Daycare.com Forum
Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Are My Expectations Too High?
daycare 08:25 PM 01-14-2016
My group consist of kids ages 19mo to 5yrs not enrolled in school.
Most of my kids are great at following our rules, sometimes they need a gentle reminder, but for the most part the older kids (4-5) really set the good example for the little ones and the little ones follow their lead.
Well all but one. I have one dcg who is 3years 11mo. dck has been here since she was 17mo, one of my youngest ever enrolled.
this child should know the rules more than anyone, but unfortunately, this is not the case. Every single day WE have to remind dck of the rules every single rule every single time every single day. dck is full time and here from 730 to 5pm 5 days a week.
the things are not horrible, just things that could lead to accidents, the child could hurt themselves or another child.
like spinning in circles inside, this child knows this is a big NO NO. We don't have the space for it and can lead to falling on a shelf, another child or such.
Yesterday, the child finished breakfast before everyone and was the first person to the circle time rug. Dck started running around the rug. I reminded them walking feet. younger dck age 2.0 comes into circle time rug and before I know it the older dck is running in the circle again and the 2.0 dck is chasing right behind. Well sure enough, older dck looks back over their own shoulder and decided to stop so that the 2.0 year old smashes right into the back of them. 2.0 year old bust lip open, blood all over the carpet. Thankfully it was a mild split in the lip, but still a child was hurt in my care and thank goodness it was just that and not worse.
The child knows the rules, but no matter what will break them every day all day.
so my question is, is this normal that the child needs CONSTANT reminder all day every day of the rules, same rules all day long? We are very clear about our expectations and boundaries as well as consequences.
We do everything we can to encourage good and desirable behavior. We are very good at affirming the good things.
Also the little kids will correct this child as well telling this child you are not supposed to do this or that.
am I expecting too much out of a child of this age to be able to follow rules after being in my care for over 2 years?
Most of my kids are great at following our rules, sometimes they need a gentle reminder, but for the most part the older kids (4-5) really set the good example for the little ones and the little ones follow their lead.
Well all but one. I have one dcg who is 3years 11mo. dck has been here since she was 17mo, one of my youngest ever enrolled.
this child should know the rules more than anyone, but unfortunately, this is not the case. Every single day WE have to remind dck of the rules every single rule every single time every single day. dck is full time and here from 730 to 5pm 5 days a week.
the things are not horrible, just things that could lead to accidents, the child could hurt themselves or another child.
like spinning in circles inside, this child knows this is a big NO NO. We don't have the space for it and can lead to falling on a shelf, another child or such.
Yesterday, the child finished breakfast before everyone and was the first person to the circle time rug. Dck started running around the rug. I reminded them walking feet. younger dck age 2.0 comes into circle time rug and before I know it the older dck is running in the circle again and the 2.0 dck is chasing right behind. Well sure enough, older dck looks back over their own shoulder and decided to stop so that the 2.0 year old smashes right into the back of them. 2.0 year old bust lip open, blood all over the carpet. Thankfully it was a mild split in the lip, but still a child was hurt in my care and thank goodness it was just that and not worse.
The child knows the rules, but no matter what will break them every day all day.
so my question is, is this normal that the child needs CONSTANT reminder all day every day of the rules, same rules all day long? We are very clear about our expectations and boundaries as well as consequences.
We do everything we can to encourage good and desirable behavior. We are very good at affirming the good things.
Also the little kids will correct this child as well telling this child you are not supposed to do this or that.
am I expecting too much out of a child of this age to be able to follow rules after being in my care for over 2 years?
Josiegirl 02:52 AM 01-15-2016
I don't think you're being unreasonable at all but evidently he needs to let some energy out. Not sure what the answer is.Can you hold his hand during transition times? What if you made walking there a game such as ok everybody we're going to tiptoe like a mouse to the rug.
daycare 07:36 AM 01-15-2016
lol I don't have an answer either.
I have been in the childcare field for many many years. I think a total of 18, 13 of these running my own daycare.
I have never come across a child like this.
I have been in the childcare field for many many years. I think a total of 18, 13 of these running my own daycare.
I have never come across a child like this.
laundrymom 07:47 AM 01-15-2016
The child hasn't learned boundaries. You need to provide them with just enough freedom to not step
Over boundaries.
Here they would sit at the table until I was available to monitor behavior. They would have no freedom until they earned it. I think that three is PLENTY old enough to expect them to remember. To be honest, if I was just "reminded" to pay my bills or "reminded to drive the speed limit, and never punished, I'd probably not change either. But let the water get turned off, or the electric, and that's a lesson I will remember.
Kids are no different.
In fact, each day they start new but first offense gets no warnings with this pattern of behavior. It simply gets them removed from free play and sitting beside me w a book or in a chair to watch the others play.
Over boundaries.
