating that most jobs/businesses now REQUIRE a degree and even if they don't in most cases it doesn't hurt to have one. My mom worked in resturants for over 30 years as a waitress and manager; she got laid off about 2 years ago and still hasn't been able to find a stable job (a few part time temp jobs through friends). She has a bunch of experience and a current food handlers permit, but most of these jobs want people who have taken culenary or business classes. And there are also many jobs now that are being out sourced to other countries or computers.
This is true. My brother is a very talented carpenter and when he decided to go work for someone other than doing his own business he worked for people that hadn't a clue about how to do carpentry! His foreman's were above him, made more money, got all the recognition because they had a college degree! And the degree could be in anything, didn't have to be in anything to do with carpentry. Now he works for a company that has 3 of his bathroom remodels in a magazine up for awards but again, he won't get the recognition since he works for a company!
Reply With Quote
  #150  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:26 PM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
Thank you My Angels foryour original post! I know you said to comment on this and you actually provided a link for that. Interesting how every one is commenting on here though and not the link you so nicely provided for us.

Interesting how we argue back and forth on issues here instead of emailing, writing, facebooking, making phone calls to the people that are in charge of these issues. I guess we are going to solve the whole issue on here instead of in Washington/our states where the leaders of our country/states reside.

My point: If you want something like this solved, take a stand and fight for it! Arguing on here is not going to solve anything.

I do have to say its an interesting subject and interesting points have been made. I think it would be wonderful though if everyone took their points, and contact someone higher up (email, call, write, facebook) and let them know how they feel. Flood their offices and have them see you point. You will never know if it will work unless you try-

Just because one chooses to have a conversation on a forum like this doesn't mean they aren't incredibly active in networking with those in positions of political power too

Will I contact those who don't care to listen to what I have to say though? Nah. Anyone that has ever tried to contact their legislators when you disagree with them on a certain issue knows full well they rarely if ever respond. If they do it's a generated message that doesn't address the heart of your concerns.

I find it's far more effective to contact the legislators who *are* on your side to let them know you are supporting their efforts, as well as networking with others in your life who may not know as much about a particular issue to get the accurate information out there. Supporting and spreading the word is far more effective than trying to talk to people who don't want to listen imho.
Reply With Quote
  #151  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:30 PM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat31 View Post
as i said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The parents need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient not educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility imho.
bam!!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #152  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:37 PM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
But maybe, just maybe this is what Obama is trying to do. By beginning to educate our children at a younger age they may not NEED public assistance as adults. It may just be the difference that is needed. No one will know until it is given a fair chance.

It's been done though.

It's called Head Start.

It was given a fair chance.

It been available for decades, given $150 billion dollars of funding, and it's been proven there is no positive effect other than the jobs it provides to keep it running.

It's been declared a employment program instead of an education program at this point because it's well known it doesn't make kids smarter. It doesn't give them a better head start in school. It doesn't help kids grow to be more responsible or more employable in adulthood.


Obama is well aware of the findings and pushes on despite them.


This is not my opinion. It is all proven fact.
Reply With Quote
  #153  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:42 PM
Country Kids's Avatar
Country Kids Country Kids is offline
Nature Lover
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,044
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
As I said in my original post, the education is not needed for the children.

The PARENTS need educating far more than the children do.

Money would be better spent investing in helping families become self-sufficient NOT educating their children. That is a parental repsonsibility IMHO.
So I have a huge question on "The parents need educating far more then the children do."

Most of "These Parents" would be about the age of our own kids (Between the 20-30 age group). Did we seriously raise a generation that can't parent, doesn't know how to raise a family, how to be involved in a childs life? Then I look and think if thats the case, gosh were did I GO wrong as a parent. I guess I have to think you can only blame the previous generation for what happened to the current generation. You can only blame the previous generation for the mess the current generation is in if they are unable to do the things needed to sustain a family/job/marriage/etc.
Reply With Quote
  #154  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:48 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
I agree. My son will be a terror at home but, you put him in his pre k class and he gets full CHARTS of stickers for listening, being a good helper, friend, and is LEARNING what he needs to be prepared for next year. I wouldn't want to deprive him of these lessons his teacher gives him. THOSE ARE PRICELESS.
Exactly this. Not all children benefit fully by being home with their parents, regardless of the socioeconomic class they are from.


