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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Summer Vacations, Holidays?
PitterPatter 05:08 PM 04-06-2011
Do any of u take summer vacations, Christmas vaca. etc off?

For those of u who do take Vacation, do the parents find their own back up provider for that time?

I just found out today I am required to provide my state paid clients with back up care for ANY time I take off including summer vacations and hoildays etc. I always knew I had to supply an alternate for illness in my home or appointments, classes etc. I have always thought it was up to the client for scheduled days I take off in my contract but nope. I told the state supervisor that all of the clients have all signed my contract that states they are to find their own back up care for vaca and hoildays. She told me " it doesn't matter the contract u have with us trumps your contract with them. If u want to do that with private paying clients that's fine but when u accept state paid clients through us then it is up to u to provide for them if u want a day off. It's not fair to the parents to have to worry about finding a provider." What the heck? If they paid on their own and went to a center or other providers they would have to find their own for any closed days. Also centers get paid for holidays off even. I get nothing and now am required to supply a provider or I can't have a day off. What a bummer the rest of my day was. Now I may not be able to take any more Holidays or vacation.
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SandeeAR 05:23 PM 04-06-2011
I would no longer be taking state pay clients. I would get out of it. That is why I'm unlicensened by choice. I don't want the government telling me how to live my life.
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cheerfuldom 05:55 PM 04-06-2011
I have never heard of this before. Did she give you anything in writing outlining that requirement? I don't take state pay because while I have heard my state is not as difficult as others, I have no desire to make my job harder than it already is. I have not had a problem finding private pay clients and find that the state pay clients asking about my daycare are people I wouldn't want to work with anyway. I am sorry if that comes off bad but I find that most of the people that are paying by state pay ask for a million exceptions to my policies, mostly involving not having to pay for anything whatsoever (including their own childs supplies) or having crazy amount of daycare hours and options available.
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PitterPatter 06:14 PM 04-06-2011
Originally Posted by cheerfuldom:
I have never heard of this before. Did she give you anything in writing outlining that requirement? I don't take state pay because while I have heard my state is not as difficult as others, I have no desire to make my job harder than it already is. I have not had a problem finding private pay clients and find that the state pay clients asking about my daycare are people I wouldn't want to work with anyway. I am sorry if that comes off bad but I find that most of the people that are paying by state pay ask for a million exceptions to my policies, mostly involving not having to pay for anything whatsoever (including their own childs supplies) or having crazy amount of daycare hours and options available.
Yes she is mailing me a copy of the policy. I tried to take 1 day for Easter and a DCM is raising a stink saying no one wants to watch her kid and she's tired of her family saying how bad he is so she will need to bring him to me. She heard I am required to take him in even on a holiday. I thought oh yeah we will see. I called in and asked my general supervisor and she wasn't sure but thought that it was required also, even if on a hoilday. She called the big boss and they both conference called me with forms in hand. I was very unhappy and venting because I already do so much for these parents that isn't even required like giving a couple bags of groceries here and there so some kids can have food. The state only charges parents a very small amount. Current client gets at least $1,800 every month and only pays $2.00 a day for care! What a crock of S***! I just find it very unfair for the state to put it all on the providers plate. We don't get any bonuses either. 1 of her examples to me was Christmas. If I can't find a back up for Christmas and a parent works that day I am screwed and will have to have the child for a lousy $20 and allow him to attend our Christmas dinner etc. Show me 1 person that will work for $2.00 an hour on Christmas? I guess me now.
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Unregistered 06:46 PM 04-06-2011
Wow that's ridiculous! There is no way I'd take state paid ppl. I cannot believe the difference. I get paid holidays through the state which can be up to 14 days, my choice. If I require private pay to pay me on my vacations the state would pay me too, which I do not require. I only require payment of holidays.
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Mandy_Jane 11:23 PM 04-06-2011
Tygerluv, you don't have to work for $2.00 an hour on Christmas. You will only do so, if you CHOOSE to do so. I would drop all state pay children if what you are saying actually turns out to be true. That is beyond absurd that they would or could force you to not ever take a day off. Surely there is some kind of mis-communication going on here somewhere. I know firsthand, that states have some pretty insane rules and laws, so this may actually be true. You can find a replacement if you lose your state pay kids. I certainly would not want to be forced to work on a holiday like Christmas. I just plain wouldn't do it. No way. I NEED to have my days off for my own mental health and for my family's well being. You need to make the choice for yourself as to what's more important for you and your family.
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PitterPatter 03:23 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Mandy_Jane:
Tygerluv, you don't have to work for $2.00 an hour on Christmas. You will only do so, if you CHOOSE to do so. I would drop all state pay children if what you are saying actually turns out to be true. That is beyond absurd that they would or could force you to not ever take a day off. Surely there is some kind of mis-communication going on here somewhere. I know firsthand, that states have some pretty insane rules and laws, so this may actually be true. You can find a replacement if you lose your state pay kids. I certainly would not want to be forced to work on a holiday like Christmas. I just plain wouldn't do it. No way. I NEED to have my days off for my own mental health and for my family's well being. You need to make the choice for yourself as to what's more important for you and your family.
Oh I am allowed to take any holiday off I want as well as a vacation but I it's on me to find a back up provider for these people. THAT is my problem. I can't find anyone and I feel I shouldn't be expected to. I have 1 for the day I wanted this Easter now but no one will want to take kids to family dinners on Christmas and Thanksgiving. I know most people can get those days off but some of mine can't. The past 5 years I just had in my contract that they were responsible for finding their own care for vaca and holidays as they have literally a years notice usually because they know from the day they enroll. State says that's not fair to them. I tried to stand up for my rights too but she said it's my option I can leave the program if I like.

