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  #1  
Old 04-09-2016, 08:39 AM
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Default Questions About How to Term and How to Bring It Up

I've been working up the nerve to term a family for a long time. I really need to do it soon. I have only termed 2 other times. One was easy because we hadn't worked together long, and the other went poorly. I'm pretty sure I know what I want to say, but I'm having trouble with the actual "how" of doing it. We are on friendly terms, though I have no intentions of continuing the friendship after this is over. A lot of you say to write a letter, but it would be way out of the norm for me to hand her a letter without saying anything about it and I feel like with how personal I let this relationship get, that it wouldn't go well. To bring it up at pick up would be hard because she would want to talk and I would have several other kids running around at her pick up time. So when you term, do you always do a letter? Do you give any lead up before you hand the letter over? If so, how do you bring it up in conversation? If it helps, my reasoning for terming is that I need to downsize my program and will no longer be able to open at the time she needs.
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Old 04-09-2016, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
I've been working up the nerve to term a family for a long time. I really need to do it soon. I have only termed 2 other times. One was easy because we hadn't worked together long, and the other went poorly. I'm pretty sure I know what I want to say, but I'm having trouble with the actual "how" of doing it. We are on friendly terms, though I have no intentions of continuing the friendship after this is over. A lot of you say to write a letter, but it would be way out of the norm for me to hand her a letter without saying anything about it and I feel like with how personal I let this relationship get, that it wouldn't go well. To bring it up at pick up would be hard because she would want to talk and I would have several other kids running around at her pick up time. So when you term, do you always do a letter? Do you give any lead up before you hand the letter over? If so, how do you bring it up in conversation? If it helps, my reasoning for terming is that I need to downsize my program and will no longer be able to open at the time she needs.
I'd just say it at drop off then so she can't stay to chat... something like:
"Hey Sally, I know this isn't the best time for bad news but when is a good time right? .... lol! Anyways, I've made some changes in my hours and my capacity limits and unfortunately I'm not going to be able to continue caring for Jr after next Friday. I know it's hard to find good care but it's also hard to manage a business and make everyone happy but his change is non-negotiable. Here are the details in writing. Feel free to email me if you have any questions"

Then hand her the written letter and tell her "See you after work!"

I know telling someone right before work isn't ideal but honestly terming someone has no right or wrong rules... You just have to do what's best for YOU and drop off seems much better for you than pick up.
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Old 04-10-2016, 11:21 AM
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I never termed anyone (but I should have twice) so take this with a grain of salt. I think I'd do like Blackcat says but do it on a Friday at pick-up.

If the reason is 'only' because of the hours, be prepared for her to say she can change her hours even if you don't think she can. She just may find a relative to drop off or may be able to adjust her work hours so you'd be stuck if you have other issues with her than just hours.

I did give someone a friendly ultimatum one time. I just simply said "I'm so sorry to have to tell you this but if we can't get his no napping under control, I just won't be able to watch him anymore." I think starting off with the "I'm so sorry" relates that it is nothing personal but a business decision.

Good luck!
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Old 04-10-2016, 02:11 PM
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I never termed anyone (but I should have twice) so take this with a grain of salt. I think I'd do like Blackcat says but do it on a Friday at pick-up.

If the reason is 'only' because of the hours, be prepared for her to say she can change her hours even if you don't think she can. She just may find a relative to drop off or may be able to adjust her work hours so you'd be stuck if you have other issues with her than just hours.

I did give someone a friendly ultimatum one time. I just simply said "I'm so sorry to have to tell you this but if we can't get his no napping under control, I just won't be able to watch him anymore." I think starting off with the "I'm so sorry" relates that it is nothing personal but a business decision.

Good luck!
I agree with Laurel. She will definitely say she's willing to change hours. So make sure you have a comeback if there are other reasons you do not want this family. Good luck!
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Old 04-11-2016, 11:34 AM
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I always term through email. I do this because I can say exactly what i want to say the way I want to say it. At pickup and drop off there is just too much going on and to be honest I don't like blindsiding people. I told one client at the door and it did not go well and I became flustered as I was not expecting such a crazy reaction.

