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  #1  
Old 08-21-2020, 10:24 AM
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Question New Reg: Let's Discuss

At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.

Such supervision must include, but not be limited to, indoor and outdoor activities, mealtimes, naptime, transportation, field trips, and transitions between activities.

"Supervision" means Staff members are providing watchful oversight to the children, volunteers and Students-in-Training.

The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs.

Staff shall be attentive and participating with all children during mealtimes and shall be seated within an armís length away from children thirty-six (36) months of age and younger.

Plans shall be made to obtain additional Staff help in cases of emergencies.
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Old 08-21-2020, 10:58 AM
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At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.

Such supervision must include, but not be limited to, indoor and outdoor activities, mealtimes, naptime, transportation, field trips, and transitions between activities.

"Supervision" means Staff members are providing watchful oversight to the children, volunteers and Students-in-Training.

The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs.

Staff shall be attentive and participating with all children during mealtimes and shall be seated within an armís length away from children thirty-six (36) months of age and younger.

Plans shall be made to obtain additional Staff help in cases of emergencies.
We had something similar a few years back; but it ended up being re-written/modified as everyone was getting "wrote up".

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:06 AM
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This gem is going to be a hit. " If formula must be provided by the Home, only commercially prepared, ready-to-feed
formula shall be used."


So it is too expensive for us to expect the parents to buy it but we are expected to pay over double for liquid ready to feed? The reimbursement does not even cover the powder.
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:10 AM
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"Menus. The Home shall provide a menu listing all meals and snacks to be served during the current week. Substitutions shall be recorded on the posted menu. Menus shall be retained at the Home for six (6) months."
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:12 AM
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This gem is going to be a hit. " If formula must be provided by the Home, only commercially prepared, ready-to-feed
formula shall be used."


So it is too expensive for us to expect the parents to buy it but we are expected to pay over double for liquid ready to feed? The reimbursement does not even cover the powder.
We only have to "offer" formula but the key is to 'offer' something no one will use. So far I've been good on that.
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:29 AM
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We only have to "offer" formula but the key is to 'offer' something no one will use. So far I've been good on that.
I've been offering the Parent's Choice Non-GMO Premium Infant Formula with Iron. Everyone takes me up on it after they finish breast feeding. Parents Choice does not even make a ready to feed liquid.

They also are mandating the breastfeeding area. Just like we expected: All of the QRIS stuff is becoming the minimum standard. This is easy for me as an empty nester, but will be a deal breaker for many others. There will be so many more illegal daycares this year.

"The Home shall encourage and support breastfeeding. The Home shall have a designated area set aside for breastfeeding mothers to breastfeed."

"Food for infants or children less than one (1) year of age shall be cut into pieces one-quarter inch or smaller and food for toddlers shall be cut into pieces one-half inch or smaller to prevent choking." - I do have one who will go ballistic if I cut his apples, pears or bananas.
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:36 AM
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I've been offering the Parent's Choice Non-GMO Premium Infant Formula with Iron. Everyone takes me up on it after they finish breast feeding. Parents Choice does not even make a ready to feed liquid.

They also are mandating the breastfeeding area. Just like we expected: All of the QRIS stuff is becoming the minimum standard. This is easy for me as an empty nester, but will be a deal breaker for many others. There will be so many more illegal daycares this year.

"The Home shall encourage and support breastfeeding. The Home shall have a designated area set aside for breastfeeding mothers to breastfeed."

"Food for infants or children less than one (1) year of age shall be cut into pieces one-quarter inch or smaller and food for toddlers shall be cut into pieces one-half inch or smaller to prevent choking." - I do have one who will go ballistic if I cut his apples, pears or bananas.
we have the "cut the food thing"...started as an QRIS assessment rule but ended up in licensing....but since assessment is different we are told there will be a new layout with licensing as well. But a little too late; FCC is near dead here! Only those my age and that have been in it for several years are all that's left. Maybe it will pick back up but who knows?

FYI...there is such a thing as goat-made baby formula....just saying...it was shown to me from another provider (oops, educator).
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Old 08-21-2020, 11:54 AM
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we have the "cut the food thing"...started as an QRIS assessment rule but ended up in licensing....but since assessment is different we are told there will be a new layout with licensing as well. But a little too late; FCC is near dead here! Only those my age and that have been in it for several years are all that's left. Maybe it will pick back up but who knows?

FYI...there is such a thing as goat-made baby formula....just saying...it was shown to me from another provider (oops, educator).


