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  #1  
Old 04-21-2014, 07:16 AM
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Default Parents Asking Leading Questions??

I have a two year old and a 2yr dcb that for the most part play fine together. They occasionally away at eachother or get into little squabbles usually over toys. Almost always it's the dcb that doesn't want to share. Anyway neither one is innocent. And most fights are resolved quickly...however the mom makes little comments that dcb is sad that 'son' was mean to him to today. 'Oh do you mean when they got into it over him taking a toy??' Or dcb has occasionally told his mom son has hit him as soon as she got there. This used to not happen.


Two Fridays ago she text me at like 10pm saying her son was really upset that my son had hurt his ear. I said nothing happened. She said a couple times that dcb has never acted like this and just keeps saying my son hurt him. I asked if there was any marks on the ear. She said no but tht it had been red and hot. I told her there was nothing my kid could have done to make his ear red and hot. It sounded like an ear infection...told her to update me. Never did, but I saw a FB post the next morning that he did indeed have an ear infection

Anyway, go figure last Friday the two boys got into a fight over a toy behind the recliner and my son bit his arm. It left a small red mark with no teeth marks.

I text mom and let her know what happen because I know how she is and she picked up within 15minutes. I'm not excusing my sons behavior but he's 2 it happens occasionally. Now I know to watch him even closer. It's just frustrating that shes acting like her son is either getting beat up here or that her son is completely innocent in any of their altercations. So I feel like she initially had to have been asking the son if my son hit him every time they got in the car. So now her son knows the reaction so is quick to tell her that. Anyway he supposedly didn't want to come today because he is still upset he got bit.

Would you keep this child?
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:18 AM
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Should have said occasionally swat at eachother
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  #3  
Old 04-21-2014, 07:21 AM
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I just picture the mom asking all weekend long if his arm still hurt...
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:23 AM
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I would keep him BUT I would let mom know that it is not one-sided. Let her know her son instigates some of this & that is it normal & is not going on 24/7 when he is at your house. Squabbling over toys is normal for 2-year-olds! Also, next time her son mentions being hurt by your ds I would say, 'Oh, thank you for bringing it up b/c I forgot to tell you that dcb did XXXX to my son today".
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Old 04-21-2014, 07:48 AM
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I don't like when parents perpetuate the victim role, so I wouldn't want to keep this child around waiting for an accusation. Let her go somewhere else and her son will be the victim there, too.
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Old 04-21-2014, 08:05 AM
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I have my own plus 2 other 2 year olds. ALL of them act push each other, hit each other, and my own son has been bitten 3 times in the last 6 months (thank God he hasn't started biting YET).

It's NORMAL behavior for 2 year olds. They are learning how to deal with frustrations, and often don't have the words to express their feelings.

They SHOULD be redirected and even removed from the situation if it gets too heated, but any parent of a 2 year old should understand that they are NOT generally "emotionally stable" kids at this age. Were this my situation, I would provide the parents with articles explaining 2 year old behaviors, as well as what I do to try to deal with them and teach the kids how to express their emotions in a non-physical way. A parent, however, needs to understand that when 2 year olds get together, they don't "get along" all day. They just don't.
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Old 04-21-2014, 08:12 AM
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I witnessed a provider who had a similar situation. Her child and a DCB just did not get along at all. The DCB strongly disliked her son for good reason. The kid pushed, bit, hit and snatched toys from the DCB on a regular basis. He had free reign to run wild and do what he pleases.

When the providerís son did those things, I noticed sheíd ignore or correct at any given times. Sometimes she didnít see it. Iíd step in and redirect & correct the behavior. I also noticed sheíd make excuses such as they are boys or refer to the ages. Iíd mentioned whatever the gender or age itís unacceptable behavior. Soon the DCB began to pick up the providerís sonís habits. Yet, I didnít hear, ďOh theyíre boys or DCB is such and such age.Ē I heard, ďHe hit my kid. I canít tolerate this sort of behavior. He bit my kid I canít tolerate this behavior.Ē

I am not insinuating your son is the big bad wolf and the DCB is the victim. I had a rule when my kids were younger. I expected them to follow the same rules when DCKs were in my care. If it was nap time they napped or laid on a cot quietly. If a kid hit them, I treated as if it was any other DCK. If they hit a child, I didnít dismiss it. I treated them as I would any other DCK during business hours. After business hours they had to deal with their earlier poor behavior with additional consequences. It is my income and business. Therefore they are held to a higher standard. I couldnít and canít have my children hurting my clientís children. I donít want them to hurt anyone elseís child period. It is unacceptable. They got it and understand to this very day. Most of my parents have mentioned the reason they have enrolled with me is their observation of my children.

