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Unregistered 10:59 AM 08-26-2017
BlackCat, you have some nerve deciding to confront me after I have been blocked from the site and from having me blocked on other sites and daycare groups.

The handbook version that I presented (and the one I sold) are my original works. Nowhere in there is any of your content. All daycare providers are going to have sections on hours late fees things like that and so to plan plagiarism for merely having the same category topics unless the same titles are used for Batum then there's no copyright infringement.

You commented and said that my title page looked a lot like yours and that if I changed it that you would not make a fuss about it. Since that was the only thing that was similar, I obliged and changed my title page and updated my Etsy account. If you look between the copies that I have submitted, the original and the more recent one, a lot of the content is still the same.

I have not done any backtracking and the only editing I did was to lengthen my handbook as needed for customers that have challenged my policies. The proof is in the pudding and whether you decide to believe me or not, the documts show as PROOF that I did not copy your content, regardless of what you claim or say that I did.

Using your tenure to hold power over new providers that did nothing wrong only shows that you are in fact a vindictive person preying on new providers who are trying to look for insight. And you are a BULLY along with all your other cronies on here that do your bidding.

And as for the exact phrases that I was asking about, those were for things that I would use *verbally* with clients, not things that I include in my handbook.

I'm creative enough of a writer to not need to plagiarize others' content, I merely read over yours to get a feel for what was included and what wasn't. Then created my own based on what I wanted to put in there. Nowhere in any of my versions is your content. Plain as day can see that.

It speaks to me of YOUR character that you are making this whole ordeal public and to shame me for doing nothing wrong. I have the decency to speak to you directly, not hide behind curtains or my mother's skirts.

Cowardice seems to run rampant in certain groups like this because rather than confront the person directly that you are having an issue with, you would rather publicly shame them before you even have the facts.

Not only does it show that you're not trying to solve the problem, you're only trying to feel powerful by putting somebody else down and get them in trouble. Sounds like high school all over again.

To anyone that blindly sides with someone, you are part of the problem. Get all facts from BOTH sides and then judge. Until you've done that, then you're a bully too.

Peace out.
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MarinaVanessa 11:18 AM 08-26-2017
I will never understand the need for exit speeches.
It helps no one and only makes you look worse.
The issue was clearly explained ... you don't have your own business sorted out yet and have issues with your clients, you are given information and help for free, you sell business information (not saying you took the wording word for word, just that you took the help, changed your polices and then try to sell them even though your business isn't running well) etc.

You'e not understanding the problem that she has with you. If you care to, go back and read BC's responses to you (just hers) and think about that ... or not if you don't. It's no skin off of anyone's back. This is the internet. You're never going to bump into BC or anyone else here in the streets, no one here can hurt your business etc so who really cares what anyone thinks about you? You do you.
These outbursts are really unbecoming.

And for the record, I don't believe that you plagiarized her wording. I've read BC's contract and handbook. I've even used some of her wording in mine (I give her proper credit in my handbook) and it's obvious that her content is much different than yours. The content, the grammar, the writing style, the formatting, the layout ... everything. There is no way that someone could confuse her work with yours. The content and quality of work is completely different.

***
On another note ... there are other groups????? Why do I not know this?!?!?! I know I don't comment often but I still read and I had no idea there were other groups. Are they related to Daycare.com? I want to join!
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Pestle 11:30 AM 08-26-2017
flounce.jpg
Reported for harassment.
Attached:
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Mom2Two 12:12 PM 08-26-2017
Originally Posted by MarinaVanessa:
On another note ... there are other groups????? Why do I not know this?!?!?! I know I don't comment often but I still read and I had no idea there were other groups. Are they related to Daycare.com? I want to join!
If there are any better groups, I'd like to know about it, but the other one I was on is definitely not better.
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Mom2Two 12:19 PM 08-26-2017
My two cents...

