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sariejohnston 07:54 PM 11-12-2015
It's been a while since I posted in here.... I have a situation in my classroom that I need advice and some Tips! I talked to some co-workers and my director they are at a loss and don't know what to tell me.. Honestly I feel like they don't really care because they are not in that class so it's not their problem...


I have a rough Pre-K Class this year....I am usually in their only in the afternoons which isn't to bad but the rest of the month their teacher is out on medical leave and I am filling in for her, This is my first week and It has been HORRIBLE! to the point I go home in tears and I have a huge Migraine.

I have a little girl that thinks she runs the classroom... as soon as we sit down for Circle time she either refuses to sit with her friends on the carpet, or she grabs the 100 day star stickers out of the circle time basket.. She then always wants to grab my clip board and hold it, or take over someone's Job, she doesn't want to sit in her assigned table in the classroom, she refuses to stand inline, sit down on the wall when we stop by the bathroom, or go to the bathroom when it is time to go to the bathroom, she usually runs up and down the hall way which causes my other students to go crazy in the hallway because they see her, in the cafeteria she always wants to pass out the cups, plates and napkins even though it is someone else's Job to do that. When She is told No or asked to do something she doesn't want to do She throws tantrums, hits and kicks the other children. my problem is not that she wants to help I don't mind her being my helper but she has to understand that she is not in charge she needs to sit when everyone else sits, and stand inline when ever I ask her to get inline and she also needs to understand that the other children have Jobs and she can not always have a Job. I am not really sure what to do how to fix this issue I have tried talking to her about it, Talking to her parents and Nothing is working I feel Like I have to give in and let her do her thing or she is going to act up for me and start acting horrible!!


I have another Girl in my class who is New she refuses to do her work, she is always knocking her paper off on the floor, she throws tantrums all day long over silly things such as sitting down and doing her work, Getting In line, going to a specific Center. she is always kicking, hitting, name calling, sticking her tongue out the other girls, she runs around the room and crawls underneath the tables when she doesn't want to do something. Her mom is not a disciplinary, and actually her cousin and her hold babysitter became a new employee at the center... That has created all kinds of issues and problems because her cousin thinks she can step in and discipline her or give feedback to her parents on how her day is when she isn't even in my room it got to the point where her mom doesn't even talk to me she always goes to her to ask about her day and not me! It makes me mad! I always write in her folder how her day is and I always want to keep open communication between me and my parents I feel like this is a bad situation!



If you have any tips on how to handle these two girls Please Please Let me know I need all the advice I can get!! I'm going crazy and I feel completely Defeated!
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Michael 08:56 PM 11-12-2015
You shouldn't have to feel like you always need to fix the problem. This one sounds like a bad fit for your group. If the situation continues, the bad one will create contagious behavior with the others. I think the worst of the two needs to go. Is termination an option at your center? I am surprised the director hasn't taken more of a supportive role.
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Thriftylady 04:50 AM 11-13-2015
If the director won't be supportive, can you start calling her in to help fix it. Ask her to sit with the class and help with these two. Once it starts to affect her, you may find that she sees the light and helps work this out one way or another.
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Laurel 05:16 AM 11-13-2015
Originally Posted by sariejohnston:
It's been a while since I posted in here.... I have a situation in my classroom that I need advice and some Tips! I talked to some co-workers and my director they are at a loss and don't know what to tell me.. Honestly I feel like they don't really care because they are not in that class so it's not their problem...


I have a rough Pre-K Class this year....I am usually in their only in the afternoons which isn't to bad but the rest of the month their teacher is out on medical leave and I am filling in for her, This is my first week and It has been HORRIBLE! to the point I go home in tears and I have a huge Migraine.

I have a little girl that thinks she runs the classroom... as soon as we sit down for Circle time she either refuses to sit with her friends on the carpet, or she grabs the 100 day star stickers out of the circle time basket.. She then always wants to grab my clip board and hold it, or take over someone's Job, she doesn't want to sit in her assigned table in the classroom, she refuses to stand inline, sit down on the wall when we stop by the bathroom, or go to the bathroom when it is time to go to the bathroom, she usually runs up and down the hall way which causes my other students to go crazy in the hallway because they see her, in the cafeteria she always wants to pass out the cups, plates and napkins even though it is someone else's Job to do that. When She is told No or asked to do something she doesn't want to do She throws tantrums, hits and kicks the other children. my problem is not that she wants to help I don't mind her being my helper but she has to understand that she is not in charge she needs to sit when everyone else sits, and stand inline when ever I ask her to get inline and she also needs to understand that the other children have Jobs and she can not always have a Job. I am not really sure what to do how to fix this issue I have tried talking to her about it, Talking to her parents and Nothing is working I feel Like I have to give in and let her do her thing or she is going to act up for me and start acting horrible!!


