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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>OMG My Parent Did NOT Tell Me About Shots And Brought Them Anyway!! WWYD??!!
LaLa1923 08:49 AM 11-21-2013
I do not know what to do! I just changed my little guys diaper and he got two shots! I freaked out at first because all I saw was a hot red spot that is swollen with two red dots. I thought OMG he got bit! Then I remembered he had a doctors appointment. I know for a fact that he and his wife know my immunization policy!! I feel like I got one pulled over on me big time!!
I think I should call dad to come pick the kids up immediately and tell him they can return on Monday. This is ridiculous!
WWYD??
BTW my policy states they can return after 48 hours, so I recommend they make appointments on Fridays.
I think I should call dad to come pick the kids up immediately and tell him they can return on Monday. This is ridiculous!
WWYD??
BTW my policy states they can return after 48 hours, so I recommend they make appointments on Fridays.
Blackcat31 08:52 AM 11-21-2013
MY policy states 48 hour exclusion too
...and in the same paragraph it says disregarding this rule is grounds for termination.
If I were in your shoes, I would terminate.
If you aren't in the position to term, call for immediate pick up with a FIRM warning that what they did was UNACCEPTABLE and any future disregard of your rules/policies will equate to being terminated on the spot.
...and in the same paragraph it says disregarding this rule is grounds for termination.
If I were in your shoes, I would terminate.
If you aren't in the position to term, call for immediate pick up with a FIRM warning that what they did was UNACCEPTABLE and any future disregard of your rules/policies will equate to being terminated on the spot.
Cat Herder 08:54 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by LaLa1923:
I think I should call dad to come pick the kids up immediately and tell him they can return on Monday. This is ridiculous!
BTW my policy states they can return after 48 hours, so I recommend they make appointments on Fridays.
What would I do in your shoes?I think I should call dad to come pick the kids up immediately and tell him they can return on Monday. This is ridiculous!
BTW my policy states they can return after 48 hours, so I recommend they make appointments on Fridays.
Enforce the policy unless you plan on taking it out of your handbook today.
TwinKristi 08:55 AM 11-21-2013
I don't exclude for vaccines except live but if it's what you have previously agreed upon I would call and let them know that your illness policy excluded for vaccines.
childcaremom 09:00 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
MY policy states 48 hour exclusion too
...and in the same paragraph it says disregarding this rule is grounds for termination.
If I were in your shoes, I would terminate.
If you aren't in the position to term, call for immediate pick up with a FIRM warning that what they did was UNACCEPTABLE and any future disregard of your rules/policies will equate to being terminated on the spot.
MY policy states 48 hour exclusion too
...and in the same paragraph it says disregarding this rule is grounds for termination.
If I were in your shoes, I would terminate.
If you aren't in the position to term, call for immediate pick up with a FIRM warning that what they did was UNACCEPTABLE and any future disregard of your rules/policies will equate to being terminated on the spot.
Unregistered 09:28 AM 11-21-2013
I'm wondering why you exclude for vaccinations? I haven't heard of that before.
Blackcat31 09:31 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I'm wondering why you exclude for vaccinations? I haven't heard of that before.
I personally exclude for vaccinations because I have had the lovely experience of having a child have a seizure afterwards. I'm wondering why you exclude for vaccinations? I haven't heard of that before.
NOT a call I want to make to the parent
NOT a situation I want to explain to the other kids
NOT something I choose to deal with.
Parents can keep their child home for 48 hours afterwards.
Makes me feel less likely to have to experience that again.
If you've ever witnessed something similar you'll know what I mean.
I fully understand that we cannot 100% safeguard ourselves from everything but I will do my darnest to eliminate as much possibility as I can.
SSWonders 09:31 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I'm wondering why you exclude for vaccinations? I haven't heard of that before.
I don't exclude for vaccinations either. But if that was agreed upon, then the terms of the agreement need to be followed. I would bet that it is simple an oversight on their part, not intentionally breaking a rule.I'm wondering why you exclude for vaccinations? I haven't heard of that before.
Unregistered 09:34 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
I personally exclude for vaccinations because I have had the lovely experience of having a child have a seizure afterwards.
NOT a call I want to make to the parent
NOT a situation I want to explain to the other kids
NOT something I choose to deal with.
Parents can keep their child home for 48 hours afterwards.
Makes me feel less likely to have to experience that again.
If you've ever witnessed something similar you'll know what I mean.