Here they would sit at the table until I was available to monitor behavior. They would have no freedom until they earned it. I think that three is PLENTY old enough to expect them to remember. To be honest, if I was just "reminded" to pay my bills or "reminded to drive the speed limit, and never punished, I'd probably not change either. But let the water get turned off, or the electric, and that's a lesson I will remember.
Kids are no different.
In fact, each day they start new but first offense gets no warnings with this pattern of behavior. It simply gets them removed from free play and sitting beside me w a book or in a chair to watch the others play.
Blackcat31 08:01 AM 01-15-2016
While I agree with Laundrymom about consequences and such I think it sounds like the child is a very physical child that needs to let off some of that energy before being required to sit and pay attention.
This is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate in my opinion. At that child's age they SHOULD be spending a majority of their day moving freely and using energy up.
They can learn so much through movement and physical expression.
I think you should focus on ways to "use" up that energy and give her activities that DO allow her to spin, move and twirl.
Unless a child has used up their physical energy and gotten a chance to get a little of it out, they will never be able to sit and pay attention or focus without some difficulty.
Kind of like a puppy/dog. The VERY first rule they teach you when you get a puppy is to make sure you exercise the heck out them BEFORE trying to do any training lessons. If you don't the pup will simply listen to their bodies because their need to expunge that energy is MUCH greater than whatever their brain is trying to tell them to do.
This is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate in my opinion. At that child's age they SHOULD be spending a majority of their day moving freely and using energy up.
They can learn so much through movement and physical expression.
I think you should focus on ways to "use" up that energy and give her activities that DO allow her to spin, move and twirl.
Unless a child has used up their physical energy and gotten a chance to get a little of it out, they will never be able to sit and pay attention or focus without some difficulty.
Kind of like a puppy/dog. The VERY first rule they teach you when you get a puppy is to make sure you exercise the heck out them BEFORE trying to do any training lessons. If you don't the pup will simply listen to their bodies because their need to expunge that energy is MUCH greater than whatever their brain is trying to tell them to do.
daycare 08:06 AM 01-15-2016
oh we do have set consequences and boundaries.
I send the child to the thinking spot and let them cool off or think about making better choices. the child turns 4 today...
I send the child to the thinking spot and let them cool off or think about making better choices. the child turns 4 today...
daycare 08:22 AM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
While I agree with Laundrymom about consequences and such I think it sounds like the child is a very physical child that needs to let off some of that energy before being required to sit and pay attention.
This is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate in my opinion. At that child's age they SHOULD be spending a majority of their day moving freely and using energy up.
They can learn so much through movement and physical expression.
I think you should focus on ways to "use" up that energy and give her activities that DO allow her to spin, move and twirl.
Unless a child has used up their physical energy and gotten a chance to get a little of it out, they will never be able to sit and pay attention or focus without some difficulty.
Kind of like a puppy/dog. The VERY first rule they teach you when you get a puppy is to make sure you exercise the heck out them BEFORE trying to do any training lessons. If you don't the pup will simply listen to their bodies because their need to expunge that energy is MUCH greater than whatever their brain is trying to tell them to do.
sorry I didn't get fully detailed in my post, but my program involves almost 80% movement. the only time we sit is to read a book and even when we are reading, we are jumping like the frog in the book, eat or napping. The rest of the time we are moving non-stop. I even have logs, big logs from Sequoia trees that the kids can roll, push move all over the yard. This child uses them the most.While I agree with Laundrymom about consequences and such I think it sounds like the child is a very physical child that needs to let off some of that energy before being required to sit and pay attention.
This is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate in my opinion. At that child's age they SHOULD be spending a majority of their day moving freely and using energy up.
They can learn so much through movement and physical expression.
I think you should focus on ways to "use" up that energy and give her activities that DO allow her to spin, move and twirl.
Unless a child has used up their physical energy and gotten a chance to get a little of it out, they will never be able to sit and pay attention or focus without some difficulty.
Kind of like a puppy/dog. The VERY first rule they teach you when you get a puppy is to make sure you exercise the heck out them BEFORE trying to do any training lessons. If you don't the pup will simply listen to their bodies because their need to expunge that energy is MUCH greater than whatever their brain is trying to tell them to do.
The issue is that it's with every single thing.
even toileting we have to tell the child every step or they won't do it. any chance to not listen to the rules they will take it.
daycare 08:29 AM 01-15-2016
I guess what I mean to say is that it's not just physical stuff where the issue lies. Often daily we have to remind the child of our meal time rules, no screaming, etc.
daycare 10:13 AM 01-15-2016
sorry, I am not good at putting my thoughts on paper.
I thought about it a little and maybe this would help some.
the child can sit no problem. The child does a really good job of sitting when needed, that is not the problem.
I guess they just really have the most difficult time listening to rules.
