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  #201  
Old 11-03-2011, 09:21 AM
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The whole "I have the right to believe/you have the right to believe" does not fix the fact that it is DIFFICULT to find a provider to care for a child for a full day, without naps. I just wish that providers were a little flexible. And yes, it took me a good deal of time to find a provider (had to be a center) that did not need the children nap so they could get a large break. Let me show you an example of why I think this is wrong: You hire a landscaping crew to work on your yard for 5(about half your day, correct?) hours every Tuesday(9:00 am to 2:00 pm). You come home and find that they are taking a 1.5 hour break in the middle of their 5 hours(about half your break, correct?). This means that they are not working on your yard for 5 hours. They claim that they need this 1.5 hours to clean their equipment, eat some lunch, and just chill a little bit and get prepared for the next 2 hours of yard work. You would say "What?!" And you would fire them and hire a crew that actually worked on your yard for 5 hours.
Yes, perhaps this landscaping company would stay in business because some of their clients are still happy with the overall result of the yard work, and they don't mind the break. But, some people would NOT be happy about paying this company for 5 hours, when they only actually work on the yard for 3.5 hours. The company that needs the extra-long break would not be nearly as profitable as the company that worked 5 hours. All that other company would need to do is advertise "We Do Not Take 1.5 Hour Breaks When We Are Being Paid To Work 5 Hours". And they would win more clients.
I KNOW you need a break. But 3 hours, really? Maybe you could put in a 30 minute or an hour long movie for the older kids and take your break then. Parents are paying you A LOT of their hard-earned money because they think you are working equally as hard. I am just asking that some of you consider the needs of 4-5 year olds who are not yet in school and also are old enough to stay awake during the day. This was truly a horrible issue with every in-home provider I considered. Why does it have to be so difficult to find someone to accept $600-$900 a month on the grounds that my child be cared for and NOT be told to lie on a cot for 3 hours? This is really a limited service, it SHOULD NOT be this difficult to find a provider to provide service to the mother of a normal four year old who doesn't need a nap. He is starting school next year, he will not be allowed to nap then. He does not need it, he functions great without it. He is happy, healthy, active and he is tired at 8:30pm. Can't any of you be willing to accommodate these children? The center my son is at now is expensive, compared to the average price in my area. I know there are older children, who are not in school, who do not need naps. And I know that not all of the mothers of these children can afford to pay for this center my son attends. It would be such a great thing if you considered other options for children who do not nap. If you've been banking on the MUST TAKE LONG BREAK policy, maybe you should try banking on things for older kids to do during little-kid-nap-time. You make like the result of your efforts. I would guess it would make for an even better bank account and happier clients.
Your analogy isn't right.

Let's say you hired a landscaper for five hours of work on Tuesday and he said to you.... I'm going to do the five hours but I will do it between 9-12 .. take a three hour break... and then do it from 3-5. Same amount of money but we will take a big break in the middle of it.

You pay for the five hours and you get five hours of work.

The part you don't GET is that we are NOT charging for the kids to be up during that time. My rates are based on a NINE hour max day with a 2.5 hour break in the middle. So I figure the break into the rate just like the landscaper in my analogy. I'm willing to "house" and supervise your child during that time but I am not willing to do the intense supervision and interaction during that time like I do when everyone is up.

You say " I am just asking that some of you consider the needs of 4-5 year olds who are not yet in school and also are old enough to stay awake during the day."

Friend the four and five year olds are a small small amount of the "keep my kid up at nap" requests. You think that's the age but MANY parents believe it is actually their infant or toddler who doesn't need a nap. There's NO age limit to it. I've had this request with a six month old. (I tell you no lies) Your child being four isn't any more of a special request then the parent with a 14 month old who is requesting it. It's all the same to me... it means no breaky breaky and Nan needs her breaky.

This is really a limited service, it SHOULD NOT be this difficult to find a provider to provide service to the mother of a normal four year old who doesn't need a nap.

Friend... you believe that but I think maybe you haven't actually cared for children who were from mulitple families of multiple ages. It's NOT the same as caring for your own kid or your friends and family kids. You think it's a really limited service.... but really it's a lot of hard work. I've been at it for 18 years and I haven't missed a day of work in 17 years cept my vacay and holiday.

I KNOW how hard this is... It might be something you think is limited and most likely you could manage to do it on a schedule like you suggested... but what you are seeing in real life is that there are few like you who can manage it. The real reason you can't find it is because it's too hard to do for MOST.

Can you tell me why you think the providers you are asking to do this won't? Do you have any insight of why provider after provider would rather not have your money then have your money and have your kid up for ten straight hours a day? You are saying it's incredibly difficult to find. Why if it's as easy as you suggest and it's really being paid for in regular day care pay.. why can't you find someone who is willing to do it? Why did you have to hire a Nanny or put your child into a Center to find it?
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  #202  
Old 11-03-2011, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
The whole "I have the right to believe/you have the right to believe" does not fix the fact that it is DIFFICULT to find a provider to care for a child for a full day, without naps. I just wish that providers were a little flexible. And yes, it took me a good deal of time to find a provider (had to be a center) that did not need the children nap so they could get a large break.

Let me show you an example of why I think this is wrong: You hire a landscaping crew to work on your yard for 5(about half your day, correct?) hours every Tuesday(9:00 am to 2:00 pm). You come home and find that they are taking a 1.5 hour break in the middle of their 5 hours(about half your break, correct?). This means that they are not working on your yard for 5 hours. They claim that they need this 1.5 hours to clean their equipment, eat some lunch, and just chill a little bit and get prepared for the next 2 hours of yard work. You would say "What?!" And you would fire them and hire a crew that actually worked on your yard for 5 hours.

Yes, perhaps this landscaping company would stay in business because some of their clients are still happy with the overall result of the yard work, and they don't mind the break. But, some people would NOT be happy about paying this company for 5 hours, when they only actually work on the yard for 3.5 hours. The company that needs the extra-long break would not be nearly as profitable as the company that worked 5 hours. All that other company would need to do is advertise "We Do Not Take 1.5 Hour Breaks When We Are Being Paid To Work 5 Hours". And they would win more clients.

I KNOW you need a break. But 3 hours, really? Maybe you could put in a 30 minute or an hour long movie for the older kids and take your break then. Parents are paying you A LOT of their hard-earned money because they think you are working equally as hard. I am just asking that some of you consider the needs of 4-5 year olds who are not yet in school and also are old enough to stay awake during the day.

This was truly a horrible issue with every in-home provider I considered. Why does it have to be so difficult to find someone to accept $600-$900 a month on the grounds that my child be cared for and NOT be told to lie on a cot for 3 hours? This is really a limited service, it SHOULD NOT be this difficult to find a provider to provide service to the mother of a normal four year old who doesn't need a nap. He is starting school next year, he will not be allowed to nap then. He does not need it, he functions great without it. He is happy, healthy, active and he is tired at 8:30pm. Can't any of you be willing to accommodate these children?

The center my son is at now is expensive, compared to the average price in my area. I know there are older children, who are not in school, who do not need naps. And I know that not all of the mothers of these children can afford to pay for this center my son attends. It would be such a great thing if you considered other options for children who do not nap. If you've been banking on the MUST TAKE LONG BREAK policy, maybe you should try banking on things for older kids to do during little-kid-nap-time. You make like the result of your efforts. I would guess it would make for an even better bank account and happier clients.
It seems to me you are saying that you want to pay the lower rates offered by home providers, but you want them to offer the same service (i.e., no rest or nap time required) of the larger, more expensive centers.

As Nan said, my rates reflect the fact that I require a rest period each day. If I were going to accomodate children who did not need that rest period then I would have to raise my rates to the same rates that the larger, no nap required, centers charge.

It does seem that the majority of conflicts between providers and parents always comes down to money.
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  #203  
Old 11-03-2011, 09:48 AM
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The center my son is at now is expensive, compared to the average price in my area. I know there are older children, who are not in school, who do not need naps. And I know that not all of the mothers of these children can afford to pay for this center my son attends. It would be such a great thing if you considered other options for children who do not nap. If you've been banking on the MUST TAKE LONG BREAK policy, maybe you should try banking on things for older kids to do during little-kid-nap-time. You make like the result of your efforts. I would guess it would make for an even better bank account and happier clients.
I don't like older children. My business is not set up to accomodate them because... duh duh duh daaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh They don't take a full afternoon nap.

If I did the options for kids that did not nap I would have to hire out nap time every day. The parents would have to pay the price you pay now for the expensive center. Your center charges more money so they have adults there to cover the "no nap" part of their service.

What you can't find is the cheap home day care that offers the expensive "no nap" service your center offers. You landed in a place where you paid more money. If you believe that this service would be a benefit to the public then feel free to open a home child care at home child care rates and market towards the kids you feel are so underserved.

If you REALLY believe in it then do it. You see a place in the market for the service. Put your belief to work. You will be full quicker than you can say "no naps here". There's a TON of people wanting their baby to five year old up all day. They will be knocking down your door trying to get in as long as it's cheap or at most the price of a regular home child care that doesn't offer a no nap service.

You think the service will be for four and five year olds but soon enough you will have parents coming to you with infants, toddlers, and three year olds saying "my child is perfectly healthy... fine... happy and in bed by 8:30 every day if they don't have a nap. Take my baby... my toddler.. my three year old... do it for the sake of the children"
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  #204  
Old 11-03-2011, 09:51 AM
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  #205  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:03 AM
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Can you tell me why you think the providers you are asking to do this won't? Do you have any insight of why provider after provider would rather not have your money then have your money and have your kid up for ten straight hours a day? You are saying it's incredibly difficult to find. Why if it's as easy as you suggest and it's really being paid for in regular day care pay.. why can't you find someone who is willing to do it? Why did you have to hire a Nanny or put your child into a Center to find it?
That is EXACTLY what I am asking. Why is this so difficult? I think they need break from all the kids, yes. But why is it not possible to turn on a movie for the older kiddos, or give them a quiet activity, while you take your break? I sincerely DO NOT want my child to lie on a cot for that long. It is boring, and it disrupts his already established sleep patterns at home. He can watch a movie or play quietly while others sleep. He knows what it means to be quiet, because others are sleeping. As far as the landscaping example goes, your analogy is incorrect. If I were paying you to care for my son for nine hours, then you are being paid to care for him for nine hours. You are saying that I would pay you for nine hours, however my son would actually be in your home for 12 hours. (9+3=12). But no, he is in your home for 9 hours and you are taking a 3 hour break during this 9 hours. Meaning that you really are only caring for my son for 6 hours, because you have told him to lie quietly on his cot for 3 hours. (9-3=6).
& Mandy Jane, I don't think it is necessary to attempt to insult me with your sarcastic remarks. "I assume you DO know how to read? " What is up with that? If you want me to edit your grammar on that post, I can and will. Just let me know. I will be all over that.
I am not trying to insult anyone here, and I would like it very much if you did not insult me.
I appreciate that you all care enough for children to open your home up to them. But you are running a business, you are providing a service. You need to stop being so selfish and look at what your clients need, and compare that to what you need. There needs to be a good balance. And with most of the providers I looked at, the needs of the provider were put well above the clients. They wanted a break, no exceptions. They would try to explain to me that my child DOES need a nap. They would try to tell me that yes, they are negotiable. But when I questioned them in detail what my child would be doing during "nap time", they failed to prove that my child would not be lying down doing nothing at all.

I am obviously not finding any answers here. I had to put my son in a center, when I preferred the "home-setting" and the personalization you get with a home provider. I was not able to find any provider willing to actually budge on this nap time/break time thing. That is a very large break. And yes, your job is quite different then mine. But why did you choose this kind of work if you cannot keep up with children for a full 8 hours, even? I could not do that, so I chose to NOT open a daycare in my home. If I thought that I could handle 6-8 kids (homes that I looked at had this # of kids, I definitely do NOT want my son in a home with more children than that. That is a chaotic mess) in my home then I would consider the fact that I would need to actually care for them for at least 9 hours. Meaning, that I would need to tend to children who were old enough to stay awake during the day. I would require that children who get cranky have naps. I would consult with the parent about their child's crankiness and there would be a solution. I would not "drop" the family because a child functions well w/out a nap. That IS bad business. That is cruel to the child. If they get used to a daycare, love the kids they play with, love the providers, why would you drop them because they do not need a nap?
Like I said, I am getting no answers here.
Based on the info you HAVE provided, this is my conclusion:

My son will stay in a center. In-home providers are unable to fully care for my child because they cannot handle children who do not require a nap. They would much rather disrupt his sleeping habits rather than disrupt their break.
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  #206  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:05 AM
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I don't like older children. My business is not set up to accomodate them because... duh duh duh daaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh They don't take a full afternoon nap.

If I did the options for kids that did not nap I would have to hire out nap time every day. The parents would have to pay the price you pay now for the expensive center. Your center charges more money so they have adults there to cover the "no nap" part of their service.

What you can't find is the cheap home day care that offers the expensive "no nap" service your center offers. You landed in a place where you paid more money. If you believe that this service would be a benefit to the public then feel free to open a home child care at home child care rates and market towards the kids you feel are so underserved.

If you REALLY believe in it then do it. You see a place in the market for the service. Put your belief to work. You will be full quicker than you can say "no naps here". There's a TON of people wanting their baby to five year old up all day. They will be knocking down your door trying to get in as long as it's cheap or at most the price of a regular home child care that doesn't offer a no nap service.

You think the service will be for four and five year olds but soon enough you will have parents coming to you with infants, toddlers, and three year olds saying "my child is perfectly healthy... fine... happy and in bed by 8:30 every day if they don't have a nap. Take my baby... my toddler.. my three year old... do it for the sake of the children"
I love nannyde!

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  #207  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:05 AM
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My naptime. Break is 1 hour 40 minutes. If noone calls, knocks, poops, or cries. This is the time I fill out paperwork, clean off tables, wash any gooey toys, wipe down the bathroom. Finally pee myself, toss a sandwich to my stomach, and lotion my hands. With the remaining 7 1/2 minutes I sit and stare at the sleeping angels.
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  #208  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:15 AM
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Default It isn't about the money...

I was willing to pay for good care. I was actually paying the previous provider well above the average rate. I am not looking for "cheap" ways to keep my son up all day. You guys are STILL not getting it. I am not asking that you keep him awake while I am at work, so that when I get home, I can just put him straight to bed. I spend time with my son in the evenings, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I hate that I even have to work; I love my job, but I love my little boy wayyy more. I am not wanting an in-home daycare provider so that I can save money. I will pay what I paid at the center, or actually even more, because I LOVE the personalization you get at the in-home daycare, and the stability. I love that I know that Ms. Sally will be there like she always is and will care for my son, and not a 20 year old girl who was just fired from her waitress job so she thought she'd work at a center and see how that is.
I am willing to pay for that kind of thing. I just couldn't find one who could meet the needs of my very normal son. He didn't fight, he didn't scream, he gets along well with others, he doesn't get cranky. He just didn't need the nap. It messed up his sleeping habits at home, and I worked so hard to get him on a great schedule. Being told to lie on a cot for 3 hours will mean that he will eventually fall asleep, therefore not fall asleep at home until 10pm or later.
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  #209  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:31 AM
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I have had 4-5 year olds in the past that don't nap. They do however have a cot, blanket and lay down after lunch. If they are awake after about 30 minutes, I do get them up out of the room and let them read or sit quietly with me. This being said, I have had 4-5 year old parents NOT want them to watch tv during this time. So I do not even turn on the TV, even for me. If they are loud then I lay them back down and they know this. Usually they will color, read or something quiet.

Sometimes they will fall asleep on the cot, and I think the at least 30 minutes of laying down is good for anyone! I wish I could just "lay" there for 30 minutes.

BUT during my "break" if the child is loud, or rude, he will lay down. SOMETIMES i had the older 4-5 year olds entertain the infants ( not hold or feed, just be by) and that was nice for a 2 minute potty break!

