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  #1  
Old 01-08-2016, 11:02 AM
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I have a dck who is 17m. He is constantly throwing toys. I am constantly telling him not to throw and showing him how to play with the toys..you get the picture.

Well, today he threw a toy (like a mirror on wheels) at one of the windows in our living room. Guess who has a cracked window? The crack is from one corner down to the other, and now it's spreading in two other directions. I called the local glass guy. Waiting for him to call back.

I was fairly upset. DH said he was surprised it took this long to happen. First, one since I opened (2.5yrs).

I'm not sure what to say to DCM. She allows him to do anything he wants at home as long as he isn't screaming. I know he throws things at home, and I have talked with her about helping me teach him not to throw. Grrr!
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:07 AM
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I would tell her I am getting an estimate and expect her to pay for the damages caused by her child.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Thriftylady View Post
I would tell her I am getting an estimate and expect her to pay for the damages caused by her child.
I would send an email before pick up. "Dcm today dcb threw a toy at our window, unfortunately it is now cracked and will need to be replaced. I am getting an estimate on what it will cost and I will update you with that amount. What strategies have you tried at home to curb dcb's behavior?"
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:11 AM
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I would tell her I am getting an estimate and expect her to pay for the damages caused by her child.
Really? That isn't a rhetorical question either. Part of me assumed that this was part of the risk of owning my own business. Part of me does feel like they should pay something.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:14 AM
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I have it in my contract. If a child intentionally breaks something the parent will repair or replace.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:14 AM
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I am very interested to see how everyone replies to this. My daycare room is the front room in my house with a large bay window and I have been waiting for someone to break the window (not that I want it to happen). Should his mom have to pay for it or does that cost come along with running a daycare? My first response is that she should pay for it because that would guarantee she will work with him on not throwing but I also feel that if I passed back all expenses to parents (broken toy or books, pee on carpet or furniture obviously not just normal wear and tear) I don't know how many parents would stick aound.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Jack Sprat View Post
Really? That isn't a rhetorical question either. Part of me assumed that this was part of the risk of owning my own business. Part of me does feel like they should pay something.
I am on the fence about this, too.

Do your policies say anything about it? I had a child deliberately run at the patio door and break it. I took blame and repair costs but in this case, if you have worked with this child, dcm knows of his behaviours, and now this? I would approach it how daycarediva suggested "update her on the cost" and see if she offers to pay some or all of it.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:19 AM
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As angry as it made me when a kid kicked out my lights that shine on the house at night years ago, I did not ask them to pay...they did know from that point they would hold the child's hand all the way to the car...
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:21 AM
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I have it in my contract. If a child intentionally breaks something the parent will repair or replace.
Yes, I have that in my contract as well. I sent her a message letting her know what happened. I explained that I was waiting for the glass guy to call back and come give an estimate. I didn't say anything about them being responsible for the bill. I was hoping she would know that they were. Well, her response was "Geez!"
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:24 AM
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I have it in my contract. If a child intentionally breaks something the parent will repair or replace.
I have the same thing in my contract. And if the parents didn't pay to replace it, I would term. We are in business to make money. We can't make any money when children are allowed to misbehave and break things. IF (and that is a huge if), I didn't make her pay for it, she would be signing a paper that everything he broke from here on out she would be paying for. I simply won't put up with kids (or adults for that matter) being destructive of my home and property. Something being broken accidentally is one thing, this was no accident.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:26 AM
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As angry as it made me when a kid kicked out my lights that shine on the house at night years ago, I did not ask them to pay...they did know from that point they would hold the child's hand all the way to the car...
They'd have paid for that here.

But I don't know that I'd have the parents pay for the window. If I know that the child is in a throwing stage, it would mean the child only had soft baby toys for play. And I have two now that I have to do that with, so I understand.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:27 AM
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I also expect parents to pay for intentional damages. I don't think I would require that if the child is 17 months, but as they all are individual, it could happen. By the age of 3, though, I consider them all responsible enough to not, for example, throw toys at the window after being asked not to. If the child were over 3, I would definitely expect compensation from the parent. As a parent, I'd expect to pay for my child's damage at any age.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Thriftylady View Post
I have the same thing in my contract. And if the parents didn't pay to replace it, I would term. We are in business to make money. We can't make any money when children are allowed to misbehave and break things. IF (and that is a huge if), I didn't make her pay for it, she would be signing a paper that everything he broke from here on out she would be paying for. I simply won't put up with kids (or adults for that matter) being destructive of my home and property. Something being broken accidentally is one thing, this was no accident.