I just got off the phone with mom and she admitted that they are having tons of issues with listening at home and following rules there too. So it sounds like the problem is at home and it just gets brought here. DCM admitted that they fail to follow through with their consequences and they always give 3 chances to correct the behavior before they give the consequence. so I guess now I know why this is happening.
I thought about it a little and maybe this would help some.
the child can sit no problem. The child does a really good job of sitting when needed, that is not the problem.
I guess they just really have the most difficult time listening to rules.
I just got off the phone with mom and she admitted that they are having tons of issues with listening at home and following rules there too. So it sounds like the problem is at home and it just gets brought here. DCM admitted that they fail to follow through with their consequences and they always give 3 chances to correct the behavior before they give the consequence. so I guess now I know why this is happening.
Unregistered 10:23 AM 01-15-2016
Sorry black cat, but early childhood education is about physical too. What you are not liking is poor quality programs. A quality program is play based and does have appropriate ece curriculum. Appropriate ece curriculum is not academics. I know its semantics but saying early childhood education is inappropriate is so wrong. Bad early childhood education is inappropriate. Quality, developmentally appropriate ece is what kids need and is where they can all thrive. That would be a playbased, child centered, (and in my opinion no academics!) curriculum. Ece doesn't mean academics... :/
Unregistered 01:25 PM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by laundrymom:
The child hasn't learned boundaries. You need to provide them with just enough freedom to not step
Over boundaries.
Here they would sit at the table until I was available to monitor behavior. They would have no freedom until they earned it. I think that three is PLENTY old enough to expect them to remember. To be honest, if I was just "reminded" to pay my bills or "reminded to drive the speed limit, and never punished, I'd probably not change either. But let the water get turned off, or the electric, and that's a lesson I will remember.
Kids are no different.
In fact, each day they start new but first offense gets no warnings with this pattern of behavior. It simply gets them removed from free play and sitting beside me w a book or in a chair to watch the others play.
Couldn't agree moreThe child hasn't learned boundaries. You need to provide them with just enough freedom to not step
Over boundaries.
Here they would sit at the table until I was available to monitor behavior. They would have no freedom until they earned it. I think that three is PLENTY old enough to expect them to remember. To be honest, if I was just "reminded" to pay my bills or "reminded to drive the speed limit, and never punished, I'd probably not change either. But let the water get turned off, or the electric, and that's a lesson I will remember.
Kids are no different.
In fact, each day they start new but first offense gets no warnings with this pattern of behavior. It simply gets them removed from free play and sitting beside me w a book or in a chair to watch the others play.
Blackcat31 02:12 PM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Sorry black cat, but early childhood education is about physical too. What you are not liking is poor quality programs. A quality program is play based and does have appropriate ece curriculum. Appropriate ece curriculum is not academics. I know its semantics but saying early childhood education is inappropriate is so wrong. Bad early childhood education is inappropriate. Quality, developmentally appropriate ece is what kids need and is where they can all thrive. That would be a playbased, child centered, (and in my opinion no academics!) curriculum. Ece doesn't mean academics... :/
I didnt say Early Childhood Education is wrong.Sorry black cat, but early childhood education is about physical too. What you are not liking is poor quality programs. A quality program is play based and does have appropriate ece curriculum. Appropriate ece curriculum is not academics. I know its semantics but saying early childhood education is inappropriate is so wrong. Bad early childhood education is inappropriate. Quality, developmentally appropriate ece is what kids need and is where they can all thrive. That would be a playbased, child centered, (and in my opinion no academics!) curriculum. Ece doesn't mean academics... :/
I said this is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate.
It was said in a completely different context than you are interpreting it.
My point was so much of what some states are requiring of child care providers is focused on academics and promoting a more "school like" atmosphere.
I understand what ECE is (I have a Bachelors in Early Childhood Education (with the ability to be licensed as a Birth through Grade 3 teacher) I am also a 4 star (max) rated program that mentors other providers in my area. I am also a certified ECE trainer and can teach trainings accepted by my state's licensing requirements. .......you get the point.
I believe 10000% in play-based learning but many providers do not and instead do things as that are based on their experiences in school when they were younger. I think a lot of the QRIS stuff that states are offering is also focused in academics and not accepting at all of the value and necessity of play.
*sigh* I could probably write a book on the dumb things I think some state's do that they "think" qualifies as appropriate for early childhood.....but I'll save you the rant...I just wanted to point out that my original statement that you commented on was misinterpreted.
daycare 02:29 PM 01-15-2016
I knew what you meant.
and yes QRIS sucks they want soo much academics.
and yes QRIS sucks they want soo much academics.
Blackcat31 02:38 PM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by daycare:
I knew what you meant.
and yes QRIS sucks they want soo much academics.
I knew you did/would I knew what you meant.
and yes QRIS sucks they want soo much academics.
