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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Hmm...I Think I Smell a Lie (Vent)
KIDZRMYBIZ 07:07 AM 11-14-2014
I had a check from a new DCF bounce. I emailed them last night, told them they must bring cash for the amount plus returned check fee this morning, and if payment was not made this morning my late fees would begin adding to it.

DCM emails back and said oops, I accidentally wrote your check from my old account and thought it was weird you hadn't cashed it yet. Riiiiiiiiiiight. It's the same account she wrote the previous checks from, aaaaaaaaaand she wrote this particular bounced check to my business name, which I had to email her to bring me a new one written out to my first and last name (this is in my contract) at pick-up. At pick-up DCM told me it was the last check from the book and she was waiting for her new order to come in. The number on the check was not an ending book number, but instead of calling her a liar I told her to add my name to the check and initial it. Why would you order checks for an account you closed? One of them is a lie.

I have had 2 previous payment problems with them, and I think there is going to be many more to come. These things amount to annoying inconveniences because we are not paycheck-to-paycheck, but would be major problems if our money were tighter. It's just really disrespectful, and I want to tell them I wasn't born yesterday.

DCM told me in this in an email sending an invoice for a late payment fee:

Just so you know, I may forget things from time to time. I manage a lot of different people and things and once in a while I will forget something in the moment. However, I will never cause any problems paying a late fee. I understand that there are consequences to forgetting to leave the money at drop off.

Okay, well, but I still have to send an invoice so she can't say she forgot or didn't know how much or some other excuse. And I don't want the late fees, I want her to follow policy. What a piece of work.
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NeedaVaca 07:15 AM 11-14-2014
Cash only, no pay no stay & late fees. Then she won't "forget"
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Baby Beluga 07:32 AM 11-14-2014
Originally Posted by KIDZRMYBIZ:
I had a check from a new DCF bounce. I emailed them last night, told them they must bring cash for the amount plus returned check fee this morning, and if payment was not made this morning my late fees would begin adding to it.

DCM emails back and said oops, I accidentally wrote your check from my old account and thought it was weird you hadn't cashed it yet. Riiiiiiiiiiight. It's the same account she wrote the previous checks from, aaaaaaaaaand she wrote this particular bounced check to my business name, which I had to email her to bring me a new one written out to my first and last name (this is in my contract) at pick-up. At pick-up DCM told me it was the last check from the book and she was waiting for her new order to come in. The number on the check was not an ending book number, but instead of calling her a liar I told her to add my name to the check and initial it. Why would you order checks for an account you closed? One of them is a lie.

I have had 2 previous payment problems with them, and I think there is going to be many more to come. These things amount to annoying inconveniences because we are not paycheck-to-paycheck, but would be major problems if our money were tighter. It's just really disrespectful, and I want to tell them I wasn't born yesterday.

DCM told me in this in an email sending an invoice for a late payment fee:

Just so you know, I may forget things from time to time. I manage a lot of different people and things and once in a while I will forget something in the moment.
However, I will never cause any problems paying a late fee. I understand that there are consequences to forgetting to leave the money at drop off.

Okay, well, but I still have to send an invoice so she can't say she forgot or didn't know how much or some other excuse. And I don't want the late fees, I want her to follow policy. What a piece of work.
Yes...because you yourself have no idea what it is like to manage different people do you? Wonder how mom would feel if you said to her "opps, sorry I have to manage the behavior of so many little people that I forgot to feed/change/whatever her child.
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craftymissbeth 07:54 AM 11-14-2014
DCM, if you would like, I can email you a couple of links that show how to set up an alarm/notification on your cell phone.

In this day of technology there is absolutely no excuse.
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CraftyMom 07:59 AM 11-14-2014
So she's covering her butt because she wants to pull the "I forgot" bull in the future. Then she can say "I warned you I forget sometimes"

I would answer back with letting her know that's fine if she forgets, but as soon as she forgets she will taking her child to work until she remembers
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CraftyMom 08:00 AM 11-14-2014
Originally Posted by Baby Beluga:
Yes...because you yourself have no idea what it is like to manage different people do you? Wonder how mom would feel if you said to her "opps, sorry I have to manage the behavior of so many little people that I forgot to feed/change/whatever her child.


You manage multiple children, multiple parents, multiple meals, multiple changing of diapers, multiple.........