My son and I butt heads constantly. He's 6 and started kindergarten this year. We never sent him to preschool because I thought that he would be better off with me. I've wanted to homeschool for as long as I could remember, but we decided to send him to kindergarten and then decide from there if we will be homeschooling. At this point, he is flourishing in public school.

I realize I'm maybe starting to get off point, but what I'm trying to say is that I wish I would have sent him to even half day preschool when he was younger. I feel that he would have gained better social skills had he gone.

Now, I am a little torn in the fact that I don't want to compete with Universal Preschools business-wise. I don't want to have to worry about needing to provide transportation to and from preschool just so I can get some clients.

Edited to add: I am way more conflicted about this than I originally thought. I finished reading the replies to this thread and I agree with a LOT of what both sides have to say. My son was totally ready for kindergarten even though he was home with me... so, yeah, conflicted here. Sorry!
Reply With Quote
  #155  
Old 03-08-2013, 12:53 PM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
So I have a huge question on "The parents need educating far more then the children do."

Most of "These Parents" would be about the age of our own kids (Between the 20-30 age group). Did we seriously raise a generation that can't parent, doesn't know how to raise a family, how to be involved in a childs life? Then I look and think if thats the case, gosh were did I GO wrong as a parent. I guess I have to think you can only blame the previous generation for what happened to the current generation. You can only blame the previous generation for the mess the current generation is in if they are unable to do the things needed to sustain a family/job/marriage/etc.
I am NOT blaming any generation. THAT is the problem. People need to stop blaming others and start taking responsibility for themselves.

I KNOW I didnt raise my children to take anything for free.

BOTH my children are contributing responsible members of society. They BOTH work two jobs while they are 3/4 to full time college students. Neither of them get financial aide other than the scholarships they received.

(My son earned a science scholarship for his work in a robotics club and my daughter earned a scholarship through her employer for going above and beyond in donating her time to the elderly people she works with)

Neither of my children rely on me or any other type of financial help other than their own job earnings. They are not single parents and are law abiding citizens who have never been in trouble with the law. Both volunteer on a regular basis for different charities.

I am proud of my children but I don't take the credit (or the blame). I gave them tools and they chose to use those tools to forge their own way in life.

THEY deserve the credit.

That was MY job and I did it. I taught my children to be responsible for their own actions and choices.

If the government wants to "help" people, they should start by giving them the tools and then stepping back and allowing them to use those tools. If someone chooses to use them...they will succeed in life. If they chose not to use them, they will fail and they should have no one to blame but themselves.

Even Jesus taught that concept when it was said that if you give a man a fish he will not be hungry today but if you teach a man to fish he will never go hungry again.

Seems a simple enough concept to me.

Society needs to STOP lowing the bar, stop lowering the expectations and have some consequences that have some follow through.
Reply With Quote
  #156  
Old 03-08-2013, 01:19 PM
MyAngels's Avatar
MyAngels MyAngels is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,152
Default

On a lighter note, check out Jon Stewart's take on the subject (the preschool bit starts at about the 3 minute mark). It's funny, no matter what side you are on :

http://earlyed.newamerica.net/blogpo..._critics-80431
Reply With Quote
  #157  
Old 03-08-2013, 01:55 PM
spud912's Avatar
spud912 spud912 is offline
Trix are for kids
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,314
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
I am NOT blaming any generation. THAT is the problem. People need to stop blaming others and start taking responsibility for themselves.

I KNOW I didnt raise my children to take anything for free.

BOTH my children are contributing responsible members of society. They BOTH work two jobs while they are 3/4 to full time college students. Neither of them get financial aide other than the scholarships they received.

(My son earned a science scholarship for his work in a robotics club and my daughter earned a scholarship through her employer for going above and beyond in donating her time to the elderly people she works with)

Neither of my children rely on me or any other type of financial help other than their own job earnings. They are not single parents and are law abiding citizens who have never been in trouble with the law. Both volunteer on a regular basis for different charities.

I am proud of my children but I don't take the credit (or the blame). I gave them tools and they chose to use those tools to forge their own way in life.

THEY deserve the credit.

