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momofboys 04:53 AM 02-07-2013
Started family about.2.weeks ago,.both children have serious tantrums like.i have never seen before, the youngest.is only 14 months. oldest.is almost.,4. (Not pt) and can't communicate well at all,doesn't look u in the eye,.doesn't understand basic directions and basically acts more like a 2-year old than an almost 4-year-old. mom told me yesterday that he might be autistic. Had i known these things.i would not have accepted them into care, i had an opening for 4 -year old and don't have time/energy to deal with one who needs so much attention as.he is not independent at all. ughhh would you call parent out on withholding info or just let it go and.term. i am a small daycarw (it is only me), i can't afford to hire extra help. I just feel like they portayed their kids in an inaccurate light to get me to take them on.
coolconfidentme 04:57 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by momofboys:
Started family about.2.weeks ago,.both children have serious tantrums like.i have never seen before, the youngest.is only 14 months. oldest.is almost.,4.and can't communicate well at all,doesn't look u in the eye,.doesn't understand basic directions and basically acts more like a 2-year old than an almost 4-year-old. mom told me yesterday that he might be autistic. Had i known these things.i would not have accepted them into care, i had an opening for 4 -year old and don't have time/energy to deal with one who needs so much attention as.he is not independent at all. ughhh would you call parent out on withholding info or just let it go and.term. i am a small daycarw (it is only me), i can't afford to hire extra help.
Supper Nanny the kids! Tantrums can go away with consistency. It's a just a thought...Started family about.2.weeks ago,.both children have serious tantrums like.i have never seen before, the youngest.is only 14 months. oldest.is almost.,4.and can't communicate well at all,doesn't look u in the eye,.doesn't understand basic directions and basically acts more like a 2-year old than an almost 4-year-old. mom told me yesterday that he might be autistic. Had i known these things.i would not have accepted them into care, i had an opening for 4 -year old and don't have time/energy to deal with one who needs so much attention as.he is not independent at all. ughhh would you call parent out on withholding info or just let it go and.term. i am a small daycarw (it is only me), i can't afford to hire extra help.
hope 05:22 AM 02-07-2013
I would be honest with DCM. Let her know that a child with special needs really needs the extra time, attention, and special services and that you alone are not trained properly to provide that. I am a mother of a special needs child and would not take offense to this. The child's needs can not be meet in such a setting. You are only doing what is best for the child. I am very surprised that this child is not in an early intervention program. Speech, physical and occupational therapy can be very helpful in a special needs child's development.
rmc20021 05:23 AM 02-07-2013
I used to have a set of 2 yo twins (almost 3 when they started), one boy and one girl. The girl was very laid back, didn't talk...no problem.
The boy was the worst child I've EVER seen. He also did not speak, but he would attack other children, going for the throat. If he saw a kid getting on a toy, he would run over and grab their throat and pull them off. Hitting, screaming...you name it, he did it. VERY oppositional and defiant.
Fortunately, my husband had just had shoulder surgery so he was home with me and it took one of us to constantly watch the one boy every single second.
Within 2 weeks, he became a different child because I was sooooo consistent with him and he learned quickly what he could and could not get away with.
I always, at least once per week, took my dck on field trips and their mom finally confided in me when she was shocked how well I'd tell her they did, that she had never even taken them to the grocery store before...no place.
It takes consistency in order for a child to 'get it', become adjusted in daycare and learn what you expect from them...BUT, if there is a potential for autism that could be a whole other story.
I used to work with autistic adults and one of the things I learned with them (one in particular who was severe) is that although they appear to not understand, as though it seems there's little to nothing going on in their brains, they are actually VERY intelligent. Most people think the autistic is not capable of thinking for themselves in any manner so they make all the decisions for them and doesn't take in consideration what the autistic person 'wants'.
I always gave my autistic people choices, and it made a huge difference in how they responded. My one lady cooperated with me where she would not with anyone else. She made a lot of progress and everyone was amazed at what she was really capable of doing.
They still don't always use good judgement, but by giving them choices it helps them to feel as though they have some control and they act out less.
The boy was the worst child I've EVER seen. He also did not speak, but he would attack other children, going for the throat. If he saw a kid getting on a toy, he would run over and grab their throat and pull them off. Hitting, screaming...you name it, he did it. VERY oppositional and defiant.