I fully understand that we cannot 100% safeguard ourselves from everything but I will do my darnest to eliminate as much possibility as I can.
Omg! I don't blame you! I have been lucky that no one has had any severe side affects from them. Usually just fussy and a low grade fever.I personally exclude for vaccinations because I have had the lovely experience of having a child have a seizure afterwards.
NOT a call I want to make to the parent
NOT a situation I want to explain to the other kids
NOT something I choose to deal with.
Parents can keep their child home for 48 hours afterwards.
Makes me feel less likely to have to experience that again.
If you've ever witnessed something similar you'll know what I mean.
I fully understand that we cannot 100% safeguard ourselves from everything but I will do my darnest to eliminate as much possibility as I can.
Unregistered 09:39 AM 11-21-2013
Call them up and say: You must have to mention the baby's shots I need you to come and pick _____ up within the hour. Remember, part of my contract states that exclusions after immunizations are 48 hours so that next time, you might wish to try Fridays so you don't have to worry about child care issues in the future.
And that's that. Don't feel bad. She SIGNED your contract. She (I assume) was told at interview, and if you don't do this now, she'll do it again.
And that's that. Don't feel bad. She SIGNED your contract. She (I assume) was told at interview, and if you don't do this now, she'll do it again.
TwinKristi 10:19 AM 11-21-2013
To each their own but the risk of seizure is actually quite low, only 4 in 100,000 shots. 2-5% of children have febrile seizures which they can have just from a virus and those children are likely to have repeated seizures, 1 in 3 will. So while there is a chance of febrile seizure, it's all relatively low.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
craftymissbeth 10:29 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by TwinKristi:
To each their own but the risk of seizure is actually quite low, only 4 in 100,000 shots. 2-5% of children have febrile seizures which they can have just from a virus and those children are likely to have repeated seizures, 1 in 3 will. So while there is a chance of febrile seizure, it's all relatively low.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
But the issue isn't whether she should exclude or not... it's what should she do since her policy IS to exclude and she wasn't even made aware of the shots.To each their own but the risk of seizure is actually quite low, only 4 in 100,000 shots. 2-5% of children have febrile seizures which they can have just from a virus and those children are likely to have repeated seizures, 1 in 3 will. So while there is a chance of febrile seizure, it's all relatively low.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
OP - my policy is the same as yours. My policy is also that if a parent disregards anything in my symptom policy they're immediately terminated.
Blackcat31 10:53 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by TwinKristi:
To each their own but the risk of seizure is actually quite low, only 4 in 100,000 shots. 2-5% of children have febrile seizures which they can have just from a virus and those children are likely to have repeated seizures, 1 in 3 will. So while there is a chance of febrile seizure, it's all relatively low.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
It doesn't matter if the risk is low or not. To each their own but the risk of seizure is actually quite low, only 4 in 100,000 shots. 2-5% of children have febrile seizures which they can have just from a virus and those children are likely to have repeated seizures, 1 in 3 will. So while there is a chance of febrile seizure, it's all relatively low.
This isn't a common thing around here. I honestly don't know of anyone who excludes for immunizations except live ones IF they have kids who have pregnant parents or are really young. If I had a 6wk old baby and someone had their CP or MMR shots I would request they stayed home for 48hrs as well but not as a general practice for ALL shots.
The provider had a rule. The parent didn't follow it.
Also, even though the risk is considered low, I still had it happen. Once is enough for me.
I also do not base my policies on what anyone else in my area does or doesn't do. I base my policies on MY experiences and preferences.
childcaremom 10:58 AM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth:
But the issue isn't whether she should exclude or not... it's what should she do since her policy IS to exclude and she wasn't even made aware of the shots.
OP - my policy is the same as yours. My policy is also that if a parent disregards anything in my symptom policy they're immediately terminated.
But the issue isn't whether she should exclude or not... it's what should she do since her policy IS to exclude and she wasn't even made aware of the shots.
OP - my policy is the same as yours. My policy is also that if a parent disregards anything in my symptom policy they're immediately terminated.
Agree with this exactly.
melilley 11:52 AM 11-21-2013
I don't exclude for shots either, but do suggest for dcp's to have their children stay home after.
Either way, they broke your policy. I would call and have them pick up right away.
Either way, they broke your policy. I would call and have them pick up right away.
TwinKristi 01:23 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by TwinKristi:
I don't exclude for vaccines except live but if it's what you have previously agreed upon I would call and let them know that your illness policy excluded for vaccines.