That was MY job and I did it. I taught my children to be responsible for their own actions and choices.

If the government wants to "help" people, they should start by giving them the tools and then stepping back and allowing them to use those tools. If someone chooses to use them...they will succeed in life. If they chose not to use them, they will fail and they should have no one to blame but themselves.

Even Jesus taught that concept when it was said that if you give a man a fish he will not be hungry today but if you teach a man to fish he will never go hungry again.

Seems a simple enough concept to me.

Society needs to STOP lowing the bar, stop lowering the expectations and have some consequences that have some follow through.


You're a great mamma !
Reply With Quote
  #158  
Old 03-08-2013, 02:00 PM
Country Kids's Avatar
Country Kids Country Kids is offline
Nature Lover
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,044
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
I am NOT blaming any generation. THAT is the problem. People need to stop blaming others and start taking responsibility for themselves.

I KNOW I didnt raise my children to take anything for free.

BOTH my children are contributing responsible members of society. They BOTH work two jobs while they are 3/4 to full time college students. Neither of them get financial aide other than the scholarships they received.

(My son earned a science scholarship for his work in a robotics club and my daughter earned a scholarship through her employer for going above and beyond in donating her time to the elderly people she works with)

Neither of my children rely on me or any other type of financial help other than their own job earnings. They are not single parents and are law abiding citizens who have never been in trouble with the law. Both volunteer on a regular basis for different charities.

I am proud of my children but I don't take the credit (or the blame). I gave them tools and they chose to use those tools to forge their own way in life.

THEY deserve the credit.

That was MY job and I did it. I taught my children to be responsible for their own actions and choices.

If the government wants to "help" people, they should start by giving them the tools and then stepping back and allowing them to use those tools. If someone chooses to use them...they will succeed in life. If they chose not to use them, they will fail and they should have no one to blame but themselves.

Even Jesus taught that concept when it was said that if you give a man a fish he will not be hungry today but if you teach a man to fish he will never go hungry again.

Seems a simple enough concept to me.

Society needs to STOP lowing the bar, stop lowering the expectations and have some consequences that have some follow through.
I guess I'm wondering why the "government" should give the people the tools? Thats my question-why shouldn't the parents give the kids the tools. The government didn't give me my tools-my parents did and generation to generation before that. This generation is being told/given to many things by the government and it needs to be slowed down and given back the parents or possibly be there to help the parents. Passing an english/math benchmark isn't going to help feed your family but learning life skills (an ELECTIVE in our school but not a required class) would help you tremendously. Having a year of child development would be a great required class to have for a graduation requirement. I see these classes helping the parents give the tools to their children that are needed to succeed in life.

I remember a time when you could work a summer job and pay for a full year of college at a University and have money left over. When of our good friends talks about making more working in mills then he did teaching a full year of school. He worked in mills during the summer to pay for his schooling at the university. Now your lucky if you can find a full-time job and still be able to pay your bills. The government is now making it so full-time jobs will eventually be a thing of the past.

I guess they can give our children the tools they need to succeed because I have a feeling they will receive the tools that the "government" feels they need, not what we would feel they needed. They have encrouched on pretty much every aspect of our lives already-our schools, our work, our homes, our healthcare, our parenting styles, why not let them raise our children. Thats what I feel is scary!
Reply With Quote
  #159  
Old 03-08-2013, 02:24 PM
MarinaVanessa's Avatar
MarinaVanessa MarinaVanessa is offline
Family Childcare Home
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Ventura County, CA
Posts: 7,200
Default

I was just thinking about when I split up with my DD's father and how embarrassed I was to go ask for financial aid from the gov't. But I needed it because I wasn't working at the time (I was let go from a job because I refused to lie to government officials about illegal things he was doing as a landlord) so I applied. While I waited to find out if I would be approved my job was to find a job. Because I was approved for financial assistance I needed to participate in Cal-works (welfare to work which required one weekly meeting) and I had an interview scheduled before I even went to my first meeting to that program. During my first meeting at the Cal-works program there were other welfare participants there and I was amazed at how just blatantly lazy some of these people were.