Fortunately, my husband had just had shoulder surgery so he was home with me and it took one of us to constantly watch the one boy every single second.
Within 2 weeks, he became a different child because I was sooooo consistent with him and he learned quickly what he could and could not get away with.
I always, at least once per week, took my dck on field trips and their mom finally confided in me when she was shocked how well I'd tell her they did, that she had never even taken them to the grocery store before...no place.
It takes consistency in order for a child to 'get it', become adjusted in daycare and learn what you expect from them...BUT, if there is a potential for autism that could be a whole other story.
I used to work with autistic adults and one of the things I learned with them (one in particular who was severe) is that although they appear to not understand, as though it seems there's little to nothing going on in their brains, they are actually VERY intelligent. Most people think the autistic is not capable of thinking for themselves in any manner so they make all the decisions for them and doesn't take in consideration what the autistic person 'wants'.
I always gave my autistic people choices, and it made a huge difference in how they responded. My one lady cooperated with me where she would not with anyone else. She made a lot of progress and everyone was amazed at what she was really capable of doing.
They still don't always use good judgement, but by giving them choices it helps them to feel as though they have some control and they act out less.
Play Care 05:38 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by momofboys:
Started family about.2.weeks ago,.both children have serious tantrums like.i have never seen before, the youngest.is only 14 months. oldest.is almost.,4. (Not pt) and can't communicate well at all,doesn't look u in the eye,.doesn't understand basic directions and basically acts more like a 2-year old than an almost 4-year-old. mom told me yesterday that he might be autistic. Had i known these things.i would not have accepted them into care, i had an opening for 4 -year old and don't have time/energy to deal with one who needs so much attention as.he is not independent at all. ughhh would you call parent out on withholding info or just let it go and.term. i am a small daycarw (it is only me), i can't afford to hire extra help. I just feel like they portayed their kids in an inaccurate light to get me to take them on.
My contract states that withholding information (being dishonest...) is grounds for immediate termination. An "oh, by the way my child *might* be autistic" is one of those times. Had mom been honest and upfront, I might have been willing to take on the kids *provided* they were able to recieve all the services etc. they needed and we had plans in place to deal with issues (toileting, tantruming, etc.) But that's not what's happening. They are at your house, not getting any services and mom seems to have a laid back approach to dealing with it (has the older child even been evaluated?!) Started family about.2.weeks ago,.both children have serious tantrums like.i have never seen before, the youngest.is only 14 months. oldest.is almost.,4. (Not pt) and can't communicate well at all,doesn't look u in the eye,.doesn't understand basic directions and basically acts more like a 2-year old than an almost 4-year-old. mom told me yesterday that he might be autistic. Had i known these things.i would not have accepted them into care, i had an opening for 4 -year old and don't have time/energy to deal with one who needs so much attention as.he is not independent at all. ughhh would you call parent out on withholding info or just let it go and.term. i am a small daycarw (it is only me), i can't afford to hire extra help. I just feel like they portayed their kids in an inaccurate light to get me to take them on.
I just can't help but feel terrible for these kids. In my area we have several awsome inclusive centers/schools that have all the EI services on site. I feel like these poor kids are missing out on some critical services
I guess you could try to work your hardest with the kids, but I can't help but feel that if mom wasn't upfront about this, the relationship is doomed.
countrymom 05:41 AM 02-07-2013
I think the hardest part is going to be that you are by yourself. Its hard to give one on one without the others suffering. I would ask mom more questions, has he been tested, is he getting help. Has he been thrown out of other daycares.
Willow 05:48 AM 02-07-2013
I agree with the previous posters, I would let this kiddo go.
If you do decide to do that though I would be careful not mention the reason being that he's autistic. Since there is no diagnosis and there are laws against discriminating against kiddos with disabilities I think it would be best to let his parents know that he has behaviors they didn't disclose at enrollment time that you find yourself unable to handle. If you want you can give them either the school districts number and suggest he get some sort of evaluation if they believe he may have a problem, and a child care resource so they can sort out a more appropriate provider for him that has the time and resources to deal with what he's got going on.