So maybe these providers that don't allow the older kids up, have had issues with parents wanting their kids to be "doing" something during this time, or the kids ARE not quiet and respectful??
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  #210  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:34 AM
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I was willing to pay for good care. I was actually paying the previous provider well above the average rate. I am not looking for "cheap" ways to keep my son up all day. You guys are STILL not getting it. I am not asking that you keep him awake while I am at work, so that when I get home, I can just put him straight to bed. I spend time with my son in the evenings, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I hate that I even have to work; I love my job, but I love my little boy wayyy more. I am not wanting an in-home daycare provider so that I can save money. I will pay what I paid at the center, or actually even more, because I LOVE the personalization you get at the in-home daycare, and the stability. I love that I know that Ms. Sally will be there like she always is and will care for my son, and not a 20 year old girl who was just fired from her waitress job so she thought she'd work at a center and see how that is.
I am willing to pay for that kind of thing. I just couldn't find one who could meet the needs of my very normal son. He didn't fight, he didn't scream, he gets along well with others, he doesn't get cranky. He just didn't need the nap. It messed up his sleeping habits at home, and I worked so hard to get him on a great schedule. Being told to lie on a cot for 3 hours will mean that he will eventually fall asleep, therefore not fall asleep at home until 10pm or later.
I am sorry your experience with family child care did not work out for you. From your posts, I gather you are the rare parent that really is trying to work WITH your provider to find a happy medium or at least some sort of compromise to your situation.

Most parents are not willing to put in the face time with their child and would never be willing to pay for the type of care they really want.

If you were a parent who came to me and discussed this issue, I would be more than happy to try and accommodate you. I do ask that all my daycare children nap/rest during the day...but NEVER for 3 hours at a time. I have a 90 minute rest period. I used to offer the TV/movie option for the older ones but I no longer have a TV (a whole other topic) but most my older kids would not be quiet so the younger ones could nap and licensing requires ALL the children to be in one room or one area so loud older kids wouldnt work for me.

I do have a couple 4-5 year olds now who do not sleep. They do rest however and listen to the audio books I play for the 90 minutes of rest time. In the summer months, I have a helper who takes those non-sleepers outside for the rest period. In the winter months I cannot afford to hire a helper and do not have that option.

I'd love to have parents pay me $600-900 per month for one full time child that is over age two. For me, that would be fantastic. Heck, I would take any age kid if the parent paid me that rate.

I do try very hard to be flexible for parents but if one parent's requests become too disruptive for the group, then I can't do it. I know in my area, there are lots of providers who offer care without naps/rest times. I am just not one of them. At least not all the time.

I also think Nan is just trying to point out that SHE personally does not offer a no nap service but others out there somewhere probably do. It costs more sometimes but I am sure it is out there.

Last edited by Blackcat31; 11-03-2011 at 10:37 AM.
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  #211  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:38 AM
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Ok, you're right about the contract thing. It was not explained well in this provider's contract.

She stated that "Naps vary depending on daily activities, but usually last 2-3 hours and children are allowed to stay awake but must remain quiet if they cannot sleep" This is very vague and I should've addressed this at first, but I understood "children are allowed to stay awake but must remain quiet" as - my child will be allowed to play quietly with other children his age while the younger ones sleep. When actually, it was "your child will lay there and do nothing for 2-3 hours while I take care of personal things". My son was allowed to "read a book" while laying there. He cannot read, and no book you give him will entertain him and keep him quiet for 2-3 hours, he is going to get bored, and he will want to get up, but you will lay him back down and tell him to hush and he will eventually fall asleep out of boredom.

I was angry at this provider because she was disrupting my son's normal sleep schedule so that she could take her break. I do not get this. Why are you expecting us to pay you when you are taking such a large break? This is just unacceptable. & yes, technically, the parents are your boss. We write your paychecks, so make sure you make your nap policy very clear, and make sure that it caters to children who are old enough to stay awake. Make sure you are making the parents happy, the children happy, and if you are not happy then maybe this isn't a good line of work for you.

You do not need such a large break, nobody needs a break like that. You do not need to make a child lay there so that you can accomplish things that every other parent/person-who-has-a-job makes time to accomplish on the weekends, or after work. That is just ridiculous, and I refuse to pay someone to take a break like that while my son is laying there.

This is hysterical, you lie in this post and completely contradict yourself. Ok so if your son just laid there for 3 hours, that would mean he didn't sleep meaning he would go to bed a normal time. You say he doesn't need a nap and won't take one, but then you say he would be so bord he would fall asleep, LOL. You go back and forth!

The real story is it was quiet time, and after a busy day he went to sleep like any other normal child. Meaning he wanted to stay up a normal time at night, and you wanted him down early so you wouldn't have to deal with him. If he stays up later at night, you let him sleep in till the last minute....so you also don't have to deal with him in the morning, so you can get ready for work. LOL.

Yep we have all had parents just like you!
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  #212  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:40 AM
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Question:

Family daycare providers, who really gets a 3 hour break? I mean when I have infants I have no break ( for the last 6 years actually, this is the first time in a long time that ALL my kids are sleeping at one time, and in a few months another newborn starts, so there goes that "break")

And when I am not taking care of infants, or checking on the kids, changing poop that happens while they sleep ( a big one this month!?) I am getting art set up for next art, preparing snack and dinner. I also email parents, upload pictures to website from morning FOR parents, and then maybe I can go pee by myself, put my feet up and relax for 30 minutes of a 12 hour day.

Now I know parents work, lets say 8 hour days with 30 minute lunch. After work for these parents, who preps for the next days work, cleans up their work station, and does work related things at night? MOST leave after 8 hours, go pee during day whenever they want, eat lunch in silence, maybe even go out to eat, then work a few more hours, and head home. They DO NOT however, stay after work, not getting paid to clean their desk, get things ready for next day, etc. If these are things us as providers should do after work, then really I would work 13-14 hour days.

Just a thought.
Don't forget to add in the groc shopping, shopping for the kids birthday presents,Christmas presents and such add that to the time you are talking about.

This is not something we will ever win with these parents on here so why bother.
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  #213  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:45 AM
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So your whole issue is that although you love the home environment, the bonds and friendships formed, the smaller numbers, limited illness exposure and all around family type feel,.... You felt him napping at family childcare was disrupting his sleep pattern? So because he got two to three hours sleep at providers he didn't go to bed until 10ish? I understand that your son is a great kid and many parents feel the same as you.
They truly would stay with their kids at least part time if their jobs allowed for it and could swing is money wise. I have the perfect solution for you! You could keep him in a family childcare and take advantage of the family vibe, smaller numbers, and general things you loved, and keep his 8/9ish bedtime!!! Just wake him 3 hours before you do now, plus that would give you even MORE quality time with him each day.

I know I know great idea isn't it?? Win win. More time for mom and son, bedtimes stay the same and you get the environment you wanted for him to begin with

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I was willing to pay for good care. I was actually paying the previous provider well above the average rate. I am not looking for "cheap" ways to keep my son up all day. You guys are STILL not getting it. I am not asking that you keep him awake while I am at work, so that when I get home, I can just put him straight to bed. I spend time with my son in the evenings, and I thoroughly enjoy it. I hate that I even have to work; I love my job, but I love my little boy wayyy more. I am not wanting an in-home daycare provider so that I can save money. I will pay what I paid at the center, or actually even more, because I LOVE the personalization you get at the in-home daycare, and the stability. I love that I know that Ms. Sally will be there like she always is and will care for my son, and not a 20 year old girl who was just fired from her waitress job so she thought she'd work at a center and see how that is.
I am willing to pay for that kind of thing. I just couldn't find one who could meet the needs of my very normal son. He didn't fight, he didn't scream, he gets along well with others, he doesn't get cranky. He just didn't need the nap. It messed up his sleeping habits at home, and I worked so hard to get him on a great schedule. Being told to lie on a cot for 3 hours will mean that he will eventually fall asleep, therefore not fall asleep at home until 10pm or later.
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  #214  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:48 AM
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nannyde nannyde is offline
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That is EXACTLY what I am asking. Why is this so difficult? I think they need break from all the kids, yes. But why is it not possible to turn on a movie for the older kiddos, or give them a quiet activity, while you take your break? I sincerely DO NOT want my child to lie on a cot for that long. It is boring, and it disrupts his already established sleep patterns at home. He can watch a movie or play quietly while others sleep. He knows what it means to be quiet, because others are sleeping. As far as the landscaping example goes, your analogy is incorrect. If I were paying you to care for my son for nine hours, then you are being paid to care for him for nine hours. You are saying that I would pay you for nine hours, however my son would actually be in your home for 12 hours. (9+3=12). But no, he is in your home for 9 hours and you are taking a 3 hour break during this 9 hours. Meaning that you really are only caring for my son for 6 hours, because you have told him to lie quietly on his cot for 3 hours. (9-3=6).
& Mandy Jane, I don't think it is necessary to attempt to insult me with your sarcastic remarks. "I assume you DO know how to read? " What is up with that? If you want me to edit your grammar on that post, I can and will. Just let me know. I will be all over that.
I am not trying to insult anyone here, and I would like it very much if you did not insult me.
I appreciate that you all care enough for children to open your home up to them. But you are running a business, you are providing a service. You need to stop being so selfish and look at what your clients need, and compare that to what you need. There needs to be a good balance. And with most of the providers I looked at, the needs of the provider were put well above the clients. They wanted a break, no exceptions. They would try to explain to me that my child DOES need a nap. They would try to tell me that yes, they are negotiable. But when I questioned them in detail what my child would be doing during "nap time", they failed to prove that my child would not be lying down doing nothing at all.

I am obviously not finding any answers here. I had to put my son in a center, when I preferred the "home-setting" and the personalization you get with a home provider. I was not able to find any provider willing to actually budge on this nap time/break time thing. That is a very large break. And yes, your job is quite different then mine. But why did you choose this kind of work if you cannot keep up with children for a full 8 hours, even? I could not do that, so I chose to NOT open a daycare in my home. If I thought that I could handle 6-8 kids (homes that I looked at had this # of kids, I definitely do NOT want my son in a home with more children than that. That is a chaotic mess) in my home then I would consider the fact that I would need to actually care for them for at least 9 hours. Meaning, that I would need to tend to children who were old enough to stay awake during the day. I would require that children who get cranky have naps. I would consult with the parent about their child's crankiness and there would be a solution. I would not "drop" the family because a child functions well w/out a nap. That IS bad business. That is cruel to the child. If they get used to a daycare, love the kids they play with, love the providers, why would you drop them because they do not need a nap?
Like I said, I am getting no answers here.
Based on the info you HAVE provided, this is my conclusion:

My son will stay in a center. In-home providers are unable to fully care for my child because they cannot handle children who do not require a nap. They would much rather disrupt his sleeping habits rather than disrupt their break.
We are giving you the answer but you are saying no to it. Your solutions are not workable for us. A kid up is a kid up. Doesn't matter to me whether they are watching TV, doing a "quiet" activity, or table craft. They are UP and one being up to me is the same as the entire house being up and being in full play.

I would NEVER try to convince you he needs a nap. He doesn't and I believe you. I also believe the legions of parents with infants to five year old who say their kid doesn't need a nap. I'm not in the business of telling you that you are wrong about it. Of course he doesn't need a nap.

I'm just not in the business of providing a no nap service. I know their are millions of children from birth to five who don't need any naps. I get that ... and I'm good with it. They just can't come to my house.

I think what you might be missing is that it IS possible to provide an amazing day care for birth to five and ONLY cater to children who NEED a full afternon nap. You are saying it comes with the territory and I'm telling you I've done this for 18 years and it IS possible to ONLY provide the service where children NEED a full afternoon nap. You ran into one after another when you did your search.
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Old 11-03-2011, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
That is EXACTLY what I am asking. Why is this so difficult? I think they need break from all the kids, yes. But why is it not possible to turn on a movie for the older kiddos, or give them a quiet activity, while you take your break? I sincerely DO NOT want my child to lie on a cot for that long. It is boring, and it disrupts his already established sleep patterns at home. He can watch a movie or play quietly while others sleep. He knows what it means to be quiet, because others are sleeping. As far as the landscaping example goes, your analogy is incorrect. If I were paying you to care for my son for nine hours, then you are being paid to care for him for nine hours. You are saying that I would pay you for nine hours, however my son would actually be in your home for 12 hours. (9+3=12). But no, he is in your home for 9 hours and you are taking a 3 hour break during this 9 hours. Meaning that you really are only caring for my son for 6 hours, because you have told him to lie quietly on his cot for 3 hours. (9-3=6).
& Mandy Jane, I don't think it is necessary to attempt to insult me with your sarcastic remarks. "I assume you DO know how to read? " What is up with that? If you want me to edit your grammar on that post, I can and will. Just let me know. I will be all over that.
I am not trying to insult anyone here, and I would like it very much if you did not insult me.
I appreciate that you all care enough for children to open your home up to them. But you are running a business, you are providing a service. You need to stop being so selfish and look at what your clients need, and compare that to what you need. There needs to be a good balance. And with most of the providers I looked at, the needs of the provider were put well above the clients. They wanted a break, no exceptions. They would try to explain to me that my child DOES need a nap. They would try to tell me that yes, they are negotiable. But when I questioned them in detail what my child would be doing during "nap time", they failed to prove that my child would not be lying down doing nothing at all.

I am obviously not finding any answers here. I had to put my son in a center, when I preferred the "home-setting" and the personalization you get with a home provider. I was not able to find any provider willing to actually budge on this nap time/break time thing. That is a very large break. And yes, your job is quite different then mine. But why did you choose this kind of work if you cannot keep up with children for a full 8 hours, even? I could not do that, so I chose to NOT open a daycare in my home. If I thought that I could handle 6-8 kids (homes that I looked at had this # of kids, I definitely do NOT want my son in a home with more children than that. That is a chaotic mess) in my home then I would consider the fact that I would need to actually care for them for at least 9 hours. Meaning, that I would need to tend to children who were old enough to stay awake during the day. I would require that children who get cranky have naps. I would consult with the parent about their child's crankiness and there would be a solution. I would not "drop" the family because a child functions well w/out a nap. That IS bad business. That is cruel to the child. If they get used to a daycare, love the kids they play with, love the providers, why would you drop them because they do not need a nap?
Like I said, I am getting no answers here.
Based on the info you HAVE provided, this is my conclusion:

My son will stay in a center. In-home providers are unable to fully care for my child because they cannot handle children who do not require a nap. They would much rather disrupt his sleeping habits rather than disrupt their break.

I have a feeling there is much more going on here, and probably the center is not as honest with you as in a home daycare. Maybe your child is disruptive and they felt he needed to quiet down, or they saw he needed a nap.

Most 4 years old I've had need a nap because we have a very active day. If your child has trouble keeping still at that age there might be other things going on with him; why you've been through various daycares. As providers we see this all the time, and often they end up at the chain type centers.

Currently I have a 4 year old and he needs a 2 hr nap every day, otherwise he is a terror. And he would not play quietly. I suspect you're embellishing the 3 hrs on the mat too. If he is taking a nap at any daycare it means he needs that nap no matter what age.

I think it comes down to your schedule being disrupted, not his.
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  #216  
Old 11-03-2011, 10:59 AM
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I have the perfect solution for you! You could keep him in a family childcare and take advantage of the family vibe, smaller numbers, and general things you loved, and keep his 8/9ish bedtime!!! Just wake him 3 hours before you do now, plus that would give you even MORE quality time with him each day.

I know I know great idea isn't it?? Win win. More time for mom and son, bedtimes stay the same and you get the environment you wanted for him to begin with
Really?? When I pay someone for a service I don't expect to have to edit my families daily life for this service. I do not feel that waking up at 4am is a good solution. But good try.
That would STILL be disrupting my son's sleeping schedule. The big problem is that I want an in-home daycare that will allow my four year old to stay awake during your break time. When I was searching for an in-home daycare that would allow this, I did find providers that were willing to let my son go without the unnecessary nap. But there were other things I did not like. (Food provided, dirty home, too many kids, etc). I could never find one that I liked that didn't have the nap policy for older kids. I've settled on a center due to this, I'm happy with it. I would've been happier with a great in-home provider that met all of my/my child's needs, but was unable to find one. I came to this forum because I wanted to really question the nap thing. I really wanted to know why providers take these long breaks. I really wanted to know why I had to resort to putting my son in a center.
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  #217  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
That is EXACTLY what I am asking. Why is this so difficult? I think they need break from all the kids, yes. But why is it not possible to turn on a movie for the older kiddos, or give them a quiet activity, while you take your break? I sincerely DO NOT want my child to lie on a cot for that long. It is boring, and it disrupts his already established sleep patterns at home. He can watch a movie or play quietly while others sleep. He knows what it means to be quiet, because others are sleeping. As far as the landscaping example goes, your analogy is incorrect. If I were paying you to care for my son for nine hours, then you are being paid to care for him for nine hours. You are saying that I would pay you for nine hours, however my son would actually be in your home for 12 hours. (9+3=12). But no, he is in your home for 9 hours and you are taking a 3 hour break during this 9 hours. Meaning that you really are only caring for my son for 6 hours, because you have told him to lie quietly on his cot for 3 hours. (9-3=6).
& Mandy Jane, I don't think it is necessary to attempt to insult me with your sarcastic remarks. "I assume you DO know how to read? " What is up with that? If you want me to edit your grammar on that post, I can and will. Just let me know. I will be all over that.
I am not trying to insult anyone here, and I would like it very much if you did not insult me.
I appreciate that you all care enough for children to open your home up to them. But you are running a business, you are providing a service. You need to stop being so selfish and look at what your clients need, and compare that to what you need. There needs to be a good balance. And with most of the providers I looked at, the needs of the provider were put well above the clients. They wanted a break, no exceptions. They would try to explain to me that my child DOES need a nap. They would try to tell me that yes, they are negotiable. But when I questioned them in detail what my child would be doing during "nap time", they failed to prove that my child would not be lying down doing nothing at all.

