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  #1  
Old 05-02-2015, 09:10 PM
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I have a DCM that wanted to go from full time to part time Asap. I emailed her my rate and still have not heard back from her. Dcg is supposed to be here this Monday part time. I'd say she's not happy with the rate. I hate talking about money when it comes to people's children as they are precious to them, but it is one of those necessary things I guess.
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Old 05-02-2015, 09:26 PM
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I am the same way. And I may be in the minority, but I started posting all of my rate and fee information on my website and enclosing a rate sheet in my enrollment packet. I direct parents to review the information in the packet or online and it has eliminated all of the money conversations. Having my fees on the website has also completely eliminated the "what are your rates" calls. My rates are what they are. It's hard to fill the other half of a part time space and many here don't even offer it. It's a valuable service to offer so its good to present it that way to parents.
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Old 05-03-2015, 07:29 AM
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I am the same way. And I may be in the minority, but I started posting all of my rate and fee information on my website and enclosing a rate sheet in my enrollment packet. I direct parents to review the information in the packet or online and it has eliminated all of the money conversations. Having my fees on the website has also completely eliminated the "what are your rates" calls. My rates are what they are. It's hard to fill the other half of a part time space and many here don't even offer it. It's a valuable service to offer so its good to present it that way to parents.
Thats a great idea. I was thinking of doing that also
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Old 05-03-2015, 07:38 AM
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I have a DCM that wanted to go from full time to part time Asap. I emailed her my rate and still have not heard back from her. Dcg is supposed to be here this Monday part time. I'd say she's not happy with the rate. I hate talking about money when it comes to people's children as they are precious to them, but it is one of those necessary things I guess.
If parents truly valued what they want (quality, safe, loving care with a provider they trust) rates shouldn't even be something they question.

"Quality", "safe" and "loving" should be priceless.
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Old 05-03-2015, 08:10 AM
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I wholeheartedly agree but, the cost of high quality care has gone up exponentially. In many states, a year of high quality child care exceeds the cost of the year at a university. I think it's normal that parents freak out a little at the cost of high quality care. It's expensive. But like bc said, high quality care in the formative years is priceless and that is what you tell parents.

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If parents truly valued what they want (quality, safe, loving care with a provider they trust) rates shouldn't even be something they question.

"Quality", "safe" and "loving" should be priceless.
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Old 05-03-2015, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
If parents truly valued what they want (quality, safe, loving care with a provider they trust) rates shouldn't even be something they question.

"Quality", "safe" and "loving" should be priceless.
While we probably all agree with this statement, we also know parents shop for best prices more often than not. It's sad really because you cannot compare it to shopping for material goods. I can't tell you how many calls I've had when a potential family calls and the only question out of their mouth is "How much do you charge?"
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Old 05-03-2015, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by spedmommy4 View Post
I wholeheartedly agree but, the cost of high quality care has gone up exponentially. In many states, a year of high quality child care exceeds the cost of the year at a university. I think it's normal that parents freak out a little at the cost of high quality care. It's expensive. But like bc said, high quality care in the formative years is priceless and that is what you tell parents.
This is a PERFECT example of media persuasion....and false.

I have yet to see someone take their area rates for both their area college and child care rates and break it down to PROVE it.

Unless a child is going to Harvard....the statements made lately about a full year of child care costing the same or more than a year in college is so mis-leading.

I also disagree that the cost of child care having gone up. Where?

Most the providers on this site, especially those that have been here awhile post about having to lower their rates or adopt discounts they wouldn't have dreamed of doing a year or two ago just to stay in business.

I'd like to know where this rise in rates is happening....

I have restructured my rates in the last few years but am basically operating at the same hourly rate I was 5-6 years ago. My state hasn't raised the reimbursement rates for child care assistance since 2006. (unless the provider is participating in QRIS) http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data...304,2305/12882

Nan and I have talked a lot about that statement (college costs = child care) and from the breakdowns we've done and from what we see posted here and on other child care boards, it simply isn't true.

(this wasn't directed specifically at you Spedmommy...I'm just ranting in general )



~@Josiegirl..... I know. IME parents have shopped via price since the day I opened. It's sad and frightening to think that cost for care of your child is done much the same way we shop for groceries.

It's even sadder that many families are more educated in the areas of healthy eating than they are in healthy child-rearing.....Although, the # of families that do adopt healthy eating habits falls short too but that's a whole 'nother thread for discussion.