If you do decide to do that though I would be careful not mention the reason being that he's autistic. Since there is no diagnosis and there are laws against discriminating against kiddos with disabilities I think it would be best to let his parents know that he has behaviors they didn't disclose at enrollment time that you find yourself unable to handle. If you want you can give them either the school districts number and suggest he get some sort of evaluation if they believe he may have a problem, and a child care resource so they can sort out a more appropriate provider for him that has the time and resources to deal with what he's got going on.
Unregistered 05:52 AM 02-07-2013
Depends on how patient you are. Here is the deal, they have waited to long and personally you wait past three yrs of age for a lot of stuff it is almost too late to catch up. Early Childhood Intervention here in Texas is for 0-3yrs. And above that the school district helps. I would check into those services. At the end of the day the PARENT/Doctor has to request the help and evaluation, but you can find out the steps and let the parent know.
If you are willing you can do this. Have the children evaluated by ECI or school district. If they deem services are necessary they will come to daycare and provide therapy free of charge to the parent. That way you can learn how to work with the child and the child benefits from the therapy and is getting his needs addressed.
Autism or any of the other things that could be wrong are way out of the scope of skill set of most people even school teachers, there simply is not enough time to teach all of that stuff unless you are a behavior therapist, OT, ST etc. It is way more than just providing consistency. Our job as providers is to guide parents in the right direction when we feel something is off. Point them in the direction of people that can help their child and support them. You are just one part of the team.
Personally once you find the process and if there are resources I would have a sit down with the parents. Spell out that you do not appreciate them not being completely honest but as a condition of continuation of care you request that the child be evaluated and then in writing give them the steps. That you will fully support any onsite therapies and would be happy to continue working with the child on the days that the therapist is not there. If the parent refuses and says there is nothing wrong and tries to wing it. Drop them I have had to do that several times. Don't feel guilty about dropping them, look at the long range picture. If enough people are honest with the parents and refuse care unless they take advantage of services provided then maybe it will sink in their head that they need to address these issues with their child. It is your responsibility to provide a positive learning environment for all children. One can surely throw a wrench in things.
Sorry for the long post, just a lot to cover. Good luck
If you are willing you can do this. Have the children evaluated by ECI or school district. If they deem services are necessary they will come to daycare and provide therapy free of charge to the parent. That way you can learn how to work with the child and the child benefits from the therapy and is getting his needs addressed.
Autism or any of the other things that could be wrong are way out of the scope of skill set of most people even school teachers, there simply is not enough time to teach all of that stuff unless you are a behavior therapist, OT, ST etc. It is way more than just providing consistency. Our job as providers is to guide parents in the right direction when we feel something is off. Point them in the direction of people that can help their child and support them. You are just one part of the team.
Personally once you find the process and if there are resources I would have a sit down with the parents. Spell out that you do not appreciate them not being completely honest but as a condition of continuation of care you request that the child be evaluated and then in writing give them the steps. That you will fully support any onsite therapies and would be happy to continue working with the child on the days that the therapist is not there. If the parent refuses and says there is nothing wrong and tries to wing it. Drop them I have had to do that several times. Don't feel guilty about dropping them, look at the long range picture. If enough people are honest with the parents and refuse care unless they take advantage of services provided then maybe it will sink in their head that they need to address these issues with their child. It is your responsibility to provide a positive learning environment for all children. One can surely throw a wrench in things.
Sorry for the long post, just a lot to cover. Good luck
Heidi 06:09 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme:
Supper Nanny the kids! Tantrums can go away with consistency. It's a just a thought...
Yeah, but autism doesnt...Supper Nanny the kids! Tantrums can go away with consistency. It's a just a thought...
momofboys 06:10 AM 02-07-2013
Thank you all for your advice! I will be terming, it is just so frustrating to feel lied to, i mean I know no kid is perfect but don't sugarcoat things so I will accept your child.
blessed mom 06:20 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by momofboys:
Thank you all for your advice! I will be terming, it is just so frustrating to feel lied to, i mean I know no kid is perfect but don't sugarcoat things so I will accept your child.
Thank you all for your advice! I will be terming, it is just so frustrating to feel lied to, i mean I know no kid is perfect but don't sugarcoat things so I will accept your child.