Very true!! And yes I do agree it was not an accident. Nor normal wear and tear. Her response has me really miffed.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:31 AM
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I know this isn't what you asked, but we had a similar situation a few years back, the glass guy at our local hardware store said the first thing is to get plastic or a plastic shower curtain liner taped up over the broken window just in case the wind, or something else, causes it to shatter completely.

As for payment, I hope the parent does the right thing and offers to pay. I would expect them to!
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Thriftylady View Post
I have the same thing in my contract. And if the parents didn't pay to replace it, I would term. We are in business to make money. We can't make any money when children are allowed to misbehave and break things. IF (and that is a huge if), I didn't make her pay for it, she would be signing a paper that everything he broke from here on out she would be paying for. I simply won't put up with kids (or adults for that matter) being destructive of my home and property. Something being broken accidentally is one thing, this was no accident.
I agree. If they don't come forward to offer to pay SOMETHING, even HALF, I would be done and probably term. This is the type of child/parent combo that WILL continue to run wild, break and destroy property and Mom will just say "Geeze!"
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:36 AM
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I can see both sides. As a parent, I would be so embarrassed and want to pay or at least offer to pay. As a provider, I would probably not charge the parent, but I would do as a PP said and have her sign something that said any intentional damages int eh future would be her responsibility. I guess the other thing I may consider is terming. It is a young age, so I am on the fence, but as someone else said, we are here to make money and if the window is going to cost a month's worth of tuition (not sure what they cost to repair), then the kid would be too expensive and a liability for me to continue watching. I think mom's response was pretty lame, though. Something more a long the lines of "Oh no! I am so sorry! I hope no one was hurt! Let me know what you find out!" would make me less likely to pass the repair bill on.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:37 AM
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I have it in my contract. If a child intentionally breaks something the parent will repair or replace.
Me too!
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:42 AM
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I can't imagine being that parent and not insisting to pay. I wouldn't wait to see if I'd be 'charged' for it. I'd pay!

Regarding the child who kicked the outdoor lights while on the parent's watch, I'd charge them and term! That is completely unacceptable.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:49 AM
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I expect wear and tear to my home is an expense I can't pass along to parents. To me, normal wear and tear would be:

*marks on the walls
*spills on the carpet
* an occasional broken toy or ripped book
* a scuff on the hardwoods

A broken window is way outside that array. I don't expect to pay for those. It sounds like the little one was throwing, you have addressed it with the parents, and they let it continue without addressing it. Paying for a window should be the consequence.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:53 AM
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Yes, to all the PP's. He is at the stage where he throws. He has been in this stage for 6 months! I do believe he understands what "no throw" means. He never throws things at the wall, just the window or other kids. I'm going to eliminate all the toys that aren't soft during nap time. DCM has a lame response to everything this child does. So really her response shouldn't have surprised me.
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:05 PM
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I had a child hit our window with a plastic hammer. He was 2...pretty much knew better but also still 2 and impulsive. I did email mom and let her know what happened. She apologized profusely and offered to pay for the whole thing. We agreed to split it though because I felt like it really could have been anyone. I was actually thankful it happened. I had no idea that window was so weak and that no one got hurt was a huge blessing. We could replace it before something really bad happened. But I think situations like this are really a case by case basis. I may have offered to spilt it in this case too...not so much after that response though!
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:14 PM
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I had a child hit our window with a plastic hammer. He was 2...pretty much knew better but also still 2 and impulsive. I did email mom and let her know what happened. She apologized profusely and offered to pay for the whole thing. We agreed to split it though because I felt like it really could have been anyone. I was actually thankful it happened. I had no idea that window was so weak and that no one got hurt was a huge blessing. We could replace it before something really bad happened. But I think situations like this are really a case by case basis. I may have offered to spilt it in this case too...not so much after that response though!
I see this as different since the provider has been working with the child and has spoken to mom (who apparently doesn't realize she needs to help with her child's behavior). I do believe that kids will be kids, but I also believe that parents should be parents.
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:27 PM
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She just sent a text saying "I guess I will be buying a new window to add to this already crappy day."