Nice excuse mom!
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BumbleBee 10:35 AM 11-14-2014
Originally Posted by Baby Beluga:
Yes...because you yourself have no idea what it is like to manage different people do you? Wonder how mom would feel if you said to her "opps, sorry I have to manage the behavior of so many little people that I forgot to feed/change/whatever her child.
Or 'oops, I forgot that dcb was scheduled to come today. I don't have room for him today.'

I only had to do it once...
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melilley 10:40 AM 11-14-2014
Originally Posted by Trummynme:
Or 'oops, I forgot that dcb was scheduled to come today. I don't have room for him today.'

I only had to do it once...
That is genius!
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melilley 10:49 AM 11-14-2014
I have a family like this too. They bounced a check once and their excuse was that dcm's work messed up her check...yeah right Or they forgot the check book, or my favorite: I had to pay the mortgage so I'll pay you tomorrow and I'll write a check for two weeks-if you wait until Friday to cash it-like that's a big benefit for me, NO!

Like you op, we won't miss paying a bill or go without if they don't pay on time, but it's the principle!
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Rockgirl 10:54 AM 11-14-2014
A provider friend once had a dcm tell her she'd pay her late, because she had bills to pay! Provider said, "I'm one of them!"
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EntropyControlSpecialist 11:09 AM 11-14-2014
No pay, no stay and late fee gets bigger each day.
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finsup 11:17 AM 11-14-2014
I had a family do this too...they "forgot" the check, then wanted to date it for a later date and then when it bounced it was because someone had "emptied out her account." I told them from here on out I would accept cash only. Guess who decided not to come back? Can't say I was too unhappy about that one! lol.
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daycarediva 11:27 AM 11-14-2014
After one bounced check, the family is cash only. It's in my contract.
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blueskiesbutterflies 09:24 AM 11-17-2014
I posted for help but have not got a response...My situation is kind of like yours but, full of LIE and LIE..

Ive got a daycare client who has been with me for a few months. Dad has drifted in and out of work and from what I hear he is not working right now. The family was evicted from their home last week and now live with gma. I knew it was coming...nonpayment but I did not know when. This morning at drop off they wrote me a check knowing good and well they did not have any money in their account. I called mom and told her that the check was rejected and she needed to come pick up the child ASAP. She took everything out of his cubby too. I have been looking to get rid of this child due to behavior issues and afraid of him hurting other kids. Here lately he has been out of control. I sent an email stating that if payment is not paid by 6:00pm today (at closing) he is terminated due to my policy and contract. Of course, I know they are not going to pay. How long do you give your clients before you dismiss? I require payment in advance and I have a strict no pay no play policy...If she does not come up with the money at 6:00 and I do not let him reenter do they still owe the money for the week even though I dismissed? I am confused!!!
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taylorw1210 09:32 AM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by blueskiesbutterflies:
I posted for help but have not got a response...My situation is kind of like yours but, full of LIE and LIE..

Ive got a daycare client who has been with me for a few months. Dad has drifted in and out of work and from what I hear he is not working right now. The family was evicted from their home last week and now live with gma. I knew it was coming...nonpayment but I did not know when. This morning at drop off they wrote me a check knowing good and well they did not have any money in their account. I called mom and told her that the check was rejected and she needed to come pick up the child ASAP. She took everything out of his cubby too. I have been looking to get rid of this child due to behavior issues and afraid of him hurting other kids. Here lately he has been out of control. I sent an email stating that if payment is not paid by 6:00pm today (at closing) he is terminated due to my policy and contract. Of course, I know they are not going to pay. How long do you give your clients before you dismiss? I require payment in advance and I have a strict no pay no play policy...If she does not come up with the money at 6:00 and I do not let him reenter do they still owe the money for the week even though I dismissed? I am confused!!!
I have been in a similar situation and while what I did will probably not be the popular answer, I just let it be (the 2 weeks notice and/or any fees owed) and was thankful to have gotten rid of them. In my case, the kid did not show up on a Friday (the day payment is due for the upcoming week), the parents never contacted me, and I was happy to be done with said kid and family.
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blueskiesbutterflies 09:40 AM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by taylorw1210:
I have been in a similar situation and while what I did will probably not be the popular answer, I just let it be (the 2 weeks notice and/or any fees owed) and was thankful to have gotten rid of them. In my case, the kid did not show up on a Friday (the day payment is due for the upcoming week), the parents never contacted me, and I was happy to be done with said kid and family.
The payment is in advance for this week...she cleaned his cubby out so I am sure they are not coming back and I wish they would not. They have no job anyways so I know I would not get the money...but getting rid of them is worth losing that money..
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CraftyMom 09:49 AM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by blueskiesbutterflies:
I posted for help but have not got a response...My situation is kind of like yours but, full of LIE and LIE..