This kid is a big 3, bigger than my neighbors 5 year old. Farm kid. Independent. Now, I am supposed to baby him. His mom is going to love it... not. Toddler = under 4. This kid climbs trees and picks his own dang apples....
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:14 PM
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This kid is a big 3, bigger than my neighbors 5 year old. Farm kid. Independent. Now, I am supposed to baby him. His mom is going to love it... not. Toddler = under 4. This kid climbs trees and picks his own dang apples....
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:22 PM
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I also don't think I should have to sit during meals.

How can I be serving seconds, cleaning droppings, picking up lost silverware, spoon feeding infants and sitting on my backside? Wheelchair? Staggered mealtimes?

I don't even have an extra chair in my dining room. Arms length? Easy. On my derriŤre at the busiest time in my work day?

How?? How do you manage that?

Also, the lack of participation is something I will remember when others need help.
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:25 PM
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I also don't think I should have to sit during meals.

How can I be serving seconds, cleaning droppings, picking up lost silverware, spoon feeding infants and sitting on my backside? Wheelchair? Staggered mealtimes?

I don't even have an extra chair in my dining room. Arms length? Easy. On my derriŤre at the busiest time in my work day?

How?? How do you manage that?

Also, the lack of participation is something I will remember when others need help.
We argued that we could stand/sit/move and still be alert enough to "act" if something like choking was taking place. I mean we are in a confined kitchen type space whether a room or small area of the daycare room like myself? It's really a judgment call now for licensing to decide if we are keeping our eyes on the kids.??
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:34 PM
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I've been doing daycare so long, I told my licensor I knew by the smell which kid had pooped. Being a provider-educator is a talent!!!
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:40 PM
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I've been doing daycare so long, I told my licensor I knew by the smell which kid had pooped. Being a provider-educator is a talent!!!
And know what they ate for dinner or on the ride over... Yep!!
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:42 PM
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And know what they ate for dinner or on the ride over... Yep!!
I've enjoyed this conversation lots today but I need to empty my bladder before entering such things that bring so much laughter in the future
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Old 08-21-2020, 12:58 PM
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I've enjoyed this conversation lots today but I need to empty my bladder before entering such things that bring so much laughter in the future
Reg change season is always super fun.

I am curious how other states compare and contrast, though. How other people are making some of this this work.

I put so much time, money and effort into making the playroom into a self contained, childproofed, classroom like they wanted and now they seem to be trying to force me back out of it and into the kitchen/bathroom with kids in tow. A complete 180.
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Old 08-21-2020, 01:08 PM
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Reg change season is always super fun.

I am curious how other states compare and contrast, though. How other people are making some of this this work.

I put so much time, money and effort into making the playroom into a self contained, childproofed, classroom like they wanted and now they seem to be trying to force me back out of it and into the kitchen/bathroom with kids in tow. A complete 180.
I am closed next Friday for the sole purpose of de-QRIS-assessing my room....20 years of number counts on math, science, literacy, music, etc is like being in a Manson-camp. I need to de-program. I call it the FCCERS-R Daycare Bible. But those days are over! Let's get back to some FUN for educators and kids!
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Old 08-21-2020, 01:27 PM
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At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.
This policy, as typed, makes sense to me.
In my state, it's not just staff that has to have background checks. All family members over 13 years of age who live in the house have to undergo a background check and fingerprinting each time I relicense, whether they have contact with the kids or not. My husband and adult kids work during the hours my day care is operating. They pretty much have zero contact with the dc kids. I'm paying an extra $105 (plus my own $35) this year to have them all fingerprinted. On the very rare day they aren't at work while I'm watching kids, they're either sick and in bed upstairs or have an appointment of some kind and are out of the house. The last thing any of them want to do is spend time with my dc kids.

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Such supervision must include, but not be limited to, indoor and outdoor activities, mealtimes, naptime, transportation, field trips, and transitions between activities.

"Supervision" means Staff members are providing watchful oversight to the children, volunteers and Students-in-Training.

The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs.
Most of this makes sense to me, too. Sad they feel as though they have to spell it out but I'm sure they've run into situations where providers are physically present but not paying attention to the kids in their care.

The regulation in my state is that we have to be able to see OR hear the kids at all times which makes more sense to me. I'd never be able to use the bathroom without bringing the kids in with me if I had to be able to see them at all times. I understand the importance of active supervision but there are times when nature calls and being able to hear the kids seems sufficient for those couple of minutes when I can't see them.

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Staff shall be attentive and participating with all children during mealtimes and shall be seated within an arm’s length away from children thirty-six (36) months of age and younger.
Crazy. I wouldn't be able to do that easily. If I'm sitting, it's usually only because I have a child who is too young to feed himself. Otherwise, I'm up and busy getting kids seconds, wiping ups spills, etc. I have a rectangular table the kids eat at. I couldn't literally be within arms reach of EVERY child sitting at the table unless one or two were sitting in the middle of it. If a child were to start choking, I'm certainly close enough to help in an instant.