I have another Girl in my class who is New she refuses to do her work, she is always knocking her paper off on the floor, she throws tantrums all day long over silly things such as sitting down and doing her work, Getting In line, going to a specific Center. she is always kicking, hitting, name calling, sticking her tongue out the other girls, she runs around the room and crawls underneath the tables when she doesn't want to do something. Her mom is not a disciplinary, and actually her cousin and her hold babysitter became a new employee at the center... That has created all kinds of issues and problems because her cousin thinks she can step in and discipline her or give feedback to her parents on how her day is when she isn't even in my room it got to the point where her mom doesn't even talk to me she always goes to her to ask about her day and not me! It makes me mad! I always write in her folder how her day is and I always want to keep open communication between me and my parents I feel like this is a bad situation!



If you have any tips on how to handle these two girls Please Please Let me know I need all the advice I can get!! I'm going crazy and I feel completely Defeated!
I agree with Michael but if that is not an option, I'll offer a few possibilities.

Can you send either child to sit in the office with the director when they get out of hand? That happens at my grandson's center.

Since she likes to help but won't sit in her seat or stay by the wall when in line, maybe make helping a privilege she can earn. I'm not sure how you decide who helps but you could base it on who follows directions. "I like how Susie is sitting in her seat nicely so Susie gets to pick a job to help me with today." Or maybe draw a huge hand (helping hands) and tack it up on the bulletin board. Outside the hand have each child's name written on a small piece of paper. For each thing you want them to do notice who is following directions and say "Oh I see Kenny and Joey and Amanda" stood nicely in the hall while we went to the restroom so I am moving their name to the Helping Hand." Then when it is time for someone to help, pick someone who has their name inside the hand. If she does get her name in the hand but later doesn't follow directions again you can remove it. If she does get her name in the hand I'd pick her pretty soon afterward to reinforce that it works. Hopefully she'll get the message that only those who follow directions get to help.

You could set aside a table and chair and tell her when you can see she is starting to have a meltdown that if she does that YOU will pick an activity and she must sit at the table alone and do ONLY that activity. She will have no choice of what to choose. When you feel she is ready to rejoin the group then and only then she can.

There is no excuse for a child to be able to hit and kick other children. I'd pull my child if someone in the class hit on a regular basis. It's not okay for the director to throw up her hands. It's her job for goodness sakes! I'd say "What would you like me to do when Susie does x, y, z?" Maybe she could come in the classroom and observe. Let her deal with it!

I might hint around about quitting and see what the reaction is.
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Laurel 05:17 AM 11-13-2015
Originally Posted by Thriftylady:
If the director won't be supportive, can you start calling her in to help fix it. Ask her to sit with the class and help with these two. Once it starts to affect her, you may find that she sees the light and helps work this out one way or another.


We must have been posting at the same time.
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Leigh 06:41 AM 11-13-2015
These kids are quite young to be expected to sit at a table and "work", or to sit on a rug for extended periods of time. What are your expectations as far as how long they need to sit in one spot (such as at a table)? Perhaps finding a way for this little one to work off some energy would help. Can she sit on a balance ball when she's at a table? Even stand at the table instead of sitting?

What do YOU do when she takes off in the hallway or grabs your stickers? How do you deal with that behavior?

How do you deal with tantrums? If you feed the tantrum, it keeps happening. Are you able to totally ignore a tantrum (at least when no one is getting hurt)?

When you say that you give in and let her have her way-that's the most telling thing here. Her behaviors are WORKING! Yay! If I'm a brat, I will eventually get what I want.

My overall opinion, however, is that these kids are too young for school, and they're not ready for it. I know it's out of your power to tell the parents to find them a place where they can play, but I think that you'll need to find a way for them to channel that energy into something positive. And, never never never reward a tantrum-it will lead to 1000 more tries when you let them win that game once. Could you pick up the child, saying NOTHING to them, and put them in a safe place or take them to the director's office? I'd just move them to the tantrum spot, saying only "looks like you need some time to cool off" and ignore.
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Laurel 08:08 AM 11-13-2015
Originally Posted by Leigh:
These kids are quite young to be expected to sit at a table and "work", or to sit on a rug for extended periods of time. What are your expectations as far as how long they need to sit in one spot (such as at a table)? Perhaps finding a way for this little one to work off some energy would help. Can she sit on a balance ball when she's at a table? Even stand at the table instead of sitting?