Ive got a daycare client who has been with me for a few months. Dad has drifted in and out of work and from what I hear he is not working right now. The family was evicted from their home last week and now live with gma. I knew it was coming...nonpayment but I did not know when. This morning at drop off they wrote me a check knowing good and well they did not have any money in their account. I called mom and told her that the check was rejected and she needed to come pick up the child ASAP. She took everything out of his cubby too. I have been looking to get rid of this child due to behavior issues and afraid of him hurting other kids. Here lately he has been out of control. I sent an email stating that if payment is not paid by 6:00pm today (at closing) he is terminated due to my policy and contract. Of course, I know they are not going to pay. How long do you give your clients before you dismiss? I require payment in advance and I have a strict no pay no play policy...If she does not come up with the money at 6:00 and I do not let him reenter do they still owe the money for the week even though I dismissed? I am confused!!!
It depends on what your contract says and also how badly you want the money opposed to how badly you want to be done with them.

If you have a strong contract that states they have to give 2 weeks notice when leaving and payment is due regardless of attendance, then yes they owe you money. You may have to go to court to get it though, especially knowing the financial situation.

I would assume they are not coming back. You told mom they had until tonight to pay. Not paying is their choice not to return, however, if it were me they would still owe me the 2 weeks notice.

In this situation though, knowing they don't have the money, you might just drop it and be done, but it depends on how you feel about the whole thing. If you need the money, have no replacements for dck, you would probably win in court if it went that far. But if your just glad to see them go and can fill the spot easily, you might drop it
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KIDZRMYBIZ 11:37 AM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by daycarediva:
After one bounced check, the family is cash only. It's in my contract.
Mine is cash only after a second. I can see making a mistake one time, and being very embarrassed about it. That was not the case here, for sure. There was an undeniable lie in one of the conversations (either about ordering new checks or about closing the account).

Whatever, because she did bring $200 cash that morning, all in 20's, which was weird because she owed $160. Then today she brought 2 100's, and she owes $115 (or even only $75 with the extra $40). I'm not saying anything, and will just keep crediting their account. They are strange people...
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KIDZRMYBIZ 11:47 AM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by blueskiesbutterflies:
The payment is in advance for this week...she cleaned his cubby out so I am sure they are not coming back and I wish they would not. They have no job anyways so I know I would not get the money...but getting rid of them is worth losing that money..
That happens a lot in this line of business. I have lost income in the past but was so happy that they left I hardly cared about the money.

I learned to collect a 2-week notice period deposit up front. I have never had a DCF balk at this, as it is explained that it is not free money for me, just that the last two weeks with me-whenever that may be-are already paid for. I am also willing to set up payment schedules of $50 every two weeks until it's satisfied if the full amount is too steep. That way, if a situation like yours happens, you don't feel so financially bad about them leaving suddenly.

If I were in your shoes, I would just let them go, count my blessings, and be done with them. It sounds like they are such a mess that it would be a herculean feat to get a penny from them anyway, and cost you way more in time, stress, and legal costs than it would be worth.
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AmyKidsCo 01:14 PM 11-17-2014
Automatic payments via direct deposit.
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EntropyControlSpecialist 08:15 PM 11-17-2014
Originally Posted by KIDZRMYBIZ:
That happens a lot in this line of business. I have lost income in the past but was so happy that they left I hardly cared about the money.

I learned to collect a 2-week notice period deposit up front. I have never had a DCF balk at this, as it is explained that it is not free money for me, just that the last two weeks with me-whenever that may be-are already paid for. I am also willing to set up payment schedules of $50 every two weeks until it's satisfied if the full amount is too steep. That way, if a situation like yours happens, you don't feel so financially bad about them leaving suddenly.

