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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Help With Sobbing 4 Year Old
Sugar Magnolia 10:54 AM 11-03-2014
I'm really stumped by this one. Little girl, 4, has been with me since she was two. Her sister also attended here, so it's a long-term family with me. She was never a problem, no issues with crying.

We are located directly next door to a charter school. This school offers free Voluntary Pre Kindergarten. (VPK). The older sister also attends there, she is in second grade there now. Younger sis is very familiar with the school, since she has been there many times to pick up older sis. Her cousins also attend there.

Mom enrolled DCG there to attend VPK. This saves mom quite a bit of money and I totally understand that. VPK ends at 1130, so I walk next door and pick her up and bring her here for the rest of her day. (Yes, mom is getting a cheap rate from me, that's not the issue, I don't mind cutting her a break on tuition)


At the start of the school year, everything was fine. Slowly, she started having problems being clingy at drop off there. Then, it progressed to dcg crying at drop off. She always seemed ok-ish when I picked her up over there. Now, the poor girl is having terrible crying there, beyond drop off time. All last week, and again today, she is crying when I pick her up at 1130. Last week, she'd be ok in a few minutes. Today, she cried all through lunch, story time and the beginning of nap. Really, really upset crying. She CANNOT tell me what is wrong, just cries for mom.

I'm not a fan of VPK in general. This room is small, crowded with kids, not too terribly many toys, no outside time, and it always seems a little chaotic. Nothing terrible, but just loud and crowded. The teacher seems ok to me, but has a loud booming voice, and while it's not"yelling", can see why some kids may be intimidated by her. She has an assistant who I'd also not terribly "comforting" in appearance or tone either. You know how it is....their goal is to have as many kids for as few staff as the law will allow. This isn't MY business model, but many big centers/VPK programs operate this way, sadly.

I am just upset seeing this normally nice, joyful, playful and happy little girl in tears every single day. Her friends here get upset that she's upset. Mom is well aware of the issues. I believe this VPK environment is not good for her. She was used to our little center that is so much more calm, home-like and WAY below state mandated ratios. I want to tell mom to pull her from over there. I don't think it's my business though. Would you all offer mom the same cheap rate for the full day again? I am pretty sure the financial aspect has something to do with her decision making process. I normally charge $195 pet week, since going to VPK half days, I dropped her rate to $100 a week

Is taking a $95 hit the right thing to do here? For the sake of this fragile and very upset little girl? WWYD???
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NeedaVaca 11:15 AM 11-03-2014
How sad for this little girl! I can understand why you would want to offer something and if that's what you decide to do then that's your choice and it would be a very nice and generous offer! IMO...I wouldn't do it...simply because I feel like it's the parents job to look out for their kids best interest. The little girl is obviously not doing well there, MOM needs to fix this! It makes me sad to hear a parent choosing free/cheap over the child's happiness....
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daycarediva 11:18 AM 11-03-2014
I think it's MOM's responsibility to take the $95 hit.

I do agree she needs to be pulled out though. poor love.
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Sugar Magnolia 11:40 AM 11-03-2014
Maybe a rate in the middle? Like $150? Mom's husband used to help pay the tuition here, but he flew the coop and I think the financial problems are significant now. I usually don't fall for the "I'm a single mom" thing, but in this case, she is supporting 3 kids on her own now. Dad is still "involved" with the kids, but really doesn't seem to contribute financially anymore. Maybe dad moving out is making dcg upset too, but she never cries for dad, he's around and participating, but who knows. He left the home over 6 months ago, and dcg seemed fine.
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Blackcat31 11:55 AM 11-03-2014
Originally Posted by Sugar Magnolia:
I'm really stumped by this one. Little girl, 4, has been with me since she was two. Her sister also attended here, so it's a long-term family with me. She was never a problem, no issues with crying.

We are located directly next door to a charter school. This school offers free Voluntary Pre Kindergarten. (VPK). The older sister also attends there, she is in second grade there now. Younger sis is very familiar with the school, since she has been there many times to pick up older sis. Her cousins also attend there.