What do YOU do when she takes off in the hallway or grabs your stickers? How do you deal with that behavior?

How do you deal with tantrums? If you feed the tantrum, it keeps happening. Are you able to totally ignore a tantrum (at least when no one is getting hurt)?

When you say that you give in and let her have her way-that's the most telling thing here. Her behaviors are WORKING! Yay! If I'm a brat, I will eventually get what I want.

My overall opinion, however, is that these kids are too young for school, and they're not ready for it. I know it's out of your power to tell the parents to find them a place where they can play, but I think that you'll need to find a way for them to channel that energy into something positive. And, never never never reward a tantrum-it will lead to 1000 more tries when you let them win that game once. Could you pick up the child, saying NOTHING to them, and put them in a safe place or take them to the director's office? I'd just move them to the tantrum spot, saying only "looks like you need some time to cool off" and ignore.
This is also true. Preschoolers just don't sit very long. My daughter's kindergarten teacher used to randomly include physical things during the day. Like everyone stand up and jump up and down and then sit back down.

OP, you could also make circle time as active as possible. Children like silly things. A follow the leader game can be done in place. How about having a little bell and when it rings, everyone must freeze for a moment of calm when the classroom gets noisy. Turn out the lights. Play soft music. Just mix it up.

Are parent/grandparent volunteers allowed or teens working for credit in community service for their high school graduation requirements? (ours have to do that) I had a high school neighbor come in a few hours a day, a few days a week at my busiest time and just knowing she was coming just made me feel great. OP, you shouldn't be getting migraines. So sorry you are.
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Josiegirl 09:34 AM 11-13-2015
How many kids in your room and how many adults? Please tell me you have assistants with you?
Maybe you could divide and conquer with your assistants? If not, then I like the idea of sending the 1 or 2 challenging kids to sit with the director.
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sariejohnston 03:00 AM 11-19-2015
How many kids are in my room I have 15 when every one is there I can have 18 by myself.... At the moment I am by myself. It's a little stressful not only do i have these two kids to deal with but I have some other ones that like to cuss, hit, kick, yell and scream, run around the room.

... To answer everyone's questions here They are 4 and 5 year old's, I change things up daily for circle time I have them sit in their chairs one day, the next day they might be sitting on the circle time rug, I also have them stand up during parts of circle time and move around. I like to keep it short because I don't expect them to sit for a long time just listening to me talk. Each child as a assigned Job that they do during the day and we change the jobs every day.

at the center I work at there is a lot of sitting around that has been the problem I have had with he place since I started... During classroom centers, circle time, at lunch, bathroom breaks ( we don't have bathrooms in the classroom), during work time their regular teacher piles on the work she usually gives them 5 worksheets. I have made a lot of changes so we can decrease the sitting time and get these kids moving because I think that is why they cause so many problems well some of it since their teacher is out I have cut down on the work sheets only giving them 2 to 3 a day. We do some learning games, hands on activities, brain breaks (dancing and singing) we go outside in the morning and afternoon, center time. I have been lacking on learning games something I am going to pick back up to see if that helps! I don't expect these kids to sit or even be perfect but respectful, listening and following rules I do expect because they do it for their regular teacher they can do it for me too! Hopefully that answers all the questions.

I have told my director that having these two together stresses me out because they don't listen to me, her solution was pulling one out and putting her in another classroom... that helped and that little girl had a wonderful two days for that teacher, but I have to be honest by putting her in another classroom although that did help me not feel so stressed out and overwhelmed, I don't think this is going to teacher the child that she has to listen, respect and follow the classroom rules no matter who her teacher is. I think she is going to see it as she can act out and then she gets to go to a new classroom she is the type to abuse something to get her way I've seen it down before. I honestly feel like my director doesn't care because she views it as not her problem because she is not in the classroom with these kids, so It took me a long time to say anything because I didn't feel like I had any support. kicking a student out is not a option at this center, we have a rep of getting the bad students from other centers and we keep them... they have never kicked a student out and I've seen some dangerous situations where I would have done something about it but It just doesn't happen at this center.
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sariejohnston 03:23 AM 11-19-2015
we don't have any volunteer work, we accept it but we just don't have any and none of are parents want to help us out.
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Josiegirl 03:25 AM 11-19-2015
BlackCat had a method she suggested when dcks became very competitive, etc. Highly praise one that's being patient, waiting their turn, being the helper, and ignore the one who's being *ahem* naughty. Most of the problems(at least in my home dc) stem from lack of attention. Negative attention is better than no attention so maybe these kids would work harder for the praise if they get nowhere by acting up? I'm sure BC can explain it a lot better.
I'm not big on reward charts anymore(I used to use them to get us through a sticky time and back into the normal groove of things)but maybe that's something that might work?
I don't know, it sounds like you've got your hands full. That's an age filled with testing and if your center gets all the challenging kids, refusing to let them go, good luck!!
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auntymimi 04:39 AM 11-19-2015
That sounds terrible! I agree with some of the other posters that the centers program may not be developmentally appropriate for children of that age group. I have no advice but tons of sympathy for you.
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Febby 07:19 PM 11-19-2015
Well, I know that personally I wouldn't work for a director who I feel like doesn't care. BTDT and I'm over it. If I'm going to work as part of someone else's program, then I need to be a good fit for it just like the children should be good fits for the program. If not, then everyone is miserable.