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Plans shall be made to obtain additional Staff help in cases of emergencies.
?? As a family child care provider, are they saying you have to have standby staff to call on in case of an emergency? Here, I can call on a neighbor or friend for help in a true emergency. Under your state guidelines, they wouldn't be able to help because "at least one staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times" - unless they agreed to undergo the check on the off chance you needed their help at some point. Would this regulation force you to pay someone to be "on staff" just in case you have an emergency?
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Old 08-21-2020, 01:49 PM
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This policy, as typed, makes sense to me.
In my state, it's not just staff that has to have background checks. All family members over 13 years of age who live in the house have to undergo a background check and fingerprinting each time I relicense, whether they have contact with the kids or not. My husband and adult kids work during the hours my day care is operating. They pretty much have zero contact with the dc kids. I'm paying an extra $105 (plus my own $35) this year to have them all fingerprinted. On the very rare day they aren't at work while I'm watching kids, they're either sick and in bed upstairs or have an appointment of some kind and are out of the house. The last thing any of them want to do is spend time with my dc kids.

CH: Exactly. My adult kids and husband are all fingerprinted. My kids because they may need to be here for a power outage in their apartments in winter or a quick load of laundry in a time pinch with crowded laundro-mats. My husband is background checked and completes the mandatory training each year so he can cover my DR. Appointments. This one I fully understand.


Most of this makes sense to me, too. Sad they feel as though they have to spell it out but I'm sure they've run into situations where providers are physically present but not paying attention to the kids in their care.

The regulation in my state is that we have to be able to see OR hear the kids at all times which makes more sense to me. I'd never be able to use the bathroom without bringing the kids in with me if I had to be able to see them at all times. I understand the importance of active supervision but there are times when nature calls and being able to hear the kids seems sufficient for those couple of minutes when I can't see them.

CH: See or hear is how I currently operate and I have never had an injury (bang on wood) operating like this. I don't want them at the stove or in the bathroom with me. I don't want to take the infants with the toddlers to potty. It isn't safe. Currently I put infants in their cribs and behind gate completely out of reach of others. The others are behind a baby gate and in their own childproofed playroom. It has worked for over 20 years, why the change now??


Crazy. I wouldn't be able to do that easily. If I'm sitting, it's usually only because I have a child who is too young to feed himself. Otherwise, I'm up and busy getting kids seconds, wiping ups spills, etc. I have a rectangular table the kids eat at. I couldn't literally be within arms reach of EVERY child sitting at the table unless one or two were sitting in the middle of it. If a child were to start choking, I'm certainly close enough to help in an instant.

CH: I don't know how I am going to make this work at all. I currently stand at the kitchen island standing with them while toddlers are all seated at the table 2 feet from me and infants high chairs are beside me. Again, it works and I have had no issues with this setup. The food is on the island for seconds and thirds if wanted...


?? As a family child care provider, are they saying you have to have standby staff to call on in case of an emergency? Here, I can call on a neighbor or friend for help in a true emergency. Under your state guidelines, they wouldn't be able to help because "at least one staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times" - unless they agreed to undergo the check on the off chance you needed their help at some point. Would this regulation force you to pay someone to be "on staff" just in case you have an emergency?
I am unsure about the last part. I am covered 90% of the time if that is what they mean. I don't know how most would do it, though.
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Old 08-21-2020, 06:04 PM
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Also, the lack of participation is something I will remember when others need help.
Youíve helped me so often (directly a few times, and just through reading your posts)! I def still feel like a newbie, despite 12 years in the job. Today was a rough ďdaycare.com-free-dayĒ

Our in-home state regs donít have this kind of... intimidating? formal?... language, but they are still over-reaching for our kind of care. Iíve gone toe to toe with our inspector (not that she can do anything), saying ďwe donít want a PROFESSIONAL EARLY CHILDHOOD EDUCATION kind of place! We want to open our home to parents who need to go to work....and provide SERVICES that enrich their childrenís days and give them a safe, healthy place to be all day.Ē Yes, health and safety standards are needed. Our license should stand for something. But even our parents roll their eyes and donít understand why the regs want our home to be exactly like the 120 (or 300!) kid center off the highway. Theyíve said the licensing people are taking away THEIR choice of how they want their kids to experience baby/toddler/PS life! But the state says, once we start taking money for services, they have to be state-mandated services only. We canít even terminate a bad fit, until we follow through on eight steps to rectify (including US setting up services and therapies for THEIR kids, and allowing evaluators into our daycare to watch the child and us interact).