I am obviously not finding any answers here. I had to put my son in a center, when I preferred the "home-setting" and the personalization you get with a home provider. I was not able to find any provider willing to actually budge on this nap time/break time thing. That is a very large break. And yes, your job is quite different then mine. But why did you choose this kind of work if you cannot keep up with children for a full 8 hours, even? I could not do that, so I chose to NOT open a daycare in my home. If I thought that I could handle 6-8 kids (homes that I looked at had this # of kids, I definitely do NOT want my son in a home with more children than that. That is a chaotic mess) in my home then I would consider the fact that I would need to actually care for them for at least 9 hours. Meaning, that I would need to tend to children who were old enough to stay awake during the day. I would require that children who get cranky have naps. I would consult with the parent about their child's crankiness and there would be a solution. I would not "drop" the family because a child functions well w/out a nap. That IS bad business. That is cruel to the child. If they get used to a daycare, love the kids they play with, love the providers, why would you drop them because they do not need a nap?
Like I said, I am getting no answers here.
Based on the info you HAVE provided, this is my conclusion:

My son will stay in a center. In-home providers are unable to fully care for my child because they cannot handle children who do not require a nap. They would much rather disrupt his sleeping habits rather than disrupt their break.
The one part of this post that bothers me is that you think because they are sleeping we are not caring for them?

when your child in signed into DC and on my premises, I am 100% responsible for them, until you sign them out and take them home.

So that means if during nap time an earthquake should hit, or a gas leak rupture in my home, I will need to remove your awake or sleeping child from my home. I must continue to watch and care for your child 100% of the time they are in my care. AWAKE or ALSEEP. My insurance company does not give me a discount when your child is sleeping. Therefore, I will still need money to cover this cost and I am still working, I am just not up having to continue to entertain your child, because they need to rest their over thinking minds and I do too.

Yes, some children can be quiet during nap time, most can't. Then it leads to a stressful environment for those children that are awake. The provider is constantly having to quiet the children that are awake. Who wants to hear please be quiet or lower your voice a million times? Not me, not you, not a child.

I know its been said a million times, but if a daycare does not offer a service your child needs, then you need to find a different daycare for your child..

It's like your going to jiffy lube asking for your brakes to be changed and they don't offer that service.....
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  #218  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:14 AM
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I am in NYS. Our regulations for home-based child care state that children must be provided with a rest period. They also state that children who are unable to rest be given alternate activities and that children must not be forced to rest for "excessive" periods.
All children under the age of five are required to rest here. For the first thirty minutes of nap time they are required to lay on their cots quietly. This allows anyone who is going to fall asleep a chance to do so and it gives me time to put the two babies down for their nap. After the initial 30 min. anyone who is awake is given a "nap box" - a shoe box with quiet activities such as books, crayons and a scribble pad, finger puppets, a magna-doodle, cards, puzzles etc. I have several boxes so the kids don't get bored with the same stuff over and over again. Anyone over the age of five is allowed to play in the playroom. If they have a nap box they are expected to play independently and quietly. If they are in the playroom they are expected to play quietly. All of this is spelled out in my contract.
Even though all of the parents return a signed contract signifying that they have read and understand my policies, I cannot tell you how many parents STILL do not accept the nap time rules:
Parent: "Why does my child have to play up here if other kids get to go in the playroom?"
Me: Because it is against the law for the toddlers and preschoolers to be out of my sight. Tiffany can play quietly right here.
Parent:"He doesn't want to nap."
Me: "?!" (There is a huge difference between a child outgrowing and not needing their nap and just not wanting to take one!)
Parent: "Why can't she play with you during nap?"
Me: Because I am not your child's playmate! We spend 4-5 hours (depending on when they are dropped off) a morning doing activities: art, playing outside, preschool stuff, story time, etc. etc. I am here to help facilitate Jack's learning and socialization, not to be his friend. And yes, I need a break in my 10 hour day! I am sorry if that makes me a bad person! I do not understand why only child care providers are expected to go without a break?!
On one occasion I had only one school-ager, and instead of having her play in the playroom by herself while the little ones napped, I let her watch a movie. Well, parents complained about that! I have no problem meeting individual needs and accommodating non-nappers, but sometimes I get so frustrated because it seems as though no one is ever satisfied with what I do.
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  #219  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:16 AM
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CheekyChick CheekyChick is offline
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In response to the parent who feels we don't deserve a break...

I am an in-home facility and don't require my 4 and 5 year olds to nap. I (personally) think it would be cruel to have an older child lay on his/her cot for 2+ hours quietly. I wouldn't be happy if my children were forced to that. So... I allow my older "non-nappers" to sit at a table and play quiet games, read, draw, etc.

With that said, anyone working with small children from 7:30 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. DESERVES and NEEDS a break. I also don't consider a parent paying $3.00 per hour "good" money. You probably pay your gardner $25.00 per hour, but you pay the person who loves and nurtures your son most of his waking hours approximately $3.00 an hour? Hmmm.... That hardly seems fair. Lastly, I'm sure when you're with your son on a Saturday, you do not play with him for 10 hours straight. Do you never sit down to pay bills, return calls, hop on the Internet, watch a TV show, read a magazine? I'm sure you do...
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  #220  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:20 AM
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Please remember that in your center, the staff is getting a break, they just rotate them in and out of rooms as necessary for the supervision of non-nappers.

Most home daycares don't have that luxury. A non-napper actually often requires more supervision as they will do all they can to wake some friends to play with. Not to mention the younger nappers that now fight nap because they see others not having to

Today I have had no breakfast, no lunch, no drinks and no potty break.

I still have one awake. It doesn't make any difference. I'm still "on the clock" so my needs will have to wait.

Before I did daycare I had visions of my provider watching soaps and cleaning her house during naptime.

You know what? I just realized that I havent even seen a soap since I worked outside the home (13 years now) and and watched them during my lunch break. I never appreciated those freedoms. I believed I earned them and would have quit my job if they were denied to me.

Home vs center are so different I cannot believe people even compare the two when it comes to stuff like this.

I know I sound cranky. I'd give anything for a cracker or something right now.

And I really need to pee
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  #221  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:22 AM
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This is hysterical, you lie in this post and completely contradict yourself. Ok so if your son just laid there for 3 hours, that would mean he didn't sleep meaning he would go to bed a normal time. You say he doesn't need a nap and won't take one, but then you say he would be so bord he would fall asleep, LOL. You go back and forth!

The real story is it was quiet time, and after a busy day he went to sleep like any other normal child. Meaning he wanted to stay up a normal time at night, and you wanted him down early so you wouldn't have to deal with him. If he stays up later at night, you let him sleep in till the last minute....so you also don't have to deal with him in the morning, so you can get ready for work. LOL.

Yep we have all had parents just like you!
I did not contradict myself at all. My son does not need a nap. He starts school next year and he will not nap then. He is able to stay awake from 7:30am to 8:30pm each and every day without having any cranky issues. This provider required that my son lay still on a cot for 2-3 hours. Yes, after a period of time HE WOULD FALL ASLEEP. If I went to my bed, RIGHT NOW, and laid there looking at a ten-page picture book for 2-3 hours, I WOULD FALL ASLEEP. BECAUSE IT IS BORING. I then would not be able to fall asleep at my normal bedtime. I am NOT trying to pay someone to keep my child awake all day so that he passes out right when he gets home. That is ridiculous. I enjoy spending time with my child in the evenings, I really, truly do. I can see where parents would be tired and they wouldn't want to "deal" with their own kids. But they need to realize that this is all the "little kid" time your going to get with this child. They are going to grow up, and you are going to miss it. I do not want to miss it. I want my son to really enjoy being four years old. I want him to really love his mom because she plays with him as often as she can. We have plans EVERY weekend. We go do something fun. I can have my "free time" when my child is 16 and wants to go hang out with his friends. Right now he wants to hang out with his mommy, and I am not about to give that up. However, I have really worked hard on establishing a great sleep schedule, and I have found that 8:30pm is good for him. He started sleeping less and less when he first turned four. I decided to stop putting him down for naps, because it was getting difficult to try and make him sleep. I learned that he was fine without the naps. My mother was his babysitter at this time, she had been for quite some time. She agreed that he was fine without the naps, and he still went to sleep at 8:30pm just fine. Then my wonderful mother decided that she was going to take a job offer. That meant my little guy needed to go to daycare. & thus, all of this mess that I am throwing a big fit about. For now, I will leave him in the in center. He seems to enjoy it, I get a daily report with all the stuff he did that day. And he isn't required to lay quietly or fall asleep out of boredom. I really liked the idea of an in-home daycare, but I couldn't find the right one.
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  #222  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:23 AM
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Maybe you need to look into having a stay at home mom watch him. We don't tend to make our kids nap forever for the same reason you don't want yours to nap forever. The environment is home-like and the group would be very small. You may not get all the bells and whistles these ladies offer, but let me tell you, your child will be fine without all that a "daycare provider" thinks kids need to be doing every day. When we need a little break, Sesame Street is still a wonderful show for kids. While your child is with us, he probably won't be told to GO PLAY TOYS because he'll be too busy learning to count while we bake, learn his colors while we sort clean socks, learn to be a helper while he puts toilet paper rolls in the cupboard, learn about plants when we water them, learn about the different kinds of birds after we've filled the bird feeder together. I'm happy to earn some money and offer a safe place for a little friend while I'm home. It's worked great for the families I've had so far.
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  #223  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:36 AM
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Maybe you need to look into having a stay at home mom watch him. We don't tend to make our kids nap forever for the same reason you don't want yours to nap forever. The environment is home-like and the group would be very small. You may not get all the bells and whistles these ladies offer, but let me tell you, your child will be fine without all that a "daycare provider" thinks kids need to be doing every day. When we need a little break, Sesame Street is still a wonderful show for kids. While your child is with us, he probably won't be told to GO PLAY TOYS because he'll be too busy learning to count while we bake, learn his colors while we sort clean socks, learn to be a helper while he puts toilet paper rolls in the cupboard, learn about plants when we water them, learn about the different kinds of birds after we've filled the bird feeder together. I'm happy to earn some money and offer a safe place for a little friend while I'm home. It's worked great for the families I've had so far.
You are right! This is exactly what I need. My mother was EXACTLY like this before she started working again. This was perfect! I just wanted to have him be around other kids. His cousin was with him at my mother's house and they are around the same age so it was so perfect. But when she started working again, my sister moved her son into a center and I wanted to keep that home environment going when it came to my son's care. I do not know a stay at home mom that could care for my son. I first hired a nanny. Except I really wanted my son to play with other children daily. I wanted him to make some little friendships because he starts school soon. I ended the nanny thing and then started the in-home daycare/nap policy fiasco.
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  #224  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:44 AM
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You are right! This is exactly what I need. My mother was EXACTLY like this before she started working again. This was perfect! I just wanted to have him be around other kids. His cousin was with him at my mother's house and they are around the same age so it was so perfect. But when she started working again, my sister moved her son into a center and I wanted to keep that home environment going when it came to my son's care. I do not know a stay at home mom that could care for my son. I first hired a nanny. Except I really wanted my son to play with other children daily. I wanted him to make some little friendships because he starts school soon. I ended the nanny thing and then started the in-home daycare/nap policy fiasco.
Probably the best place to find a willing stay at home mom is through the school your child will attend. Call and ask if they know of any stay at home moms who watch a couple kids. You could also check with your local story time librarian. She'll usually know who the stay at home moms are that bring an extra or two along. We're around, we just don't advertise because someone is always recommending us. ;~)
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  #225  
Old 11-03-2011, 11:48 AM
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I did not contradict myself at all. My son does not need a nap. He starts school next year and he will not nap then. He is able to stay awake from 7:30am to 8:30pm each and every day without having any cranky issues. This provider required that my son lay still on a cot for 2-3 hours. Yes, after a period of time HE WOULD FALL ASLEEP. If I went to my bed, RIGHT NOW, and laid there looking at a ten-page picture book for 2-3 hours, I WOULD FALL ASLEEP. BECAUSE IT IS BORING. I then would not be able to fall asleep at my normal bedtime. I am NOT trying to pay someone to keep my child awake all day so that he passes out right when he gets home. That is ridiculous. I enjoy spending time with my child in the evenings, I really, truly do. I can see where parents would be tired and they wouldn't want to "deal" with their own kids. But they need to realize that this is all the "little kid" time your going to get with this child. They are going to grow up, and you are going to miss it. I do not want to miss it. I want my son to really enjoy being four years old. I want him to really love his mom because she plays with him as often as she can. We have plans EVERY weekend. We go do something fun. I can have my "free time" when my child is 16 and wants to go hang out with his friends. Right now he wants to hang out with his mommy, and I am not about to give that up. However, I have really worked hard on establishing a great sleep schedule, and I have found that 8:30pm is good for him. He started sleeping less and less when he first turned four. I decided to stop putting him down for naps, because it was getting difficult to try and make him sleep. I learned that he was fine without the naps. My mother was his babysitter at this time, she had been for quite some time. She agreed that he was fine without the naps, and he still went to sleep at 8:30pm just fine. Then my wonderful mother decided that she was going to take a job offer. That meant my little guy needed to go to daycare. & thus, all of this mess that I am throwing a big fit about. For now, I will leave him in the in center. He seems to enjoy it, I get a daily report with all the stuff he did that day. And he isn't required to lay quietly or fall asleep out of boredom. I really liked the idea of an in-home daycare, but I couldn't find the right one.
You sound like a great Mom. I would love to work for you minus the nap deal. Just keep looking for the right placement if you are still interested.

I hope your experience here has taught you that it's not personal. It's not about what you need or your kid needs. Deciding to limit the business to only children who NEED a full afternoon nap is just ONE of the decisions we make in this business. It's not made for the benefit of one family or one kid. For me, it's based on YEARS of doing this and wanting happiness, LONGEVITY, and being around really rested kids. I love the nappers... they are my fave.