If I were in your shoes, I would just let them go, count my blessings, and be done with them. It sounds like they are such a mess that it would be a herculean feat to get a penny from them anyway, and cost you way more in time, stress, and legal costs than it would be worth.
I am the only one around here who does the security deposit fee and it has saved my hiney many times! Such a great thing.
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blueskiesbutterflies 05:48 AM 11-18-2014
Originally Posted by EntropyControlSpecialist:
I am the only one around here who does the security deposit fee and it has saved my hiney many times! Such a great thing.
How does the security deposit work? Is this a two week fee that they pay for the last two week of care? I think that would be a really good idea.
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Blackcat31 06:53 AM 11-18-2014
I require cash ONLY after the first incident with a check.

However, if I have a self-admitted "non-rememberer" like your DCM has claimed to be, I require the family to submit a months worth of pre-written checks in the beginning of the month.

I keep these pre-written/pre-dated checks in child's file and take one on each scheduled pay day.

When there is only one check left, I remind the parent and require another envelope to be brought with another months worth of pre-dated/pre-written checks.

However, like previously stated, once one of the check bounces, then payment via checks is no longer an option.
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Play Care 09:40 AM 11-18-2014
Originally Posted by EntropyControlSpecialist:
I am the only one around here who does the security deposit fee and it has saved my hiney many times! Such a great thing.
I get a deposit that's applied to the LAST week's tuition. I'd like to do 2 weeks, but that may be pushing it. This way if someone bails, I at least have that slight cushion. I don't think I'd ever be okay with working for no pay. At least this way I'm ahead something.
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mrsnj 06:41 AM 11-19-2014
This post has me giggling. I think I have about heard it all and then some. Sometimes I would love to say to the parents "Really? Do you think I have not heard this before?" Cause they seriously cannot think me THAT dumb. Bad checks, wrong name, wrong amount, post dated, wrong account, I forgot, etc etc etc

I love the "OH I left my checkbook on the counter. I will stop by and pick it up and pay you when I pick up"....then Gmom picks up.....then I get a message saying little Jonny is sick and will be out till Wed......... Seriously? Come on.

My thing is, would these parents be happy if they got paid whenever THEIR boss remembered? I doubt a "Oh you know what, I forgot about your check. I will have to bring it on Friday. But you will have to wait until Monday to cash it. Hope that isn't a problem" would go over well! So WHY do they feel it is ok to do it to the person that watches their most prized procession?

And that passive aggressive reminder that she WILL do it again would send me over the edge. I would give her a hefty fee and a note saying again=cash. Then I would up her late cash payment fee each time it is 'forgotten'. She will either leave, remember or pay for your next vacation in fees!

Hang in there.
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blueskiesbutterflies 10:15 AM 11-19-2014
Originally Posted by mrsnj:
This post has me giggling. I think I have about heard it all and then some. Sometimes I would love to say to the parents "Really? Do you think I have not heard this before?" Cause they seriously cannot think me THAT dumb. Bad checks, wrong name, wrong amount, post dated, wrong account, I forgot, etc etc etc

I love the "OH I left my checkbook on the counter. I will stop by and pick it up and pay you when I pick up"....then Gmom picks up.....then I get a message saying little Jonny is sick and will be out till Wed......... Seriously? Come on.

My thing is, would these parents be happy if they got paid whenever THEIR boss remembered? I doubt a "Oh you know what, I forgot about your check. I will have to bring it on Friday. But you will have to wait until Monday to cash it. Hope that isn't a problem" would go over well! So WHY do they feel it is ok to do it to the person that watches their most prized procession?

And that passive aggressive reminder that she WILL do it again would send me over the edge. I would give her a hefty fee and a note saying again=cash. Then I would up her late cash payment fee each time it is 'forgotten'. She will either leave, remember or pay for your next vacation in fees!

Hang in there.

I am glad to see I am not the only one who thinks like this. I ask my clients to pay every monday morning at drop off. I had three parents tell me that they "forgotten" the check and I would have to wait till that evening. I finally go sick of it and sent a newsletter to my parents advising a late fee would apply to anyone who neglected to make their payment at drop off. One parent, told me that the check was no good and I would have to wait till Friday to cash it. I told her that her daughter would not be able to stay for ONE second without the payment. I know it sounds mean, but no child is allowed to stay without payment in hand.
In my newsletter I ask them to put think how they would feel if their boss told them they did not get a paycheck because it was "forgotten". After that, no one was late again! I let a few things slide, but NEVER will I allow payment to slide.
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