Iím only the manager and not the owner. I donít know how many more regs will pile on before I jump ship. If this were happening in my home, I would have bailed a few years ago.
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Old 08-21-2020, 06:34 PM
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Would it help if enough providers in your state gave feedback to your state's EEC commissioner? EEC here came up with new regs in response to the COVID threat but some of the regs weren't realistic for most providers. After receiving enough feedback, EEC did change some of them. Maybe if enough providers give feedback to the head of EEC in your state and let him/her know how the changes would impact them and the kids, the regs might be reconsidered???
The chances are probably slim to none but it could happen.
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Old 08-21-2020, 08:51 PM
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Would it help if enough providers in your state gave feedback to your state's EEC commissioner? EEC here came up with new regs in response to the COVID threat but some of the regs weren't realistic for most providers. After receiving enough feedback, EEC did change some of them. Maybe if enough providers give feedback to the head of EEC in your state and let him/her know how the changes would impact them and the kids, the regs might be reconsidered???
The chances are probably slim to none but it could happen.
This is not an easy task. I have met with licensing all the way to the top, legislators many times, had round table discussions with powers that be, etc. each time feeling "heard" only for things to remain the same or the administration change every time something began moving forward that would lessen the stringent regs. I have been in child care 34 years; FCC for 28; and have rolled with many changes....The past 20 have beat down and trod on top of FCC providers with QRIS. That is changing FINALLY, but I'm afraid it is too little too late for the FCC dying profession. While I'm happy about the changes, I'm near too old to get going again My mind has many ideas but the body don't necessarily move as fast
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Old 08-22-2020, 07:14 AM
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Thanks guys. I would love to be able to bail but after a certain number of years I am closer to retirement than I am able to begin another career. I have about 20 years of working left to fund my own retirement.

As far as commenting, they only listen to centers. Specifically centers who take subsidy allowing the writers to sponge federal funds to cover their self-created jobs. Most have never spent a whole week doing hands on care of children, including their own.

I do plan to write my representatives all the way from local to the top but feel it will be akin to urinating up a flag pole.

It is the federal dollars they want. Children, families and providers be damned. Universal daycare, bought voters. They want us gone.

These regs have nothing to do with coronavirus. They are using the virus to push them through while everyone is looking the other way.
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Old 08-22-2020, 02:50 PM
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Thanks guys. I would love to be able to bail but after a certain number of years I am closer to retirement than I am able to begin another career. I have about 20 years of working left to fund my own retirement.

As far as commenting, they only listen to centers. Specifically centers who take subsidy allowing the writers to sponge federal funds to cover their self-created jobs. Most have never spent a whole week doing hands on care of children, including their own.

I do plan to write my representatives all the way from local to the top but feel it will be akin to urinating up a flag pole.

It is the federal dollars they want. Children, families and providers be damned. Universal daycare, bought voters. They want us gone.

These regs have nothing to do with coronavirus. They are using the virus to push them through while everyone is looking the other way.
I think covid booted our QRIS out quicker than originally intended.....no one can make visits and daycare (center and family) licenses are so far behind. All is being done virtually now and quickly. But like I stated in the earlier post, FCC is near gone anyway so all that is left is us, the ones who are too old to change careers at this point.
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Old 08-23-2020, 08:01 AM
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I think covid booted our QRIS out quicker than originally intended.....no one can make visits and daycare (center and family) licenses are so far behind. All is being done virtually now and quickly. But like I stated in the earlier post, FCC is near gone anyway so all that is left is us, the ones who are too old to change careers at this point.
If you can't beat them, get creative. I have been working on solutions all weekend. Maybe I can make it work by A) cooking the night before and adding a half wall toilet to the playroom or B) tweaking my program into exempt status.
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Old 08-23-2020, 08:16 AM
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If you can't beat them, get creative. I have been working on solutions all weekend. Maybe I can make it work by A) cooking the night before and adding a half wall toilet to the playroom or B) tweaking my program into exempt status.
I like the latter solution. I work with my mom and she slowly would like to work into only being a sub which would be possible by summer/fall 2021 as we will lose many to school then. That would lower my ratio but not be where I could be exempt but it would be nice to be exempt when my own sons had kids. Just a dream but it could happen!!! I don't know, I will probably be doing daycare FOREVER
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Old 08-23-2020, 12:08 PM
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At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.
Our state doesn’t have the term “Comprehensive Records Check Determination” (criminal background check?) but the context of that sentence makes me wonder: can the rest of your staff have UNsatisfactory CRCD and care for the kids as assistants?

When we were told that we could no longer terminate a child on OUR terms and had to provide the parent with resources and services (as well as that whole rule on being required to accept unvaccinated kids), I told the inspector that these rules were going to make some of us close up. She basically replied that so far it hasn’t really been the case. (Put up or shut up I guess is what she was saying!)