Don't take it personally... cuz it's not personal. It's just business.
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Old 11-03-2011, 11:56 AM
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Probably the best place to find a willing stay at home mom is through the school your child will attend. Call and ask if they know of any stay at home moms who watch a couple kids. You could also check with your local story time librarian. She'll usually know who the stay at home moms are that bring an extra or two along. We're around, we just don't advertise because someone is always recommending us. ;~)
I cannot believe I did not even think about that. I thought about getting a babysitter, but I only knew friends and family members who all work and mainly take their own kids to centers. I will definitely become a little more nosy about what these mothers are doing - going to the library in the afternoon on a weekday! haha. I may sound like a freak asking "Hello, it appears you are a stay at home mom and you have three kids with you. May I please go into your home and observe for a day so that I can determine if I want to ask you to watch my son, as well?"
I'm sure I can find a better way of finding one of these fabulous people, but I pictured my self totally doing that like a weirdo.
I am still so shocked that I did not think of this. I mean, if I am going to allow a stranger to watch my child, why does she have to own an in-home daycare? I can find a good "babysitter". I was just thinking friends & family when I thought of "babysitter". My mother wasn't licensed to care for children, but she watched my son & my nephew and she was absolutely the best. I would need to find someone who only keeps a couple of kids, and I would need to see what they feed my child, what the home is like, etc. I just have to track one down.
Thanks!!!
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Old 11-03-2011, 12:22 PM
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Check with your local elementary schools as well. They often keep a list of moms that babysit in the area and have children attending the school. You might find someone who can continue with afterschool care next year for you.
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Old 11-03-2011, 12:52 PM
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I cannot believe I did not even think about that. I thought about getting a babysitter, but I only knew friends and family members who all work and mainly take their own kids to centers. I will definitely become a little more nosy about what these mothers are doing - going to the library in the afternoon on a weekday! haha. I may sound like a freak asking "Hello, it appears you are a stay at home mom and you have three kids with you. May I please go into your home and observe for a day so that I can determine if I want to ask you to watch my son, as well?"
I'm sure I can find a better way of finding one of these fabulous people, but I pictured my self totally doing that like a weirdo.
I am still so shocked that I did not think of this. I mean, if I am going to allow a stranger to watch my child, why does she have to own an in-home daycare? I can find a good "babysitter". I was just thinking friends & family when I thought of "babysitter". My mother wasn't licensed to care for children, but she watched my son & my nephew and she was absolutely the best. I would need to find someone who only keeps a couple of kids, and I would need to see what they feed my child, what the home is like, etc. I just have to track one down.
Thanks!!!
You're welcome! But, I do have to warn you...asking to come and observe for a day probably won't get you anywhere. We are stay at home moms...we do the things stay at home moms do....laundry, dishes, cooking/baking, gardening, etc. and we would feel really weird having you come to watch that so the day wouldn't look like a normal day anyway. Definitely ask to visit to see what the home and mom are like, but don't be thinking that because we're home all day that it's all neat as a pin...we live in it 24/7 so it may or may not be quite as tidy as your house. Of course, ask about the food and napping, just don't get too high and mighty on us. Don't think you're our boss, because we are not a nanny. Don't go into it thinking it should be any cheaper. It has to be worth our trouble to do it. Check around. You'll find what you're looking for, but have an open mind when you find someone. Good luck on your search!
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Old 11-03-2011, 01:52 PM
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Remember also with a SAHM, they are also doing things for the family also. If they need to go to the store, run errands, do grocery shopping your son will need to go so don't ask that they don't transport. Also, they will probably be very involved with their own childrens lifes so don't be suprised if they want to go on field trips, school parties and things that maybe your son won't be able to do. In that case will you have back-up care?
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Old 11-03-2011, 01:55 PM
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You're welcome! But, I do have to warn you...asking to come and observe for a day probably won't get you anywhere. We are stay at home moms...we do the things stay at home moms do....laundry, dishes, cooking/baking, gardening, etc. and we would feel really weird having you come to watch that so the day wouldn't look like a normal day anyway. Definitely ask to visit to see what the home and mom are like, but don't be thinking that because we're home all day that it's all neat as a pin...we live in it 24/7 so it may or may not be quite as tidy as your house. Of course, ask about the food and napping, just don't get too high and mighty on us. Don't think you're our boss, because we are not a nanny. Don't go into it thinking it should be any cheaper. It has to be worth our trouble to do it. Check around. You'll find what you're looking for, but have an open mind when you find someone. Good luck on your search!

Oh my goodness, I think this summed it up why she has gone from daycare to daycare!
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Old 11-03-2011, 01:56 PM
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Oh my goodness, I think this summed it up why she has gone from daycare to daycare!
Consider registering on the forum. You won't have to wait for your conversation to be moderated.
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Old 11-03-2011, 02:28 PM
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Oh my goodness, I think this summed it up why she has gone from daycare to daycare!
how did this sum it up? I am not sure I understand what you are saying here?
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Old 11-03-2011, 02:46 PM
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Consider registering on the forum. You won't have to wait for your conversation to be moderated.

Thankyou Michael, I am already a member on here.

Just decided to post unregistered for this one!
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Old 11-03-2011, 03:14 PM
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I cannot believe I did not even think about that. I thought about getting a babysitter, but I only knew friends and family members who all work and mainly take their own kids to centers. I will definitely become a little more nosy about what these mothers are doing - going to the library in the afternoon on a weekday! haha. I may sound like a freak asking "Hello, it appears you are a stay at home mom and you have three kids with you. May I please go into your home and observe for a day so that I can determine if I want to ask you to watch my son, as well?"
I'm sure I can find a better way of finding one of these fabulous people, but I pictured my self totally doing that like a weirdo.
I am still so shocked that I did not think of this. I mean, if I am going to allow a stranger to watch my child, why does she have to own an in-home daycare? I can find a good "babysitter". I was just thinking friends & family when I thought of "babysitter". My mother wasn't licensed to care for children, but she watched my son & my nephew and she was absolutely the best. I would need to find someone who only keeps a couple of kids, and I would need to see what they feed my child, what the home is like, etc. I just have to track one down.
Thanks!!!
Even though in my state you are not allowed to watch kids w/out a license, there are still plenty of SAHMs that advertise on Craigslist to babysit. You might be able to find someone that way too.
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  #235  
Old 11-03-2011, 03:25 PM
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Remember also with a SAHM, they are also doing things for the family also. If they need to go to the store, run errands, do grocery shopping your son will need to go so don't ask that they don't transport. Also, they will probably be very involved with their own childrens lifes so don't be suprised if they want to go on field trips, school parties and things that maybe your son won't be able to do. In that case will you have back-up care?
These are definitely things to check on as well. I live in the country so we really don't go anywhere too often, but if I want to go out & about, we do. I have parents sign the same type of transportation waiver that a daycare would. I carry with me all the pertinent information about each child that a daycare would. It's not a bad thing to go to the grocery store. There are a LOT of learning opportunities to be found there, from colors to numbers and letters. I probably wouldn't watch your child if I couldn't get permission to leave the house. If I want to do things with my school kids, I simply have my mom come over just like she would for my own kids. Parents know this up front and within a few days of the child being here, I usually have my mom, who is still a stay at home mom, come over for pickup time so the parents can meet her. Some parents have just taken a day off, some get another family member...it all depends on what they want to do, but I always have a backup for them if they need it.
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Old 11-03-2011, 03:37 PM
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how did this sum it up? I am not sure I understand what you are saying here?
I think this person thinks it was "summed up" because I think I am the boss & need to realize that I am not. This is true, I need to really think about daycare as a service that I sign up for. I know I am having a hard time viewing it the right way. & I am sorry for that. I just have a hard time paying someone and then dealing with that person when they are not doing the job to my standards. I know that this is not the same thing as hiring an employee. This is very different, but at the same time, there are similarities. It's hard for me to grasp that. I will get over that, just need to think about it as a business owner. I apologize for offending anyone with my wrongful way of labeling the work you do for me.

On another note, this really isn't summed up. I thought it was a GREAT idea to find a SAHM to watch my son. But I would HAVE to ask her what goes on day to day, and she could list all these wonderful things all day long, if she wanted. But I am still asking a stranger to care for my son, I would HAVE to visit her home and watch what goes on with these children, even if only for an hour or so. I cannot believe what she says and drop my kid off the next day. No way. I mean, what if she sits on the couch all day and yells at the kids to shut up because she is trying to hear the TV? What if she says it is OK for my son to have potato chips and chocolate ice cream for lunch? I know nothing like that would go on while I was watching, but I could get idea of who she is and what she does by watching her tone and how she interacts with the kids. I wouldn't mind if she folded laundry and let the kids help, or watered the plants, or turned on a good TV show for them for a little bit. I understand that a child does not have to be sitting at a table reciting ABC's and 123's and doing the standard "curriculum"-based activities in order to learn. My mother watched my son for quite a long time, he learned so much spending his days with her. She did not do anything special, she took him to the park, showed him how to tie his shoelaces, my son actually knows how to fold a towel perfectly, lol. He can say his ABC's and count to 19. (He gets mixed up after that and goes back to 12). I actually wouldn't mind if the SAHM drove my son around, as long as they didn't take a full 8 hour road trip each day, & there were logical reasons to drive him, that is fine. I just need to know I can trust this person first. How can I do that if it is too weird for me to watch for a little while? I need to make a good call on this person and evaluate them the best I can before I allow my child to spend a great, big chunk of his life at this home? Can I get some suggestions here? (I also just registered but I am not sure if I should sign in because I do not want to get attacked and remembered as a horribly difficult parent that daycare providers hate, and I am not sure if I will be using this forum regularly. I don't typically have this many daycare issues. The whole nap thing with a recent provider really irked me. I went searching online for other nap policies pertaining to four year olds, and I came across this).
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  #237  
Old 11-03-2011, 04:58 PM
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It's hard for me to grasp that. I will get over that, just need to think about it as a business owner. I apologize for offending anyone with my wrongful way of labeling the work you do for me.

Can I get some suggestions here? (I also just registered but I am not sure if I should sign in because I do not want to get attacked and remembered as a horribly difficult parent that daycare providers hate, and I am not sure if I will be using this forum regularly. I don't typically have this many daycare issues. The whole nap thing with a recent provider really irked me. I went searching online for other nap policies pertaining to four year olds, and I came across this).
You have the same right to vent your frustrations here as anyone else. Stick around, we ALL have something to learn from each other.

And for the record, I was the worlds most horribly demanding parent . That is why I opened my own daycare.
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  #238  
Old 11-03-2011, 04:59 PM
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I posted the last reply on this thread. I am thinking I should probably start a new thread asking for suggestions on how to establish trust if I choose a SAHM as a provider. What category should this be in? The Parent and Guardians category? I think I will start there.
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  #239  
Old 11-03-2011, 05:11 PM
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I posted the last reply on this thread. I am thinking I should probably start a new thread asking for suggestions on how to establish trust if I choose a SAHM as a provider. What category should this be in? The Parent and Guardians category? I think I will start there.
If you want the providers to tell you to absolute truth, no PR, then I'd recommend the providers section. Many Family Home Providers started out that way.
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Old 11-03-2011, 05:33 PM
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Ok, I will post it there.
Thanks!
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  #241  
Old 11-03-2011, 08:50 PM
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Believe me you... if you were a provider who was willing to do a twelve hour haul without a BIG break mid day... you would be killing it in your business.
I do provide this service. I don't make a killing. If I have a 4 yr old who I have determined does not benefit from a nap, and in fact loses sleep at night because of it, then I don't give them a nap. They sit and do quiet activities. I am fully capable of doing dishes while a kid colors, watches a dvd, or plays with a dollhouse. You make it sound like we have to sit WITH the kid, therefore not getting a break. Nope. I go about my bizness.

That being said, you also imply that parents would LOVE it if I didn't give their kid a nap. That's not always true. I have had many who want LONGER naps sometimes! They don't want to deal with a kid who is cranky when mom shows up. She can't even go to the grocery store to pick up two items because the kid is whiney. So I'm not sure why you think a no-nap policy would be so desirable to parents. To some, maybe, but not all. If they need it, they need it. If they don't, they don't. I see no value in forcing them to lay there. I actually find it demeaning.
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Old 11-03-2011, 09:03 PM
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Because if you do a no nap policy and the parents don't want to spend time with the child in the evening they can pick them up tired, feed them and head them straight to bed. Believe me parents are looking for child care that doesn't nap children so they are tired enough for a 6 or 7 oclock bedtime. I have one child that now fights naps and nap on the way home at 5 and then head to bed at 7:30.
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Old 11-03-2011, 09:16 PM
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Because if you do a no nap policy and the parents don't want to spend time with the child in the evening they can pick them up tired, feed them and head them straight to bed. Believe me parents are looking for child care that doesn't nap children so they are tired enough for a 6 or 7 oclock bedtime. I have one child that now fights naps and nap on the way home at 5 and then head to bed at 7:30.
This child would not fit my criteria for "doesn't benefit from a nap". I don't want to be misunderstood. If they NEED one, they need one. I don't let them stay awake because mom & dad asked me to so they could put him to sleep earlier. Nuh-uh! It has to be the kid described by Unregistered - the kid who just lays there frustrated, and then can't sleep at night because they had such a long and un-necessary (for them) rest time. It's MY call. Not the kid, and not mom and dad.
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  #244  
Old 11-04-2011, 06:58 AM
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I do provide this service. I don't make a killing. If I have a 4 yr old who I have determined does not benefit from a nap, and in fact loses sleep at night because of it, then I don't give them a nap. They sit and do quiet activities. I am fully capable of doing dishes while a kid colors, watches a dvd, or plays with a dollhouse. You make it sound like we have to sit WITH the kid, therefore not getting a break. Nope. I go about my bizness.

That being said, you also imply that parents would LOVE it if I didn't give their kid a nap. That's not always true. I have had many who want LONGER naps sometimes! They don't want to deal with a kid who is cranky when mom shows up. She can't even go to the grocery store to pick up two items because the kid is whiney. So I'm not sure why you think a no-nap policy would be so desirable to parents. To some, maybe, but not all. If they need it, they need it. If they don't, they don't. I see no value in forcing them to lay there. I actually find it demeaning.
I completely, 100%, TOTALLY agree and do the same
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  #245  
Old 11-04-2011, 07:38 AM
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I do provide this service. I don't make a killing. If I have a 4 yr old who I have determined does not benefit from a nap, and in fact loses sleep at night because of it, then I don't give them a nap. They sit and do quiet activities. I am fully capable of doing dishes while a kid colors, watches a dvd, or plays with a dollhouse. You make it sound like we have to sit WITH the kid, therefore not getting a break. Nope. I go about my bizness.

That being said, you also imply that parents would LOVE it if I didn't give their kid a nap. That's not always true. I have had many who want LONGER naps sometimes! They don't want to deal with a kid who is cranky when mom shows up. She can't even go to the grocery store to pick up two items because the kid is whiney. So I'm not sure why you think a no-nap policy would be so desirable to parents. To some, maybe, but not all. If they need it, they need it. If they don't, they don't. I see no value in forcing them to lay there. I actually find it demeaning.
I'm not saying you are going to go to the bank if you are offering services only to kids who YOU think don't need a nap. I'm saying that you will make bank if you offer services to the kids who have PARENTS who say they don't need a nap.

If you marketed your daycare that you don't do ANY naps for any kid of any age unless parents request the nap you would have people knocking your door down to get in. There are LEGIONS of parents out there who want their kid up ALL........... DAY.............. LONG.
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Old 11-04-2011, 08:06 AM
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Maybe you need to look into having a stay at home mom watch him. We don't tend to make our kids nap forever for the same reason you don't want yours to nap forever. The environment is home-like and the group would be very small. You may not get all the bells and whistles these ladies offer, but let me tell you, your child will be fine without all that a "daycare provider" thinks kids need to be doing every day. When we need a little break, Sesame Street is still a wonderful show for kids. While your child is with us, he probably won't be told to GO PLAY TOYS because he'll be too busy learning to count while we bake, learn his colors while we sort clean socks, learn to be a helper while he puts toilet paper rolls in the cupboard, learn about plants when we water them, learn about the different kinds of birds after we've filled the bird feeder together. I'm happy to earn some money and offer a safe place for a little friend while I'm home. It's worked great for the families I've had so far.
A good provider is going to take in all and make a decision for what is best for your child when it comes to napping. Telling a child to GO Play Toys is a nice thing to do- you need to read more about NannyDe and her belief behind this, because it does make sense and works. It's not the only thing this child is doing all day. Smaller daycares verses centers, to me are better. Your child doesn't become a number in a center. He/She becomes extended family in a small group childcare. His needs are cared for faster and usually the kids grow up together. Not as much come and go. I am not downing Centers, just preference. There are good and bad in both. You really need to look around and find a good fit for your little love. Demanding all your wants and expecting that in any type of care system is not realistic. It has to work for the group as a whole. Asking that your child not sleep or sit quiet past two hours is reasonable. If your child is happy to go and happy when you pick them up to me that is what counts, and if your child is well looked out for when you can't be there to do that ......you know you have a good provider.
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Old 11-04-2011, 08:11 AM
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I'm not saying you are going to go to the bank if you are offering services only to kids who YOU think don't need a nap. I'm saying that you will make bank if you offer services to the kids who have PARENTS who say they don't need a nap.

If you marketed your daycare that you don't do ANY naps for any kid of any age unless parents request the nap you would have people knocking your door down to get in. There are LEGIONS of parents out there who want their kid up ALL........... DAY.............. LONG.
Odd. I've never met ONE in 17 plus years who has asked for no nap. Hmmm. (Unless it was for the four year old who is aging out of one. Then we begin the discussions and trials.) I have had them say their kid needs MORE nap because they're so whiney.
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Old 11-04-2011, 08:14 AM
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Odd. I've never met ONE in 17 plus years who has asked for no nap. Hmmm. (Unless it was for the four year old who is aging out of one. Then we begin the discussions and trials.) I have had them say their kid needs MORE nap because they're so whiney.
You are out in the country a bit, like me, right?

I think that is why we don't see it. Kids are more active out here. In the city/suburbs this seems to be more of an issue.

I have not seen it again once I made the move out here...
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Old 11-04-2011, 08:22 AM
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You are out in the country a bit, like me, right?

I think that is why we don't see it. Kids are more active out here. In the city/suburbs this seems to be more of an issue.

I have not seen it again once I made the move out here...
That was my thought too.... We are pretty rural and most my dck's spend a majority of their time doing outside/physical activites.