I only have state paid clients but not by choice. I accept everyone (as long as the people seem ok that is) It's rare for me to have a private paying client. Especially with parents being able to make literally thousands a month and still receive almost free care through the state. THAT is what really gets me. If they changed it I would have more private pay but they hand out free child care lvery easily around here.

No miscommunication unfortuanatley, I flat out asked "and what about special holidays like Christmas and Thanksgiving that's not fair to ME and MY FAMILY." That's when she told me Christmas too. She also told me it was my choice to sign up to accept state paying clients and if I feel it is unfair it is my choice to quit at any time. Seems fair that I have the option, IF they hadn't raised the bar so high by allowing just about anyone free child care. So I have to stay and accept the terms. The income guidelines is just a joke! A family of 4 (my new family) is permitted to make $3,400 and still only pay $2.50 per day for care. So no wonder there are no private paying clients. Why pay when u can get it for free and have the state pay. AND LEGALLY!

Thank u everyone for the help and advise I would REALLY love to drop the state I just can't as I have no choice.
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countrymom 05:09 AM 04-07-2011
um isnt it law that you have to be closed. I would either drop them, or look further into this. So if the daycare office is closed for christmas then why are you open. Why do you have to provide back up, i would hand her a list of numbers (including teenagers) and then its up to her whether or not she wants to use the back ups that she provided, you did your job, just because they don't want him is not your responsibility.
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boysx5 05:26 AM 04-07-2011
nobody tells me when I take my vacations I take two weeks off every summer when my kids are off and any other days within reason. I give plenty of notice and they find there own back up care
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Meeko 05:27 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Tygerluv:
Yes she is mailing me a copy of the policy. I tried to take 1 day for Easter and a DCM is raising a stink saying no one wants to watch her kid and she's tired of her family saying how bad he is so she will need to bring him to me. She heard I am required to take him in even on a holiday. I thought oh yeah we will see. I called in and asked my general supervisor and she wasn't sure but thought that it was required also, even if on a hoilday. She called the big boss and they both conference called me with forms in hand. I was very unhappy and venting because I already do so much for these parents that isn't even required like giving a couple bags of groceries here and there so some kids can have food. The state only charges parents a very small amount. Current client gets at least $1,800 every month and only pays $2.00 a day for care! What a crock of S***! I just find it very unfair for the state to put it all on the providers plate. We don't get any bonuses either. 1 of her examples to me was Christmas. If I can't find a back up for Christmas and a parent works that day I am screwed and will have to have the child for a lousy $20 and allow him to attend our Christmas dinner etc. Show me 1 person that will work for $2.00 an hour on Christmas? I guess me now.
I would try and rally other providers together and get that changed.

It is quite frankly obscene that you are required to do so much for the state parents. Required to tend kids on Christmas??? I know darn well, that you will end up with partiers, who dump their kids on you and love the fact they can party the day away with friends. Contact sympathetic local newspapers and see what the general public think of you all being forced to watched welfare kids over Christmas. Any state hates embarrassment.

I hate to sound bad, but may of these state moms (not all) are irresponsible girls who have 2 or 3 kids (or more) with various just as irresponsible men and then expect the state to take care of them for the rest of their lives.