I’ve had parents ask why a certain kid is still around (not that directly) and/or getting all the focus from the caregivers and all I can say is that we’re in the middle of our eight steps. PARENTS don’t like that we have to keep those kids around their kids, as well as refocus our days around them. As much as we providers need to speak up, I wish the parents would too. They say they select home-based for a reason but soon there will be no difference.

I know our regs are often written to deal with the actions of the worst caregivers and I was trying to think what prompted your state to tell you how to HAVE LUNCH with your own DCKs but I guess your theory of legislators wanting to drive us under continues to make the most “sense.”

Last edited by Blackcat31; 08-23-2020 at 07:00 PM.
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Old 08-23-2020, 05:52 PM
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From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???
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Old 08-23-2020, 06:01 PM
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From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???
Oh my gosh, ya got me there!! I never thought so many things have to be spelled out to so many people!

Iíve been thinking about that lunch rule in particular though: wouldnít you be able to respond more quickly if you were already on your feet and circulating??!
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Old 08-23-2020, 06:01 PM
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From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???
One more thing In the past, there were "gray" areas that left for "the situation issue" however now it has to say "exactly verbatim" what is or is not accepted because we live in a "negotiating" time where "if that is not what it said exactly; or I did this because, etc."..
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Old 08-24-2020, 07:44 AM
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I don't know all the answers, I do know that they don't care how if effects us. That is perfectly clear.

Little of it benefits kids or families, either. Well, unless your family has the biting/destructive kid and you don't want to pay for your own childcare, I suppose. I refuse to play that game, though. I have already paid my dues.
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Old 08-24-2020, 07:52 AM
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I don't know all the answers, I do know that they don't care how if effects us. That is perfectly clear.

Little of it benefits kids or families, either. Well, unless your family has the biting/destructive kid and you don't want to pay for your own childcare, I suppose. I refuse to play that game, though. I have already paid my dues.
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Old 08-26-2020, 05:50 PM
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I have 4 kids agree 13-18. ALL my kids would count toward ratio though they are all capable of doing babysitting on their own! Lol It used to be kids under age 12 (except when in school). Therefore, as exempt, I can't watch ANY kids 'technically' and as licensed I could watch only 4! I could watch 4+2 school agers back in the day.

Being in child care is TOO difficult. I told licensing board that beer rules are so stupid that technically every single parent that has four children and takes a child from school for a couple hours is basically breaking the rules. I ask her what the real rules are for Rideshare as far as parents who have 4 kids taking home 3 kids say from after school band practice. " well technically if you're not a licensed daycare, you're not supposed to be watching kids at all in those circumstances" most parents of older kids who need rides, are not going to be paying child care services, you know that one of those band parents are carpooling and everybody kind of switches off. I could not believe that they consider this actually child care. Really really stupid. Furthermore, I cannot believe that they actually consider 13 year olds on up to at least age 18, to be unable to entertain themselves or help out with the daycare kids or to do anything. They make it sound like they're just babies. Ridiculous
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Old 08-28-2020, 07:33 AM
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Enough with the ridiculous regulations already!

I wish the folks who come up with these ideas would spend just one whole day providing childcare while implementing the regulations they come up with.

I havenít seen anything in my state yet like the new regs OP posted but Iím sure if theyíre starting somewhere itís just a matter of time.

I love the ďgo toĒ answers and the expressions on the licensors faces when I ask for clarification on some rules. The way the supervision rules are written, they donít allow for a caregiver to use the bathroom, ever. Címon people, you gotta know we have to be allowed to use the bathroom. Theyíre answer is ďItís up to you to figure out how to make it workĒ. The equivalent of putting their hands over their ears and singing ďLa La La La La LaĒ. Itís like Iím either supposed to hire another person and pay them minimum wage (more than I make in this business) should I need to use the bathroom so I can stay within the supervision ratio at any given time of the day. Or I can take a crowd of kids into the bathroom with me so I can supervise them at the same time? I donít want my child observing their caregiver in the bathroom. Sounds like criminal charges to me.

We must have a working monitor on in any room children sleep in, check on them every 15 minutes and leave the door between rooms open. Fire code says to close the doors. My babies who require 2 naps a day sleep in a room next to the daycare playroom. I can hear the sleeping babies better without the monitor amplifying the noise from the older kids playing outside the babies room. But nope, not allowed to use my common sense and judgement as an experienced parent. Gotta follow rules that make no sense.

Iím thinking the proposed regulation of having to sit within armís reach at meals coincides with the family-style meals the food program had been promoting before Coronavirus. Makes no sense with little ones. I hardly have time to sit when I make dinner for adult guests and they are self-sufficient. Iím not a fan of family-style meals for daycare. Having my own child with severe food allergies, itís too easy for another child to cause cross-contamination of a dish by accidentally using their own utensils for serving instead of the serving utensils.