In all my years, I have had only 1 ask for her child to not be napped. She was, sadly a parent who didn't want any face time with her child and he did go to bed at 6:30 after being at care from 7 AM until 5:30 PM. So, in my situation, it had nothing to do with the child's needs but about the parents.
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Old 11-04-2011, 09:35 AM
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A good provider is going to take in all and make a decision for what is best for your child when it comes to napping. Telling a child to GO Play Toys is a nice thing to do- you need to read more about NannyDe and her belief behind this, because it does make sense and works. It's not the only thing this child is doing all day. Smaller daycares verses centers, to me are better. Your child doesn't become a number in a center. He/She becomes extended family in a small group childcare. His needs are cared for faster and usually the kids grow up together. Not as much come and go. I am not downing Centers, just preference. There are good and bad in both. You really need to look around and find a good fit for your little love. Demanding all your wants and expecting that in any type of care system is not realistic. It has to work for the group as a whole. Asking that your child not sleep or sit quiet past two hours is reasonable. If your child is happy to go and happy when you pick them up to me that is what counts, and if your child is well looked out for when you can't be there to do that ......you know you have a good provider.

Good advice. If they are going home happy you have a good provider.

The child is four years old, he will tell mom all about his day. Plus he should be able to sit on a mat for a length of time to settle down or to have a quiet time.

In all my years a child merely falls asleep if they are tired, there is no forcing them. Here they can have a book or paint, but often IF I have them play they are not quiet and end up waking the other children.

Even a 4 yr old needs a quiet time if not a nap.
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  #251  
Old 11-04-2011, 09:59 AM
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You are out in the country a bit, like me, right?

I think that is why we don't see it. Kids are more active out here. In the city/suburbs this seems to be more of an issue.

I have not seen it again once I made the move out here...

Sort of in between. I am in a town of 15,000 people. We are a mixture of rural and urban, but its a pretty built up and quickly growing town. The "urban" is pushing out the "rural" pretty quickly. It's small-town mentality in that we feel safe to leave our doors unlocked, we are very friendly as if we all know each other, etc. We have 3 elementary schools, and 1 each of middle and high schools. We are 7 miles from a town of about 40,000, and 30 minutes from a metropolitan city of 600,000 population.
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  #252  
Old 11-04-2011, 07:06 PM
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Really?? When I pay someone for a service I don't expect to have to edit my families daily life for this service. I do not feel that waking up at 4am is a good solution. But good try.
That would STILL be disrupting my son's sleeping schedule. The big problem is that I want an in-home daycare that will allow my four year old to stay awake during your break time. When I was searching for an in-home daycare that would allow this, I did find providers that were willing to let my son go without the unnecessary nap. But there were other things I did not like. (Food provided, dirty home, too many kids, etc). I could never find one that I liked that didn't have the nap policy for older kids. I've settled on a center due to this, I'm happy with it. I would've been happier with a great in-home provider that met all of my/my child's needs, but was unable to find one. I came to this forum because I wanted to really question the nap thing. I really wanted to know why providers take these long breaks. I really wanted to know why I had to resort to putting my son in a center.

When I was doing IHDC all the kids took a nap - but it was never more than 2 hours total. And it was not a "2 hr break" for me either! Typically I spent a good hour or longer just cleaning up (if you have never cared for 5-6 or more kids at a time you don't realize how long it can take to clean up after lunch!), recording details of the kids' day, taking a chance to eat for ME, pee, etc! Usually if I was lucky I may have ended up with about a 10-15 min break. Regarding letting kids who are older stay up - sometimes it is not an issue of just letting the kid do something quiet or watch tv. My home is small - if the tv was on in my living room it would likely be disruptive to the children sleeping. For some kids who still nap & are older if "Tommy" is watching tv they will want to also. Another issue is if one child is up it's hard for the provider to really have anytime to herself. I had one mom who insisted (in the last 2 weeks of school) that her preschool daughter who had napped consistently & easily at my home the whole school year stop napping. She wanted me to let her watch a movie or do puzzles, etc. I was okay with it (the girl was 4 1/2) but the issue was the child would fall asleep everyday despite my efforts to "keep her awake!". She'd be sitting on the couch looking at books or doing puzzles & would fall asleep. I think that in a home daycare it is hard to do this (find someone who will let the kids stay up) because in most cases providers are working alone with no outside help. If you could walk a week in your provider's shoes you'd understand why she needs 1-2 hours "break" & in most cases the kids DO need the nap!
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Old 11-04-2011, 10:13 PM
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I'm not saying you are going to go to the bank if you are offering services only to kids who YOU think don't need a nap. I'm saying that you will make bank if you offer services to the kids who have PARENTS who say they don't need a nap.

If you marketed your daycare that you don't do ANY naps for any kid of any age unless parents request the nap you would have people knocking your door down to get in. There are LEGIONS of parents out there who want their kid up ALL........... DAY.............. LONG.
PLEASE FORGIVE ME.. I did not take the time to read through all of the posts and I would like to say, that I did agree with Joyce and Crystal, but find this particular post to be absolutely ridiculous!

In all of the years and experience I've had, I find this to be complete and utter nonsense! Are you kidding?!?! I have NEVER had a parent want their child to be over tired and be knocking down my door b/c they want their child up all day. I think it's extremely condescending to parents to say this is their desire and to even imply that it would have monetary value marketing this is silly! I have NEVER known a parent who wants their child having melt downs and being over tired when they pick them up.

I was doing daycare in my home when all 3 of my own children gave up naps between the ages of 2 and 3. Yes, they fought it and yes, I had them lay down to rest. They did not sleep though. They did have early bed times and it was NOT so that I could get rid of my children. My youngest would willingly and often ask to go to bed around 8 pm.

I often have 2, 3 or 4 yo that will not fall asleep and I have never looked upon "nap time" as "my time off". I will have them lay down and watch a movie, read a book or play quietly, but it's a time for the house to be quiet, so that those napping can rest and sleep if they need it.

I open at 7am and close at 6pm and have for many years. I watch children 0-12 yo and with that comes flexibility and accommodating many different situations...some that nap and some that don't!
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Old 11-04-2011, 10:41 PM
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That is EXACTLY what I am asking. Why is this so difficult? I think they need break from all the kids, yes. But why is it not possible to turn on a movie for the older kiddos, or give them a quiet activity, while you take your break? I sincerely DO NOT want my child to lie on a cot for that long. It is boring, and it disrupts his already established sleep patterns at home. He can watch a movie or play quietly while others sleep. He knows what it means to be quiet, because others are sleeping. As far as the landscaping example goes, your analogy is incorrect. If I were paying you to care for my son for nine hours, then you are being paid to care for him for nine hours. You are saying that I would pay you for nine hours, however my son would actually be in your home for 12 hours. (9+3=12). But no, he is in your home for 9 hours and you are taking a 3 hour break during this 9 hours. Meaning that you really are only caring for my son for 6 hours, because you have told him to lie quietly on his cot for 3 hours. (9-3=6).
& Mandy Jane, I don't think it is necessary to attempt to insult me with your sarcastic remarks. "I assume you DO know how to read? " What is up with that? If you want me to edit your grammar on that post, I can and will. Just let me know. I will be all over that.
I am not trying to insult anyone here, and I would like it very much if you did not insult me.
I appreciate that you all care enough for children to open your home up to them. But you are running a business, you are providing a service. You need to stop being so selfish and look at what your clients need, and compare that to what you need. There needs to be a good balance. And with most of the providers I looked at, the needs of the provider were put well above the clients. They wanted a break, no exceptions. They would try to explain to me that my child DOES need a nap. They would try to tell me that yes, they are negotiable. But when I questioned them in detail what my child would be doing during "nap time", they failed to prove that my child would not be lying down doing nothing at all.

I am obviously not finding any answers here. I had to put my son in a center, when I preferred the "home-setting" and the personalization you get with a home provider. I was not able to find any provider willing to actually budge on this nap time/break time thing. That is a very large break. And yes, your job is quite different then mine. But why did you choose this kind of work if you cannot keep up with children for a full 8 hours, even? I could not do that, so I chose to NOT open a daycare in my home. If I thought that I could handle 6-8 kids (homes that I looked at had this # of kids, I definitely do NOT want my son in a home with more children than that. That is a chaotic mess) in my home then I would consider the fact that I would need to actually care for them for at least 9 hours. Meaning, that I would need to tend to children who were old enough to stay awake during the day. I would require that children who get cranky have naps. I would consult with the parent about their child's crankiness and there would be a solution. I would not "drop" the family because a child functions well w/out a nap. That IS bad business. That is cruel to the child. If they get used to a daycare, love the kids they play with, love the providers, why would you drop them because they do not need a nap?
Like I said, I am getting no answers here.
Based on the info you HAVE provided, this is my conclusion:

My son will stay in a center. In-home providers are unable to fully care for my child because they cannot handle children who do not require a nap. They would much rather disrupt his sleeping habits rather than disrupt their break.
I agree with everything you stated, EXCEPT that I have been a "in-home provider" for over 25 years and want you to know that there are people like myself that support and believe in the same exact things you do!!!

I would never drop a child b/c they did not nap. Yes, there are times when I do not get a minutes peace, but that is IMHO...part of the job!
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Old 11-05-2011, 11:35 AM
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PLEASE FORGIVE ME.. I did not take the time to read through all of the posts and I would like to say, that I did agree with Joyce and Crystal, but find this particular post to be absolutely ridiculous!

In all of the years and experience I've had, I find this to be complete and utter nonsense! Are you kidding?!?! I have NEVER had a parent want their child to be over tired and be knocking down my door b/c they want their child up all day. I think it's extremely condescending to parents to say this is their desire and to even imply that it would have monetary value marketing this is silly! I have NEVER known a parent who wants their child having melt downs and being over tired when they pick them up.

I was doing daycare in my home when all 3 of my own children gave up naps between the ages of 2 and 3. Yes, they fought it and yes, I had them lay down to rest. They did not sleep though. They did have early bed times and it was NOT so that I could get rid of my children. My youngest would willingly and often ask to go to bed around 8 pm.

I often have 2, 3 or 4 yo that will not fall asleep and I have never looked upon "nap time" as "my time off". I will have them lay down and watch a movie, read a book or play quietly, but it's a time for the house to be quiet, so that those napping can rest and sleep if they need it.

I open at 7am and close at 6pm and have for many years. I watch children 0-12 yo and with that comes flexibility and accommodating many different situations...some that nap and some that don't!
And to top it off... she (not mom2many - but the person she was quoting) has stated numerous times that she gets all her work done WHILE THE KIDS ARE UP. So this 3 hours is 100% down time. It's not like some of us who use naptime to do dishes and sweep. AND she has a teenager to clean and do paperwork.

Btw, Mom2Many, your daycare sounds a lot like mine.
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  #256  
Old 11-05-2011, 12:44 PM
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And to top it off... she (not mom2many - but the person she was quoting) has stated numerous times that she gets all her work done WHILE THE KIDS ARE UP. So this 3 hours is 100% down time. It's not like some of us who use naptime to do dishes and sweep. AND she has a teenager to clean and do paperwork.

Btw, Mom2Many, your daycare sounds a lot like mine.
You talking about me?

My staff assistant is 22 and my nap is 2.5 hours long.

I DO get all the work done with the KIDS ARE UP. We have between six and eight kids a day with TWO adults.

It's BAD to have two adults doing work so both adults can have a good long break in the midst of a long day?

Ummmm let me think?

You can operate ten hours a day and have a long break in the afternoon without any kids up OR you can operate ten hours a day and have part of a break with some of the kids up and daycare work?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

That's a toughie.

It's not free or special. I PAY a second person. I FIND the parents who can pay for such a low adult to child ratio. I WORKED hard to get to this point.

It's a GOOD thing to have rested children AND adults together. Makes for a very happy home and a super happy Nan
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  #257  
Old 11-06-2011, 11:51 AM
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I often have 2, 3 or 4 yo that will not fall asleep and I have never looked upon "nap time" as "my time off". I will have them lay down and watch a movie, read a book or play quietly, but it's a time for the house to be quiet, so that those napping can rest and sleep if they need it.

I open at 7am and close at 6pm and have for many years. I watch children 0-12 yo and with that comes flexibility and accommodating many different situations...some that nap and some that don't!
I can't imagine having 2, 3, and 4 year olds up at nap. I can't imagine working an eleven hour day without a LONG break in the afternoon. I don't know how you do it. I know for sure I couldn't manage it.

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Old 11-06-2011, 12:13 PM
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I can't imagine having 2, 3, and 4 year olds up at nap. I can't imagine working an eleven hour day without a LONG break in the afternoon. I don't know how you do it. I know for sure I couldn't manage it.

I guess it's like everything else in life...if it's what you are used to and okay with, then it's no biggie! I do have to stay organized and utilize every spare moment I have to keep things running smooth, but I don't consider my days stressful or difficult w/o having this break. It's not like everyone is up running around...it's "quiet time" and even the S/A kids know that they need to be respectful to those that are napping. Sometimes the non-nappers watch a movie, color or simply play quietly. I can sweep the floor, wash up lunch dishes or do paperwork. "My" time starts at 6 pm! That's when I relax!!!

I have NEVER had an assistant either to help me clean, interact with the dcks or take care of other dc duties either. I have never felt the need to hire anyone and am completely fine with taking care of everything myself. I do relish the fact that my hubby was able to go on early retirement and helps me now with the transportation, so I don't have to load kids in and out of my Suburban. Now that is HUGE!
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  #259  
Old 12-27-2011, 11:53 PM
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Default how long should 4 year old nap

I am a preschool teacher and am surprised at all the other providers who consider nap time a break for them. I suppose if you are in an in-home daycare and work by yourself, that time can be considered a break even if it is spent cleaning and prepping. However, I work in a wonderful center and I get my hour lunch break during nap time while my co-teacher stays in the room with the napping kids- when I return she goes on her hour lunch. State licensing law requires that children lay on their mats quietly for a half hour. If they are awake after this point I will give them books to look at while I set up quiet table activities for post nap. I also clean the lunch tables, write in the notebooks so that parents know what their child did during the day, disinfect and bleach and make sure we are up to licensing standards in terms of paperwork on the rare occasion that everyone is down and all else is done (Both teacher take turns with these duties- FYI). Naptime can be a source of contention between families and teachers, but at the end of the day we all want what is best for the children. I am not looking for nap time to be my down time- I have a lunch break for that. However, I do not want the children who do need naps to go without because one child is having a hard time falling asleep at home. Please note that nap time is never three hours! Maybe from the completion of lunch and transitioning onto mats, bathrooms, last minute bathrooms and until the last child is awake and doing an activity but I have never heard of having kids lay on mats for three or even two hours, especially if they are awake.
I currently teach a mixed age (3-5 year-olds) classroom and have two families who don't want their children to nap. One parent has a 4 1/2 year old who apparently has a hard time falling asleep at home and the bedtime routine, as it was explained to me, does not seem very relaxing. Also, I asked about any toys that are allowed in bed and mom said they can have legos or similar toys so that they are more likely to stay in bed. Legos, blocks, cars- pretty much anything other than stuffed animals or other cuddly toys- do not belong in bed. Also, this child falls asleep during the rest time and I hate having to quietly shake and coax the child awake after a half hour or hour of sleep. I do it, because the parent had asked this of us to help the bed time at hom but now we are being asked to "phase" naps out entirely. A child is the one who phases a nap out.
The other child is three and naps like a champ! The infant sibling at home apparently is on a new feeding schedule so the three year old wants to stay up like the baby but mom blames her desire to stay up with mom and the baby on her school naps. This child falls asleep on her own and is impossible to wake up. On the one or two occasions she didn't sleep (naptime disruptions from another child who did not want to sleep) she was a wreck the rest of the day. I am happy to allow a child books and paper and crayons on their mats after the half hour rest period but I will not keep a child up. That is preposterous to me!
Furthermore, when you pay someone to care for your child- whether it is in-home or a center, I find it repulsive and demeaning that you feel that person does not deserve a break. Apparently, the quality of care your child receives is less important than the fact that he not nap since you sent him to a place where the food was not great and the place was not as clean as you would have preferred- but hey, no naps! Did you ever think: "Perhaps my child's teacher is totally burned out from dealing with children all day without any opportunity for a moment of silence or peace and will probably deliver less than stellar care for the remainder of the day". I guess that the thought of moving your child's 8pm bedtime back a little (What an idea! Ever considered that instead of no naps- maybe he can stay up an extra half hour since he's FOUR?!) seemed less far-fetched than child care hopping. I wonder why your mom took another job instead of watching your son and nephew? And think about it this way: if your child came home cranky and miserable every day because the non-napping kids kept him up, how would that make you feel. I get a lot more parents asking that their kids nap than those who want them awake. On those "busy" weekends when you guys probably make cookies and walk to the park, little "Tommy" is getting a lot less tuckered out because he is not following a classroom schedule. A day in preschool dealing with 10 to 14 other children, non-stop activities, playtime and learning can quite frankly can be exhausting compared to hanging out with mom- no matter how much you do. Take home your child's classroom schedule and invite three or more of his friends (and children he doesn't like to really replicate the classroom experience) over and see how well he naps that day. I am completely in favor of supporting parents but I feel like sometimes parents feel like their child is the only one being cared for. That is called getting a nanny.
If it is so hard to find "good help" why not downgrade your car, move to a smaller home in a less desirable neighborhood, cut back on your frivolous spending so you can work less and spend more time at home with your child. That way, you can raise him any way you see fit. BUT as long as you pay someone else to do that job for you, you cease being the one and only rule-maker.
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Old 12-30-2011, 01:24 PM
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Thanks for all the comments. Just another bit of info here. She has been sleeping in her parents bed since birth and just about a month ago, they tried to get her in her own room. Needless to say, the child told me on Monday, that her mom just moved her bed into her parents room. I am just going to do as I always have and have her take a nap with the other kids. She very clearly runs her household, but I will not allow her to run my daycare. I do need that break every day, and actually look forward to catching up on the laundry and cleaning at nap time. It is the only way, I can get my own chores done.
You are not getting paid to do your chores, your paid to watch the kids!
that means all of you know it all baby sitters, whom get paid 2 - 3hrs for watching kids sleep.
It's funny how its always the parents don't know anything. HUH
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  #261  
Old 01-04-2012, 07:15 AM
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I happened upon this site just looking for advice about the possibility of my 4 3/4 year old no longer needing a nap. She's having a hard time falling asleep at night.