Providers here in Utah "revolved" some years back. We were tired of being paid after care had already been given. We were tired of reams of paperwork. The parents used to have to go to an ATM or bank and get CASH off their welfare cards to pay the provider. Well guess how many providers didn't get paid because parents suddenly saw a bunch of cash in their hand and thought it was OK to spend it and tell the provider they didn't get it, or that they had to pay their rent etc etc. I ran into this a few times. I told them it was mis-appropriation of government funds and a felony and that I would report them if I didn't get my money ASAP. I got it....but it wasn't worth the hassle.

After the state were forced to listen us providers, the whole system was changed. The parents don't even see the money. It's put on their cards, but they can't touch it. Providers punch in a code and it gets transferred to our banks automatically. And we get paid in advance, just like self parents have to. And we get paid even if we take vacation, holidays etc. If the parent is a pain and we can them...we can keep however much money we need for notice etc.

Your state is being so unreasonable. They are pandering to the welfare parents. If they decide to have kids, they have to take SOME responsibility for them! Good grief!
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momma2girls 05:31 AM 04-07-2011
I stopped taking state children about 5 yrs. ago. It totally was not near worth everything to me!!!! Plus I only received $14.00 per day, per child!! I charged $25.00 per day, per child. I tried to have her pay the difference, but I found out this is illegal!!
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Lilbutterflie 05:34 AM 04-07-2011
Have you called your licensing office and spoken to them about what the state told you? Maybe there is something in the licensing rules about being required to be closed on major holidays (like Christmas and Thanksgiving) or something?

I can maybe understand the state requiring that you provide backup care for the vacation that you take, but I think it's absolutely ABSURD that they would require you to provide backup care for holidays.

Have you spoken to any other daycare providers who accept state clients about this? Do they KNOW about this? If you can get the word out and meet other daycare providers with state clients you can all do one of two things:

1- Terminate all state clients and make it CLEAR why you are doing so and ask them to take it up with the state and file complaints. Pretty soon the state is going to get some angry phone calls from parents asking them to drop that rule. What does the state think is more FAIR; providing a wide selection of daycare providers who are willing to take state pay OR providing very few daycare providers and allowing state clients options for holiday care?
2- Work with the rest of the daycare providers in maybe doing a rotation on holidays. Say you find 5 other providers who take state clients, and use each other as backups on holidays on a rotation. Who cares if the provider is one hour away? You are still providing backup!

The other option is to ADVERTISE ADVERTISE ADVERTISE and drop one family at a time as you get new clients that are not state paid.

So sorry you are dealing with this. I too am not licensed for exactly things like this.
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Unregistered 07:48 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Tygerluv:
It's not fair to the parents to have to worry about finding a provider."
Sure. They don't have the responsibility of paying you, why should they have to find a backup? Sheesh.
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PitterPatter 07:49 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Meeko60:
I would try and rally other providers together and get that changed.

It is quite frankly obscene that you are required to do so much for the state parents. Required to tend kids on Christmas??? I know darn well, that you will end up with partiers, who dump their kids on you and love the fact they can party the day away with friends. !
Well there is a catch for the parents too as far as that goes. They are only permitted to bring them to care during work or school hours. So come Christmas many places close but some remain open, fast food, groceries etc. If a parent is required to work then I have to make sure she has care if not me then I supply someone else a friend a fellow provider etc then I pay them. The DCM will sign in on my sheet for that day and the state will pay me. I then pay the person I sent her to in return.

Some DCMs dont actually go to work every day it's just a matter of busting them. 1 Parent was busted at an amusment park 3 years ago nice huh.

To reply to someone else who mention the daycare office being closed. The daycare office they go through CCRC and Dept of welafre close on many holidays. Just because they are closed doesn't make a difference. As I said I am permitted to close BUT I am the required to have a provider for the parents to go to.
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PitterPatter 07:53 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by momma2girls:
I stopped taking state children about 5 yrs. ago. It totally was not near worth everything to me!!!! Plus I only received $14.00 per day, per child!! I charged $25.00 per day, per child. I tried to have her pay the difference, but I found out this is illegal!!
I get $20 per day for preschool and under. It turns to $15 per day for school aged up to the age of 12. Yep same here, I cannot charge anything else. The state did recently allow for late payment fees and late pick up fees though but they can't be much.

