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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>A Provider's Experience With STARS Assessors
Josiegirl 02:07 AM 04-13-2018
I ran into a provider last night that is shooting for her 4th STAR. She needs to pass the assessment to get it. They've been to her home 2-3 times already and she hasn't passed yet. 
She got dinged for having a 1 yo yawn at lunchtime. One yawn. They suggested she change her schedule so the 1 yo can eat earlier and nap earlier.
It was during the winter, a cold day, and the assessors arrived at 10-2. They gave her no marks for outside time that day because dc was already back inside by the time they got there.
She lives out of the way with lots of room for dcks to run, kind of a dead-end road where the kids would have to go quite far to hit the road at all. She's never had a fence so she got docked for that.
She mentioned something about the diaper changing procedure so that must've messed her up.
She didn't have a soft spot for her 12 mo to sit and relax.
How many 12 mo's just want to sit and rest?? Usually we're holding them in our laps, etc.
The kids can't be left waiting for more than 5 minutes for anything. She sat them at the table at lunch time while she served up lunch and the assessors were still in her playroom. They docked her because they said she made them wait too long.
Another provider I know of was docked because her bird feeders outdoors were not at kid eye level.
She bought a nice new changing table; it didn't meet their qualifications.
There were other issues, she said she has a whole list of ridiculous grievances. The state wants perfection. There is no such thing. Will they ever lighten up?? This provider has been in it a long long time. She never needs to advertise and is a terrific person. Kids like her. Parents like her. WTH.
She got dinged for having a 1 yo yawn at lunchtime. One yawn. They suggested she change her schedule so the 1 yo can eat earlier and nap earlier.
It was during the winter, a cold day, and the assessors arrived at 10-2. They gave her no marks for outside time that day because dc was already back inside by the time they got there.
She lives out of the way with lots of room for dcks to run, kind of a dead-end road where the kids would have to go quite far to hit the road at all. She's never had a fence so she got docked for that.
She mentioned something about the diaper changing procedure so that must've messed her up.
She didn't have a soft spot for her 12 mo to sit and relax.
How many 12 mo's just want to sit and rest?? Usually we're holding them in our laps, etc.The kids can't be left waiting for more than 5 minutes for anything. She sat them at the table at lunch time while she served up lunch and the assessors were still in her playroom. They docked her because they said she made them wait too long.
Another provider I know of was docked because her bird feeders outdoors were not at kid eye level.
She bought a nice new changing table; it didn't meet their qualifications.
There were other issues, she said she has a whole list of ridiculous grievances.
The state wants perfection. There is no such thing. Will they ever lighten up?? This provider has been in it a long long time. She never needs to advertise and is a terrific person. Kids like her. Parents like her. WTH.
Annalee 04:39 AM 04-13-2018
Originally Posted by Josiegirl:
I ran into a provider last night that is shooting for her 4th STAR. She needs to pass the assessment to get it. They've been to her home 2-3 times already and she hasn't passed yet.
She got dinged for having a 1 yo yawn at lunchtime. One yawn. They suggested she change her schedule so the 1 yo can eat earlier and nap earlier.
It was during the winter, a cold day, and the assessors arrived at 10-2. They gave her no marks for outside time that day because dc was already back inside by the time they got there.
She lives out of the way with lots of room for dcks to run, kind of a dead-end road where the kids would have to go quite far to hit the road at all. She's never had a fence so she got docked for that.
She mentioned something about the diaper changing procedure so that must've messed her up.
She didn't have a soft spot for her 12 mo to sit and relax. How many 12 mo's just want to sit and rest?? Usually we're holding them in our laps, etc.
The kids can't be left waiting for more than 5 minutes for anything. She sat them at the table at lunch time while she served up lunch and the assessors were still in her playroom. They docked her because they said she made them wait too long.
Another provider I know of was docked because her bird feeders outdoors were not at kid eye level.
She bought a nice new changing table; it didn't meet their qualifications.
There were other issues, she said she has a whole list of ridiculous grievances. The state wants perfection. There is no such thing. Will they ever lighten up?? This provider has been in it a long long time. She never needs to advertise and is a terrific person. Kids like her. Parents like her. WTH.