Instead I found some really self-righteous providers who may want to re-evaluate their line of work. I thought I'd provide a few "indicators" so you know who you are:

1. If you are quick to say "ALL THE OTHER children do this" or "ALL MY EIGHT kids did it like this" - you are clueless about respecting the fact that each kid is different and has different needs. (i'm not advocating nap vs. no nap, break vs no break as I don't believe that that is the real issue with some of these posts).

2. The lady who said she "laid really still" and "pretended to be asleep" so she wouldn't "get in trouble at daycare" during the 2 hour nap period... am I the only person who found this disturbing? This sounds like the kind of "lessons" that come from being abused at home. Ijs...

3. If you are 100% confident that you KNOW FOR A FACT that little Suzie's God-awful parents let her stay up until 11:00 EVERY SINGLE NIGHT... seriously? now you're the omnicient, ever-present, santa claus provider? You are not at that child's house so you may think you know but have the humility to realize that you can't say for certain...

4. If you use phrases like "these parents will never get it" - you should definitely stick a fork in yourself. Once you start seeing this as "you against them" you're done.

5. Finally, if you are posting on this forum while the children in your care are napping.... well... I think you get my point.

It's okay to decide that a certain career is no longer bringing you joy. It doesn't mean you're a bad person or that you failed.
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  #262  
Old 01-08-2012, 07:42 AM
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Angry child has hard time going to sleep at night after daycare allows 3 hour naps

I've read alot of the posts on here and seems to me that the daycare people do not understand, in fact my child wouldnt attend any of your daycares because the people that run them do not respect the parents wishes. I went to pick my daughter up from daycare at 4:30 the other evening to find her still asleep on the mat. She then stays up til midnight laying in her bed staring at the ceiling at night before she falls asleep, and she is in bed at 8:30 every night. I understand that the state mandates that naps be given for 2 hours ONLY. However it doesnt specifiy that the nap has to start at 1 and go til the child wakes up hours later. I as a parent feel that the lazy caregivers should be waking the children. The state law also manadates that the child get to play outside for a specified period of time EVERYDAY not when you feel like it. I also read that one daycare provider refuses to let the child drink from a regular cup, my advice to the parents is if you get a letter from the dentist saying that your child can not drink from a sippy cup they HAVE TO ABIDE BY IT. My daughter had a lot of dental issues because as her dentist told me there is hardly a difference between a bottle and a sippy cup...I came on this sight looking for advice on how to help my child fall asleep and was extremely upset to find the daycare providers we pay to care for our children throwing such a fit. Theres more than one daycare out there and there are people who will care for your children the way you see fit!
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  #263  
Old 01-31-2012, 10:21 PM
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I love nannyde!

Priceless
Really??? She is seriously nasty. She thinks she is the be-all end-all of dayhome operators and is so deserving of her 3 hour "break" that she "hates" older children. I do not want someone like that watching my children. I've been doing this for 18 years too and I know there are other more enjoyable ways to give an older child "quiet time" without forcing them to lie still with nothing to do. Many of them are also very good company during MY "breaks"! I also know that it's possible to get all of the prep work and clean up done AND eat my lunch in a half-hour period. The rest of it is silliness and YES laziness. These children are our first priorities and if you people are not able to see their individual needs then you need to find another profession.

Seriously. Everyone bowing down to a childcare worker who stated that she hates ANY child. Good on you Nannyde that you have such loving fans. Makes me sick.
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  #264  
Old 02-01-2012, 03:49 AM
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And tune in tomorrow for the next episode of "HOW LONG SHOULD A 4 YEAR OLD NAP"..............
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  #265  
Old 02-01-2012, 05:21 AM
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I have two almost 4's. They both sleep 2-3 hours in the afternoon, but i think it is because we play so hard in the mornings and their little bodies really need the rest. My daughter is one of them, and she goes to bed at 7:30, is up at 6:30, and takes a 2-3 hour nap. The other little boy's parents keep him up late and at least 2 times a week I have to almost drag him out of bed at naptime to get him ready for his parents to arrive, or because it has been longer than 3 hours. I think it all depends on the child really.

Now, if either of them wake up after an hour's nap or so, I let them get up and read/computer game/movie, etc until naptime is over for everyone else. That rarely happens though, they're great sleepers!
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Old 02-01-2012, 05:27 AM
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PS: For those of you making comments about lazy providers who let the kids sleep: I always text the mom and ask her if she wants me to get him up or let him sleep, and she always tells me to let him sleep because he needs it. His parents are divorced and dad never gives him naps and keeps him up late, not maliciously, but just because it's what they do. My daycare kids sleep because we already ran around outside, played hard, did a bazillion fun actrivities, and they are just tired from all of the excitement.

My other daycare parents told me to wake them up if they have been asleep for 3 hours, less than that, let them sleep.

Before you judge a provider for letting a child sleep, think about all of the exciting activities that they may have done during the day that may have exhausted them. I'm just saying...
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Old 02-01-2012, 05:43 AM
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I happened upon this site just looking for advice about the possibility of my 4 3/4 year old no longer needing a nap. She's having a hard time falling asleep at night.

Instead I found some really self-righteous providers who may want to re-evaluate their line of work. I thought I'd provide a few "indicators" so you know who you are:

1. If you are quick to say "ALL THE OTHER children do this" or "ALL MY EIGHT kids did it like this" - you are clueless about respecting the fact that each kid is different and has different needs. (i'm not advocating nap vs. no nap, break vs no break as I don't believe that that is the real issue with some of these posts).

2. The lady who said she "laid really still" and "pretended to be asleep" so she wouldn't "get in trouble at daycare" during the 2 hour nap period... am I the only person who found this disturbing? This sounds like the kind of "lessons" that come from being abused at home. Ijs...

3. If you are 100% confident that you KNOW FOR A FACT that little Suzie's God-awful parents let her stay up until 11:00 EVERY SINGLE NIGHT... seriously? now you're the omnicient, ever-present, santa claus provider? You are not at that child's house so you may think you know but have the humility to realize that you can't say for certain...

4. If you use phrases like "these parents will never get it" - you should definitely stick a fork in yourself. Once you start seeing this as "you against them" you're done.

5. Finally, if you are posting on this forum while the children in your care are napping.... well... I think you get my point.

It's okay to decide that a certain career is no longer bringing you joy. It doesn't mean you're a bad person or that you failed.
Are you a provider or an angry parent? Just wondering- it doesn't sound like you are a provider, because you have no clue that you cannot accommodate 6 different children's individual schedules in group care. Some states mandate 2 hours of naptime/ quiet rest-time- we are not going to break the law because YOU want us to. Sorry.

I know that some of my daycare kids go to sleep at 10 or 11 pm because THE PARENTS TELL ME.

Some parents "NEVER GET IT" about a lot of things. It isn't you versus us, it's that we tell you things over and over and you don't listen or care. Don't bring your sick child to daycare. Pay on time. Pick up on time. Bring more food when your child is out. We usually don't fault the parents IF we have not talked to them first: the parents who dont get it are the ones whom we have to consistently tell THE SAME THINGS TO over and over. PS: A lot of my daycare kids call me ma-ma. I keep telling them my name over and over, but they prefer to call me ma-ma. I feel sad for their real mothers and am embarassed when they call me that in front of them, but the fact is that I spend more time with your child than you do.

Maybe it isn't so bad if your child stays up an hour later at night so you can give them some attention?

Uhhhh, and what about posting on this forum when the kids are napping? Should we post on it when they are outside or free play or somethng else? Maybe we should post on it while they are running with scissors... seriously? What we do during naptime isnt your business.

I am not a self-righteous provider. I love the kids. I love my families. We have open communication, and are all on the same page about a lot of things. I hate it when people post to this, and sorry, a lot of the time it is jaded parents, and criticize what we do. Most of us work at least 50 hours a week minumim- if 10 of those hours are mandated naptimes for your child- so be it.

Would you wake up your child from a nap on the weekends so they go to sleep earlier if you knew they had a big day and were exhausted and needed the sleep?

And for the person who posted about NannyDe- I am relatively new to this forum and I don't know you or NannyDe, but this is a daycare provider's forum, and she is a provider with a lot of good advice. You do not have to judge or like everything she does, but who the heck are you to criticize someone like that?

So sick of all of these jerks who are coming on this site lately.

Oh- I'm a registered user too
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Old 02-01-2012, 05:48 AM
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And tune in tomorrow for the next episode of "HOW LONG SHOULD A 4 YEAR OLD NAP"..............
I was thinking Tune in Tomorrow for "Another Cowardly "unregistered" Nannyde Attack".....

Mods, can you see that IP address?

Nan is the ONLY one here with CLIENTS who adore her on this board.....
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Old 02-01-2012, 06:37 AM
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I was thinking Tune in Tomorrow for "Another Cowardly "unregistered" Nannyde Attack".....

Mods, can you see that IP address?

Nan is the ONLY one here with CLIENTS who adore her on this board.....
You call it an "attack" when it is aimed at one of your own, yet there are any number of providers on here saying worse things about the loving parents of the children in their care. Shame on you.

My ip number is of no consequence. I am a visitor to this board who was so disgusted by what I saw that I could not help but comment. CHILDREN ARE INDIVIDUALS WITH INDIVIDUAL NEEDS AND NO ALL CHILDREN NEED TO NAP. It is NOT a sin to let non mallets stay up with you, and it can be very pleasant to have older children stay up to help ou or visi with you.

You are all entitled to your opinions. So am I.

I do not like the mind-set on this board and I will not be back. I do, however, want to make it plain to the parents out there that we are not ALL of this selfish, narrow mind-set.
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  #270  
Old 02-01-2012, 07:20 AM
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I have a 4 year old who has to lay on a mat for 1 and a half hours at her preschool/day care center. She can't get her little body to rest/sleep. The teachers reward the resting sleeping children with stickers. So every day my daughter comes home crying thinking she did something wrong because she gets no reward. Every child is different. To force a 4 year old to lay on a mat for that long doing nothing is bizarre to me. Could someone please post the Maryland state regulation that says child care workers must force a child to lay on a mat for 2 hours.

I think I read that regulation at one point and it states that a child care center must offer a nap area and a rest period but it is up to the child if he/she wants to nap or rest. I understand the need for quiet time but please this is crazy the way you think you can force children to sleep or sit still on a mat when their bodies are not able to do so.
Stop and really think about the power struggle you are creating. The feeling of shame you are creating in these children when you are telling them to do this and if they don't something is wrong with them.
You are interrupting the regulation all wrong. This regulation was to support and understand the needs of the child not to give the care giver a break.

Read and reread the regulation with each individual child in mind. Then please, please listen to the parents who knows more about their own child then the person in government that wrote a regulation that is being misused.
Explain to your child why those children are getting stickers. Bring this up to your daycare. They might not realize your child is feeling this way.

I don't feel you are creating shame- your teaching your child to be able to follow directions. You should thank your provider for this instead of looking at this as a negative.

If you feel your child should get a sticker too, your only setting your child up to needing something for everything she does. I feel reward systems are good in some ways but over used. Kids feel they should "get" something for everything they do. They are not learning self satisfaction. It's just a give me, give me more, more more.

It's ok for kids to learn NO and not run the adults. Having reasonable rules and boundaries is not a bad thing and is helping to set your child up early to being able to listen and follow directions and learn.

For those of you that are coming into the forum and bashing us providers.....take it up with your own providers. Work it out with them. Tell them your concerns and listen to what they have to say about the issue. We love and care for kids and have the best interest of the kids at large. This forum should be closed to parents and only for providers. A seperate forum should be opened for parents to ask providers questions. Parents come in here and don't realize we are venting to our co-workers a portion of our day. For me anyways, my positives out weigh the negatives but if I post one negative it sets me up to look like a horrible provider.

I hear you as a parent- and that is why I feel you should go to your provider and explain what you see going on with your child. Find a happy medium. No provider is ever going to be you. Hear me as a provider- almost all of us providers care for the best interest of our children. We spend long hours with them and love and care for them. When I ask your child to rest, its because I know your child needs it. I know the other kids need it. I am not trying to punish your child, its just our routine and one of the many things we do at care. Again, I hear you as a parent- your child does not need a sleep nap, but asking her to be quiet and read books, or quiet activity is no unreasonable. For me- I have the older kids try to rest for a while, if they can't I put on a quiet down time movie (Otis and Milo) is a favorite and they can opt to watch that, read, or quiet activity. Just having down time for the non nappers makes a difference in the rest of the day for them and for me.
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  #271  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:20 AM
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You call it an "attack" when it is aimed at one of your own, yet there are any number of providers on here saying worse things about the loving parents of the children in their care. Shame on you.

My ip number is of no consequence. I am a visitor to this board who was so disgusted by what I saw that I could not help but comment. CHILDREN ARE INDIVIDUALS WITH INDIVIDUAL NEEDS AND NO ALL CHILDREN NEED TO NAP. It is NOT a sin to let non mallets stay up with you, and it can be very pleasant to have older children stay up to help ou or visi with you.

You are all entitled to your opinions. So am I.

I do not like the mind-set on this board and I will not be back. I do, however, want to make it plain to the parents out there that we are not ALL of this selfish, narrow mind-set.
You do realize that Nannyde runs a very specific program and her parents are fully aware of her policies? And that they still chose to use her services? And that she has glowing recommendations? YOU don't have to agree with it because the families that she cares for do.

There is something to be said by the fact you chose to hide in anonymity while Nannyde lets this forum have full access to her website and real life person.

I don't take kids that watch tv or eat processed foods. I don't want them here and I weed them out during the interview process. You could say I discriminate against treehouse and Mcd's junkies. How does that measure up to your standards?
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  #272  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:25 AM
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Are you a provider or an angry parent? Just wondering- it doesn't sound like you are a provider, because you have no clue that you cannot accommodate 6 different children's individual schedules in group care. Some states mandate 2 hours of naptime/ quiet rest-time- we are not going to break the law because YOU want us to. Sorry.

I know that some of my daycare kids go to sleep at 10 or 11 pm because THE PARENTS TELL ME.

Some parents "NEVER GET IT" about a lot of things. It isn't you versus us, it's that we tell you things over and over and you don't listen or care. Don't bring your sick child to daycare. Pay on time. Pick up on time. Bring more food when your child is out. We usually don't fault the parents IF we have not talked to them first: the parents who dont get it are the ones whom we have to consistently tell THE SAME THINGS TO over and over. PS: A lot of my daycare kids call me ma-ma. I keep telling them my name over and over, but they prefer to call me ma-ma. I feel sad for their real mothers and am embarassed when they call me that in front of them, but the fact is that I spend more time with your child than you do.