I don't know about the copyright violations, but I don't put time into this forum for the purpose of others making money SELLING any of my ideas, even if they put it into their own words.

While it may not technically be illegal to use other people for ideas and logic, it's still not nice to use people that way. It's "taking advantage," "being sneaky and ungrateful," and we all get enough of that stuff already. It's "law of the jungle" rather than kindness, gratitude, and courtesy.
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mommyneedsadayoff 12:49 PM 08-26-2017
So I read the other posts and will just give my two cents. I have never read BC's handbook and other than the sample pages on Etsy, I did not read your original or amended versions that you posted on the other link, so I have nothing to say on copy right or how comparable they are to each other.

What I do know, however, is that you are very new to daycare, yet your handbook seems to sell you as a veteran provider. I have read your posts asking for help and for what exactly to say to parents and I thought you were just a new provider who needed guidance. Now, I feel like you found a jackpot website and real veteran providers who gave you more than just guidance, but also exact wording and you ran with it and took advantage of this free information. You said you are a business woman, but your business practices are a little shady. I imagine you have enrollment issues because you sell yourself as one thing and when parents realize you are pretty new to this, they feel like they are overpaying or have been ripped off. A 40 page handbook (for $80 ) is something I would expect from someone who runs a larger group and/or is fairly well established(as in 20+ years), not a first year in home provider. Again, jmo, but as a first year nanny, I made $10 an hour and had very little benefits. Now, as a nanny/provider with close to 20 years, I get offers for much larger salaries and full benefits (vacation and insurance), but I worked hard for those offers. I got taken advantage of, learned a millions lessons, researched and evolved in my knowledge and took in all the advice I could get my hands on. And that advice is priceless! But you should use it to advance your daycare, not try to sell it on the side as if you came up with it and know how to implement it with ease. I don't think you are reading your market correctly and you are taking advantage of really good people. You are using what works in a completely different area, with different providers who have different experience levels to gain business in your area. Every area is different, and your experience level is not the same and parents are not stupid. That is why it is not working.

I LOVE this site and I would recommend it to any new provider because I think they will learn so much from it, but not so they can take the info and try to sell it as their own. It is not authentic. I could not imagine having a 27+ page handbook on my first year of doing child care! I think mine was four and that is being generous! I used large font!

Anyhoo, I hope you figure things out. My last piece of advice is to focus on your day to day and how you can improve it and make it be better. Provide awesome care, make great meals, be active and have fun. Stop selling handbooks and reduce your own hand book to 2 pages of what is non-negotiable. Put in the time actually caring for kids. This is a business where the amount of TIME you actually spend doing it is more valuable than anything. You learn so much just working every day. I will wish you the best, but I think you should really rethink your business strategy if you truly want to be successful.
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Blackcat31 01:07 PM 08-26-2017
YOU are selling content that does not belong to you as your own.

YOU got banned from another group for posting a link to your store which is against group rules.

YOU are the one that is having issues with getting and/keeping clients with the common theme being poor communication.

YOU claim to be a creative writer yet use others' ideas, words and phrases

YOU call me vindictive, out to prey on new providers and a bully!

YOU accuse me of hiding behind my authority, using my tenure and getting my cronies to do my bidding.

Let me ask you this... why?

Why would I be all those things to a virtual stranger?
You aren't competition, inspiring or even supportive in my world and I have no desire to be part of your world (hence not engaging while you have your tantrum) so the facts just don't add up.

I think you just got caught doing something sketchy and are pissed that I had enough nerve to confront you.

The irony in this entire drama filled situation is I would never have seen or known about any of this had YOU not posted that link to your store site.
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Blackcat31 01:12 PM 08-26-2017
Oh and just so know you aren't blocked. Just moderated.

If I were truly vindictive and a bully I would have blocked you all together since I was given the go-ahead to do so.

I wanted to give you the opportunity to give it up and just stop digging the hole deeper but you are quickly proving with no help from me or anyone else that you are unable to do so.