Can you imagine how crappy a day it would have been if the window had shattered and I had to close because of the HUGE draft coming in? Now, that would have made that crappy day of hers even more crappy. Oh and the fact that 8 other sets of parents would have been out child care for the day and myself out of a days wages? Now that would have been crappy.
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:29 PM
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She just sent a text saying "I guess I will be buying a new window to add to this already crappy day."

Can you imagine how crappy a day it would have been if the window had shattered and I had to close because of the HUGE draft coming in? Now, that would have made that crappy day of hers even more crappy. Oh and the fact that 8 other sets of parents would have been out child care for the day and myself out of a days wages? Now that would have been crappy.
Honestly, she sounds like the kind of parent I would be looking to replace. But I am in kinda a mood right at the moment anyway.
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:38 PM
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I would probably pay to replace the window this time and then write up the incident and state that any destruction after this is to be paid by the parent and have her sign. I would also have a serious talk with her about working on his throwing at home. Let her know it is term worthy.
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:33 PM
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In my opinion he is rather young to understand and think it comes with teaching young children, I would not require the parents to pay although it sucks. I would talk to them and tell them that per his age you would not make them pay but if he were older and more of an appropriate age to understand then they would have to pay. Just my take on it.
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:36 PM
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She just sent a text saying "I guess I will be buying a new window to add to this already crappy day."

Can you imagine how crappy a day it would have been if the window had shattered and I had to close because of the HUGE draft coming in? Now, that would have made that crappy day of hers even more crappy. Oh and the fact that 8 other sets of parents would have been out child care for the day and myself out of a days wages? Now that would have been crappy.
I wouldn't even respond. Although I would want to say something about how expensive and inconvenient it can be to have a child sometimes, so she needs to put on her big girl panties and deal with it, but her text sounds so passive aggressive that it is not worth giving her hissy fit any attention. If you do respond, maybe something along the lines of, "I understand your frustration. I am dreading my electric (or gas) bill next month since there is a draft in the house from it, so hopefully they can get it fixed quickly!"
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:41 PM
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That rocks if she assumed she has to pay for the window without you explicitly telling her, and I'd just hand her the estimate when you get it. But if it were my home, unfortunately I'd suck it up and pay for it if a toddler did the damage. They can't really be responsible when we choose the toys they have access to and we (mostly) have control over their behavior. If it were one of my preschoolers or school age children that had a prior history of violent play, I'd definitely make the parent pay. Where do you draw the line at the age where they're accountable for their actions though? This is a tough one. Maybe we should add a poll at the top?
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:45 PM
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In my opinion he is rather young to understand and think it comes with teaching young children, I would not require the parents to pay although it sucks. I would talk to them and tell them that per his age you would not make them pay but if he were older and more of an appropriate age to understand then they would have to pay. Just my take on it.
I agree that he is too young to understand and I don't think it falls under "deliberate destruction of property". But if I were the parent, I would still pay.
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:56 PM
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Haven't read all the replies yet but I absorb the costs of normal wear and tear on my daycare stuff.

However, if a child intentionally breaks something and they are old enough to know better and the "problem" has been discussed with the parent before, I would require the parent to pay for the damages IF and ONLY IF I did my part as well....

For example if throwing toys is something you've had a written plan of action in place to address, curb and teach the child and you have discussed this with the parents and you are both working on fixing it, then I might charge the parent....atleast a portion of the repair costs

If you as the provider knew he was a thrower and still allowed him to play with hard toys and he threw something that broke the window then I probably wouldn't charge the parents because he only had an opportunity to throw something hard because you let him have something hard enough to do damage when thrown.

So, unless he was right in front of you and you literally could not stop him from grabbing something hard and throwing it, you as the provider (since you knew about his throwing habit) bear some of the responsibility and in that case I would maybe see if you could come to some sort of compromise with the parent and have them contribute something towards the costs but I certainly wouldn't expect them to just pay for it when there really wasn't anything the parents could have done to prevent it.