Maybe it isn't so bad if your child stays up an hour later at night so you can give them some attention?

Uhhhh, and what about posting on this forum when the kids are napping? Should we post on it when they are outside or free play or somethng else? Maybe we should post on it while they are running with scissors... seriously? What we do during naptime isnt your business.

I am not a self-righteous provider. I love the kids. I love my families. We have open communication, and are all on the same page about a lot of things. I hate it when people post to this, and sorry, a lot of the time it is jaded parents, and criticize what we do. Most of us work at least 50 hours a week minumim- if 10 of those hours are mandated naptimes for your child- so be it.

Would you wake up your child from a nap on the weekends so they go to sleep earlier if you knew they had a big day and were exhausted and needed the sleep?

And for the person who posted about NannyDe- I am relatively new to this forum and I don't know you or NannyDe, but this is a daycare provider's forum, and she is a provider with a lot of good advice. You do not have to judge or like everything she does, but who the heck are you to criticize someone like that?

So sick of all of these jerks who are coming on this site lately.
Oh- I'm a registered user too
I wouldn't go so far as to call anyone a jerk, but I too, am really tired of all the posters (members and non members alike ) who come on this forum and try to stir things up.....

Some people need to find something better to do with their time
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  #273  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:31 AM
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I let my dcg nap for 4 hours this morning


Why? Because he dad asked me to because she had an awful night.
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  #274  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:44 AM
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I was thinking Tune in Tomorrow for "Another Cowardly "unregistered" Nannyde Attack".....

Mods, can you see that IP address?

Nan is the ONLY one here with CLIENTS who adore her on this board.....
Yes we can and it's not one that's been causing any issues. It's a new one to me.

We're watching the one causing issues. Pretty carefully actually.
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  #275  
Old 02-01-2012, 06:50 PM
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These children are our first priorities and if you people are not able to see their individual needs then you need to find another profession.
Or you could stay in the profession and just care for the kids who have the "individual need" of a full afternoon nap.
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  #276  
Old 02-01-2012, 08:13 PM
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For the parents who's children don't "need" a nap. My 4.5 year old doesn't need a nap at home either. THATS AT HOME. At daycare she's miserable and antisocial and learns NOTHING without a rest period.
Yes she does go to bed later, but it's better than having everyone in her class dislike her becuase she's absolutely miserable from 12:00 - 5:30 every day.

In my opinion children that will nap and aren't allowed to are in a way being set up by their parents to FAIL in the afternoons. Their daycare afternoons are often fraught with constant fights, alienation by other kids, and break downs and grumpiness. NOT what I want my child to go through for 5 hours a day.

My child can be grumpy at home with me in the afternoons when she doesn't nap at home. That's not accepeptable at daycare I don't want her be friendless at daycare because she's miserable and picking fights and half brain dead from exhaustion just so she can fall asleep with zero assistance at 8 every night. Lets make it even better by not letting all the other kids not sleep too, 16 miserable children. Recipe. For. Disaster. It's not about an early bedtime, it's about her time at daycare being productive. Her daycare time is for her. It's my job to make her care providers day easier, not them make my job as a parent easy.

Rest sets children up for success. In my book that's more important than a hassle free bedtime.
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  #277  
Old 02-01-2012, 09:20 PM
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when my child went to a center naptime or rest was a mandatory thing so its not just inhome daycares that want your child to take a nap. I would be very suprised if you found a center either that said any child did not have to at least have a rest time!Yes even centers take breaks or did you think the providers just wear diapers and eat there lunch while your kids watched them? So I dont think nap times are much different at a center verses inhome!
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  #278  
Old 02-02-2012, 04:44 AM
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Yes we can and it's not one that's been causing any issues. It's a new one to me.

We're watching the one causing issues. Pretty carefully actually.
Ok..... Thank you

My apologies, new unregistered... You are entitled to your opinions. I simply disagree with you. I know Nans heart is devoted to the kids in her care.....and her clients adore her. I am proud to call her a friend. Taking her words out of context will never change that.

I honestly thought you were the same unregistered who has been stirring the pot and creating a bit of chaos in several threads.

I am sorry for being ugly to you.
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  #279  
Old 02-02-2012, 05:54 AM
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Originally Posted by C'est la vie. View Post
For the parents who's children don't "need" a nap. My 4.5 year old doesn't need a nap at home either. THATS AT HOME. At daycare she's miserable and antisocial and learns NOTHING without a rest period.
Yes she does go to bed later, but it's better than having everyone in her class dislike her becuase she's absolutely miserable from 12:00 - 5:30 every day.

In my opinion children that will nap and aren't allowed to are in a way being set up by their parents to FAIL in the afternoons. Their daycare afternoons are often fraught with constant fights, alienation by other kids, and break downs and grumpiness. NOT what I want my child to go through for 5 hours a day.

My child can be grumpy at home with me in the afternoons when she doesn't nap at home. That's not accepeptable at daycare I don't want her be friendless at daycare because she's miserable and picking fights and half brain dead from exhaustion just so she can fall asleep with zero assistance at 8 every night. Lets make it even better by not letting all the other kids not sleep too, 16 miserable children. Recipe. For. Disaster. It's not about an early bedtime, it's about her time at daycare being productive. Her daycare time is for her. It's my job to make her care providers day easier, not them make my job as a parent easy.

Rest sets children up for success. In my book that's more important than a hassle free bedtime.
- excellent point!
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  #280  
Old 03-13-2012, 08:19 AM
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Default Update - Story of a non napping child

I posted my story here a while ago and just wanted to to update on the situation. My child stopped napping at 3.5. Her provider (subsidized in Quebec) kicked her out when she was 4, but kept her younger sister. She would lay on the mat quietly for 2 hours as long as the provider was in the room, but then after two hours of laying quietly, the provider would leave the room. Then my little girl would wake the other kids. The provider complained my little girl would stare at her the entire time she was in the room. She took this for defiance. I tried talking to my daughter, about the importance of her nap, punishing her if she doesn't nap, and a whole slew of other things to back up the daycare provider. For the first few months she would take a long nap at home with no issue, so I didn't know why she didn't sleep at daycare. She always went to bed at 8 with no issues, so I was not opposed to her napping. I agreed with the daycare provider that she should nap. After she stopped napping at home also I started to realize that she really just didn't need a nap. I tried to provide strategies for her to be up. The daycare lady was opposed to her being downstairs watching TV as this is her space. We tried books and things, but the daycare lady was not really receptive and said she couldn't have a book on her mat because she would "rustle" and wake the other kids.

At the time we were forcing her to nap, her behavior deteriorated. Punishments meant nothing to her because she was being punished so much for not napping, which was something she couldn't control. She began acting out. Finally the dreaded day came and she was kicked out of this daycare.

We searched for another and were upfront about the fact that she doesn't nap. We found another subsidized place that said they could handle it because she had an assistant. She said she would take her upstairs and let her watch TV. This worked for months, then the other kids started complaining because they wanted to watch TV too. Then my daughter had to color quietly for 2 hours at the kitchen table without moving. There was no interaction from the daycare lady as this was her break. My daughter would "wiggle in her chair to make it squeak" or "tap the table leg" in an effort to discreetly wake the other kids because she was terribly bored. Eventually she got kicked out. She was also openly defiant a few times due to the fact that we had punished her for napping while she was at the previous daycare. The lady told me she was so bad she needed to go to a special school for disturbed kids.

I was terrified. I took her to a child psychologist to have her evaluated. The child psychologist said she is perfectly fine. We just punished her for not napping which she can't control, and now punishment has no meaning and she sees us as mean and unfair. She told us to let her be up.

We found a private daycare, again being upfront about how our child doesn't nap. The new lady had a daughter the same age who didn't nap plus a child almost ready for school who didn't nap. She had two babies who did nap. The older kid watched TV or played quiet activities during nap time. My daughter was not alone. Finally after months of rebuilding trust with our daughter and having this wonderful provider who she looked forward to visiting her behavior improved dramatically. She started Montessori preschool in September and has had glowing reviews. The teacher says she is super smart, integrates very well, has tons of friends and she mentors the slower children. There is a small rest period, but they have to be quiet for 1/2 hour and then the awake children can go outside to play. She is not the only one. Now she knows that she is not a bad child, she just doesn't sleep at nap time like a lot of other kids.

Moral of this long story. Don't make your child nap if she doesn't need to. Not all kids require a nap. If your daycare is forcing your child to nap, change daycares. It is worth it, even if you have to pay more. They may be great daycares, and your child may love it there, but it is not good for her. My youngest is still with the first lady who kicked out my second. She is very happy there. It is very difficult for me to pick up my kids at two different places. It wastes an hour of my day that could be spent playing with my kids, but keeping her there was more damaging to her and it was not worth it. It is not fair, but that is life and you have to accept it. The daycares that do not want kids who don't sleep, will resent your child and this will affect your child. Even if they make half hearted attempts to accommodate you, even if they are loving and kind and warm hearted, for whatever reason, be it they think kids need nap time, or they think they need a break, if your child doesn't sleep, they will resent her and it will affect her. That is my experience. I hope it helps somebody.
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  #281  
Old 03-13-2012, 09:29 AM
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I honestly do not understand the fury.

If you do not like a policy at a daycare don't sign up there.

If you find out a daycare policy is not what you want for your child then switch providers.


It really is that simple.
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  #282  
Old 03-13-2012, 10:11 AM
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I honestly do not understand the fury.

If you do not like a policy at a daycare don't sign up there.

If you find out a daycare policy is not what you want for your child then switch providers.


It really is that simple.
I wonder Greenplasticwateringcans, if you have ever had to try and find a daycare that accepts kids who are awake.

When I was on maternity leave, I read all about choosing a daycare, what questions to ask, what to look for. When I conceived my first child, I put my name on all the center's in my area. I got called back for one of them when my child was six months old and was offered a spot. I accepted the spot gave them a void check, signed the contract, jumped through all the hoops, then was called back to say a sibling who has priority over outside children took the spot but I was first on the waitlist. I got called back 4 years later after I had already paid for the preschool for my daughter. None of the other centers called. They all had 2-5 year waitlists.

When I started looking for an in home daycare. The first few I asked the questions, then was told she had 20 kids lined up for the spot and she would get back to me after she was finished all her interviews. We did not get the spot. I asked too many questions I think. Eventually I changed my approach to look like an accommodating mother and found a spot. Then tried to hold on to it, but alas you have my story.

In the second daycare, I was upfront about my needs, she agreed to meet them, then kicked my child out because she got tired of meeting them.

Do you really think it is a good idea to switch providers every time there is a policy that you don't like? How do you think your child feels to be bounced from daycare to daycare? My child developed a fear of rejection due to getting kicked out of two daycares. That is partially my fault, as I tried to back up the daycare lady rather than just switching her when she started to complain, but every daycare I have ever had my child in has complained about something. One daycare complained if my child's poop was less than solid, not taking into consideration if you left her sitting in a poopy diaper, the poop then gets smooshed and it looks less than solid. She prefered my child to cry during bowel movements due to constipation. I did move her from that place. I think every time you change your child's daycare, it is hard on the child. The child makes friends, the child gets comfortable. Changing every few months is not good for the child. So you try to make things work and hope that the solution will remedy itself. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

The fury is because this is our children at stake, and every mother is emotional about her baby. Every working mother wants a safe place for her child where she will be loved and cared for and treated as an individual. When that is not available, what do you do? Quit your job, uproot your family, sell your house, move to a scummy neighborhood and hope your child doesn't get into trouble like the neighborhood kids, but just for another couple of years until they are in school. Of course then you can't afford a house in your old neighborhood, you can't find a new job in this economy and your child is now stuck going to school with bad influences. That doesn't really sound like a good solution to me. Every working mother has guilt about going to work and not being with their child more, but we want to provide the best possible life. Plus, I want my kid to have friends when she starts school and know how to socialize so she won't get teased like I did. I had a stay at home Mom and had no idea what to do with other kids.
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  #283  
Old 03-13-2012, 10:31 AM
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I wonder Greenplasticwateringcans, if you have ever had to try and find a daycare that accepts kids who are awake.

When I was on maternity leave, I read all about choosing a daycare, what questions to ask, what to look for. When I conceived my first child, I put my name on all the center's in my area. I got called back for one of them when my child was six months old and was offered a spot. I accepted the spot gave them a void check, signed the contract, jumped through all the hoops, then was called back to say a sibling who has priority over outside children took the spot but I was first on the waitlist. I got called back 4 years later after I had already paid for the preschool for my daughter. None of the other centers called. They all had 2-5 year waitlists.

When I started looking for an in home daycare. The first few I asked the questions, then was told she had 20 kids lined up for the spot and she would get back to me after she was finished all her interviews. We did not get the spot. I asked too many questions I think. Eventually I changed my approach to look like an accommodating mother and found a spot. Then tried to hold on to it, but alas you have my story.

In the second daycare, I was upfront about my needs, she agreed to meet them, then kicked my child out because she got tired of meeting them.

Do you really think it is a good idea to switch providers every time there is a policy that you don't like? How do you think your child feels to be bounced from daycare to daycare? My child developed a fear of rejection due to getting kicked out of two daycares. That is partially my fault, as I tried to back up the daycare lady rather than just switching her when she started to complain, but every daycare I have ever had my child in has complained about something. One daycare complained if my child's poop was less than solid, not taking into consideration if you left her sitting in a poopy diaper, the poop then gets smooshed and it looks less than solid. She prefered my child to cry during bowel movements due to constipation. I did move her from that place. I think every time you change your child's daycare, it is hard on the child. The child makes friends, the child gets comfortable. Changing every few months is not good for the child. So you try to make things work and hope that the solution will remedy itself. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.

The fury is because this is our children at stake, and every mother is emotional about her baby. Every working mother wants a safe place for her child where she will be loved and cared for and treated as an individual. When that is not available, what do you do? Quit your job, uproot your family, sell your house, move to a scummy neighborhood and hope your child doesn't get into trouble like the neighborhood kids, but just for another couple of years until they are in school. Of course then you can't afford a house in your old neighborhood, you can't find a new job in this economy and your child is now stuck going to school with bad influences. That doesn't really sound like a good solution to me. Every working mother has guilt about going to work and not being with their child more, but we want to provide the best possible life. Plus, I want my kid to have friends when she starts school and know how to socialize so she won't get teased like I did. I had a stay at home Mom and had no idea what to do with other kids.
I hear your frustration and truley feel for you.

A few years ago when I wanted to take a break from child care I did put my children in a no napping daycare.

I ended up pulling them out because they were being hurt (talk about mommy guilt!) and doing daycare at home again.

My program is no required naps because it's what works for me. I only have one that naps right now. However, my policies and the policies of other daycare providers are not usually negotiable. I provide a service and if someone isn't happy with what I provide then they can seek daycare services else were. I won't budge because I have the right, as the owner of my buisness, to create a work environment that works for me.

Yes, I really think it is better to pull a child out from care that is harmful to your child even if it is quite frequently and costly.
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  #284  
Old 03-13-2012, 11:14 AM
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My kids ALL lay down, even the schoolagers in the summer are they usually sleep the hardest! The kids that are 4 take a nap most days except one little girl and she is quiet during that time. I have a lot of very young children that absolutely need a nap so it is imperative to not wake them up. The children all know what is expected of them so they do not even question it. My dc families all know how hectic my job is and just appreciate me taking good care of their kids so they dont bother complaining about nap and in fact act disappointed if their child arrived too late for nap or didnt fall asleep. At four, if you do not like how a home daycare operates, it would be best to switch to a fulltime preschool or montessori program.
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Old 03-13-2012, 11:23 AM
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My kids ALL lay down, even the schoolagers in the summer are they usually sleep the hardest! The kids that are 4 take a nap most days except one little girl and she is quiet during that time. I have a lot of very young children that absolutely need a nap so it is imperative to not wake them up. The children all know what is expected of them so they do not even question it. My dc families all know how hectic my job is and just appreciate me taking good care of their kids so they dont bother complaining about nap and in fact act disappointed if their child arrived too late for nap or didnt fall asleep. At four, if you do not like how a home daycare operates, it would be best to switch to a fulltime preschool or montessori program.
Yes, I did switch to a Montessori preschool, but since my daughter was born in January and schools require that your child is 4 on September 30, she was 4 for 9 months before she was allowed to go to preschool. We went through 3 daycares in that time.

The first daycare did not mention a napping policy, but since my daughter napped when she started there, I had no idea it would be an issue. The second daycare said she could handle it, but then decided she didn't want to anymore. We were upfront about our needs. The third was amazing, and we were sad to leave but my daughter is quite bright and I thought she would get a lot out of the stimulation provided at preschool.