That is what works for me. It gives them time to process and then we chat about it the next day or that Monday or whenever. All of my terms I did this way have gone amazingly well. The only negative term was when I did it face to face.

I usually say something like "this is by far the hardest part of my job but......" It is the truth. Terming stinks.
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Old 04-11-2016, 12:45 PM
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I also only term in writing due to a parent losing it when I did it face to face.

But I do like Blackcat's method.
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Old 04-11-2016, 01:53 PM
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Thank you for all of your responses. This does help me get a grasp on it. I think I'm going to tell her in person, even though in writing would be so much easier for me. Curious, when you do it in writing, how does the next day go usually? Do you bring it up to make sure they're clear? I really wanted to wait until summer to tell her because she is off for summer anyway and thinks she is just leaving for my maternity leave soon until summer and then coming back in the fall. It would be so easy Peasy to just send her an email since she would still l have 2.5 months to find care at that point, but everyone tells me that's wrong. Can you tell this is difficult for me?
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Old 04-11-2016, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Thank you for all of your responses. This does help me get a grasp on it. I think I'm going to tell her in person, even though in writing would be so much easier for me. Curious, when you do it in writing, how does the next day go usually? Do you bring it up to make sure they're clear? I really wanted to wait until summer to tell her because she is off for summer anyway and thinks she is just leaving for my maternity leave soon until summer and then coming back in the fall. It would be so easy Peasy to just send her an email since she would still l have 2.5 months to find care at that point, but everyone tells me that's wrong. Can you tell this is difficult for me?
If it were me, I would wait until your leave started and send her a term letter. I see absolutely nothing wrong with that as she will have over two months to secure other care. That is not short notice, or in any way shape or form unprofessional.

If it were me, I'd take a deep breath and let it go. When mom talks about the fall I'd nod and smile. And then, a few days after my leave started, I'd send the letter.
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Old 04-11-2016, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Thank you for all of your responses. This does help me get a grasp on it. I think I'm going to tell her in person, even though in writing would be so much easier for me. Curious, when you do it in writing, how does the next day go usually? Do you bring it up to make sure they're clear? I really wanted to wait until summer to tell her because she is off for summer anyway and thinks she is just leaving for my maternity leave soon until summer and then coming back in the fall. It would be so easy Peasy to just send her an email since she would still l have 2.5 months to find care at that point, but everyone tells me that's wrong. Can you tell this is difficult for me?
The main reason I think it would be wrong for you to wait, is in your posts about it, it sounds like you are just ready to be done. And dragging it on when you feel the need to be done is just punishing yourself.
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Old 04-11-2016, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Thank you for all of your responses. This does help me get a grasp on it. I think I'm going to tell her in person, even though in writing would be so much easier for me. Curious, when you do it in writing, how does the next day go usually? Do you bring it up to make sure they're clear? I really wanted to wait until summer to tell her because she is off for summer anyway and thinks she is just leaving for my maternity leave soon until summer and then coming back in the fall. It would be so easy Peasy to just send her an email since she would still l have 2.5 months to find care at that point, but everyone tells me that's wrong. Can you tell this is difficult for me?
I usually term on the weekend (friday evening) and ask for a response in the email before I see them face to face. That way I know they have read the email. You could also text or mention that you sent them an important email to which you need a response kind of thing. Mostly I will offer extra time to find alternate care and then ask whether or not they were going to take it or end care at the contracted two weeks etc.

I have never had a client not read the email and respond before I saw them. I have also never had a child return to care once the email was sent.
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Old 04-14-2016, 08:17 AM
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I've only termed twice. Once by face to a young mother who flipped @*&# in my living room. Slammed my door, peeled out of my driveway, stalked my business facebook with rude comments and demands for hours afterwards, posting pictures of her crying, just oh my gosh - VERY uncomfortable situation!