I don't exclude for vaccines except live but if it's what you have previously agreed upon I would call and let them know that your illness policy excluded for vaccines.
Originally Posted by craftymissbeth:
But the issue isn't whether she should exclude or not... it's what should she do since her policy IS to exclude and she wasn't even made aware of the shots.
OP - my policy is the same as yours. My policy is also that if a parent disregards anything in my symptom policy they're immediately terminated.
But the issue isn't whether she should exclude or not... it's what should she do since her policy IS to exclude and she wasn't even made aware of the shots.
OP - my policy is the same as yours. My policy is also that if a parent disregards anything in my symptom policy they're immediately terminated.
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
It doesn't matter if the risk is low or not.
The provider had a rule. The parent didn't follow it.
Also, even though the risk is considered low, I still had it happen. Once is enough for me.
I also do not base my policies on what anyone else in my area does or doesn't do. I base my policies on MY experiences and preferences.
Note my first comment in post #4, I completely understand and agree she should stand by her policy but I don't want newer providers to think "OMG I should do this too for the seizure risk!" Or something. This isn't the "norm" in my area. I honestly don't know anyone who excludes for vaccines. It's been discussed before and I had the same stance. Obviously this parent either forgot or didn't know what they meant. I don't know! But I wouldn't be slamming the term hammer down over it personally because to "me" it's not a big deal that I exclude for, obviously that's not the case with OP. I think there are other things that should be excluded for before shots but that's simply my opinion. The chances of a child having a seizure in your home is really in the 2-5% range period due to febrile seizures. Kids can be running around fine all morning and spike a fever during nap. Give parents 30 mins to get to your home and you're opening yourself up to the liability there. Parents work an hour away in the city and you have a worse situation. But we're more worried about recovery, comfort and contagiousness not seizures.It doesn't matter if the risk is low or not.
The provider had a rule. The parent didn't follow it.
Also, even though the risk is considered low, I still had it happen. Once is enough for me.
I also do not base my policies on what anyone else in my area does or doesn't do. I base my policies on MY experiences and preferences.
daycare 01:27 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
It doesn't matter if the risk is low or not.
The provider had a rule. The parent didn't follow it.
Also, even though the risk is considered low, I still had it happen. Once is enough for me.
I also do not base my policies on what anyone else in my area does or doesn't do. I base my policies on MY experiences and preferences.
I am on the same page as BC. Things Can happen and in my eyes when the parents increase those risks, they need to do it on their time, not mine.It doesn't matter if the risk is low or not.
The provider had a rule. The parent didn't follow it.
Also, even though the risk is considered low, I still had it happen. Once is enough for me.
I also do not base my policies on what anyone else in my area does or doesn't do. I base my policies on MY experiences and preferences.
I also require 24 hour exclusion and recommend that they be done on a Friday so that no one misses work or care during the recovery time.
Meeko 01:33 PM 11-21-2013
Excluding/not excluding for shots is irrelevant. What's in the contract is.
If a provider has it in her contract that she excludes for a week and charges a $1000 fine for blinking while wearing blue and the parent SIGNS IT.....then it stands.
That's all that matters. Follow the contract.
If a provider has it in her contract that she excludes for a week and charges a $1000 fine for blinking while wearing blue and the parent SIGNS IT.....then it stands.
That's all that matters. Follow the contract.
daycare 01:36 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Meeko:
Excluding/not excluding for shots is irrelevant. What's in the contract is.
If a provider has it in her contract that she excludes for a week and charges a $1000 fine for blinking while wearing blue and the parent SIGNS IT.....then it stands.
That's all that matters. Follow the contract.
You made me spit water on my screen. that is so funny and true at the same time. Excluding/not excluding for shots is irrelevant. What's in the contract is.
If a provider has it in her contract that she excludes for a week and charges a $1000 fine for blinking while wearing blue and the parent SIGNS IT.....then it stands.
That's all that matters. Follow the contract.
I would do as others stated, call for pick up. I would explain that per our policies, _______________________so xxx can come back on Monday. Please understand that I am bypassing this policy this time with a warning, next time I will terminate.
MarinaVanessa 02:03 PM 11-21-2013
I'd be calling the parent asap and giving them a written warning if they fessed up.
I'd love to call and say something like this ...
"Hi Susan, you need to come get little Johny right away! He has a big red hot spot on his thigh and it seems to be very painful. He cringes every time I touch it. You need to take him to the Dr.'s right away to have it checked out! I'll need a note with a diagnosis! Come get him immediately!!"