... which is why you have trouble with your clients.

^^ That's FREE advice you have my permission to use and re-use as needed.
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Unregistered 02:11 PM 08-26-2017
To blackcat:
I'm VERY VERY SORRY that you are having to go through this drama with this person, I hope that you can forget all of this and move on. People like her don't need to be commenting on other postsif they nothing nice to say
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Snowmom 02:57 PM 08-26-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
BlackCat, you have some nerve deciding to confront me after I have been blocked from the site and from having me blocked on other sites and daycare groups.

The handbook version that I presented (and the one I sold) are my original works. Nowhere in there is any of your content. All daycare providers are going to have sections on hours late fees things like that and so to plan plagiarism for merely having the same category topics unless the same titles are used for Batum then there's no copyright infringement.

You commented and said that my title page looked a lot like yours and that if I changed it that you would not make a fuss about it. Since that was the only thing that was similar, I obliged and changed my title page and updated my Etsy account. If you look between the copies that I have submitted, the original and the more recent one, a lot of the content is still the same.

I have not done any backtracking and the only editing I did was to lengthen my handbook as needed for customers that have challenged my policies. The proof is in the pudding and whether you decide to believe me or not, the documts show as PROOF that I did not copy your content, regardless of what you claim or say that I did.

Using your tenure to hold power over new providers that did nothing wrong only shows that you are in fact a vindictive person preying on new providers who are trying to look for insight. And you are a BULLY along with all your other cronies on here that do your bidding.

And as for the exact phrases that I was asking about, those were for things that I would use *verbally* with clients, not things that I include in my handbook.

I'm creative enough of a writer to not need to plagiarize others' content, I merely read over yours to get a feel for what was included and what wasn't. Then created my own based on what I wanted to put in there. Nowhere in any of my versions is your content. Plain as day can see that.

It speaks to me of YOUR character that you are making this whole ordeal public and to shame me for doing nothing wrong. I have the decency to speak to you directly, not hide behind curtains or my mother's skirts.

Cowardice seems to run rampant in certain groups like this because rather than confront the person directly that you are having an issue with, you would rather publicly shame them before you even have the facts.

Not only does it show that you're not trying to solve the problem, you're only trying to feel powerful by putting somebody else down and get them in trouble. Sounds like high school all over again.

To anyone that blindly sides with someone, you are part of the problem. Get all facts from BOTH sides and then judge. Until you've done that, then you're a bully too.

Peace out.
I told myself I wasn't going to comment because I really do hate to look at things one-sided and prefer to only comment online when it is something I am well versed and knowledgeable on.
I do consider myself a writer though. I write blog posts for my own two blogs and guest post on others. I have taken extensive courses in writing and find it a passion of mine. I take note on grammar and punctuation, but not irritatingly so where I call people out on it- just notice.

I admit, I am not knowledgeable when it comes to Blackcat's handbook. I have not read it.
I did however, read yours Trix, when you posted the two versions on the other link. I skimmed the etsy page and the handbook that was posted there. The one on the etsy page looks professional in it's presentation. It was spaced well and had verbiage that was clear and concise. I did notice Nan's "changing of the guard" in this etsy version as well. I don't think Nan would be too happy with anyone making money off her writing as well.
The version you posted here is not spaced well, it has page breaks and formatting that looks like chunks were taken out and not properly re-formatted to flow. It's hard to read (not concise).
I also noted Blackcat's exact phrasing she posts here when referring to being asked to visit/linger at daycare. Exact- as in an entire paragraph exact.

But, I didn't want to jump to conclusions quite yet, so I looked at some of the other things you have written. Like this: https://www.carelulu.com/childcare-i...daycare/164420
The way you describe yourself and daycare is nothing at all like the way you have written on this etsy page. I can hear you saying "But, I was still learning and adding to my work". But the thing is, writing style doesn't change that drastically. If you are putting yourself out there and intend to make money on your words, you make damn sure what you write is solid. Solid everywhere that has your name.