I have a two week trial period in my contract so that either one of us can terminate within that period if the childcare is not a good fit for either child or provider. Might help for next time.
Unregistered 06:21 AM 02-07-2013
Get used to being lied to. No parent with a kid over 6m of age will be completely honest with you about why they are coming to you for care. It is just part of the business don't take it personal, this is why as time goes on you refine your lie detector skills
Read between the lines.
Or only take infants
In parents defense most of them are in denial and don't want to address that there could be anything wrong with their child, whether it's their parenting, bad previous daycare environment or a potential diagnosis of Autism etc. So they turn a blind eye to it until the behavior or problem get's bad enough that they are kicked out of multiple daycare's, doc brings it up or the school system forces them to address the problem.
Sad reality. If you look at it this way hopefully it is easier to feel better about it. People lie for many reasons. Good luck
Read between the lines.Or only take infants
In parents defense most of them are in denial and don't want to address that there could be anything wrong with their child, whether it's their parenting, bad previous daycare environment or a potential diagnosis of Autism etc. So they turn a blind eye to it until the behavior or problem get's bad enough that they are kicked out of multiple daycare's, doc brings it up or the school system forces them to address the problem.
Sad reality. If you look at it this way hopefully it is easier to feel better about it. People lie for many reasons. Good luck
kitykids3 07:02 AM 02-07-2013
If she says he might have autism, I would ask if he has been tested or is getting any help. Refer her to help if not and then decide if this is something you want to help with or not. You know - keep him if he is getting help if he needs it or term. If he isn't special needs, be consistent and it should get better.
Blackcat31 07:08 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Get used to being lied to. No parent with a kid over 6m of age will be completely honest with you about why they are coming to you for care. It is just part of the business don't take it personal, this is why as time goes on you refine your lie detector skills Read between the lines.
Or only take infants
In parents defense most of them are in denial and don't want to address that there could be anything wrong with their child, whether it's their parenting, bad previous daycare environment or a potential diagnosis of Autism etc. So they turn a blind eye to it until the behavior or problem get's bad enough that they are kicked out of multiple daycare's, doc brings it up or the school system forces them to address the problem.
Sad reality. If you look at it this way hopefully it is easier to feel better about it. People lie for many reasons. Good luck
Wow! Get used to being lied to. No parent with a kid over 6m of age will be completely honest with you about why they are coming to you for care. It is just part of the business don't take it personal, this is why as time goes on you refine your lie detector skills
Read between the lines.Or only take infants
In parents defense most of them are in denial and don't want to address that there could be anything wrong with their child, whether it's their parenting, bad previous daycare environment or a potential diagnosis of Autism etc. So they turn a blind eye to it until the behavior or problem get's bad enough that they are kicked out of multiple daycare's, doc brings it up or the school system forces them to address the problem.
Sad reality. If you look at it this way hopefully it is easier to feel better about it. People lie for many reasons. Good luck
That is really a sad outlook on parents. It sounds as if you are pretty jaded based on maybe some bad experiences you have had, I don't know....but I would never make such a generalized sweeping statement that all parents with kids over 6 months lie to their providers. 
I think the relationship you have with your clients has as much to do with you as it does them. If you set clear boundaries and expectations from the beginning there leaves little room for lying and dishonesty.
I also disagree with the statement that most parents are in denial about their child.
Most parents I have had in care are genuinely concerned about their child and his/her development. Most parents I have had in care form an honest open trusting relationship with me so that we can rest assured that we are both on the same page and doing what is best for the child.
I have had a few who were in denial or refused to seek services or additional help based on observations I had made and brought up but those parents are pretty rare and don't come along very often. Atleaset not in my experience so far.
I am sorry you have had to deal with so many clients that are so dishonest. I can see how that would make this job really hard.
__________________________________________________________
OP~ I understand that you feel lied to but unless this mom has had her child assessed AND diagnosed, she is only suspecting autism. It doesn't mean the child does have it. Like a PP said, his behavior could have to do with parental routines with discipline and family life. It could be due to something environmental or developmental too.
If I were you, I would personally just be honest with the parent and tell them you do not feel you have the ability to provide the type of care that the child requires. Whether that is due to simple behavior issues or autism doesn't matter....what matters is he is requiring MORE attention and care than what is considered normal for a 4 yr old and you are unable to do that.