The Assessment is not only an unreliable tool, but is left to the assessor's perception of that tool. The grievance process here is worse than the actual assessment because it takes so long and if you follow through long enough, you end up in a court setting so providers don't grieve their scores very often. I feel for the provider you are talking about because it really affects how you feel about yourself as a provider and that is wrong of any state entity to inflict on a provider. I ran into a provider last night that is shooting for her 4th STAR. She needs to pass the assessment to get it. They've been to her home 2-3 times already and she hasn't passed yet.
She got dinged for having a 1 yo yawn at lunchtime. One yawn. They suggested she change her schedule so the 1 yo can eat earlier and nap earlier.
It was during the winter, a cold day, and the assessors arrived at 10-2. They gave her no marks for outside time that day because dc was already back inside by the time they got there.
She lives out of the way with lots of room for dcks to run, kind of a dead-end road where the kids would have to go quite far to hit the road at all. She's never had a fence so she got docked for that.
She mentioned something about the diaper changing procedure so that must've messed her up.
She didn't have a soft spot for her 12 mo to sit and relax.
How many 12 mo's just want to sit and rest?? Usually we're holding them in our laps, etc.The kids can't be left waiting for more than 5 minutes for anything. She sat them at the table at lunch time while she served up lunch and the assessors were still in her playroom. They docked her because they said she made them wait too long.
Another provider I know of was docked because her bird feeders outdoors were not at kid eye level.
She bought a nice new changing table; it didn't meet their qualifications.
There were other issues, she said she has a whole list of ridiculous grievances.
The state wants perfection. There is no such thing. Will they ever lighten up?? This provider has been in it a long long time. She never needs to advertise and is a terrific person. Kids like her. Parents like her. WTH.
Blackcat31 06:34 AM 04-13-2018
Originally Posted by Annalee:
The Assessment is not only an unreliable tool, but is left to the assessor's perception of that tool. The grievance process here is worse than the actual assessment because it takes so long and if you follow through long enough, you end up in a court setting so providers don't grieve their scores very often. I feel for the provider you are talking about because it really affects how you feel about yourself as a provider and that is wrong of any state entity to inflict on a provider.
I agree.... some assessors seem to be on a power trip and rather than being an advisor or peer who's role is to support and assist the provider in reaching and maintaining the highest level of quality possible, they seem to think they are drill sergeants and there to break up some sort of massive illegal operation The Assessment is not only an unreliable tool, but is left to the assessor's perception of that tool. The grievance process here is worse than the actual assessment because it takes so long and if you follow through long enough, you end up in a court setting so providers don't grieve their scores very often. I feel for the provider you are talking about because it really affects how you feel about yourself as a provider and that is wrong of any state entity to inflict on a provider.
I purposely make the kids wait. The "guidelines" they say in regards to transitions and periods of time that kids should be made to wait are absolutely silly and unrealistic.
I think patience is a virtue that is very rare and one I think all kids should learn. My kiddos (all ages) wait for certain things and during certain periods of the day for upwards of 10-15 minutes....and they all rock at it.
As for the yawning and the bird feeders.... wow! That's crazy! I wonder how the assessor thinks the provider can manage someone's body actions...like what if the child passed gas...would the provider be dinged for that too? She can't control how parent's parent not how quickly a child tires and thus yawns.
This is the kind of stuff that makes this profession difficult. ANY one that enters a family child care program in whatever official capacity should be celebrating and praising the provider for all the hard work she/he does!
I wonder if any of the assessors have heard about positive reinforcement and how much better it is compared to punishment and consequences? You know, the exact concept they expect of the provider but yet don't do themselves.
There are not enough
's to adequately convey my feelings for those in the ECE world but NOT actual hands on folks.
CalCare 07:12 AM 04-13-2018
One thing on Fccers that I can't wrap my head around is they want kids to wash hands before and after outside play. The kid is playing with Legos in my house and has to wash hands before they go play in the dirt. Ha.
Country Kids 08:19 AM 04-13-2018
Some of that has nothing to even do with the STARS program at least in my state. I would see them almost more of a state rule type thing. Interesting how it changes from state to state.
My mentor wants me to go for my Four Star. I'm not sure if I have the energy for it anymore and honestly, it doesn't bring the clients in by the droves and I stay full just by having a quality childcare without all the extra rules and worry.