Last edited by Blackcat31; 05-03-2015 at 09:20 AM.
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  #8  
Old 05-03-2015, 03:22 PM
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I will agree there's a certain media hype to it but, politifact did use childcare aware data to back up the claim for 31 states. (And of course, they were comparing to public university tuition)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ild-care-cost/

Especially on the west cost, childcare has gotten outrageous. Family childcare can run around $300 per week for high quality infant care. (Particularly in the Bay area, LA, etc) Average in my area is $200 for infant care.

I also agree it's sad that parents bargain shop for childcare and I have recently gotten several clients who came from poor quality childcare facilities. All say they would never use price as the determining factor again but unfortunately, for some I think it takes a negative experience to change their mind.

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This is a PERFECT example of media persuasion....and false.

I have yet to see someone take their area rates for both their area college and child care rates and break it down to PROVE it.

Unless a child is going to Harvard....the statements made lately about a full year of child care costing the same or more than a year in college is so mis-leading.

I also disagree that the cost of child care having gone up. Where?

Most the providers on this site, especially those that have been here awhile post about having to lower their rates or adopt discounts they wouldn't have dreamed of doing a year or two ago just to stay in business.

I'd like to know where this rise in rates is happening....

I have restructured my rates in the last few years but am basically operating at the same hourly rate I was 5-6 years ago. My state hasn't raised the reimbursement rates for child care assistance since 2006. (unless the provider is participating in QRIS) http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data...304,2305/12882

Nan and I have talked a lot about that statement (college costs = child care) and from the breakdowns we've done and from what we see posted here and on other child care boards, it simply isn't true.

(this wasn't directed specifically at you Spedmommy...I'm just ranting in general )



~@Josiegirl..... I know. IME parents have shopped via price since the day I opened. It's sad and frightening to think that cost for care of your child is done much the same way we shop for groceries.

It's even sadder that many families are more educated in the areas of healthy eating than they are in healthy child-rearing.....Although, the # of families that do adopt healthy eating habits falls short too but that's a whole 'nother thread for discussion.
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  #9  
Old 05-03-2015, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by spedmommy4 View Post
I will agree there's a certain media hype to it but, politifact did use childcare aware data to back up the claim for 31 states. (And of course, they were comparing to public university tuition)

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ild-care-cost/

Especially on the west cost, childcare has gotten outrageous. Family childcare can run around $300 per week for high quality infant care. (Particularly in the Bay area, LA, etc) Average in my area is $200 for infant care.

I also agree it's sad that parents bargain shop for childcare and I have recently gotten several clients who came from poor quality childcare facilities. All say they would never use price as the determining factor again but unfortunately, for some I think it takes a negative experience to change their mind.
I believe Politifacts as much as I believe mainstream media in most cases but....

The link you posted just proved my point. At the bottom of the article it says
"Hes chosen a statistic that originated in a wide-ranging survey of child care costs (albeit one published by an advocacy group). However, Obama has cherry-picked the most dramatic statistic of four presented in the report, allowing him to say 31 states, rather than as few as 10. He also ignores uncertainty about how federal aid and tax credits would affect the comparison."

I agree it's "mostly" true that INFANTS (which infancy lasts a mere 12 months) in a HIGH end CENTER can cost more than a year in public college but again there is NO proof that the blanket statement that a year of child care costs on average costs more than a year in public college has any merit.

The Child Care Aware site that they gleened this partial info from lists child care rate average for my state (by area) and none of those fees/costs are higher than public college tuition for the college in the same areas yet my state is ranked as one where college costs about $3,000-4,000 less per year than child care.

So applying their (CCA) theory to my state and they directly contradict themselves and their own report.

*sigh* I just wish the media would stop trying to make people think paying for the care and nurturing (and now the education) of your child is something that should be so low paying and something that should be negotiable when purchasing.

Most people wouldn't dream of trying to strike a deal with their Doctor or their car mechanic but they have no issue when it comes to their kids. There is something fundamentally wrong with that and in my honest opinion THAT is the problem.
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Old 05-03-2015, 04:44 PM
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I'm sorry.

I don't mean to hijack this thread or come off as argumentative.

This is just a really hot button top for me.

Every provider I've ever met (virtually or in real life) has something awesome to offer the kids they have in care and most those kids take that "something" with them their whole lives so if what we do is so important, why is pay even a topic of discussion?

We are one of THE lowest paid professions in this country and yet what we do (or don't do) impacts every generation and each one afterwards. No matter how much education you have or don't have this job ranks low on the pay scale hands down.

We pay people to throw a ball to someone else 1000X's what we make/earn and odds are I bet I know WHO taught that person to even throw a ball.
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Old 05-03-2015, 05:15 PM
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I agree with your statements wholeheartedly, particularly the ones below. And I cringe when I see $75 a week for infant care ads on Craigslist.