That said, would it be possible for someone to help you during the most difficult times of day, at the least? Such as when you're doing bathroom breaks or serving lunch or whatever is hardest?

When I'm asking my director (or co-workers) for advice, I'll usually ask them what they would do in a specific situation. So rather than "How would you fix my class?" I'd ask "What would/do you do when Susie grabs the stickers from the circle time basket?"

As far as refusing to do work, is it possible that the child is frustrated by it? My room doesn't normally use worksheets, but we'll do a few right before school starts to teach them how to do worksheets and there's always a couple that will have trouble with them and will get frustrated without teacher intervention. Do you do them as large group or small group activities?

Give negative behavior as little attention as possible. Completely ignore it if you can. (Obviously intervene if safety is an issue!) Praise, praise, praise positive behavior. Specific praise, not a generic "Good job!"

I don't generally like behavior/sticker charts, but it might be worth trying.
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kendallina 10:44 AM 11-20-2015
18 4-5 year olds and only one teacher?? Oh my! That's insane, I'm so sorry. I don't have much advice, maybe when I pick my jaw up off the floor...
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sariejohnston 05:19 AM 11-23-2015
Thanks everyone for the advice! It's a big challenge with this group of kids! One thing I've realized and I'm working on is they all have to learn respect, kindness and Listening Skills that's hard to do! I'm coming up with different activities and Hands on approaches to daily work. I have three more days in the class then their teacher will be back after thanksgiving so yay! But I'm still going to be working with them in the afternoons and whenever she isn't there.. So I'm coming up with stuff maybe she can do with them and that way When I come in their in the afternoons or when she is gone They will know what to expect.. we will see... I really think the problem is she gives them a like 5 to 6 work sheets usually and I have to cut it down to 3 work sheets and try to find hands on activities to go along with what they are learning about because the worksheets and them sitting for a long time makes them stir crazy! (by the way for the work sheets We do some as a large group and some they are very independent and want to do them by themselves the ones that have a hard time with it I go around and help them) anyway thanks for advice.
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sariejohnston 07:05 AM 11-29-2015
Turns out I have another week in that classroom... Kinda upset that no one told me until last min but My goal for the last week is to really teach them about kindness, loving one another....
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Unregistered 01:58 PM 11-29-2015
Try to be preemptive. Give her a job before hand. She can be the door holder at your destination if she stays in line on the way there. If circle time is a problem. Give her a job such as "wiping down the tables with a damp sponge" during circle time. Sure she will miss circle time but the rest of them will have it uninterupted hopefully.
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Laurel 12:41 PM 11-30-2015
Originally Posted by kendallina:
18 4-5 year olds and only one teacher?? Oh my! That's insane, I'm so sorry. I don't have much advice, maybe when I pick my jaw up off the floor...
I think THAT is the real problem. I wouldn't watch 18, 4-5 year olds by myself on my best day! It actually sounds illegal.
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Silly Songs 01:54 PM 11-30-2015
Unfortunately it's not illegal. I have 16 in my class.
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Febby 06:10 PM 12-01-2015
Originally Posted by Laurel:
I think THAT is the real problem. I wouldn't watch 18, 4-5 year olds by myself on my best day! It actually sounds illegal.
Texas has high ratios. I've worked for some pretty bad centers in the past and the number of children I've had by myself is absolutely horrifying. Worst I was ever left with would probably be the 16 infants (all under 1 year, state ratio is 5!) a center left me with for about an hour. I'm convinced that's why infant rooms stress me out so much.

Hope this week is going better. I know it takes a while to get a group's behavior "fixed" and the long weekend probably didn't help. Unless your center wasn't closed.
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Tags:backbone - not, manipulative behavior, need - support
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