Also, do you have insurance that will cover this type of thing?
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:56 PM
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I agree that he is too young to understand and I don't think it falls under "deliberate destruction of property". But if I were the parent, I would still pay.
I agree completely with this. Throwing is one of those toddler actions. And yes, you can work on the behavior with the toddler but it still takes time for them to understand. They have to throw a lot of things and receive a lot of correction before it sinks in.
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Old 01-08-2016, 02:42 PM
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Haven't read all the replies yet but I absorb the costs of normal wear and tear on my daycare stuff.

However, if a child intentionally breaks something and they are old enough to know better and the "problem" has been discussed with the parent before, I would require the parent to pay for the damages IF and ONLY IF I did my part as well....

For example if throwing toys is something you've had a written plan of action in place to address, curb and teach the child and you have discussed this with the parents and you are both working on fixing it, then I might charge the parent....atleast a portion of the repair costs

If you as the provider knew he was a thrower and still allowed him to play with hard toys and he threw something that broke the window then I probably wouldn't charge the parents because he only had an opportunity to throw something hard because you let him have something hard enough to do damage when thrown.

So, unless he was right in front of you and you literally could not stop him from grabbing something hard and throwing it, you as the provider (since you knew about his throwing habit) bear some of the responsibility and in that case I would maybe see if you could come to some sort of compromise with the parent and have them contribute something towards the costs but I certainly wouldn't expect them to just pay for it when there really wasn't anything the parents could have done to prevent it.

Also, do you have insurance that will cover this type of thing?
i agree! Also isn't this what insurance is for?
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Old 01-08-2016, 02:46 PM
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i agree! Also isn't this what insurance is for?
But insurance usually has a deductible and the 3 windows I've had to replace panes of glass in, cost about $45 each. My dog broke 2 of them trying to get to squirrels outside but the 3rd was broken by a dcb who was old enough to know better, although he wasn't doing it intentionally.
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Old 01-08-2016, 03:17 PM
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But insurance usually has a deductible and the 3 windows I've had to replace panes of glass in, cost about $45 each. My dog broke 2 of them trying to get to squirrels outside but the 3rd was broken by a dcb who was old enough to know better, although he wasn't doing it intentionally.
I still think its part of the risk we assume when opening a business in our homes.

Intentional, on purpose behavior by a child old enough to to understand AND possess the capability of choosing to do or not do something is the ONLY time I'd outright charge a parent.
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Old 01-08-2016, 03:34 PM
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I still think its part of the risk we assume when opening a business in our homes.

Intentional, on purpose behavior by a child old enough to to understand AND possess the capability of choosing to do or not do something is the ONLY time I'd outright charge a parent.
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Old 01-08-2016, 04:05 PM
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I wouldn't male them pay. I'm supervising and I know he's a thrower. I would only give him access to toys that were cloth or restrict him to areas where glass wasn't within his throw range.

He's very young. If he were a thrower he would be in a large play yard with cloth toys, cloth books, very lightweight plastic blocks, rags, etc that don't fly far so he could get his throw on.

He would be out in the general population but first toss... back in the free fly zone.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:06 PM
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I wouldn't male them pay. I'm supervising and I know he's a thrower. I would only give him access to toys that were cloth or restrict him to areas where glass wasn't within his throw range.

He's very young. If he were a thrower he would be in a large play yard with cloth toys, cloth books, very lightweight plastic blocks, rags, etc that don't fly far so he could get his throw on.

He would be out in the general population but first toss... back in the free fly zone.
I guess it depends where you are. When I was in Kansas, my rep told me I couldn't use play yards and such in that way it was considered a "lengthy timeout".
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:11 PM
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I wouldn't male them pay. I'm supervising and I know he's a thrower. I would only give him access to toys that were cloth or restrict him to areas where glass wasn't within his throw range.

He's very young. If he were a thrower he would be in a large play yard with cloth toys, cloth books, very lightweight plastic blocks, rags, etc that don't fly far so he could get his throw on.

He would be out in the general population but first toss... back in the free fly zone.
I totally agree.