You said in this post that the only thing you've added were to lengthen your handbook, in another post you state you've shortened your handbook.... I just don't think people see consistency here in what you say.

I think others are right too, you don't see the error of what you are doing and how wronged others feel for giving advice for you to make money off of. You come across online to have an air of superiority about yourself. It was evident when you asked for advice on your website, it's evident in how you approach your daycare issues and very clearly evident in this matter.
I wish you luck and hope you can change things.
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laundrymom 05:38 PM 08-26-2017
----->late to party. Lost on what happened. But years on this site and know that one of the posters mentioned is a true veteran w a wealth of knowledge that they freely share when it could help someone. Not real sure about the other poster because I guess they are too new or not experienced enough to have caught my attention by helping others.
--- back to my bubble I go.
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flying_babyb 06:35 PM 08-26-2017
just fyi-
Your first sentence on your page needs to have your name capitalized.
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Unregistered 03:12 PM 08-27-2017
Only thing I can think of is that you're upset you didn't think to sell yours sooner. *shrugs*

As far as me sharing my Etsy page, someone asked me for the link. I said i sell mine on Etsy. She asked about it, so I posted the link. I wasn't just randomly promoting.

The 40 page version is my older habdbook version from earlier this year. I've since made it concise and shorter. Add content as needed but still keep it short. Told it wouldn't do well in court.

And it was never my intention to collect info to sell it. Had that been my motive, my Etsy shop wouldn't be new. I was reading ways that other providers earn a side income and one of them said that she sells her handbook and application documents and forms and stuff online as part of a side income, which gave me the idea.

I don't hide the fact I'm new. But i don't let the fact that I'm new mean that I'm not prepared for what may happen.
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Michael 03:22 PM 08-27-2017
Trix, the simple thing to do is write up a new handbook. Like anything including cooking and music, people borrow for others but change the flavor and rhythm of something into their own. For an $80 price tag, you can take the time to rework it. Likewise, there is no shame in crediting those that "inspired" you while you learned. Yes, people can sense someone else's style in written words. BC if anyone, has that perception.
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Blackcat31 03:37 PM 08-27-2017
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Only thing I can think of is that you're upset you didn't think to sell yours sooner. *shrugs*
That's the difference between me and you.

I genuinely want to help others.

You want to make a profit off of others.
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Leigh 04:38 PM 08-27-2017
Originally Posted by Michael:
Trix, the simple thing to do is write up a new handbook. Like anything including cooking and music, people borrow for others but change the flavor and rhythm of something into their own. For an $80 price tag, you can take the time to rework it. Likewise, there is no shame in crediting those that "inspired" you while you learned. Yes, people can sense someone else's style in written words. BC if anyone, has that perception.
Absolutely. If each of us here wrote a paragraph describing something, she'd be able to identify at least 75% of us, and narrow it down to a few for the last 25%. BC absolutely knows who is writing whether their name is on the page or not.
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Mom2Two 04:39 PM 08-27-2017
Slightly OT...but I did look at your website, Holly, and I would change out your decor a bit and about 80% of your photos. The one on front with the sandbox is good and at least one other was good, but the others were not appealing to me...to the point that I would get turned off care.

I am not saying this to be rude or dog-piling coz of the handbook thing.

Specific suggestions: Some 6 x 8 or whatever rugs. Maybe 3 (I can't quite remember how large your space it, but I got the impression that it was one big room that was divided with furniture). Maybe all the same color rugs. Even from Walmart or Home Depot. Even polyester.

And I'd have less stuff on the floor for your photos--more organized in shelves or even clear Rubber maid containers. Idk maybe you've got a friend to help.

I looked at the pics yesterday, so it's not quite fresh, but I know that personally it would be a factor for me. Like it would give more impression of being mentally organized if your space was a bit more organized.
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