Then -- the other, the mother who was very sweet and understanding, I emailed. She obviously was very hurt but kept it simple and business-y.

With the first one, I quickly learned that I am not able to think of all my reasons when feeling anxious or pressured like that (them staring at you, waiting for you to spit out what you're trying to say ) I was only able to tell her one small reason why she was being terminated before she flipped. I had so much emotion after wards from not knowing what to do, I started crying myself! So, from now on, I will always email with all my reasons explained so the emotion can be left out of it. Good luck, terming sucks. But, you feel so much better after you get rid of what's making you unhappy
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Old 04-14-2016, 09:44 AM
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If it were me, I would wait until your leave started and send her a term letter. I see absolutely nothing wrong with that as she will have over two months to secure other care. That is not short notice, or in any way shape or form unprofessional.

If it were me, I'd take a deep breath and let it go. When mom talks about the fall I'd nod and smile. And then, a few days after my leave started, I'd send the letter.


When you start your maternity leave, I would email her then to let her know she wouldn't have a space in fall due to program restructuring (number of children, hours, ages, include it all if you feel like she will attempt to negotiate).
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Old 04-14-2016, 09:48 AM
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When you start your maternity leave, I would email her then to let her know she wouldn't have a space in fall due to program restructuring (number of children, hours, ages, include it all if you feel like she will attempt to negotiate).


I feel like providers are made to feel guilty when making changes to their programs. And we think we are being nice by giving more notice than we are contractually obligated to.
Having fallen for that , I can say all it does it make for a very long, uncomfortable few months (or however long the period is).
Unless you are only giving them two week NOW, I wouldn't do it before you were originally planning.
You can even say "the new baby has brought more changes than I planned on" etc. Most people are somewhat understanding that adding a new baby to the mix can change things.
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Old 04-14-2016, 11:53 AM
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Those of you who say to term while I'm on maternity leave, I love you, but does your opinion change if I told you she was having trouble finding care to cover my leave? She doesn't want to pay for summer while she is home so she has been telling providers she only needs 5 weeks of care to cover may through first part of June and of course no one is interested in her as a client. I know that's not technically my problem, but if I would just grow a pair and tell her she's done here, maybe she could find care easier for may. That is where I'm struggling. Though I suppose there won't be many who will let her have the summer off for free anyway...She got lucky with me.
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Old 04-14-2016, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Those of you who say to term while I'm on maternity leave, I love you, but does your opinion change if I told you she was having trouble finding care to cover my leave? She doesn't want to pay for summer while she is home so she has been telling providers she only needs 5 weeks of care to cover may through first part of June and of course no one is interested in her as a client. I know that's not technically my problem, but if I would just grow a pair and tell her she's done here, maybe she could find care easier for may. That is where I'm struggling. Though I suppose there won't be many who will let her have the summer off for free anyway...She got lucky with me.
I would tell her now and allow her to look for a long term new provider. I always give them a note AND tell them in person. I give the letter because when someone tells you bad news people often shut down. They can't fully listen, process, remember etc. I termed a set of twins a few months back. I loved the parents. Kids were ok. But I had a golden family with an infant wanting the spot and it was a fulltime trumped part time situation too. I told mom "I am so sorry, ___ is the last day I will be able to provide care. I am not offering PT anymore. I will miss G and L very much. You are a wonderful family to work with. Everything I just said, plus some resources for finding care are in the letter. Please don't hesitate to email me with any questions." They were sad, but understand this is a business.
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Old 04-14-2016, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Those of you who say to term while I'm on maternity leave, I love you, but does your opinion change if I told you she was having trouble finding care to cover my leave? She doesn't want to pay for summer while she is home so she has been telling providers she only needs 5 weeks of care to cover may through first part of June and of course no one is interested in her as a client. I know that's not technically my problem, but if I would just grow a pair and tell her she's done here, maybe she could find care easier for may. That is where I'm struggling. Though I suppose there won't be many who will let her have the summer off for free anyway...She got lucky with me.
For me this would factor big time into telling her right away and it is what I would do. I could not in clear conscious do that to somebody. Finding care is a very difficukt situation and to ask her to find care twice under a false pretense is just not fair and isn't something I would feel comfortable doing
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Old 04-15-2016, 06:09 AM
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If it were me, I would wait until your leave started and send her a term letter. I see absolutely nothing wrong with that as she will have over two months to secure other care. That is not short notice, or in any way shape or form unprofessional.