At 17 months, he lacks impulse control. It's up to the provider to either do as suggested above, or remain in close physical proximity to him to prevent what happened.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:47 PM
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i agree! Also isn't this what insurance is for?
Our deductible is $500...... So yes, ins will cover it but depending on the deductible you may pay most of it out-of-pocket
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Old 01-09-2016, 08:05 AM
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Our insurance deductible is $500. My DH can replace the window himself but, we of course have to wait till the weather warms up for the caulking to set. So probably Monday or Wednesday.

I do agree this is partly my fault for allowing him to play with toys that aren't soft. I told DCM not to worry about paying for the window as he is still learning and we will continue to work on not throwing toys and that now he will only have access to soft toys. She said he throws everything at home and has destroyed several items and a television and they just don't know what to do. She also said she wasn't sure she wanted him to only have access to soft toys. I told her flat out I didn't want anymore broken windows. I told her that if he was 2 or 3 then yes I would ask them to pay. But, not at this age.

I'm not sure about the use of play yards here (KS) as a time out. He was a little confused when he awoke from nap yesterday and found that there were only soft toys in the cube. But, played with what was offered. It would be great to move him to an area where windows were out of his range. But, that room would be the kitchen lol!
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Old 01-09-2016, 08:16 AM
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She also said she wasn't sure she wanted him to only have access to soft toys.
He doesn't have to ONLY have access to soft toys.

He can have access to as many hard toys as she wants him to have on HER watch at HER house so that when things get broken they are 100% HER responsibility to pay for/replace.

He only has to have access to soft toys at your house.
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Old 01-09-2016, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Jack Sprat View Post
Our insurance deductible is $500. My DH can replace the window himself but, we of course have to wait till the weather warms up for the caulking to set. So probably Monday or Wednesday.

I do agree this is partly my fault for allowing him to play with toys that aren't soft. I told DCM not to worry about paying for the window as he is still learning and we will continue to work on not throwing toys and that now he will only have access to soft toys. She said he throws everything at home and has destroyed several items and a television and they just don't know what to do. She also said she wasn't sure she wanted him to only have access to soft toys. I told her flat out I didn't want anymore broken windows. I told her that if he was 2 or 3 then yes I would ask them to pay. But, not at this age.

I'm not sure about the use of play yards here (KS) as a time out. He was a little confused when he awoke from nap yesterday and found that there were only soft toys in the cube. But, played with what was offered. It would be great to move him to an area where windows were out of his range. But, that room would be the kitchen lol!
If I were you, I would write up a written plan of action with mom, and I guess that would include soft toys. If she doesn't want that she could look for other care. For me, KS was a bear. I got written up one day when my rep locked her keys in her car and was waiting for someone from the office to bring her new ones. While she was waiting I went on with circle time. One was acting up hitting and such so I sent her to TO. My rep wrote me up for sending kiddo away from the group for time out, because sending the child away from the group was "embarrassing" to the child. I had to write a letter saying I would never send a kiddo away from the group again.
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Old 01-09-2016, 09:10 AM
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I would be doing a written plan, as well. Dcm may not like the restrictions but too bad. I would also be detailing what you are going to be doing in an effort to curb the behaviour at your house, and what you expect to have dcm to be doing at home. I would also detail what you will expect, in terms of payment, for any further damage caused by him throwing (if you won't charge until he's 2, fine, but what happens if he breaks something else in the meantime? Term?)

He has broken several things at home, including a tv?

You're lucky it was a window that got broken and he didn't launch the toy at another dck.
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Old 01-10-2016, 08:01 AM
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If I were you, I would write up a written plan of action with mom, and I guess that would include soft toys. If she doesn't want that she could look for other care. For me, KS was a bear. I got written up one day when my rep locked her keys in her car and was waiting for someone from the office to bring her new ones. While she was waiting I went on with circle time. One was acting up hitting and such so I sent her to TO. My rep wrote me up for sending kiddo away from the group for time out, because sending the child away from the group was "embarrassing" to the child. I had to write a letter saying I would never send a kiddo away from the group again.
Omg, that is nuts!
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Old 01-10-2016, 09:51 AM
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IMHO....he is only 17 months old. I also feel it's my responsibility to keep kids under control. I know just about anything can happen during childcare, even under close supervision. Still feel it's my job to keep things like this at bay and if a 17 mo. old throws something I'd take responsibility for it.
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