Itís a shame the actual caregivers arenít consulted on their opinions of appropriate regulations.
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Old 08-28-2020, 09:30 AM
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Just for curiosity, are parents allowed to view the regulations that are set by childcare licensing or is it for providers and employees only?
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Old 08-28-2020, 09:54 AM
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Just for curiosity, are parents allowed to view the regulations that are set by childcare licensing or is it for providers and employees only?
I give all the links to all the parents and anyone who will listen. I also publish them regularly so they know the bullspit we have to deal with.

http://www.decal.ga.gov/documents/at...nyofbIkdyJ74Ig
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Old 08-28-2020, 02:15 PM
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I have managed to solve most of the feeding issues but cannot for the life of me figure out a plan for taking toddlers to the bathroom without having to drag infants there, too. "Sight and Sound" + "at all times".

I don't think I can afford to add a half bath after I just sunk almost 5k into the QRIS tuition/upgrades. I have not made that back yet. That is the only solution I can see. Surely I am missing something?


Help

Suggestions?
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Old 08-28-2020, 09:51 PM
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I have managed to solve most of the feeding issues but cannot for the life of me figure out a plan for taking toddlers to the bathroom without having to drag infants there, too. "Sight and Sound" + "at all times".

I don't think I can afford to add a half bath after I just sunk almost 5k into the QRIS tuition/upgrades. I have not made that back yet. That is the only solution I can see. Surely I am missing something?

Help

Suggestions?
Is your bathroom where you could cut the door high enough where you could see over but still be where you could see the kids and latch the top part back during daycare time. Just a thought....
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Old 08-28-2020, 11:52 PM
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I have managed to solve most of the feeding issues but cannot for the life of me figure out a plan for taking toddlers to the bathroom without having to drag infants there, too. "Sight and Sound" + "at all times".

I don't think I can afford to add a half bath after I just sunk almost 5k into the QRIS tuition/upgrades. I have not made that back yet. That is the only solution I can see. Surely I am missing something?


Help

Suggestions?

Okay so the rule says "The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs."

1. Wear depends
2. Use a camera and monitor with a microphone
3. Train them to sit outside the door
4. install a two way mirror

That's all I got for now.
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Old 08-29-2020, 07:19 AM
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Is your bathroom where you could cut the door high enough where you could see over but still be where you could see the kids and latch the top part back during daycare time. Just a thought....
It is a guest bath across from the guest room and my husbands office. I don't think that would go over well.

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Okay so the rule says "The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs."

1. Wear depends
2. Use a camera and monitor with a microphone
3. Train them to sit outside the door
4. install a two way mirror

That's all I got for now.
I do have a camera in there, the monitor is in the kitchen for when I am cooking. No sound, though. You could be on to something, though. Ring. Nest. Audio/video on my phone??? I will ask my inspector if that counts.
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Old 08-29-2020, 07:20 AM
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I have 4 kids agree 13-18. ALL my kids would count toward ratio though they are all capable of doing babysitting on their own! Lol It used to be kids under age 12 (except when in school). Therefore, as exempt, I can't watch ANY kids 'technically' and as licensed I could watch only 4! I could watch 4+2 school agers back in the day.

Being in child care is TOO difficult. I told licensing board that beer rules are so stupid that technically every single parent that has four children and takes a child from school for a couple hours is basically breaking the rules. I ask her what the real rules are for Rideshare as far as parents who have 4 kids taking home 3 kids say from after school band practice. " well technically if you're not a licensed daycare, you're not supposed to be watching kids at all in those circumstances" most parents of older kids who need rides, are not going to be paying child care services, you know that one of those band parents are carpooling and everybody kind of switches off. I could not believe that they consider this actually child care. Really really stupid. Furthermore, I cannot believe that they actually consider 13 year olds on up to at least age 18, to be unable to entertain themselves or help out with the daycare kids or to do anything. They make it sound like they're just babies. Ridiculous
Ugh. That sounds awful. Kids stop counting in ratios at 13, here, but must be fingerprinted and have a comprehensive background check.
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Old 08-29-2020, 09:37 AM
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Other than put in a porta-potty or let the kids wear pull-ups all day; I got nothing!

I closed yesterday and spent the day de-qris-assessing my daycare room. My dumpster is full of materials and little signs that were hung up that I used to make sure I received credit for "everything" as I doubted my assessor's perception more times than not.

Got a little more to do today, but back to the "welcoming/engaging/non-counting items/fun-looking/etc".

While there are some issues going on within the state right now, the FCCERS-R guidelines are GONE!
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Old 08-29-2020, 01:02 PM
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Other than put in a porta-potty or let the kids wear pull-ups all day; I got nothing!