If it were me, I'd take a deep breath and let it go. When mom talks about the fall I'd nod and smile. And then, a few days after my leave started, I'd send the letter.
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When you start your maternity leave, I would email her then to let her know she wouldn't have a space in fall due to program restructuring (number of children, hours, ages, include it all if you feel like she will attempt to negotiate).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Those of you who say to term while I'm on maternity leave, I love you, but does your opinion change if I told you she was having trouble finding care to cover my leave? She doesn't want to pay for summer while she is home so she has been telling providers she only needs 5 weeks of care to cover may through first part of June and of course no one is interested in her as a client. I know that's not technically my problem, but if I would just grow a pair and tell her she's done here, maybe she could find care easier for may. That is where I'm struggling. Though I suppose there won't be many who will let her have the summer off for free anyway...She got lucky with me.
(^bolding^ by me)
~No, to me, it doesn't change anything. ..And I agree with the above. I think you should wait to term her...I'd wait until your maternity leave and then term very shortly thereafter. I think it makes it a lot easier on both of you. That way there are no awkward confrontations or "moments" to worry about. You can simply send her an email, no face-to-face, and no added stress. Doing it this way, IMHO, is more professional and allows for a "clean break"(or at least a much "cleaner break" than you would have if terming now)...none of this extra burden on your shoulders. I also think she would take the term less personally if done over the summer during your leave rather than right now.

~If she's having trouble finding care now, even if the reason is because she only needs 5 weeks of care, I still don't think she's going to find it any easier when given 7. Besides, if you term shortly after your maternity leave, she will still have basically the entire summer to secure other care without having the "only for 5 weeks" stipulation added to it. So, either way you dice it...5 weeks is plenty of time; and to me, that is the bottom line here...she has 5 weeks, more than enough time to find care. ...Just my 2 cents. ~Anyway, I hope that everything works out for the best for you regardless of which route you choose to take.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
Those of you who say to term while I'm on maternity leave, I love you, but does your opinion change if I told you she was having trouble finding care to cover my leave? She doesn't want to pay for summer while she is home so she has been telling providers she only needs 5 weeks of care to cover may through first part of June and of course no one is interested in her as a client. I know that's not technically my problem, but if I would just grow a pair and tell her she's done here, maybe she could find care easier for may. That is where I'm struggling. Though I suppose there won't be many who will let her have the summer off for free anyway...She got lucky with me.
"I'm going to tell my day care provider months before we plan on leaving since it's so hard to fill spots!" said NO parent ever.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:10 AM
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"I'm going to tell my day care provider months before we plan on leaving since it's so hard to fill spots!" said NO parent ever.
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:45 AM
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"I'm going to tell my day care provider months before we plan on leaving since it's so hard to fill spots!" said NO parent ever.
Lol fair enough
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Old 04-15-2016, 09:55 AM
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"I'm going to tell my day care provider months before we plan on leaving since it's so hard to fill spots!" said NO parent ever.
Lol! True but that doesn't mean you have to suspend all decency because a parent is a turd.

Edit: Tried to use a word that wouldn't be censored. Turd FTW!! Lol
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Old 04-15-2016, 10:18 AM
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My concern is the stress. Stress for a pregnant provider is SO important to avoid.