I definitely don't think it's good, right, or best practice. Its just a factor. When my husband and I needed childcare years ago, we made just a little too much to qualify for anything. I depended a lot on the charity of family members to get through school so I know how money, or an inherent lack thereof, can influence your choices.

As a country, the US just needs to do better in the area of supporting and funding ece. Something a lititle more like our neighbors overseas would be amazing.

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/02/15/us...perts-say.html

I have been in education a long time and it just seems like politicians rarely put kiddos at the top of the priority spending list.

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*sigh* I just wish the media would stop trying to make people think paying for the care and nurturing (and now the education) of your child is something that should be so low paying and something that should be negotiable when purchasing.

Most people wouldn't dream of trying to strike a deal with their Doctor or their car mechanic but they have no issue when it comes to their kids. There is something fundamentally wrong with that and in my honest opinion THAT is the problem.

Last edited by Blackcat31; 05-04-2015 at 08:35 AM.
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Old 05-04-2015, 04:35 AM
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This is a PERFECT example of media persuasion....and false.

I have yet to see someone take their area rates for both their area college and child care rates and break it down to PROVE it.

Unless a child is going to Harvard....the statements made lately about a full year of child care costing the same or more than a year in college is so mis-leading.

I also disagree that the cost of child care having gone up. Where?

Most the providers on this site, especially those that have been here awhile post about having to lower their rates or adopt discounts they wouldn't have dreamed of doing a year or two ago just to stay in business.

I'd like to know where this rise in rates is happening....

I have restructured my rates in the last few years but am basically operating at the same hourly rate I was 5-6 years ago. My state hasn't raised the reimbursement rates for child care assistance since 2006. (unless the provider is participating in QRIS) http://datacenter.kidscount.org/data...304,2305/12882

Nan and I have talked a lot about that statement (college costs = child care) and from the breakdowns we've done and from what we see posted here and on other child care boards, it simply isn't true.

(this wasn't directed specifically at you Spedmommy...I'm just ranting in general )



~@Josiegirl..... I know. IME parents have shopped via price since the day I opened. It's sad and frightening to think that cost for care of your child is done much the same way we shop for groceries.

It's even sadder that many families are more educated in the areas of healthy eating than they are in healthy child-rearing.....Although, the # of families that do adopt healthy eating habits falls short too but that's a whole 'nother thread for discussion.

I have not raised my rates in over 5 years. The state has not raised rates in that time that I am aware of. (I haven't had a state funded kidlet in almost a year)
I wish I got paid per kid what college tuition is! Then I would just have to have one to keep my ds in school!
I also feel like kidlets are much harder to find. I have very few phone calls. I think because the unemployment rate is high a lot of people now have friends that aren't working that say oh I will keep little Susie Snowflake for you and only charge you minimal amount. More grandparents, aunts etc are watching little ones because their "poor parents with their brand new cars and vacations to beaches" can't afford child care!

<sigh> I have some big decisions to make in the next year. I love my job. I love being home. I just need to be actually able to pay my bills too. Ds goes off to college in the fall. I have been offered several jobs. After last week- I don't know. But, I really just want to stay at home with 6 little ones. I just need to get 6 little ones that fit well... Pray for kidlets for me Good news, the local community college's childcare is closing down (they are spending way too much to keep it open) but my elementary school across the street is offering preschool this next year (only 16 kids 8 special needs/ 8 "normal" kids) I need 2 babies..
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Old 05-04-2015, 11:32 AM
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While we probably all agree with this statement, we also know parents shop for best prices more often than not. It's sad really because you cannot compare it to shopping for material goods. I can't tell you how many calls I've had when a potential family calls and the only question out of their mouth is "How much do you charge?"
And I just got an email for someone looking for childcare for a 4.5 yo, starting preschool in the fall. One question...what are your rates for a school age child?
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Old 05-04-2015, 12:11 PM
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And I just got an email for someone looking for childcare for a 4.5 yo, starting preschool in the fall. One question...what are your rates for a school age child?
Wouldn't it be nice if you could reply like this:

"Choose your rate:

"kind of" keeping an eye on: $10.00 per day
Constant supervision + : $20.00 per day

Which of those do you prefer? "


Of course the + means all the other things we provide....like healthy food and educational and/or developmentally appropriate toys and activities.