Maybe she'd fess up, if not I'd require her to bring me a Dr's note before letting him back in. For me this would be grounds for termination. Policies are policies, if you don't agree with a policy ... DON'T SIGN THEM AND KEEP LOOKING!
I'd love to call and say something like this ...
"Hi Susan, you need to come get little Johny right away! He has a big red hot spot on his thigh and it seems to be very painful. He cringes every time I touch it. You need to take him to the Dr.'s right away to have it checked out! I'll need a note with a diagnosis! Come get him immediately!!"
Maybe she'd fess up, if not I'd require her to bring me a Dr's note before letting him back in. For me this would be grounds for termination. Policies are policies, if you don't agree with a policy ... DON'T SIGN THEM AND KEEP LOOKING!
Michelle 02:32 PM 11-21-2013
What is the difference between a "live" immunization and regular immunization?
I have had all of my kids immunized and never heard this term.
Are you talking about a live polio by mouth immunization?
I didn't think they did that anymore.
It is included in a shot now.
What's a live immunization?
I have had all of my kids immunized and never heard this term.
Are you talking about a live polio by mouth immunization?
I didn't think they did that anymore.
It is included in a shot now.
What's a live immunization?
LaLa1923 02:37 PM 11-21-2013
I exclude for shots just like I exclude for "medication". I think these are along the lines of the same thing.
For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
I'm not saying that one way or another is wrong. Just another prospective.
It's something that goes into their bodies.....I need the parent home with them to make sure there are no reactions.
For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
I'm not saying that one way or another is wrong. Just another prospective.
It's something that goes into their bodies.....I need the parent home with them to make sure there are no reactions.
Blackcat31 02:38 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by LaLa1923:
I exclude for shots just like I exclude for "medication". I think these are along the lines of the same thing.
For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
I'm not saying that one way or another is wrong. Just another prospective.
It's something that goes into their bodies.....I need the parent home with them to make sure there are no reactions.
What's the update to your original issue? I exclude for shots just like I exclude for "medication". I think these are along the lines of the same thing.
For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
I'm not saying that one way or another is wrong. Just another prospective.
It's something that goes into their bodies.....I need the parent home with them to make sure there are no reactions.
Did you call or just let it go?
BrooklynM 02:43 PM 11-21-2013
I'm a big believer in open, simple communication. I would just call DCM and say- hey Sally, I noticed Billy's legs had a couple of marks on them. Did he happen to get any shots at his doctor's appointment? Oh he did? Oh, I'm so sorry, I try to make it very clear in the contract to let parents know to always get shots on Fridays because I can't take them after they have had their shots. When something foreign goes into their bodies, I just can't take the risk of a reaction. Unfortunately you will need to come pick up Billy and he cannot come back until Monday.
I always give people the benefit of the doubt and never come AT them if I can avoid it. It usually makes for smaller or no waves.
I always give people the benefit of the doubt and never come AT them if I can avoid it. It usually makes for smaller or no waves.
LaLa1923 02:55 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
What's the update to your original issue?
Did you call or just let it go?
I called Mom at work, I asked "Did DCB get shots yesterday!?".....then a moment of silence.........I then say "I was pretty freaked out when I saw his leg is red and puffy with two red dots." What's the update to your original issue?
Did you call or just let it go?
Mom then says "Um... I'm not sure, you are gonna have to call DCD."
So I hang up and then call DCD
I say the same thing to him that I said to mom.
He says, "Oh, um yes. I was leaving the doctors yesterday when they said he was due for two shots so we ran back in and he got them. I totally forgot to tell you, I'm so sorry. He wasn't supposed to get shots that day".
I then say, "You know my policy, they are to be excluded for 48 hours. It's one thing that he got shots, but another that you didn't tell me. It's something that went into his body, and if something were to happen while he was here I wouldn't have any idea why. What would I tell 911 when I call?"
He said he was very sorry, he wasn't trying to hide the fact that DCB got shots. He said it will never happen again.
I told him I would have to think about what is going to happen for breaking one of my policies, and that I would have to think about it and get back to him. I told him I am not happy at all.
Mom came to get the kids later and said she was sorry and that it will never happen again. She said from now on she will take off work and stay home when they get shots.
She said they are still trying to learn all of my policies.
(they started in middle of September, and they came from another provider)
Cat Herder 02:56 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by LaLa1923:
For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
.