I also get NO pay upfront. At the end of the month I send in my sign in sheets and the state tallies up the days and makes a deposit in my bank for those days.
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Blackcat31 07:53 AM 04-07-2011
Umm, yeah, I'd be dropping all my state assistance families if that was a rule here......what is next? Find them jobs too if they lose theirs? Bring their children to the doctor when they are sick? Get their grocery shopping and house cleaning done too?

NO WAY would I agree to be responsible for find back up care for someone!! Does the state find clients for you when a state paid family no shows or quits coming?!?!?
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PitterPatter 07:59 AM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Lilbutterflie:
I can maybe understand the state requiring that you provide backup care for the vacation that you take, but I think it's absolutely ABSURD that they would require you to provide backup care for holidays.

Have you spoken to any other daycare providers who accept state clients about this? Do they KNOW about this? If you can get the word out and meet other daycare providers with state clients you can all do one of two things:

.
I know it's crazy but when she said holidays as well I pointed out Christmas thinking no way can they include that but she did. She kept telling me I can choose to leave at any time. There are soo many providers around here it's sickening! I actually had a client leave my care to become a provider. That stinks!

I am asking around to see if anyone else is aware of this. I only know 2 providers well enough to call them. The 1 is who I am using as a back up and she is aware of the rules. I aske her what she does for holidays. She said she takes kids whenever needed she doesn't mind it's just her and her husband. The other provider is retiring in a couple months. I emailed her last night and asked if she was aware of it and she hasn't replied yet.

I told my new back up that I want to start asking around because if we all ban together maybe they will change the rules. She said count her out she won't rock the boat because the state will just dump u.
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squareone 12:49 PM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Tygerluv:
The 1 is who I am using as a back up and she is aware of the rules. I aske her what she does for holidays. She said she takes kids whenever needed she doesn't mind it's just her and her husband.
Well then hopefully she can be your backup on Christmas Day too!

Is it just this one mom that doesn't have anyone (that wants) to watch her kid? Or do you have other parents that work on most major holidays that truly need you to be open? If so, you could just drop that one client and keep the rest.
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PitterPatter 04:27 PM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Umm, yeah, I'd be dropping all my state assistance families if that was a rule here......what is next? Find them jobs too if they lose theirs? Bring their children to the doctor when they are sick? Get their grocery shopping and house cleaning done too?

NO WAY would I agree to be responsible for find back up care for someone!! Does the state find clients for you when a state paid family no shows or quits coming?!?!?
OMG YES!! Actually not required but I was asked to take him to the Dr for her by the state monitor.

I had a 2 yr old child who would come in with bites on him more and more and they were in a small cluster then trailed down his back or down his neck etc where ever he had been bit that night. YES NIGHT! My 1st thought was bedbugs but the Mom insisted they were spider bites but she claims to not have any. This went on almost ever day new bites for 3 weeks and she wasn't taking him to the Dr as I suggested.

I got so worried they were bedbugs I called my state monitor and asked him if I could deny care until she had him checked because if they are bedbugs and I get them in my home I will have to close down and the other families could be at risk too. He asked why she hadn't taken him to the Dr and I told him she claims to not have the time. She works until 6:00pm m-f. BUT she had a day off during this time and didn't take him so there was no excuse!

His response to me was "well can't you take him to the Dr for her?" OMG!! I said well no not really I do have other kids to attend to. He then suggested calling in a backup provider so that I can take him to the Dr for her! He reminded me that children come 1st and we take an oath to protect them. Such BS! I told him I would see what I could do. When the Mom picked him up that night I told her she had to have him checked because with so many bites and not knowing what it is and if it is a spider as she claimed it could harm him maybe be slowly poisoning him. She took him to the ER that night and text me to complain that she was still waiting 2 hours later and she will never take him to the ER again!
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PitterPatter 04:34 PM 04-07-2011
Originally Posted by squareone:
Well then hopefully she can be your backup on Christmas Day too!

Is it just this one mom that doesn't have anyone (that wants) to watch her kid? Or do you have other parents that work on most major holidays that truly need you to be open? If so, you could just drop that one client and keep the rest.
Well thing is state paid clients seem to come and go. They quit jobs, quit school, get fired etc. A percentagoe of them anyway. I'm not saying all state paid clients have issues but a lot do.

As of now I have 3 kids that the parents claim to have no one. My back up for now is only permitted to have 4 kids in care and she already has 2 so if all 3 kids need care on Christmas then I still have to find another back up even if she is willing to take them on Christmas because she can only take 2 of them (if hers are there that is). I don't know what everyones schedule will be come Christmas that was just the major holiday that popped in my head so I asked her about it.
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