.....that's probably half the reason some of the forum readers think a few of us (long time members) are cray-cray.... we all talk like old friends that read each other's minds and finish each other's sentences sometimes. 
daycare 03:12 PM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I knew you did/would .....that's probably half the reason some of the forum readers think a few of us (long time members) are cray-cray.... we all talk like old friends that read each other's minds and finish each other's sentences sometimes.
lol...one of my asst read something that someone posted on here once and was like wow that person is so mean. I started laughing becuase I knew the poster pretty well and it was totally taken the wrong way.I knew you did/would
.....that's probably half the reason some of the forum readers think a few of us (long time members) are cray-cray.... we all talk like old friends that read each other's minds and finish each other's sentences sometimes. thanks for your feed back.
now DCM is asking for a sit down meeting with me wants to know what we can do to resolve the behavior issues and I really feel like it needs to be fixed at home before it's ever going to work here.
what is your thought?
Blackcat31 04:07 PM 01-15-2016
Originally Posted by daycare:
lol...one of my asst read something that someone posted on here once and was like wow that person is so mean. I started laughing becuase I knew the poster pretty well and it was totally taken the wrong way.
thanks for your feed back.
now DCM is asking for a sit down meeting with me wants to know what we can do to resolve the behavior issues and I really feel like it needs to be fixed at home before it's ever going to work here.
what is your thought?
Good eating and good sleeping routines as well as consistent discipline/consequences for unwanted behaviors at HOME are the foundation everything else is built on. lol...one of my asst read something that someone posted on here once and was like wow that person is so mean. I started laughing becuase I knew the poster pretty well and it was totally taken the wrong way.
thanks for your feed back.
now DCM is asking for a sit down meeting with me wants to know what we can do to resolve the behavior issues and I really feel like it needs to be fixed at home before it's ever going to work here.
what is your thought?
I'd tell the DCM that when SHE gets those things regulated at home you will happily have a conference with her as more than likely once those things become more consistent and regular at home there wont be anything for you two to discuss.
daycare 04:28 PM 01-15-2016
i couldn't agree more. I decided to print off some of our local resource center parent workshops and told her that I think that would be a good start.
luckily the parents are a dream and they agreed. SO hopefully we get some where with this very soon.
fingers crossed.
luckily the parents are a dream and they agreed. SO hopefully we get some where with this very soon.
fingers crossed.
Josiegirl 03:10 AM 01-16-2016
I'm beginning to wonder if any family has instituted a good sleep routine???
daycare 11:51 AM 01-16-2016
Originally Posted by Josiegirl:
I'm beginning to wonder if any family has instituted a good sleep routine???
You and me both. Every time I ask a parent about their child's sleep schedule they say oh they are getting a full nights sleep, my child is on a great schedule. I'll ask what their schedule looks like and they always say they are at least getting 8.5-9 hours, naps in the car And then you see me hit my head on the wall. Lol.I'm beginning to wonder if any family has instituted a good sleep routine???
MunchkinWrangler 12:19 AM 01-17-2016
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I didnt say Early Childhood Education is wrong.
I said this is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate.
It was said in a completely different context than you are interpreting it.
My point was so much of what some states are requiring of child care providers is focused on academics and promoting a more "school like" atmosphere.
I understand what ECE is (I have a Bachelors in Early Childhood Education (with the ability to be licensed as a Birth through Grade 3 teacher) I am also a 4 star (max) rated program that mentors other providers in my area. I am also a certified ECE trainer and can teach trainings accepted by my state's licensing requirements. .......you get the point.
I believe 10000% in play-based learning but many providers do not and instead do things as that are based on their experiences in school when they were younger. I think a lot of the QRIS stuff that states are offering is also focused in academics and not accepting at all of the value and necessity of play.
*sigh* I could probably write a book on the dumb things I think some state's do that they "think" qualifies as appropriate for early childhood.....but I'll save you the rant...I just wanted to point out that my original statement that you commented on was misinterpreted.
I didnt say Early Childhood Education is wrong.
I said this is where the "early childhood education" stuff starts getting really inappropriate.
It was said in a completely different context than you are interpreting it.
My point was so much of what some states are requiring of child care providers is focused on academics and promoting a more "school like" atmosphere.
I understand what ECE is (I have a Bachelors in Early Childhood Education (with the ability to be licensed as a Birth through Grade 3 teacher) I am also a 4 star (max) rated program that mentors other providers in my area. I am also a certified ECE trainer and can teach trainings accepted by my state's licensing requirements. .......you get the point.
I believe 10000% in play-based learning but many providers do not and instead do things as that are based on their experiences in school when they were younger. I think a lot of the QRIS stuff that states are offering is also focused in academics and not accepting at all of the value and necessity of play.
*sigh* I could probably write a book on the dumb things I think some state's do that they "think" qualifies as appropriate for early childhood.....but I'll save you the rant...I just wanted to point out that my original statement that you commented on was misinterpreted.