They do offer a public preschool here, but the school itself, and the psychologist said it is for children with special needs, meaning poor pronunciation, or vulgar or aggressive children. They both indicated that my daughter would just pick up bad behavior if she went there. That is why we paid for Montessori, even though it is killing us financially. She will finally get into public kindergarten this September.
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  #286  
Old 04-03-2012, 12:17 PM
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I too have a 4 year old who has a tv in his room, however, the timer goes off at 9 and he can not cut it back on. He sleeps 2 to 2 1/2 hours at the daycare and I KNOW this is why he will not go to bed at a decent hour at night! He is wired up usually when it is time to lay down, even after a calm relaxing bed time routine. The days that he does NOT sleep at the daycare, he sleeps at night, so I am a believer that it has a lot to do with it. I feel that at this age, the requirement for sleep is different and it affects the sleeping habit of my child. Bravo for the moms that can get their child to bed after sleeping long nap hours, but mine will not because those two hours that he is asleep puts him two hours later on his sleeping time at night!
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Old 04-03-2012, 01:02 PM
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The never ending debate...

I haven't weighed in on this because I'm sure that what I do will be unpopular, but it works form me, my kids and my dcp's. I never have a parent ask for no nap or a shorter nap time. I also get a break in the action everyday, except for when a new baby starts and even then it doesn't take long to get them on the schedule.

We don't have have afternoon 'naptime' beyond approximately 2 years old (give or take). After 2, you graduate from your pnp onto a nap mat in the main room and **poof** it's now 'Quiet Time'. From 1:00pm to 2:30pm you MUST be on your napmat, sleeping or not, I don't care. The only rule is stay quiet and on your nap mat. Books are allowed. This is the only time of the day the TV is on, with a movie of their choice (Rated 'G' and usually Disney/Pixar, of course!). I have 100's of kids DVD's.

I have 6 here now ~ ranging from 2.5 to almost 5 ~ 3 are watching the movie and 3 are sleeping. 3 I/T are in PNP's in the other room, also sleeping and it is blissfully quiet. The littles usually go down around 12:30 while the others are playing outside.

This is the method that I have used for 20+ years ~ the only problem the I had was years ago when a parent didn't want her child watching ANY type of TV. I respect that ~ but I also told her that this wasn't the daycare for her child.

I have a WII also and the 5 year old boys can kick my butt at SuperMario on rainy days

That's my 2 cents, for what it's worth.
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Old 04-03-2012, 01:40 PM
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The never ending debate...

I haven't weighed in on this because I'm sure that what I do will be unpopular, but it works form me, my kids and my dcp's. I never have a parent ask for no nap or a shorter nap time. I also get a break in the action everyday, except for when a new baby starts and even then it doesn't take long to get them on the schedule.

We don't have have afternoon 'naptime' beyond approximately 2 years old (give or take). After 2, you graduate from your pnp onto a nap mat in the main room and **poof** it's now 'Quiet Time'. From 1:00pm to 2:30pm you MUST be on your napmat, sleeping or not, I don't care. The only rule is stay quiet and on your nap mat. Books are allowed. This is the only time of the day the TV is on, with a movie of their choice (Rated 'G' and usually Disney/Pixar, of course!). I have 100's of kids DVD's.

I have 6 here now ~ ranging from 2.5 to almost 5 ~ 3 are watching the movie and 3 are sleeping. 3 I/T are in PNP's in the other room, also sleeping and it is blissfully quiet. The littles usually go down around 12:30 while the others are playing outside.

This is the method that I have used for 20+ years ~ the only problem the I had was years ago when a parent didn't want her child watching ANY type of TV. I respect that ~ but I also told her that this wasn't the daycare for her child.

I have a WII also and the 5 year old boys can kick my butt at SuperMario on rainy days

That's my 2 cents, for what it's worth.
Hey, I could've written this! Except I smoke 'em all on the Wii.

On rainy day afternoons we break out the old PS2 and use the EyeToy game to wash windows and pop bubbles and all sorts of fun stuff. Great stuff!

I don't require naps but I do encourage them and induce an environment in my home that practically guarantees them. It's hard not to fall asleep myself!!
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  #289  
Old 04-30-2012, 03:25 PM
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Reading through all these responses, I can't help but feel a little bit attacked as a parent of a 4-year-old non-sleeper. She was in a wonderful home daycare who followed the cues of her daycare kids. If they wanted to nap, they napped. If they didn't need naps anymore, or a parent requested no naps, they didn't nap. My daughter has been at home with me for a year now, as I am on mat leave. She does not nap and does NOT need a nap. We have a great bedtime routine, and always have. She is in bed at 7 and lights out by 7:30. If she does happen to have a nap during the day, we keep the bed time routine the same, but she is up and out of bed until 9 or 10. It doesn't matter how "strict" we are, she still gets up. Or asks for water. Or has to go the bathroom. Or just needs to tell us something. As an intelligent and observant parent, I attribute this behaviour to her having had a nap. Not all 4 year-old's need naps. And yes, if you lay her down in a dark room, on a bed, with music, she will go to sleep. It doesn't mean she needed it though. Sometimes, parents do know best.
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Old 08-21-2012, 05:56 PM
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I'd take my preschooler to you anyday, I read the thread and I must say I was waiting for a provider to respond this way. I worked at a preschool for 5 years, it was private and nap time was a requirement. We would provide the children with quiet activities if they did not want to nap. If they fell asleep we would not wake them up but they would not be allowed to sleep over 2 hours. There was NO tv, which in my opinion is well justified. We established an routine: drop off, breakfast, circle time, centers, snack, playground, lunch, story time, nap/quiet,time, snack, community free play, recap, and pick up would be from the classroom/or playground. Someways we would have waterplay, or music etc... Bathroom breaks all day. We even had a may set out all day for anyone who wasn't feeling well or whose parents stated they wanted them to sleep. We made our patents a priority an as long as it was safe and in the best interest of the child, we always gave it. It did not make us push overs, it made us a team. I have my preschooler now and I have been blessed to have been home with him since he was born, he started prek now at a public school and their policy is 30 minutes nap/quiet time b/c they are only there from 8-2 pm. I wish my son would Sleep! But he doesn't and there is NO one to blame, he is an individual, every child is different! He relaxes when he gets home, (he doesn't crash not get cranky), I feed him, bathe him, read to him for 30 minutes, and cuddle with him. Sometimes I pass out right next to him. He is out by 7:30 pm and up by 7 am everyday. He use to nap for 2.5-3 hours and go to bed by 9 am just a couple weeks ago but he's adjusted to life as a preschooler. Go with the flow, be flexible, respect children as individuals. They are not just "kids" they are little people!
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  #291  
Old 09-29-2012, 04:40 PM
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Angry Oh no you didn't....

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I have a 4 year old who has to lay on a mat for 1 and a half hours at her preschool/day care center. She can't get her little body to rest/sleep. The teachers reward the resting sleeping children with stickers. So every day my daughter comes home crying thinking she did something wrong because she gets no reward. Every child is different. To force a 4 year old to lay on a mat for that long doing nothing is bizarre to me. Could someone please post the Maryland state regulation that says child care workers must force a child to lay on a mat for 2 hours.

I think I read that regulation at one point and it states that a child care center must offer a nap area and a rest period but it is up to the child if he/she wants to nap or rest. I understand the need for quiet time but please this is crazy the way you think you can force children to sleep or sit still on a mat when their bodies are not able to do so.
Stop and really think about the power struggle you are creating. The feeling of shame you are creating in these children when you are telling them to do this and if they don't something is wrong with them.
You are interrupting the regulation all wrong. This regulation was to support and understand the needs of the child not to give the care giver a break.

Read and reread the regulation with each individual child in mind. Then please, please listen to the parents who knows more about their own child then the person in government that wrote a regulation that is being misused.
I agree that it's not right that they give all the kids stickers or awards after nap time and not giving her one for being quite but not sleeping. And maybe they should let her read a book or watch a movie in a seperate room, but thats not fair to say that Child Care workers aren't entitled to 1 break when working with 5+ children for up to 8+ hours! Many FCC/daycare's don't even use this time to just rest: sometimes this is the only meal/bathroom break they get between 6/7am-12/1 and they don't get regular manditory 15 minute breaks after every 2 hours of work like most jobs (at least according to CA break laws) while getting paid as little as 1.50 an hour per kid which is less than minimum wage. Some providers also use this time to have staff meetings, set up for afternoon activities, clean up, work on food program forms (which pays them to feed your child so that you don't have to pay more), paperwork/ record keeping/ taxes, work on curriculum, updating CC websites, returning missed calls, balancing checkbooks, preparing snacks, work on upcomming events/ parents notices, etc. Maybe you should volenteer at a daycare and see if you are willing to do all this for little pay and no breaks or benifits.
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  #292  
Old 01-15-2013, 09:53 AM
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Exclamation My 4 year old doesn't nap

First off, he doesn't have a TV in his room, nor would we allow that. Second, we do have a set routine of bath, books, then bedtime between 7:30 and 8 and he sleeps for about 11-12 hours. Even if he gets as little as a 25 minute nap during the day, he will inevitably refuse his bedtime and be up playing in his room til 10 or later, no matter how much we try to discipline him. Maybe the routine nap will make him less cranky at times if he was willing to take it (I admit he can be a pill some times), but his required 2.5 hour preschool nap time seems ridiculously long. I got about a 30-45 minute nap at his age and rarely would sleep the duration. The quiet playtime at his school appears to be lip service as the teachers seem to snap at kids who aren't laying their heads down and sleeping. I'm uncomfortably certain when my son tries to play quietly or read his books, he's yelled at to lay down and that's messed up. When did the preschool teachers begin taking 2.5 hour lunch times? Seems like any more than one hour is is a waste of valuable learning time and my money. We're already paying the price of a college tuition but yet these preschools appear to be teaching much less than when I was a child, and adding an extra hour and half adds insult to injury. If my son got an associates degree from the two years of paying a college tuition, I wouldn't probably complain, but he's obviously not. This mandate really needs some refinement as it is making my son not want to go to school since he's routinely getting yelled at for wanting to read his books or draw during quiet time, which accounts for ALMOST HALF THE TIME HE's AT SCHOOL.
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  #293  
Old 01-15-2013, 12:05 PM
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First off, he doesn't have a TV in his room, nor would we allow that. Second, we do have a set routine of bath, books, then bedtime between 7:30 and 8 and he sleeps for about 11-12 hours. Even if he gets as little as a 25 minute nap during the day, he will inevitably refuse his bedtime and be up playing in his room til 10 or later, no matter how much we try to discipline him. Maybe the routine nap will make him less cranky at times if he was willing to take it (I admit he can be a pill some times), but his required 2.5 hour preschool nap time seems ridiculously long. I got about a 30-45 minute nap at his age and rarely would sleep the duration. The quiet playtime at his school appears to be lip service as the teachers seem to snap at kids who aren't laying their heads down and sleeping. I'm uncomfortably certain when my son tries to play quietly or read his books, he's yelled at to lay down and that's messed up. When did the preschool teachers begin taking 2.5 hour lunch times? Seems like any more than one hour is is a waste of valuable learning time and my money. We're already paying the price of a college tuition but yet these preschools appear to be teaching much less than when I was a child, and adding an extra hour and half adds insult to injury. If my son got an associates degree from the two years of paying a college tuition, I wouldn't probably complain, but he's obviously not. This mandate really needs some refinement as it is making my son not want to go to school since he's routinely getting yelled at for wanting to read his books or draw during quiet time, which accounts for ALMOST HALF THE TIME HE's AT SCHOOL.
Oh my goodness.... With a laundry list that long of grievances, I have to wonder what kind of parent continues to allow their child to attend such a terrible place?!
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  #294  
Old 01-15-2013, 12:33 PM
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and it's the thread that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends.....

Okay, as a provider who does not insist on children napping, I do undertsand where parents are coming from when they request shorter naps for their child. HOWEVER, I have to question parents who insist that their child be in bed by 7:30-8:00 every night. WHY???????????? Why are you insisting your child go to bed that early, when clearly they are not sleeping that early, AND you have only had a couple of hours with them. Is it, perhaps, because YOU want a break at the end of your long day? Why should a provider spend 9-11 awake hours with your child. and not get even half an hour break during a VERY busy, hectic day so that you can have 1 or two awake hours with your child and then put your non-napping child to bed at 8:00????

I'd call that hypocrisy.
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  #295  
Old 01-15-2013, 08:39 PM
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Seriously??? Did this thread REALLY need to get opened back up again?? Ugh!!!
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  #296  
Old 01-30-2013, 06:49 PM
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If your child no longer needs a nap, pull them from the home daycare and wrestle it out with a center that is probably going to tell you your child needs to lay down for a certain amount of time.
Not every environment is right for every child. We do a ton of arts and crafts in my home. A couple of projects every day. It's what I do. I would not make and exception for a child that was into sports or basketball or soccer or whatever to go outside and play their choice of sports while the rest of us did the art activities. If that child or their parents were so opposed to doing what I had scheduled, and they knew that was the type of program I ran, then they need to find care elsewhere.
Nap time is a scheduled daily activity and it is usually written about in every home providers policy so the parents should know about it in advance. If they do not want their child participating in any of the scheduled daily activities then the child should not be in that program. The provider should not be and is not obligated to "make exceptions" for anyone.
Kid age out of programs all the time. To the woman who left and put her kid in a Montessori program - you probably did your provider a favor and saved her the time and energy of finding an excuse to terminate you. Home providers don't really have the luxury of worrying about the best interests of a particular child, it's the best interest of all of the children. If your kid is the square peg and going to screw up the nap routine of all of the rest of the kids, YOUR kid needs to go somewhere else. Not really an issue.
You just sound like a bully
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Old 06-17-2013, 06:15 PM
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WOW. This kids 4 years old?

Obviously the father must have a girlfriend....I don't know of any man who would allow this to go on for 4 years (kid sleeping in the bed, no "marital time" available).

Your ignorance shows. We have a 4 year old daughter who has slept in our bed since birth. My husband and I are happily married.

We put her to bed at 7pm in our bed (read, sing, lights out 7:30). We have plenty of time to make love all around the house-- including the guest room, couch, floor, etc. You have to have a really dead love life to believe the myth that parents who co-sleep don't get any, lol. We make love during the day while the kids are playing in other rooms, on date nights, whenever. You are clueless.
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  #298  
Old 06-17-2013, 06:45 PM
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Sooooo...it was a bright, sunny, & seasonably warm day here in NY. Lovely June weather.
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  #299  
Old 06-17-2013, 07:20 PM
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Random Fact: The infinity sign is properly known as a "lemniscate."
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Old 06-18-2013, 03:42 AM
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Why would a home daycare provider need a "Break" during the day to get their "own" chores done? I am at work all day a do get to get my "own" chores done on my break.

Yeh, why would we need a break? All we do is sit around, watch tv all day with the kids and eat bonbons.
Good grief!

And "our" chores?? Gimme a break. These extra chores are caused by lots of extra little hands and feet running through our home all day long. Extra dishes. Extra clutter. Extra everything everywhere. I do not do laundry during the day but if I didn't keep up with some of this other stuff, we'd eat off the table and trip over our own feet.

My crew's ages are from 1 year-6 years. I require a rest time in the afternoon. The only one to usually fall asleep is the 1 yo. But for one hour, just ONE hour, we all rest our bodies, our voices, and we don't call it nap time or rest time, we call it quiet time. I try to emphasize resting for my 2 1/2 yo but other than that, the others are allowed to do puzzles, read, watch an hour long video(only time of the day tv is allowed). They're also allowed to play quietly but they know I'm also having quiet time. Why? Well, because for the past 5 hours prior to that, I've been at their beck and call, didn't eat breakfast or lunch for that matter, had to stop bickering, do toileting, chase them outside, inside, read stories, change diapers, plan activities, paint, color, keeping up with dishes, making sure the floor is clear of all chokeables, you name it, and I've been doing it. So for that one hour *I* need to unwind/recharge before the next 4 hours begin. That way *I* can give the same quality care all day long.

It's not about keeping your child out of my hair, because they visit me constantly while I have computer time during quiet time, asking for water, telling me this, telling me that, asking for help with whatever. Plus it's for the little ones who do fall asleep and need their sleep. If the house is filled all day long with chaos and activity, the children go home all stressed out, grumpy as he!! and then their parents have to deal with it. Quiet time gives ALL of us a little much-needed break.

Granted, I only read page 1 but this is the way I do things here.
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