I closed yesterday and spent the day de-qris-assessing my daycare room. My dumpster is full of materials and little signs that were hung up that I used to make sure I received credit for "everything" as I doubted my assessor's perception more times than not.

Got a little more to do today, but back to the "welcoming/engaging/non-counting items/fun-looking/etc".

While there are some issues going on within the state right now, the FCCERS-R guidelines are GONE!
Nice Congrats! I know you will enjoy it so much more, now.
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Old 08-29-2020, 06:50 PM
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It is a guest bath across from the guest room and my husbands office. I don't think that would go over well.



I do have a camera in there, the monitor is in the kitchen for when I am cooking. No sound, though. You could be on to something, though. Ring. Nest. Audio/video on my phone??? I will ask my inspector if that counts.
I have a camera with an app on my phone/tablet. The app allows you to zoom in, move the camera and talk to the kids.
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Old 08-30-2020, 07:15 AM
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I have a camera with an app on my phone/tablet. The app allows you to zoom in, move the camera and talk to the kids.
Interesting. What is the name of it?
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Old 08-30-2020, 07:23 AM
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Catherder, maybe you could add on your ads "come to CH daycare where your child is NEVER left alone; even while using the bathroom".

The state regs are so "out-there". They need to at least have providers look at them before enforcing them
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Old 08-30-2020, 09:14 AM
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Yes they do @annalee
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Old 09-01-2020, 11:17 AM
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Ugh. That sounds awful. Kids stop counting in ratios at 13, here, but must be fingerprinted and have a comprehensive background check.
Fingerprint a 13yo? What on earth history are they gonna have? Minor records are generally sealed, no?
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Old 09-01-2020, 11:36 AM
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Fingerprint a 13yo? What on earth history are they gonna have? Minor records are generally sealed, no?
Not during a comprehensive background check for childcare. There are 13 years old's with multiple felonies around here, already.

It will just come back saying "Not cleared" and automatically updates if anything changes before it expires. It won't say why although as the parent you would generally already know.

https://www.aps.gemalto.com/index.htm
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Old 09-01-2020, 01:35 PM
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Interesting. What is the name of it?
I have the same ability, a wyze cam.

I can pull it up on my phone, zoom in, and talk to the kids through it. With an SD card it records for around 5 days. Might be 7. And you can program it to turn off/on and record during certain times. Once there is no room left on the SD card, it just records over the oldest material. Within that time if there is anything concerning I can record a clip of whatever the incident was and save it in an album, email it, text it, etc.

And yes, it works wonders when using the bathroom! No one is unattended or unheard.
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Old 09-01-2020, 02:30 PM
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I have the same ability, a wyze cam.

I can pull it up on my phone, zoom in, and talk to the kids through it. With an SD card it records for around 5 days. Might be 7. And you can program it to turn off/on and record during certain times. Once there is no room left on the SD card, it just records over the oldest material. Within that time if there is anything concerning I can record a clip of whatever the incident was and save it in an album, email it, text it, etc.

And yes, it works wonders when using the bathroom! No one is unattended or unheard.
My concern is they did not stop at sight and sound, they made it impossible. "hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised"

They did not define promptly, of course.
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Old 09-01-2020, 03:15 PM
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My concern is they did not stop at sight and sound, they made it impossible. "hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised"

They did not define promptly, of course.
Well, bummer.

You can certainly hear and see at all times with a camera. But if a provider is in the restroom in the middle of whatever, they are not going to be able to respond promptly, pending the definition of promptly. Quickly, of course! I think we all know how to have lightening fast restroom breaks

Has any asked their licensor what the solution to this is? I am curious. Do they skirt around the question?
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Old 09-01-2020, 03:23 PM
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Well, bummer.

You can certainly hear and see at all times with a camera. But if a provider is in the restroom in the middle of whatever, they are not going to be able to respond promptly, pending the definition of promptly. Quickly, of course! I think we all know how to have lightening fast restroom breaks

Has any asked their licensor what the solution to this is? I am curious. Do they skirt around the question?
Crickets. And a lot of I don't knows. Per usual. We have 30 days to comply. They have no time table to set guidance. It took over 8 months last time.
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Old 09-01-2020, 10:37 PM
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Crickets. And a lot of I don't knows. Per usual. We have 30 days to comply. They have no time table to set guidance. It took over 8 months last time.
That must be so frustrating for you. We just got our new rules last December. I had heard about the rules for over a year before and started to implement them, then found out that they were not ineffect yet. (which for some of the rules, I would have been in the wrong if I had implemented them.)
Then when they went into effect, I got an email 10 days before. We got the rule book a month (but the technical is not upto date) before I took the training course, 3 months after they went into effect.
Then the pamedemic hit and I shelved updating my e plan. Most of our changes were simple expect the e plan. I rushed to get it done before my inspection last month and I was told that it needed improvement. Then he told me that I had another year to get it done due to the pandemic, lucky me because if they had not given me an extension he would have wrote me up for it.