My mentor wants me to go for my Four Star. I'm not sure if I have the energy for it anymore and honestly, it doesn't bring the clients in by the droves and I stay full just by having a quality childcare without all the extra rules and worry.
Annalee 09:13 AM 04-13-2018
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I agree.... some assessors seem to be on a power trip and rather than being an advisor or peer who's role is to support and assist the provider in reaching and maintaining the highest level of quality possible, they seem to think they are drill sergeants and there to break up some sort of massive illegal operation
I purposely make the kids wait. The "guidelines" they say in regards to transitions and periods of time that kids should be made to wait are absolutely silly and unrealistic.
I think patience is a virtue that is very rare and one I think all kids should learn. My kiddos (all ages) wait for certain things and during certain periods of the day for upwards of 10-15 minutes....and they all rock at it.
As for the yawning and the bird feeders.... wow! That's crazy! I wonder how the assessor thinks the provider can manage someone's body actions...like what if the child passed gas...would the provider be dinged for that too? She can't control how parent's parent not how quickly a child tires and thus yawns.
This is the kind of stuff that makes this profession difficult. ANY one that enters a family child care program in whatever official capacity should be celebrating and praising the provider for all the hard work she/he does!
I wonder if any of the assessors have heard about positive reinforcement and how much better it is compared to punishment and consequences? You know, the exact concept they expect of the provider but yet don't do themselves.
There are not enough 's to adequately convey my feelings for those in the ECE world but NOT actual hands on folks.
Yes, and those transitional/wait times really affect the scoring..... I think assessors should work in FCC before becoming an assessor..... No ONE book has an answer for a complete "typical" day in FCC because there is NO "typical" day.....we are emergent providers many times and the FCCERS-R does not allow for that!!!!!!I agree.... some assessors seem to be on a power trip and rather than being an advisor or peer who's role is to support and assist the provider in reaching and maintaining the highest level of quality possible, they seem to think they are drill sergeants and there to break up some sort of massive illegal operation
I purposely make the kids wait. The "guidelines" they say in regards to transitions and periods of time that kids should be made to wait are absolutely silly and unrealistic.
I think patience is a virtue that is very rare and one I think all kids should learn. My kiddos (all ages) wait for certain things and during certain periods of the day for upwards of 10-15 minutes....and they all rock at it.
As for the yawning and the bird feeders.... wow! That's crazy! I wonder how the assessor thinks the provider can manage someone's body actions...like what if the child passed gas...would the provider be dinged for that too? She can't control how parent's parent not how quickly a child tires and thus yawns.
This is the kind of stuff that makes this profession difficult. ANY one that enters a family child care program in whatever official capacity should be celebrating and praising the provider for all the hard work she/he does!
I wonder if any of the assessors have heard about positive reinforcement and how much better it is compared to punishment and consequences? You know, the exact concept they expect of the provider but yet don't do themselves.
There are not enough
's to adequately convey my feelings for those in the ECE world but NOT actual hands on folks.
Unregistered 03:28 PM 04-13-2018
God's for sake!!!! I'd say take a jump in a lake and forget it. Ugh!!!!!
Unregistered 03:30 PM 04-13-2018
I Meant "Oh for God's sake!" I'm tired! Can u tell? LOL!
hwichlaz 10:12 PM 04-13-2018
Here you’re assessed by your mentor. So they help you set up your facility to pass. I had 5 stars at my old location, and will soon be doing it at my current location.
Josiegirl 02:30 AM 04-14-2018
Originally Posted by Annalee:
Yes, and those transitional/wait times really affect the scoring..... I think assessors should work in FCC before becoming an assessor..... No ONE book has an answer for a complete "typical" day in FCC because there is NO "typical" day.....we are emergent providers many times and the FCCERS-R does not allow for that!!!!!!
OH I completely agree. You can only become an assessor by starting at dc level and working through more levels.Yes, and those transitional/wait times really affect the scoring..... I think assessors should work in FCC before becoming an assessor..... No ONE book has an answer for a complete "typical" day in FCC because there is NO "typical" day.....we are emergent providers many times and the FCCERS-R does not allow for that!!!!!!
Our food program person is SO understanding because she did FCC for a lot of years. She knows!! Assessors should be more reasonable in their expectations.