For me, personally, I know how to monitor for reactions and treat seizures or anaphylactic shock until EMS arrives to transport. Few of my clients do. I keep my emergency transport permission forms updated and go with the flow.. For those providers that exclude for 24 hrs when a child is on medication, why not for shots too?
.
It is simply what you are comfortable with, you don't have to do anything that scares you.
nannyde 05:54 PM 11-21-2013
Originally Posted by Cat Herder:
For me, personally, I know how to monitor for reactions and treat seizures or anaphylactic shock until EMS arrives to transport. Few of my clients do. I keep my emergency transport permission forms updated and go with the flow..
It is simply what you are comfortable with, you don't have to do anything that scares you.
I don't exclude for shots but I do understand the fear. I ask parents to do them on their last day of the week. For me, personally, I know how to monitor for reactions and treat seizures or anaphylactic shock until EMS arrives to transport. Few of my clients do. I keep my emergency transport permission forms updated and go with the flow..
It is simply what you are comfortable with, you don't have to do anything that scares you.
I don't like kids being here on advil or Tylenol.
cheerfuldom 06:21 AM 11-22-2013
Originally Posted by nannyde:
I don't exclude for shots but I do understand the fear. I ask parents to do them on their last day of the week.
I don't like kids being here on advil or Tylenol.
same hereI don't exclude for shots but I do understand the fear. I ask parents to do them on their last day of the week.
I don't like kids being here on advil or Tylenol.
MarinaVanessa 07:13 AM 11-22-2013
I don't take medicated kids unless for serious medical issues and I don't administer medications and I exclude for vaccinations.
I personally don't want to be in BC's situation if anything went wrong and I don't have the experience or the confidence to handle a situation like that if I can avoid it.
The children are usually grouchy for me after getting shots anyway and like when they are sick, should be home and comfortable where an adult can care for them better than I can at daycare (I can't do that much one-on-one). Usually shots are in the legs on the upper thigh and if they're diapered it's a sore spot to avoid and if they're squirmers it's just hard to to that. If they're babies they're hard to hold because the shots are where I place my hands when I hold them. Even if they are in the arm it's hard not to be bumped.
Also I've had some clients use the "some kids get a fever after vaccines" excuse to sneak they're sick kids into daycare by saying that they're kids got shots so I had to start excluding for vaccines also. I had my suspicions after some of the other daycare kids got sick after "someone got a shot" and I noticed that someone was getting a lot of shots (parent's said that they were breaking up the shots individually and didn't want the "cocktails" that had two or more shots in it, they were good at the excuses and very convincing) but didn't confirm it until I updated the immunization records and the days that they "got shots" weren't on the card.
I also exclude because fevers are common after shots and I personally don't know why the child has a fever so I just exclude for fevers period, no matter what reason. The only shot I don't exclude for is the flu shot but if they get a fever, they do stay home anyway.
Not saying that everyone should exclude, just giving my reasons as to why I do what I do for those that wonder why others exclude.
I personally don't want to be in BC's situation if anything went wrong and I don't have the experience or the confidence to handle a situation like that if I can avoid it.
The children are usually grouchy for me after getting shots anyway and like when they are sick, should be home and comfortable where an adult can care for them better than I can at daycare (I can't do that much one-on-one). Usually shots are in the legs on the upper thigh and if they're diapered it's a sore spot to avoid and if they're squirmers it's just hard to to that. If they're babies they're hard to hold because the shots are where I place my hands when I hold them. Even if they are in the arm it's hard not to be bumped.
Also I've had some clients use the "some kids get a fever after vaccines" excuse to sneak they're sick kids into daycare by saying that they're kids got shots so I had to start excluding for vaccines also. I had my suspicions after some of the other daycare kids got sick after "someone got a shot" and I noticed that someone was getting a lot of shots (parent's said that they were breaking up the shots individually and didn't want the "cocktails" that had two or more shots in it, they were good at the excuses and very convincing) but didn't confirm it until I updated the immunization records and the days that they "got shots" weren't on the card.
I also exclude because fevers are common after shots and I personally don't know why the child has a fever so I just exclude for fevers period, no matter what reason. The only shot I don't exclude for is the flu shot but if they get a fever, they do stay home anyway.
Not saying that everyone should exclude, just giving my reasons as to why I do what I do for those that wonder why others exclude.
crazydaycarelady 07:25 AM 11-22-2013
I don't exclude for vaccinations either. I have a 1yo here today that got 6 shots yesterday at his 1yr check-up, never had any problems with after effects.