I am in agreement with most of the rules, expect I find doing the e plan to be difficult since I have never had training on what to do for a man made threat or experienced the after facts of a natural disaster.
Although today was interesting in itself. (We had an armed suspect less than a mile away with a road block at the end of our road, I had DCD come another route to my home to get the kids)
I do have tighter rules on use of a pack and play, which is a good thing that this board had talked me into switching to portable cribs before I knew about the rules on PNP.


Anyway, I would think you could use the camera microphone to respond promptly to the kids.
"Jimmy put Suize down" "Mikey I know you like it, but please stop tasting everything!" lol

Or back to my random thought list...

How to respond promptly while still on the toilet??

1. A robot with a monitor that shows your face
2. Service Dog with CPR/1st aid training
3. Remote control car instead of a robot
4. Movie magic
5. A stunt double

Okay that is all I got for now...
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Old 09-02-2020, 09:17 AM
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A note from your doctor saying that your body needs to eliminate every couple of hours in private. Lol
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Old 09-02-2020, 06:13 PM
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My regs specifically say that video monitoring is not an acceptable form of supervision.

We can only use monitors for supervision while kids are asleep and still must physically check on them every 15 minutes. We cannot leave the floor that the children are sleeping on so thereís no running upstairs to use the bathroom even while all the kids nap.

I was told by one of my licensors that if they arrived and I was in the bathroom with the door closed, they could violate me. Luckily, we have to keep the entrance doors locked so itís not like they are gonna walk in and catch a provider using the bathroom. Just make sure the door is answered quickly when they knock though.
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Old 10-31-2020, 11:52 PM
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At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.

Such supervision must include, but not be limited to, indoor and outdoor activities, mealtimes, naptime, transportation, field trips, and transitions between activities.

"Supervision" means Staff members are providing watchful oversight to the children, volunteers and Students-in-Training.

The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs.

Staff shall be attentive and participating with all children during mealtimes and shall be seated within an armís length away from children thirty-six (36) months of age and younger.

Plans shall be made to obtain additional Staff help in cases of emergencies.
I was thinking about you the other day, when the baby I have in care woke while the kids were eating lunch and I had to feed her a bottle, I thought hmm "how is CH going to feed a bottle and eat with the kids at the same time?"
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Old 11-01-2020, 01:26 PM
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I was thinking about you the other day, when the baby I have in care woke while the kids were eating lunch and I had to feed her a bottle, I thought hmm "how is CH going to feed a bottle and eat with the kids at the same time?"
Apparently, I am not.

If tested, I would just move everyone's plates to the center of the table, scoot back their chairs then grab baby.

Generally, I would have had little one settled in in preparation for lunch but they sure don't seem to give us any wiggle room.

I would love to see any one of them follow their own regs. I know they can't.
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Old 11-02-2020, 02:15 PM
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"Food for infants or children less than one (1) year of age shall be cut into pieces one-quarter inch or smaller and food for toddlers shall be cut into pieces one-half inch or smaller to prevent choking." - I do have one who will go ballistic if I cut his apples, pears or bananas.
THIS is why we have 3 year olds who don't chew their food and don't know how to take a bite out of anything!
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Old 11-02-2020, 03:37 PM
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THIS is why we have 3 year olds who don't chew their food and don't know how to take a bite out of anything!
The 1/2 inch rule is for 3 and under.
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Old 11-15-2020, 08:21 AM
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Oh my gosh, ya got me there!! I never thought so many things have to be spelled out to so many people!

Iíve been thinking about that lunch rule in particular though: wouldnít you be able to respond more quickly if you were already on your feet and circulating??!
Yes! If I was sitting at their table (kid size) - it would take longer to respond that if I was standing. I won't fit at their table anyway! I guess magic shrinking pills are necessary to fit!

Just another example of insanity!
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Old 11-19-2020, 12:21 PM
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I only have to offer formula--- I don't take babies though.
Sight and sound supervision has ALWAYS been a reg here. Ever since I can remember. It is a PITA. As FCC I lined the kids up outside the bathroom, left the door open and we did songs and movement games while we took turns pottying.

They did give me a note allowing 'brief and necessary' restroom breaks. How kind of them.

As group, we have to have one with sight and sound and that usually means we potty when the kids do so they're lined up.

Noone is allowed alone with kids without a passed background check, even family 18+ with no contact have to have one every 5 years.
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