I would start communicating with the mother on ocassion when they have squabbles and that they worked it out minutes later. ďJohnny and Tommy got into a scuffle today. I told both boys it was unacceptable. I redirected them to the train set. They worked out their differences and played nicely with one another. We also read Little Dinos Donít Hit."
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Old 04-21-2014, 08:28 AM
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I've mentioned before that I don't like passive aggressive comments. I would point blank address the issue with dcm by stating that you noticed that she states that dcb gets hit/picked on/bit/whatever by your ds a lot and so you wanted to know if she is concerned. Maybe offer to form an "action plan" to address future squabbles. Maybe she needs to find a different daycare where she isn't stressing about your son potentially getting special treatment and you aren't stressing about her comments and dcb.
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  #9  
Old 04-21-2014, 08:35 AM
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We had a family like that here. Dcb DID NOT get along with my boys at all and dcm was always blaming my children for any fights (believe me her little angels were not as perfect as she liked to believe!) I finally got tired of her moaning and groaning and told her since our children do not get along here is your two week notice. Never saw her or her troublemakers after that day.
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Old 04-21-2014, 09:49 AM
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Document, document, document! If you don't have a record of what's going on, she could seriously accuse you of allowing abuse between the children, even call cps with a complaint. If you have documentation of the squabbles, conversations with dcm, etc, you're much less likely to get into any real trouble. And if this is a true concern for you, I would advise meeting with dcm to discuss these squabbles. Remain professional, give no indication that you feel you need to defend your child because that would imply guilt, and have a conversation as if you were talking about two enrolled dcks who are not related to you. If that doesn't end well or you still feel uncomfortable about dcm causing problems for you down the road, then I would term. Don't let her drag you down with her negativity and her "victim syndrome".

I'm sorry to say, dcm, that this will be your two week notice. Our children are just not compatible together. I feel you already know this and will agree with me that this is not a good fit for either of our families. I'd be happy to offer you some recommendations for other providers/centers in our area.

And call it a day.
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  #11  
Old 04-21-2014, 09:54 AM
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Personally, I would keep the two boys separated for a period of time such as a week. Don't mention that you are separating them. See what DCM does/says...


I had a DCM insist that a particular child was being mean to her child. She repeatedly made comments about this specific child. Her child and this other child were both 3 yrs old. She came one Friday and gave me a list of things that this other child supposedly did to her son.

I gave her the list back and showed her my sign in/out sheet showing that this particular child was not in attendance for the previous 2 weeks.

Boy....did she back pedal pretty quickly...

I am NOT saying that there isn't an issue between the two boys but sometimes when one child realizes he can use that info to manipulate the situation, they take that idea and run with it...kwim?

Last edited by Blackcat31; 04-21-2014 at 10:03 AM.
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  #12  
Old 04-21-2014, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
Personally, I would keep the two boys separated for a period of time such as a week. Don't mention that you are separating them. See what DCM does/says...


I had a DCM insist that a particular child was being mean to her child. She repeatedly made comments about this specific child. Her child and this other child were both 3 yrs old. She came one Friday and gave me a list of things that this other child supposedly did to her son.

I gave her the list back and showed her my sign in/out sheet showing that this particular child was not in attendance for the previous 2 weeks.

Boy....did she back pedal pretty quickly...

I am NOT saying that there isn't an issue between the two boys but sometimes when on child realizes he can use that info to manipulate the situation, they take that idea and run with it...kwim?
I agree 100%. Kids use what works. When they realize x gets y result which may be a lot of extra attention they continue to use it, even if it's not true.

I'd DEFINATELY do this. Just be sure you don't tell mom. At the end of the week document all that mom says dcb says happened that week. Then on Friday you can say " oh gosh, that's amazing the other child did all that considering they have been separated and haven't been within five feet of each other all week long!" And then I'd probably follow hat up with an incompatibility term letter. Bye bye.
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Old 04-21-2014, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Cradle2crayons View Post
I agree 100%. Kids use what works. When they realize x gets y result which may be a lot of extra attention they continue to use it, even if it's not true.
got child right now whom all winter told his mom I wouldn't let him put his coat on when we went outside and he got cold. The text/calls were always after 9 pm.....funny thing was most of those days we DID NOT go outside....now he is telling her he gets pepsi at lunch.....who needs the "here's you sign here"? She gets the "hand" to talk to by the look on my face when she arrives cause she realizes she is in survival mode now.
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Old 04-21-2014, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cradle2crayons View Post
I agree 100%. Kids use what works. When they realize x gets y result which may be a lot of extra attention they continue to use it, even if it's not true.

I'd DEFINATELY do this. Just be sure you don't tell mom. At the end of the week document all that mom says dcb says happened that week. Then on Friday you can say " oh gosh, that's amazing the other child did all that considering they have been separated and haven't been within five feet of each other all week long!" And then I'd probably follow hat up with an incompatibility term letter. Bye bye.
Exactly! I feel if he isn't being prodded he is doing it for attention. I also should have mentioned mom started him three days after having his new baby brother. He's only part time.
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Old 04-21-2014, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
Personally, I would keep the two boys separated for a period of time such as a week. Don't mention that you are separating them. See what DCM does/says...