Mom enrolled DCG there to attend VPK. This saves mom quite a bit of money and I totally understand that. VPK ends at 1130, so I walk next door and pick her up and bring her here for the rest of her day. (Yes, mom is getting a cheap rate from me, that's not the issue, I don't mind cutting her a break on tuition)


At the start of the school year, everything was fine. Slowly, she started having problems being clingy at drop off there. Then, it progressed to dcg crying at drop off. She always seemed ok-ish when I picked her up over there. Now, the poor girl is having terrible crying there, beyond drop off time. All last week, and again today, she is crying when I pick her up at 1130. Last week, she'd be ok in a few minutes. Today, she cried all through lunch, story time and the beginning of nap. Really, really upset crying. She CANNOT tell me what is wrong, just cries for mom.

I'm not a fan of VPK in general. This room is small, crowded with kids, not too terribly many toys, no outside time, and it always seems a little chaotic. Nothing terrible, but just loud and crowded. The teacher seems ok to me, but has a loud booming voice, and while it's not"yelling", can see why some kids may be intimidated by her. She has an assistant who I'd also not terribly "comforting" in appearance or tone either. You know how it is....their goal is to have as many kids for as few staff as the law will allow. This isn't MY business model, but many big centers/VPK programs operate this way, sadly.

I am just upset seeing this normally nice, joyful, playful and happy little girl in tears every single day. Her friends here get upset that she's upset. Mom is well aware of the issues. I believe this VPK environment is not good for her. She was used to our little center that is so much more calm, home-like and WAY below state mandated ratios. I want to tell mom to pull her from over there. I don't think it's my business though. Would you all offer mom the same cheap rate for the full day again? I am pretty sure the financial aspect has something to do with her decision making process. I normally charge $195 pet week, since going to VPK half days, I dropped her rate to $100 a week

Is taking a $95 hit the right thing to do here? For the sake of this fragile and very upset little girl? WWYD???
Rates and enrollment aside, I am curious as to the above bolded part....

If she (DCG) truly dislikes VPK, then one would assume she would be thrilled at 11:30 pick up and be more than happy to be with you verses VPK...kwim?

I am NOT suggesting anything is wrong with your program but perhaps with DCG herself and/or her homelife?

Has anything else changed with her? Overall mood with you? Eating or sleeping habits? Toileting? Anything at home?

Is mom aware of her crying at VPK? Is she aware that it carried on beyond what is considered normal at drop off (even if it was only a couple times)?
Is mom aware that she remains upset even after you pick her up?
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EntropyControlSpecialist 11:56 AM 11-03-2014
Would I give a severely discounted rate for a child's benefit? Yes. I am doing so right now and I do NOT regret it at all.

I know we always say it's the parent's responsibility but sometimes the parents just cannot financially pull it off. I don't do sob stories, though, where there is begging. Usually, those are poor financial planners doing the begging and has little to do with need. Does that make any sense? Perhaps offer her a lower rate and say you will re-evaluate in 6 months? Or, do what you feel you are being led to do for now and just play it by ear.
God told me so loudly that I needed to do this (I fret about money, so it took me a week) that I couldn't ignore it.
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Sugar Magnolia 12:04 PM 11-03-2014
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Rates and enrollment aside, I am curious as to the above bolded part....

If she (DCG) truly dislikes VPK, then one would assume she would be thrilled at 11:30 pick up and be more than happy to be with you verses VPK...kwim?

I am NOT suggesting anything is wrong with your program but perhaps with DCG herself and/or her homelife?

Has anything else changed with her? Overall mood with you? Eating or sleeping habits? Toileting? Anything at home?

Is mom aware of her crying at VPK? Is she aware that it carried on beyond what is considered normal at drop off (even if it was only a couple times)?
Is mom aware that she remains upset even after you pick her up?
Just dad leaving the home. Nothing else has changed. She said she doesn't like it there, but can't explain why. The only change, besides dad, is VPK.
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Sugar Magnolia 12:07 PM 11-03-2014
Originally Posted by EntropyControlSpecialist:
Would I give a severely discounted rate for a child's benefit? Yes. I am doing so right now and I do NOT regret it at all.