Another case in point...my Birth-5 mentor(whose job they have now delegated to someone else
) used to be a FCC so she was so understanding also. She used to do the assessments way back before they felt their need for professional assessors was great. She was compassionate, helpful, easy to work with and SUPPORTIVE(in the words of the state 'hand-holding'). I would've gone further in STARS if she had stayed. She and 1 other person(who was also forced to another position) were the reasons I started in the first place. They made me feel capable. I would've welcomed them into my dc. And did many times. But not these other people. No effin way. I'd rather work under the radar.
Josiegirl 02:33 AM 04-14-2018
Originally Posted by hwichlaz:
Here you’re assessed by your mentor. So they help you set up your facility to pass. I had 5 stars at my old location, and will soon be doing it at my current location.
It used to be that way here. Here you’re assessed by your mentor. So they help you set up your facility to pass. I had 5 stars at my old location, and will soon be doing it at my current location.
As it SHOULD be!!! I cannot help but feel some states are more for helping bigger centers and more formal preschools. Good luck with your new location!!
Country Kids 08:31 AM 04-16-2018
We have a petition in our state right now asking for licensor specialists to have some sort of background in childcare besides all the other qualifications. As of now, there is no requirement to have anything with a background in childcare.
It would be nice to have someone that when they come through understands what we are going through. There is a difference between a provider just not caring and one that is a quality provider but is watching children, running a business, be a cook, janitor, housekeeper, etc at the same time.
It would be nice to have someone that when they come through understands what we are going through. There is a difference between a provider just not caring and one that is a quality provider but is watching children, running a business, be a cook, janitor, housekeeper, etc at the same time.
Blackcat31 09:01 AM 04-16-2018
Originally Posted by Country Kids:
We have a petition in our state right now asking for licensor specialists to have some sort of background in childcare besides all the other qualifications. As of now, there is no requirement to have anything with a background in childcare.
It would be nice to have someone that when they come through understands what we are going through. There is a difference between a provider just not caring and one that is a quality provider but is watching children, running a business, be a cook, janitor, housekeeper, etc at the same time.
Oh my, your state has your licensing specialist do the assessments? We have a petition in our state right now asking for licensor specialists to have some sort of background in childcare besides all the other qualifications. As of now, there is no requirement to have anything with a background in childcare.
It would be nice to have someone that when they come through understands what we are going through. There is a difference between a provider just not caring and one that is a quality provider but is watching children, running a business, be a cook, janitor, housekeeper, etc at the same time.
In my state the assessors are from MnAEYC (MN chapter of NAEYC) or from our QRIS program. Depending on who you are being accredited by. No one from licensing does any type of assessment. No one from our licensing department
or DHS has anything to do with accreditation.
If your state is tying licensing to assessments I wonder if they are soon to make QRIS or accreditation mandatory for providers? Yikes...I sure hope not...
Annalee 09:12 AM 04-16-2018
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Oh my, your state has your licensing specialist do the assessments?
In my state the assessors are from MnAEYC (MN chapter of NAEYC) or from our QRIS program. Depending on who you are being accredited by. No one from licensing does any type of assessment. No one from our licensing department
or DHS has anything to do with accreditation.
If your state is tying licensing to assessments I wonder if they are soon to make QRIS or accreditation mandatory for providers? Yikes...I sure hope not...
Providers here have suggested Licensing perform our assessments since they visit us all 4-6 times a year and actually know what we are doing/who we are.....Right now, the assessor is a degreed person with very little if any knowledge of child care. Our report card is getting revamped now with the changes coming....anxious for it all to unfold......but not holding my breath for it to benefit the providerOh my, your state has your licensing specialist do the assessments?
In my state the assessors are from MnAEYC (MN chapter of NAEYC) or from our QRIS program. Depending on who you are being accredited by. No one from licensing does any type of assessment. No one from our licensing department
or DHS has anything to do with accreditation.
If your state is tying licensing to assessments I wonder if they are soon to make QRIS or accreditation mandatory for providers? Yikes...I sure hope not...
Country Kids 09:49 AM 04-16-2018
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Oh my, your state has your licensing specialist do the assessments?