There was a young lady there in partivular about my same age that I had worked with a few years previously at a retail store and she had been on the program for a full year. She slouched in her seat, didn't make eye contact with the program specialist when she was being spoken to, filed her nails during the meeting and said that the meeting was a waste of her time. When the specialist asked her if she had scheduled any interviews for that week the answer was no, when she was asked if she had applied to any jobs that previous week her answer was no. The specialist commented that she hadn't applied to any jobs in three weeks and hadn't had any scheduled interviews in over 3 months, her response was an annoyed "I know, and?". The specialist asked her why she wasn't out looking for a job (which is a requirement of welfare here in CA if you don't have a job) and the girl's answer was "I don't know. I just didn't feel like it".

THESE are the people that should not be on the program. If you are not willing to help yourself then why should the gov't help you? Why should I and the rest of the US working class help you if you aren't even willing to help yourself? I was shocked. And I think I was disturbed at the idea that the specialist wouldn't just say this person shouldn't be on the program. Cut her off. The welfare system is broken. I for one am glad that some states are requiring drug tests. It's about time that someone did something about the people taking advantage of the program.

BTW I had my interview later that week and started working that following week. It took me 2 weeks to apply at jobs, interview at a few places and get hired. I know things are different now but back then there was work available and people just being lazy and not wanting to work. And why should they when they can get money for doing nothing? This problem needs to be fixed. Let's fix what is broken first before we start another project.
Reply With Quote
  #160  
Old 03-08-2013, 02:24 PM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MyAngels View Post
On a lighter note, check out Jon Stewart's take on the subject (the preschool bit starts at about the 3 minute mark). It's funny, no matter what side you are on :
I hate to disagree but it's actually incredibly left bias and ridiculously offensive.

It mocks the findings of the results studies and sends the message that this countries children are stupid - hence the need to not only continue Head Start but completely back Obama's new plan.
Reply With Quote
  #161  
Old 03-08-2013, 02:48 PM
MyAngels's Avatar
MyAngels MyAngels is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
I hate to disagree but it's actually incredibly left bias and ridiculously offensive.

It mocks the findings of the results studies and sends the message that this countries children are stupid - hence the need to not only continue Head Start but completely back Obama's new plan.
Reply With Quote
  #162  
Old 03-08-2013, 02:52 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default



I have to say, this thread is becoming intolerable for me. I know I don't have to view it, but the some of the responses are on the verge of ridiculous.

It's unlikely that anyone in this thread is going to change anyone elses opinion to match their own, yet many on here are debating it like they that's their goal.
Reply With Quote
  #163  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:02 PM
Willow Willow is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,607
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth View Post


I have to say, this thread is becoming intolerable for me. I know I don't have to view it, but the some of the responses are on the verge of ridiculous.

It's unlikely that anyone in this thread is going to change anyone elses opinion to match their own, yet many on here are debating it like they that's their goal.

That's a whole lotta *rolleyes" lol! If it's intolerable, simply stop clicking on the link to the thread and move on to other topics?

I think it's been a great conversation, lots of respectful back and forth. There is nothing wrong with hashing out the information that people have that's brought them to the beliefs they currently hold.
Reply With Quote
  #164  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:08 PM
Scout's Avatar
Scout Scout is offline
Advanced Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,763
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth View Post


I have to say, this thread is becoming intolerable for me. I know I don't have to view it, but the some of the responses are on the verge of ridiculous.

It's unlikely that anyone in this thread is going to change anyone elses opinion to match their own, yet many on here are debating it like they that's their goal.
But, it's fun!! It's not every day we get to have these conversations with our dck's or our own!! Some of us don't see anyone over 4 all day long!
Reply With Quote
  #165  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:09 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
That's a whole lotta *rolleyes" lol! If it's intolerable, simply stop clicking on the link to the thread and move on to other topics?

I think it's been a great conversation, lots of respectful back and forth. There is nothing wrong with hashing out the information that people have that's brought them to the beliefs they currently hold.
Haha... I enjoy clicking on those emoticons... It's strangely satisfying.