I know we always say it's the parent's responsibility but sometimes the parents just cannot financially pull it off. I don't do sob stories, though, where there is begging. Usually, those are poor financial planners doing the begging and has little to do with need. Does that make any sense? Perhaps offer her a lower rate and say you will re-evaluate in 6 months? Or, do what you feel you are being led to do for now and just play it by ear.
God told me so loudly that I needed to do this (I fret about money, so it took me a week) that I couldn't ignore it.
Mom has never asked for a discount, I offered it when she enrolled in VPK. She is a proud, hard working lady, really a good mom. She is trying to make ends meet, but it's hard when dad isn't helping much.
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Blackcat31 12:10 PM 11-03-2014
Originally Posted by Sugar Magnolia:
Just dad leaving the home. Nothing else has changed. She said she doesn't like it there, but can't explain why. The only change, besides dad, is VPK.
Aw, that is so hard and sad.

4 is a tough age. I have a little gal here I;ve had since birth and she's always been witty and funny and bubbly but this last year it's almost as if she is PMS'ing as she has been overly emotional and surprisingly moody. Especially in the afternoons.

ONE thing I did notice in my case was DCG was getting a ton less sleep than she had been because at 4 mom thought she really didn't need to nap much but was getting up earlier and going to bed later thus the lack of needed sleep and that lack of needed sleep was foundational to her. I didn't realize she needed so much sleep because before she was getting it and I never thought twice about it until her mood started changing and mom and I started talking more about it.

Do you think sleep could be part of her issue with her going to VPK, the overall environment could just be emotionally draining and causing her to need more sleep.

Have you tried to have any type of one on one snuggle session to see if she'll talk to you?

Poor little one. (Glad she has you though... )
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AuntTami 02:24 PM 11-03-2014
Is she just purely overwhelmed there with all the other kids?

I'm a very quiet, reserved person, especially in large groups. If I was to get put into a new group of people and forced to participate(as I'm sure they're doing. If not forcing, at least strongly encouraging her participation) I would break down and cry too! It's not that I'm anti-social, or don't like people. I just get overwhelmed by a lot of people, and it's made worse when I have to actually interact and socialize with the people. And when I get overwhelmed, I cry. Full on, huge tears, sobbing into my pillows.

For the little ones sake, if you can financially afford to care for her more hours for not as much pay, I personally would do it. Poor kiddo. I think the suggestion of meeting in the middle at $150 sounds good. I would just talk to mom, explain what you've seen, explain that you don't this its a healthy environment emotionally for little one, and that you'd like to discuss having her brought back full time, and tell mom you're even willing to negotiate on your weekly fee to help ease the burden that putting her back into full time care would create...

Good luck! Poor kiddo
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nanglgrl 09:20 PM 11-03-2014
It could just be hitting her that dad isn't moving back in. Each day it gets more real. If his involvement has lessened over time (like it sometimes does with the parent that does not live in the main household any longer) it could explain her behavior. She has also realized that people leave and could be scared that mom could leave as well thus she frets about it and calls out for mom so she can be assured that mom isn't gone like dad. The poor little girl has had some big changes, dad left and she went off to preschool I. Think she probably needs lots of reassurance that mom isn't going anywhere and her dad still loves her. As far as a discount goes, only you can decide if that's something you're willing to do. I've done it before, I'm sure most of us have at one point or another for those children/families that have a special place in our hearts. The only thing to consider if you give a discount is how much you can give without developing any resentment.
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Elko 04:58 AM 11-04-2014
Sounds like she's attached to you, and when she sees you she just stops holding in her feelings! Like when you were little and had a bad day at school, when mom picks you up it all just comes out...

I don't own a daycare, and am a total bleeding heart, so I vote for insisting that mom pulls her out and having a frank talk about what she can afford vs what you need income-wise...
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Tags:crying, vpk
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