I had a DCM insist that a particular child was being mean to her child. She repeatedly made comments about this specific child. Her child and this other child were both 3 yrs old. She came one Friday and gave me a list of things that this other child supposedly did to her son.

I gave her the list back and showed her my sign in/out sheet showing that this particular child was not in attendance for the previous 2 weeks.

Boy....did she back pedal pretty quickly...

I am NOT saying that there isn't an issue between the two boys but sometimes when one child realizes he can use that info to manipulate the situation, they take that idea and run with it...kwim?
I think this is a great idea!! I'm not sure it's possible but you could keep your son with you at all times to know for sure there was no altercation occurred and see what happens then. I know it's not possible in my program to completely separate the children but I can keep one away from the other as much as possible and have.
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Old 04-21-2014, 11:22 AM
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I have had the exact same issue here, especially with one girl and my own daughter. I dont get baited into a confrontation listing everything their kid did to my kid. I just keep my response similar each time

"Pam, thank you for bringing this to my attention. It is very normal for kids to squabble with one another and at this age, they are all working out what is appropriate in a group environment. As always, I do my best to deal with each situation as it comes, but I can't guarantee that anything will never happen within a group setting. If anything outside of an ordinary childhood squabble happens, I will definitely let you know. Please also keep in mind that the things any child tells us are often times not the full story or never happened at all. This is true of any child, not just yours"

Rinse, repeat. If they dont like my response or keep pushing it, I will gently remind them that if they are unhappy with the environment, they are always welcome to find new care. I had to do that recently and the complaints from Dad stopped. I really cannot worry about the million things a child could be telling their parents at home.
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Old 04-21-2014, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Annalee View Post
got child right now whom all winter told his mom I wouldn't let him put his coat on when we went outside and he got cold. The text/calls were always after 9 pm.....funny thing was most of those days we DID NOT go outside....now he is telling her he gets pepsi at lunch.....who needs the "here's you sign here"? She gets the "hand" to talk to by the look on my face when she arrives cause she realizes she is in survival mode now.
Pepsi?? Tell the dcm you are a coca cola household and soda is too expensive to share!

I agree w blackcat
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:47 AM
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Mom text me this morning that son doesn't want to come this week... Is this an appropriate response? Should it be more simple?


That's fine. I actually need next week to be Dcb last week as I have filled my remaining full time spot. Part time doesn't hold over full time. But from the sounds of it that might be best if Dcb is uncomfortable with coming. And best for ds as well so he isn't made to be a bully when both of them are hitting or not sharing occasionally. Typical behavior that needs lots of talking through and redirection but can be stressful to hear about nonetheless.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:14 AM
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The last two sentences are a little confrontational, IMHO. But I also don't know the entire nature of your relationship with dcm. Looks like she's been somewhat confrontational herself, but should you stoop to her level? What you said is the truth, don't get me wrong. But I believe including those last two sentences will probably guarantee that dcb won't return at all. Which is probably a good thing.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:26 AM
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It's just really hard for me to not be 'right'...our relationship hasn't been bad except for these passive aggressive comments that her son is sad. Or saying my son has hurt hers. Yes they squabble. My son has bit him one time. Any other hitting incidents, her son included, they have been over within two seconds.

Her son is probably seeking attention after being shipped to daycare within day of his new brother being born. He only comes mtwf 9-1.

It just irks me that it's being made out that her son is being beat up. That's so not the case. They play fine other than their fights. We deal with them and move on with the day. Unfortunately it seems mom and son have some kind of bonding going on over how sad he is...which is not how he acts here.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:28 AM
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I also know she has no intention of paying for this week she is missing.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:42 AM
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I would then term effective immedialty. The fact she isn't sending her son because he doesn't want to go is a HUGE red flag. I would also be calling my licensor to let her know what's been going on.

I would send a professional term notice though - nothing passive aggressive etc. be the bigger person.
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Old 04-22-2014, 07:47 AM
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She's private pay.
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:13 AM
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You need to either tell her in writing that you are giving two weeks term notice, or ask for her 2 weeks, and quote your term notice with pay- so you have something in writing in case you have to fight for the money she owes. I would not add anything about the 2 not getting along, either, in case she wants to try to fight it and make it look like her son was being hurt or something.
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:44 AM
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I also know she has no intention of paying for this week she is missing.
I assume you have a policy regarding terms? Do parents have to give two weeks paid written notice? If so, I would respond only with...

"Dcm, Consider this your two weeks notice of end of care. You balance is $xxx and is due on xxx or late fees in the amount too xxx will be due and owning. A written copy of his can be picked up during normal daycare business hours."
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:56 AM
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I also know she has no intention of paying for this week she is missing.
I would count this as week 1 of her deposit, then.
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