You're right, nothing wrong with respectful discussion. There are those, though, that must not realize when they aren't as respectful as they could be.
Reply With Quote
  #166  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:10 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
But, it's fun!! It's not every day we get to have these conversations with our dck's or our own!! Some of us don't see anyone over 4 all day long!
Ok, ok, ok... maybe I'm just having an off day. Political discussion is a hot button for me, apparently lol
Reply With Quote
  #167  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:10 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default

Aaannnnnndddddd... You may continue
Reply With Quote
  #168  
Old 03-08-2013, 03:58 PM
Lyss's Avatar
Lyss Lyss is offline
Chaos Coordinator :)
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NW
Posts: 1,361
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
That's a whole lotta *rolleyes" lol! If it's intolerable, simply stop clicking on the link to the thread and move on to other topics?

I think it's been a great conversation, lots of respectful back and forth. There is nothing wrong with hashing out the information that people have that's brought them to the beliefs they currently hold.
I agree!!! I've seen MANY of these debates (not referring to this site but there have been a few ) get way out of control and become personal attacks on one another rather than about the issues at hand. I, personally, like debates like this because they always provide a view I've never considered or I find out information I've never heard of/learned before.

I've liked checking in on this thread and only felt the urge to let out an "oh brother!" a few times!!
Reply With Quote
  #169  
Old 03-08-2013, 04:07 PM
nannyde's Avatar
nannyde nannyde is offline
All powerful, all knowing daycare whisperer
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 7,311
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth View Post


I have to say, this thread is becoming intolerable for me. I know I don't have to view it, but the some of the responses are on the verge of ridiculous.

It's unlikely that anyone in this thread is going to change anyone elses opinion to match their own, yet many on here are debating it like they that's their goal.
Hmmm. Methinks you just told us to pipe down. This is very mild considering the topic. This issue cuts to the core of the great divide in child care/education. It SHOULD get heated because it's straight serious. If we can't whack it around then who should?
Reply With Quote
  #170  
Old 03-08-2013, 04:24 PM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
I guess I'm wondering why the "government" should give the people the tools? Thats my question-why shouldn't the parents give the kids the tools. The government didn't give me my tools-my parents did and generation to generation before that. This generation is being told/given to many things by the government and it !
I don't necessarily think the government SHOULD give people (parents) the tools but I do think the government is responsible for taking away the tools.



The government has robbed society of the ability to use those necessary life skills by enabling people.

Just like the parents we vent about who rob their children of independence by coddling them.
Reply With Quote
  #171  
Old 03-08-2013, 04:26 PM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth View Post


I have to say, this thread is becoming intolerable for me. I know I don't have to view it, but the some of the responses are on the verge of ridiculous.

It's unlikely that anyone in this thread is going to change anyone elses opinion to match their own, yet many on here are debating it like they that's their goal.
Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.
~Martin Luther King Jr.
Reply With Quote
  #172  
Old 03-08-2013, 04:42 PM
craftymissbeth's Avatar
craftymissbeth craftymissbeth is offline
Legally Unlicensed
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest
Posts: 2,367
Default

Thank you everyone for quoting the post where I went a little craycray... I wrote other stuff after that
Reply With Quote
  #173  
Old 03-08-2013, 05:06 PM
MyAngels's Avatar
MyAngels MyAngels is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,152
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth View Post
Thank you everyone for quoting the post where I went a little craycray... I wrote other stuff after that
Hey no problem - we all love each other even when we disagree .

I do believe this is an important topic to discuss, debate, argue about, whatever because if and when this gets passed it has the potential to change a lot of what most of us do.

I don't know how much it will change my business since I serve mostly middle into upper class families. I've always encouraged my families to send their 4 year olds to some type of preschool because I do not offer a "structured" type of program. All but 2 families over the years have chosen the half day, two or three times a week program and opted for their children to remain with me until they age out to kindy. If this proposal turns into "Preschool for All" then I will simply lose kids a year earlier. I don't think it will hurt me and I'm not worried about it.

I can see how it could really affect providers in other areas, though, and that's why I think it deserves not only a good discussion amongst ourselves, but with others who have the ability to affect the outcome. Who better to start that discussion than those it affects the most.