I would be afraid though of how many parents would just choose the "kind of" supervise option though.....
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Old 05-04-2015, 12:23 PM
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The issue I see in my area is people just don't want to pay for care period. I mean my one DCM just left me because she found a SAHM with a toddler and was "babysitting" another toddler and is going to take 13 month DCG and full time hours for $30 a week. But mom has no handbook or contract with her. I told mom I wouldn't touch this with a ten foot pole and gave her all my reasons why including the fact there is NO contract about anything. But people here want to do that. I think hubby thought I was thinking of stooping that low because he said to me "well you can't lower your rate that much, at that point you might as well just do it for free". Um no dear I wasn't going there lol.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:07 PM
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I have yet to see someone take their area rates for both their area college and child care rates and break it down to PROVE it.

Unless a child is going to Harvard....the statements made lately about a full year of child care costing the same or more than a year in college is so mis-leading.
Just for comparison's sake:

Local State university tuition: 3150 a semester, 6300 a year

Current daycare subsidy in same county: 34.13 a day for 2-5 year old or 8532 a year full time.

Now I know that's just tuition, not including books and other fees, but it is very close.

I think the majority of parents don't realize that daycare should be their second largest expense, after housing.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:11 PM
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Just for comparison's sake:

Local State university tuition: 3150 a semester, 6300 a year

Current daycare subsidy in same county: 34.13 a day for 2-5 year old or 8532 a year full time.

Now I know that's just tuition, not including books and other fees, but it is very close.

I think the majority of parents don't realize that daycare should be their second largest expense, after housing.
Not sure what this means... subsidy as in parents don't pay?

I also think if they are going to make the statement then the cost (of college)should include everything (books and other fees) because if it isn't the FULL cost, then we can compare apples to oranges.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:18 PM
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Not sure what this means... subsidy as in parents don't pay?

I also think if they are going to make the statement then the cost (of college)should include everything (books and other fees) because if it isn't the FULL cost, then we can compare apples to oranges.
I agree with BC on this one. MOST childcare providers include quite a few supplies, and even meals and snacks for that matter. So in order to compare the two, we would have to factor in supplies, including books, paper, ink, etc. And we may have to include the cost of a meal plan at college in order to get the full comparison, just because you eat at daycare and some students pay to eat meals prepared at college. We have to compare apples to apples.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:24 PM
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Here is the comparison in my state. I live in a city of 50k and there is a public university that is a very good school. Tuition for a year is just shy of $13000. This includes books, housing, the works. Average daycare cost is $150 a week, $7800 a year, but most daycares here do unpaid vacations, so most parents only pay 48-50 weeks a year, so the average price is between $7000-$8000 a year.

So, in my area, daycare providers make almost ahlf what colleges do and we provide the foundation for a child's life. I spend 50+ hours a week with my kiddos and a lot of it is one on one time, so there is no way to compare college education with daycare. None of my professors spent 50 hours a week "molding" me into a great person! Daycare is personal and college is not, imo.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:26 PM
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Not sure what this means... subsidy as in parents don't pay? Yes, I couldn't find the average rate charged for this county. I do know that my dh's coworkers are paying average of $35/day for child care in the same city the university is in. They wouldn't qualify for subsidy.

I also think if they are going to make the statement then the cost (of college)should include everything (books and other fees) because if it isn't the FULL cost, then we can compare apples to oranges. Oh I completely agree. I don't have college age students, so I haven't a clue of what the grand total would be. But would those extras exceed $2200? .
I know this isn't a great comparison, but when the statement of college vs. child care was made, I did a quick look to see what it would be here in CenCal. Now compare the Fresno State tuition to what people in other areas charge, like Daycare, then child care would be much higher. Maybe that's where the inconsistencies lie.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:35 PM
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I know this isn't a great comparison, but when the statement of college vs. child care was made, I did a quick look to see what it would be here in CenCal. Now compare the Fresno State tuition to what people in other areas charge, like Daycare, then child care would be much higher. Maybe that's where the inconsistencies lie.
It is possible that books and other college supplies would run more than $2200. Books are horribly expensive, I have seen some college books run over $100 each. It doesn't take long for the costs of books and such to add up. If you are lucky, you can get used ones, but those are still pricey, just not as high.
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Old 05-05-2015, 11:30 AM
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I guess I don't feel that college and child care can be compared at all.

Child care rates are for no less than 50 hours per week. How many hours in class is full time enrollment? 16 or 20, maybe? Most daycare is a 1:8 ratio. What is in in many university courses? Often times 1:100. Never less than 1:25. Do the tuition rates include the countless other things that are provided at daycare (meals, supplies, etc.)? I think if you break it down and factor in ALL of it, you'd find daycare to be much, much less costly. What university includes a promise to clean up boogers, poop, and pee with paid tuition? It just does not compare!

