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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Stressed - Not Sure What to Think or Do?????
daycare123 08:51 PM 06-27-2012
First of let me say I am legally unlicensed in ND...I care for 4 children plus my daughter. Only one is under 12 mo. one is under 24 mo. I have been doing daycare for 3 years now. Never once been a problem. My landlord called me this evening and there is now an issue with my daycare. And i am positive that it is the 80 sum year old lady who lives across the hall from me that is causing the problems. One time MY daughter was having a fit she knocked on the door and asked if i needed help. I said no..it's just my kid having a fit. A few weeks ago she had made a comment about the kids giving her a headache. I was speechless. Then last friday she stopped on of my dck moms and told her her son was crying all day. I was like are you serious. Dcm had text me and told me. Not the case at all. I brought the baby inside while i got the other kids inside and he started crying, cause he was tired. So i'm sure that irritated her. In the last three years my landlords have seen the kids outside and never said anything even though i never "asked" for permission to daycare. Well this evening i get a call from my landlord. Am I licensed? I said no I don't have to be but i follow all licensing standards for ND. I don't have over 5 kids including my daughter nor do i want anymore. Do I have liability ins? No but i will check into it and gladly purchase it. then they said something about reducing my numbers. I don't know what to think. I keep the kids quiet as possible, no running, screaming and such inside. What gets me is that they have clearly known all this time and now it's an issue. I don't know if there are any laws in North Dakota that say i can't run a daycare here or not. I talked to the woman that lives above me and she said they asked her and she said she has no complaints what so ever about the kids. Funny thing is that i asked the neighbor lady next door the other day after i heard that she stopped my dcm if the kids were bothering her and she said no. I'm stessed and don't know what to do or think. I have to check into liability ins in the morning and call them back and then have a meeting i think with them. They are worried that if someone gets hurt here that i will get sued or they will get sued. I'm at a loss!!!!!!!!
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MyAngels 09:16 PM 06-27-2012
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your landlord has every right to be concerned about liability issues, particularly if you are not carrying any sort of liability insurance.

You should probably read through your lease to see what provisions are in there about using the property for commercial purposes. Most residential leases don't allow it without prior written consent from the landlord.
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EchoMom 09:32 PM 06-27-2012
Sorry, this is terrible news! I wouldn't be so sure though that it's the old lady. Sounds like it certainly might be, but you never know who might have complained but not have the guts to say it to your face.
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Michael 10:45 PM 06-27-2012
Originally Posted by MyAngels:
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your landlord has every right to be concerned about liability issues, particularly if you are not carrying any sort of liability insurance.

You should probably read through your lease to see what provisions are in there about using the property for commercial purposes. Most residential leases don't allow it without prior written consent from the landlord.
IMO, the landlord knew about the daycare for how many months, and allowed it? What does the lease say? I had an 80 yo neighbor have my band kicked out of our house when I was a kid but you are running a daycare and that is a public need. What city ordinence is being broken? I would continue as usual and get homeowners insurance or daycare insurance umbrella to be sure. Let you landlord know he is covered.
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daycare123 06:17 AM 06-28-2012
I will have to dig out our lease and see what it says. I don't believe any city ordinence is being broken. I know they have known since i started and have never said a word. I do have renters insurance but will be calling at 9 am when my ins lady opens to ask about liability insurance. I have no problem getting it. It just gets me why it's never been an issue before, they have been here when the kids have been outside and stuff. Guess we will see what happens. Worse case quit daycare i guess, or have to term one or 2 familys. I did ask all my parents to come early today so i could let them know what was going on so if i do have to let someone go then it's not a complete shock. Praying all they want is the liability insurance!!
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MyAngels 06:44 AM 06-28-2012
I'm not sure about the public need angle as I'm sure it's different for every municipality, but I doubt that private daycare falls under the umbrella of public need.

I'd go to the meeting to find out what they want. It may very well be that they just want you to have liability insurance. If they opt to continue to let you provide daycare services I'd ask for that decision in writing in case there are any more complaints from the neighbors.

If they decide to be difficult about it you might contact an attorney to see if the fact that they've been allowing you to operate with their full knowledge can work against them in any way.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes .
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Kiki 08:04 AM 06-28-2012
So sorry, this whole situation really sucks!
I would read through your lease, and try to find anything in there that restricts you from running a business out of your apartment, and then contact your city as well to make sure you aren't breaking any ordinances by running a day care out of an apartment.