This is a little redundant from my original post, but here is the fact sheet released by the White House:

http://seiu99.org/files/2013/02/Earl...hite-House.pdf
Reply With Quote
  #174  
Old 05-20-2017, 12:54 PM
mommyneedsadayoff's Avatar
mommyneedsadayoff mommyneedsadayoff is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,753
Default

I know this post is old, but I found it to be an excellent read! Especially considering our current political climate. It is amazing how much can change in 4 years, yet the conversation seems to remain the same.
Reply With Quote
  #175  
Old 05-21-2017, 12:54 PM
Unregistered
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
Key words are "spend the days with"

Of course they have licensed teachers but the teachers aren't the ones taking care of the kids.

It's like nursing homes... there are nurses there but they aren't the ones doing the hands on care of the residents. The vast majority of the cares are being done by low level workers.
I've worked in head start as a licensed early childhood/K-6 teacher. No way are the majority of cares being done by low level workers. In each room teachers were doing all hands-on interaction and care of the children. I was in a room of 15 3-5 yr. olds. There is no comparison to a nurse doing charting and going around room to room with meds.

I planned lessons, planned centers (after kids were gone), interacted with the children during free choice, conducted circle time, sat with them at lunch, helped get out mats, sat with them during nap, engaged in behavior management, cleaned room, etc. there wasn't anything my assistant was doing that I wasn't. I was with the children 100% of the day!

No different than when I taught kindergarten.
Reply With Quote
  #176  
Old 05-21-2017, 04:23 PM
Blackcat31's Avatar
Blackcat31 Blackcat31 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 19,760
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
I've worked in head start as a licensed early childhood/K-6 teacher. No way are the majority of cares being done by low level workers. In each room teachers were doing all hands-on interaction and care of the children. I was in a room of 15 3-5 yr. olds. There is no comparison to a nurse doing charting and going around room to room with meds.

I planned lessons, planned centers (after kids were gone), interacted with the children during free choice, conducted circle time, sat with them at lunch, helped get out mats, sat with them during nap, engaged in behavior management, cleaned room, etc. there wasn't anything my assistant was doing that I wasn't. I was with the children 100% of the day!

No different than when I taught kindergarten.
I was the low level worker at one time.
The teacher in my room didn't do much.
I had no degree, no prior experience.
I had nothing other than willingness to work.
That's the way it was in most the centers our agency was in charge of (approx 2 dozen) so your experience IMHO wasn't the norm in all Head Start classrooms.
Reply With Quote
  #177  
Old 05-21-2017, 10:51 PM
mommyneedsadayoff's Avatar
mommyneedsadayoff mommyneedsadayoff is offline
Daycare.com Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,753
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
I've worked in head start as a licensed early childhood/K-6 teacher. No way are the majority of cares being done by low level workers. In each room teachers were doing all hands-on interaction and care of the children. I was in a room of 15 3-5 yr. olds. There is no comparison to a nurse doing charting and going around room to room with meds.

I planned lessons, planned centers (after kids were gone), interacted with the children during free choice, conducted circle time, sat with them at lunch, helped get out mats, sat with them during nap, engaged in behavior management, cleaned room, etc. there wasn't anything my assistant was doing that I wasn't. I was with the children 100% of the day!

No different than when I taught kindergarten.
The similarity is very much the same. In our nursing homes, CNAs do the majority of hands on care. Low lelvel does not mean unqualified, it just means that you do not need a degree to provide the day to day basic care of patients or children. Even in our school district, with exception to teachers, a large part of basic care/supervision is provided by people with no degree in education. There is nothing wrong with it and in fact, proves the point that quality care can be provided by those with little to no professional education.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
board of education, devos, entitlement, government subsidies, head start, obama, obama care, preschool debate, universal childcare, universal preschool

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:55 AM.



Daycare.com         Find A Daycare         List Your Daycare         Toys & Products                 About Us

Daycare.com
Please read our Disclaimer before continuing.

Topics pertain mainly to the following States:

Alabama Alaska Arizona Arkansas California Colorado Connecticut Delaware District of Columbia Florida Georgia Hawaii Idaho Illinois Indiana Iowa Kansas Kentucky Louisiana Maine Maryland Massachusetts Michigan Minnesota Mississippi Missouri Montana Nebraska Nevada New Hampshire New Jersey New Mexico New York North Carolina North Dakota Ohio Oklahoma Oregon Pennsylvania Rhode Island South Carolina South Dakota Tennessee Texas Utah Vermont Virginia Washington West Virginia Wisconsin Wyoming