Sure, a parent may pay more for their offsprings' daycare than they do for their college education. So what? It's not the same thing. I bet almost all parents will pay way more for all the toys and gadgets they buy their kids over their first 18 years than they will ever spend on daycare or college, too. So what? Should we launch a big study and berate Little Tikes, Legos, and Sony for their audacity to operate a business and provide a product or service that people choose to purchase, because it costs more than the average college education?

My DCFs each pay me $2.30 per hour for the enormous responsibility of caring for their very young children, and pay for groceries, supplies, and taxes. A pittance, really.

Last edited by KIDZRMYBIZ; 05-05-2015 at 11:33 AM. Reason: clarification
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Old 05-05-2015, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by KIDZRMYBIZ View Post
I guess I don't feel that college and child care can be compared at all.

Child care rates are for no less than 50 hours per week. How many hours in class is full time enrollment? 16 or 20, maybe? Most daycare is a 1:8 ratio. What is in in many university courses? Often times 1:100. Never less than 1:25. Do the tuition rates include the countless other things that are provided at daycare (meals, supplies, etc.)? I think if you break it down and factor in ALL of it, you'd find daycare to be much, much less costly. What university includes a promise to clean up boogers, poop, and pee with paid tuition? It just does not compare!

Sure, a parent may pay more for their offsprings' daycare than they do for their college education. So what? It's not the same thing. I bet almost all parents will pay way more for all the toys and gadgets they buy their kids over their first 18 years than they will ever spend on daycare or college, too. So what? Should we launch a big study and berate Little Tikes, Legos, and Sony for their audacity to operate a business and provide a product or service that people choose to purchase, because it costs more than the average college education?

My DCFs each pay me $2.30 per hour for the enormous responsibility of caring for their very young children, and pay for groceries, supplies, and taxes. A pittance, really.
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Old 05-05-2015, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by KIDZRMYBIZ View Post
I guess I don't feel that college and child care can be compared at all.

Child care rates are for no less than 50 hours per week. How many hours in class is full time enrollment? 16 or 20, maybe? Most daycare is a 1:8 ratio. What is in in many university courses? Often times 1:100. Never less than 1:25. Do the tuition rates include the countless other things that are provided at daycare (meals, supplies, etc.)? I think if you break it down and factor in ALL of it, you'd find daycare to be much, much less costly. What university includes a promise to clean up boogers, poop, and pee with paid tuition? It just does not compare!

Sure, a parent may pay more for their offsprings' daycare than they do for their college education. So what? It's not the same thing. I bet almost all parents will pay way more for all the toys and gadgets they buy their kids over their first 18 years than they will ever spend on daycare or college, too. So what? Should we launch a big study and berate Little Tikes, Legos, and Sony for their audacity to operate a business and provide a product or service that people choose to purchase, because it costs more than the average college education?

My DCFs each pay me $2.30 per hour for the enormous responsibility of caring for their very young children, and pay for groceries, supplies, and taxes. A pittance, really.
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Old 05-05-2015, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by KIDZRMYBIZ View Post
I guess I don't feel that college and child care can be compared at all.

Child care rates are for no less than 50 hours per week. How many hours in class is full time enrollment? 16 or 20, maybe? Most daycare is a 1:8 ratio. What is in in many university courses? Often times 1:100. Never less than 1:25. Do the tuition rates include the countless other things that are provided at daycare (meals, supplies, etc.)? I think if you break it down and factor in ALL of it, you'd find daycare to be much, much less costly. What university includes a promise to clean up boogers, poop, and pee with paid tuition? It just does not compare!

Sure, a parent may pay more for their offsprings' daycare than they do for their college education. So what? It's not the same thing. I bet almost all parents will pay way more for all the toys and gadgets they buy their kids over their first 18 years than they will ever spend on daycare or college, too. So what? Should we launch a big study and berate Little Tikes, Legos, and Sony for their audacity to operate a business and provide a product or service that people choose to purchase, because it costs more than the average college education?

My DCFs each pay me $2.30 per hour for the enormous responsibility of caring for their very young children, and pay for groceries, supplies, and taxes. A pittance, really.
I don't understand this comparison either, unless it's for sticker-shock value or to play on the emotions of parents since college is one of the big expenses that they are most likely to stress over. I spent three hours a day at school for a full-time semester. It only proves to me that the colleges are over-priced. I mostly care for children of parents with corporate jobs, and they want 50 hours a week, five days a week. I have charged $30 a day for six years, but the local doggy daycares charge $35 a day, and they're always full. (I would also bet that the dog gets picked up first)
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