If this family is at all causing stress to the provider, she shouldn't be guilted into prolonging a termination.

Everyone of us has our own comfort levels and I've come to recognize and understand that by the time a provider comes to this forum to post/vent/ask for advice....the situation is usually much more stressful than the poster lets on and sometimes the posters are simply looking for a "push" in the direction they are already heading.

OP does NOT owe this family ANY type of courtesy or special consideration. She owes them the same notice period they would owe her if the situation was reversed.

The care environment outside her program (whether other care situations are available or not) is really not her concern.

Her concern should be focused on her pregnancy and a healthy baby. Eliminating ANY stress is a necessary evil in some situations.
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Old 04-15-2016, 10:38 AM
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My concern is the stress. Stress for a pregnant provider is SO important to avoid.

If this family is at all causing stress to the provider, she shouldn't be guilted into prolonging a termination.

Everyone of us has our own comfort levels and I've come to recognize and understand that by the time a provider comes to this forum to post/vent/ask for advice....the situation is usually much more stressful than the poster lets on and sometimes the posters are simply looking for a "push" in the direction they are already heading.

OP does NOT owe this family ANY type of courtesy or special consideration. She owes them the same notice period they would owe her if the situation was reversed.

The care environment outside her program (whether other care situations are available or not) is really not her concern.

Her concern should be focused on her pregnancy and a healthy baby. Eliminating ANY stress is a necessary evil in some situations.


Agreed! I hope it doesn't come across that I thought she should keep them. If they are causing stress, term now.

I just don't think you should feel you should have to term them before you are ready because you feel bad, etc.
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Old 04-15-2016, 11:08 AM
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I so appreciate all of your input whether you are for or against me doing this during my maternity leave. I see both sides and am starting to see that there is no one way to do this where the dcm will just say, "oh ok no problem! Whatever works best for you!" Yes, the family does cause me stress, but knowing they will be gone in a few weeks has helped a lot with that. The thing causing me the most stress is over thinking this term and wanting to do it the "right" way with the least confrontation and/or rebuttal from dcm. I'm worried about not coming across confident and getting emotional about it in front of her. I'm worried about putting them in a stressful situation with finding new care. I'm worried she'll be hurt that I picked to continue doing business with other families and not her or that she'll think I'm a bad provider because I can't handle my new baby, my older 2 kids going off to school and a full load of daycare kids. I'm worried about dcm leaving bad reviews and talking to my other families. All of this I have to confront whether I term her today or a month from now and the fact that I eventually have to gather my nerves and just do it is causing me way more stress than her being here.
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Old 04-15-2016, 04:08 PM
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I so appreciate all of your input whether you are for or against me doing this during my maternity leave. I see both sides and am starting to see that there is no one way to do this where the dcm will just say, "oh ok no problem! Whatever works best for you!" Yes, the family does cause me stress, but knowing they will be gone in a few weeks has helped a lot with that. The thing causing me the most stress is over thinking this term and wanting to do it the "right" way with the least confrontation and/or rebuttal from dcm. I'm worried about not coming across confident and getting emotional about it in front of her. I'm worried about putting them in a stressful situation with finding new care. I'm worried she'll be hurt that I picked to continue doing business with other families and not her or that she'll think I'm a bad provider because I can't handle my new baby, my older 2 kids going off to school and a full load of daycare kids. I'm worried about dcm leaving bad reviews and talking to my other families. All of this I have to confront whether I term her today or a month from now and the fact that I eventually have to gather my nerves and just do it is causing me way more stress than her being here.
This is exactly why I think you should do it now! If you weren't feeling bad about waiting you wouldn't be here asking for our advice right? You would just wait and do it later.