In my state the assessors are from MnAEYC (MN chapter of NAEYC) or from our QRIS program. Depending on who you are being accredited by. No one from licensing does any type of assessment. No one from our licensing department
or DHS has anything to do with accreditation.
If your state is tying licensing to assessments I wonder if they are soon to make QRIS or accreditation mandatory for providers? Yikes...I sure hope not...
Whoops-sorry! No just a requirement for our licensors to have some background in early childhood education when they come for our inspections on our childcares. They have no requirements at this time and we feel they should. Oh my, your state has your licensing specialist do the assessments?
In my state the assessors are from MnAEYC (MN chapter of NAEYC) or from our QRIS program. Depending on who you are being accredited by. No one from licensing does any type of assessment. No one from our licensing department
or DHS has anything to do with accreditation.
If your state is tying licensing to assessments I wonder if they are soon to make QRIS or accreditation mandatory for providers? Yikes...I sure hope not...
I always wonder if the people who are over QRIS have ever actually ran a childcare or have worked in a home daycare.
The expectations between the state and QRIS are sometimes unrealistic so it has to make you wonder how much they know about running an in home childcare business.
Blackcat31 09:58 AM 04-16-2018
Originally Posted by Country Kids:
Whoops-sorry! No just a requirement for our licensors to have some background in early childhood education when they come for our inspections on our childcares. They have no requirements at this time and we feel they should.
I always wonder if the people who are over QRIS have ever actually ran a childcare or have worked in a home daycare.
The expectations between the state and QRIS are sometimes unrealistic so it has to make you wonder how much they know about running an in home childcare business.
Oh whew! Whoops-sorry! No just a requirement for our licensors to have some background in early childhood education when they come for our inspections on our childcares. They have no requirements at this time and we feel they should.
I always wonder if the people who are over QRIS have ever actually ran a childcare or have worked in a home daycare.
The expectations between the state and QRIS are sometimes unrealistic so it has to make you wonder how much they know about running an in home childcare business.
I was like oh my goodness... 
Our state just recently passed some sort of requirement that all licensors have to have training on interpreting our regulations. This was done becaue there were so many providers getting dinged for things that were interpreted incorrectly. Kind of like the food program.
Now ALL our licensors know the rules the same in all counties.
Country Kids 11:25 AM 04-16-2018
The biggest issues we have here are=interpretation of rules and getting the rules confused.
In our state there are 3 main types of childcare. Registered Familly, Certified Family and Center. Most of the time since Registered has the least amount of rules, licensor's are always trying to ding providers on things. We always need to ask, can you show that to us in the rule book. 9 times out of 10 it isn't there because it isn't even a rule for us.
In our state there are 3 main types of childcare. Registered Familly, Certified Family and Center. Most of the time since Registered has the least amount of rules, licensor's are always trying to ding providers on things. We always need to ask, can you show that to us in the rule book. 9 times out of 10 it isn't there because it isn't even a rule for us.
Country Kids 11:38 AM 04-16-2018
The state is looking for a License Specialist. I looked into job requirements and everything that was entailed. Under work conditions it was listed:Contact with hostile, frustrated people.
Nice way to look at and describe the childcare providers of your state.
Nice way to look at and describe the childcare providers of your state.
Blackcat31 12:54 PM 04-16-2018
Originally Posted by Country Kids:
The state is looking for a License Specialist. I looked into job requirements and everything that was entailed. Under work conditions it was listed:Contact with hostile, frustrated people.
Nice way to look at and describe the childcare providers of your state.
The state is looking for a License Specialist. I looked into job requirements and everything that was entailed. Under work conditions it was listed:Contact with hostile, frustrated people.
Nice way to look at and describe the childcare providers of your state.
That's funny and truthful at the same time.
My licensor has said she's had providers swear at her, ask her to leave and one that literally had a tantrum (tears and all) during licensing visits.
I know one provider (no longer a provider) that was so rude and non-compliant with our licensor during a visit that the licensor told the provider she would never step foot in her program again without another adult accompanying her.
Later this provider vented to me that she behaved badly due to not getting her way (she was cited for something and thought our licensor should just look the other way). Provider said to me "Well I wouldn't have treated her that way if she would have just did what I asked her to do".
Clearly her maturity level was on par with her DCK's.