It may force the parent to have her suspicions checked out. Either way, there is NOTHING wrong with saying you are just not equipped to deal with his needs. Don't make it about autism (as that could be considered discriminatory) just make it about his needs in general.
Good luck, this kind of thing is hard but good foryou for recognizing that this situation is just more than you want to deal with.
momofboys 07:21 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
Depends on how patient you are. Here is the deal, they have waited to long and personally you wait past three yrs of age for a lot of stuff it is almost too late to catch up. Early Childhood Intervention here in Texas is for 0-3yrs. And above that the school district helps. I would check into those services. At the end of the day the PARENT/Doctor has to request the help and evaluation, but you can find out the steps and let the parent know.
If you are willing you can do this. Have the children evaluated by ECI or school district. If they deem services are necessary they will come to daycare and provide therapy free of charge to the parent. That way you can learn how to work with the child and the child benefits from the therapy and is getting his needs addressed.
Autism or any of the other things that could be wrong are way out of the scope of skill set of most people even school teachers, there simply is not enough time to teach all of that stuff unless you are a behavior therapist, OT, ST etc. It is way more than just providing consistency. Our job as providers is to guide parents in the right direction when we feel something is off. Point them in the direction of people that can help their child and support them. You are just one part of the team.
Personally once you find the process and if there are resources I would have a sit down with the parents. Spell out that you do not appreciate them not being completely honest but as a condition of continuation of care you request that the child be evaluated and then in writing give them the steps. That you will fully support any onsite therapies and would be happy to continue working with the child on the days that the therapist is not there. If the parent refuses and says there is nothing wrong and tries to wing it. Drop them I have had to do that several times. Don't feel guilty about dropping them, look at the long range picture. If enough people are honest with the parents and refuse care unless they take advantage of services provided then maybe it will sink in their head that they need to address these issues with their child. It is your responsibility to provide a positive learning environment for all children. One can surely throw a wrench in things.
Sorry for the long post, just a lot to cover. Good luck
Depends on how patient you are. Here is the deal, they have waited to long and personally you wait past three yrs of age for a lot of stuff it is almost too late to catch up. Early Childhood Intervention here in Texas is for 0-3yrs. And above that the school district helps. I would check into those services. At the end of the day the PARENT/Doctor has to request the help and evaluation, but you can find out the steps and let the parent know.
If you are willing you can do this. Have the children evaluated by ECI or school district. If they deem services are necessary they will come to daycare and provide therapy free of charge to the parent. That way you can learn how to work with the child and the child benefits from the therapy and is getting his needs addressed.
Autism or any of the other things that could be wrong are way out of the scope of skill set of most people even school teachers, there simply is not enough time to teach all of that stuff unless you are a behavior therapist, OT, ST etc. It is way more than just providing consistency. Our job as providers is to guide parents in the right direction when we feel something is off. Point them in the direction of people that can help their child and support them. You are just one part of the team.
Personally once you find the process and if there are resources I would have a sit down with the parents. Spell out that you do not appreciate them not being completely honest but as a condition of continuation of care you request that the child be evaluated and then in writing give them the steps. That you will fully support any onsite therapies and would be happy to continue working with the child on the days that the therapist is not there. If the parent refuses and says there is nothing wrong and tries to wing it. Drop them I have had to do that several times. Don't feel guilty about dropping them, look at the long range picture. If enough people are honest with the parents and refuse care unless they take advantage of services provided then maybe it will sink in their head that they need to address these issues with their child. It is your responsibility to provide a positive learning environment for all children. One can surely throw a wrench in things.
Sorry for the long post, just a lot to cover. Good luck
thanks for advice, one issue is 1 parent works by my home - i am not located in the counry they LIVE in I actually live @ 45 min from their home
cheerfuldom 08:08 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme:
Supper Nanny the kids! Tantrums can go away with consistency. It's a just a thought...
I disagree. while things could be better with time and consistency, austistic or special needs kids are a whole different ball game. there is no reason why the OP should feel like she has to keep a child that is very delayed (from the sounds of it) and further, keep a family when the mom knew good and well that she was misrepresenting her childs needs. PLUS the younger one is quite demanding on their own. Supper Nanny the kids! Tantrums can go away with consistency. It's a just a thought...