Who is your renters insurance through? Most have some pretty sticky policies in regards to businesses being ran out of rentals, and don't offer coverage, even an umbrella can be denied. My insurance is through Farmers, and they don't offer any coverage at all unless I own my home, or own a facility. I know that Allstate covers day care owners under their rental policies, and they will cover you up to 4 children that are not your own, I'm not really sure about other places too. I think someone might have mentioned American Family the other day.

Your landlord is probably more concerned with the possibility of being sued than anything else, especially if some jerk made a complaint. I am not 100% positive on this, but I think I may have read somewhere that you can get sued, as well as the owner of your property. Not sure.

If you cover your bases and make sure you're not breaking any rules in your lease, or city, and gain the liability insurance needed for a day care, I'd say they'd have a pretty tough time trying to shut you down. Just be prepared when you go into the meeting with them so they can see that you have your end covered to the best of your ability.

Good luck, keep us posted.
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Crystal 09:03 AM 06-28-2012
In the state of california landlords cannot deny you the right to operate a family childcare in their rental. They can require a higher deposit and that you have liability insurance, but otherwise they have no legal authroity to deny operation of a child care. It is also illegal for them to retaliate against you for operating a child care on premises. I would look up the legality of it for your state/county, not just your lease agreement.

Good luck!
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DaisyMamma 09:19 AM 06-28-2012
Can you move? If it is an option I would look into it. Not only will it save your business, but it will help in other ways as well, seeing as now you will be suspicious of all your neighbors and feeling like you are walking on eggshells all the time.
Either way you should get insurance.
so sorry you have to deal with it.
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daycare123 09:32 AM 06-28-2012
Thanks for all the replys!! I have Nodak Mutual for insurance and my lady is checking into liability ins for me. I have tried looking up online as to whether nd is like ca regarding doing daycare in an apartment. It's so common around here i never thought anything about it. Our lease just says for personal residence. Nothing about business or anything like that. I suppose i could call the county and see what they say? I thought about the moving part but we have fairly cheap rent here and it's nice to be on the ground floor.
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daycare123 10:28 AM 06-28-2012
Update.....My ins lady called and it's only 75 a year so that is awesome!! Called my landlord and he was happy to hear that i would be getting it, i also told him that my parents are all willing to sign a paper stating that they will not sue him in any even. It was actually a dcm that came up with that idea! He said the other landlord is out of town on a fishing trip so he can't talk to him till next week. I just have to get him a copy of the ins certificate when i get it and I "think" we will be ok .
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Sugar Magnolia 11:14 AM 06-28-2012
I could be totally wrong, hope I am, but unless your lease contains verbage that clearly allows you to use the apartment for commercial or business use, I am fairly certain it is up to the landlord entirely. If your lease specifically prohibits it, he has reason to evict. Its not just the liability issue.... If he is unhappy with the additional wear and tear on the unit, the potential damage like carpet stains or wall/window/door damage, really anything, he would be within his rights to not renew your lease,.ask for additional deposits or ask you to cease and desist using his property for daycare. Its like pets, some allow them and some don't. His property, his choice. If other tenants complain to him a lot about noise, parking, etc, he could.decide it is not worth the hassle and simply not renew your lease and start fresh with a tennant that doesn't do daycare. Most leases are drawn up by lawyers and designed to protect landlords.
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Sugar Magnolia 11:21 AM 06-28-2012
Originally Posted by Crystal:
In the state of california landlords cannot deny you the right to operate a family childcare in their rental. They can require a higher deposit and that you have liability insurance, but otherwise they have no legal authroity to deny operation of a child care. It is also illegal for them to retaliate against you for operating a child care on premises. I would look up the legality of it for your state/county, not just your lease agreement.

Good luck!
Wow CA is very liberal! How awesome! I don't do daycare from my home, but even though I own the house, my HOA specifically prohibits home daycare. If I were caught doing it, they could sue and force the sale of my home. Not nice. hoa's really.are quite powerful here.
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Tags:north dakota, stressed, unlicensed, unlicensed - north dakota
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