The small amount of stress that terming her now will be better than the prolonged stress of waiting until later. Kind of like ripping off a bandaid

Just my opinion. You obviously do not owe her anything but what is causing you more stress? Which scenario gives the greater sense of relief at the end? That is the one you should go with

And please please please do not worry either way what DCM thinks of you! You are doing the best you can.
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Old 04-16-2016, 04:26 AM
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For me this would factor big time into telling her right away and it is what I would do. I could not in clear conscious do that to somebody. Finding care is a very difficukt situation and to ask her to find care twice under a false pretense is just not fair and isn't something I would feel comfortable doing
(^bolding^ by me)
~Okay, I'm getting confused. What is the false pretense and asking twice?
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Old 04-16-2016, 05:20 AM
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(^bolding^ by me)
~Okay, I'm getting confused. What is the false pretense and asking twice?
I think she's talking about how I have already asked dcm to find care for maternity leave once and now I will have to ask her to find care again because she will be termed, when I should have just termed her in the first place since I knew along I didn't want to continue with this family in the fall. She's right that I have been dragging it out.
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Old 04-16-2016, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
I think she's talking about how I have already asked dcm to find care for maternity leave once and now I will have to ask her to find care again because she will be termed, when I should have just termed her in the first place since I knew along I didn't want to continue with this family in the fall. She's right that I have been dragging it out.
~Oh okay. ..So, how much longer till you go on maternity leave if you don't mind my asking?
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  #29  
Old 04-16-2016, 07:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Laurel View Post
I never termed anyone (but I should have twice) so take this with a grain of salt. I think I'd do like Blackcat says but do it on a Friday at pick-up.

If the reason is 'only' because of the hours, be prepared for her to say she can change her hours even if you don't think she can. She just may find a relative to drop off or may be able to adjust her work hours so you'd be stuck if you have other issues with her than just hours.

I did give someone a friendly ultimatum one time. I just simply said "I'm so sorry to have to tell you this but if we can't get his no napping under control, I just won't be able to watch him anymore." I think starting off with the "I'm so sorry" relates that it is nothing personal but a business decision.

Good luck!
I usually like to term at drop off and never on a Friday. Parents tend to have a lot of free time on the weekend and want to go back and forth.
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Old 04-16-2016, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by sleepinghart View Post
~Oh okay. ..So, how much longer till you go on maternity leave if you don't mind my asking?
May 6th will be the last day for her and another tough family. The other 2 families I'm keeping until I go into labor at end of may because they have dream hours, dependable backup care, and are all around easy kids and parents. Not sure if the 2 families leaving early know that I'm keeping the 2 others for longer. I just wanted my last month to be easier.
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Old 04-16-2016, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Indoorvoice View Post
May 6th will be the last day for her and another tough family. The other 2 families I'm keeping until I go into labor at end of may because they have dream hours, dependable backup care, and are all around easy kids and parents. Not sure if the 2 families leaving early know that I'm keeping the 2 others for longer. I just wanted my last month to be easier.
~Oh, I see...I think. That's about 3 weeks from now? So it's either term now and she has 8 or so weeks to find other care or term after your leave and she has 5 or so weeks(I'm like Teen Talk Barbie "math class is tough" for me too)? If this particular family we're talking about is difficult & stressful for you in other ways, that makes a difference and factors into the decision. Otherwise, I just also wanted to add this...

I don't think it matters when you tell her she's termed as long as you give her enough notice, and you are. I don't think it matters when you knew you wanted to term her, or how long you've known you were going to term her as long as you give her enough notice, and you are. Whether you term now or you wait until your leave, you are giving her plenty of time. *You're not being deceitful in any way if you decide to wait to term during your leave*. This is a business, your business, and it's a business decision...nothing personal. You have to run it in your best interest and if that means not telling her she's termed until a certain time, then there's nothing wrong with that...If that means you term now, then there's nothing wrong with that either. *I see no harm coming to mom if you do decide to wait and term on your maternity leave*. I would try not to feel guilty about telling her before now as it's not like you had any malicious intent...in fact, it's your good nature that has made this such a difficult decision for you in the first place; you're doing the best you can and it's good .
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