I would term because even if this boy gets a diagnosis and services immediately, it could be months before a therapy plan is in place and before you see progress. I would let the mom know that you cannot meet her children's needs right now and your program is not the right fit. I would provide a print out of resources for free special needs evaluations (practically ever place in America has this type of service) and let her know that you recommend that she be up front with her next provider about what her kids will need while in daycare.
also, do you know why they were even looking for care? perhaps the kids already got kicked out of other places?
blessed mom 08:20 AM 02-07-2013
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
Wow! That is really a sad outlook on parents. It sounds as if you are pretty jaded based on maybe some bad experiences you have had, I don't know....but I would never make such a generalized sweeping statement that all parents with kids over 6 months lie to their providers.
I think the relationship you have with your clients has as much to do with you as it does them. If you set clear boundaries and expectations from the beginning there leaves little room for lying and dishonesty.
I also disagree with the statement that most parents are in denial about their child.
Most parents I have had in care are genuinely concerned about their child and his/her development. Most parents I have had in care form an honest open trusting relationship with me so that we can rest assured that we are both on the same page and doing what is best for the child.
I have had a few who were in denial or refused to seek services or additional help based on observations I had made and brought up but those parents are pretty rare and don't come along very often. Atleaset not in my experience so far.
I am sorry you have had to deal with so many clients that are so dishonest. I can see how that would make this job really hard.
__________________________________________________________
OP~ I understand that you feel lied to but unless this mom has had her child assessed AND diagnosed, she is only suspecting autism. It doesn't mean the child does have it. Like a PP said, his behavior could have to do with parental routines with discipline and family life. It could be due to something environmental or developmental too.
If I were you, I would personally just be honest with the parent and tell them you do not feel you have the ability to provide the type of care that the child requires. Whether that is due to simple behavior issues or autism doesn't matter....what matters is he is requiring MORE attention and care than what is considered normal for a 4 yr old and you are unable to do that.
It may force the parent to have her suspicions checked out. Either way, there is NOTHING wrong with saying you are just not equipped to deal with his needs. Don't make it about autism (as that could be considered discriminatory) just make it about his needs in general.
Good luck, this kind of thing is hard but good foryou for recognizing that this situation is just more than you want to deal with.
Agree...none of my parents have lied to me about their children, but I have a two week trial just in case.Wow!
That is really a sad outlook on parents. It sounds as if you are pretty jaded based on maybe some bad experiences you have had, I don't know....but I would never make such a generalized sweeping statement that all parents with kids over 6 months lie to their providers. I think the relationship you have with your clients has as much to do with you as it does them. If you set clear boundaries and expectations from the beginning there leaves little room for lying and dishonesty.
I also disagree with the statement that most parents are in denial about their child.
Most parents I have had in care are genuinely concerned about their child and his/her development. Most parents I have had in care form an honest open trusting relationship with me so that we can rest assured that we are both on the same page and doing what is best for the child.
I have had a few who were in denial or refused to seek services or additional help based on observations I had made and brought up but those parents are pretty rare and don't come along very often. Atleaset not in my experience so far.
I am sorry you have had to deal with so many clients that are so dishonest. I can see how that would make this job really hard.
__________________________________________________________
OP~ I understand that you feel lied to but unless this mom has had her child assessed AND diagnosed, she is only suspecting autism. It doesn't mean the child does have it. Like a PP said, his behavior could have to do with parental routines with discipline and family life. It could be due to something environmental or developmental too.
If I were you, I would personally just be honest with the parent and tell them you do not feel you have the ability to provide the type of care that the child requires. Whether that is due to simple behavior issues or autism doesn't matter....what matters is he is requiring MORE attention and care than what is considered normal for a 4 yr old and you are unable to do that.
It may force the parent to have her suspicions checked out. Either way, there is NOTHING wrong with saying you are just not equipped to deal with his needs. Don't make it about autism (as that could be considered discriminatory) just make it about his needs in general.
Good luck, this kind of thing is hard but good foryou for recognizing that this situation is just more than you want to deal with.