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  #1  
Old 07-28-2016, 10:39 AM
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I'm about to lose it with my little boy. He is 4 and he's about a month away from being moved to the pre-k class in his daycare center. He's with a lot of kids much younger than him at the moment and I honestly feel like he's matured out of the classroom, but they won't move him until the kindergartners start in the fall.

A child got upset with my son because he thought he heard him say a bad word (poop) when he actually said "I can't carry both". I 100% trust that this was the case given the context of the situation, not that he's an angel, but he doesn't use bad words and only talks about poop in the bathroom.

Well, my kid flipped, and lunged at the other child with both hands and "clawed" at his face, squeezed his cheeks with his fingernails. Another teacher had to tell me second-hand about it when I arrived to pick him up, but stated that he was so mad that his hands were shaking as he clawed his face. My child was told to take a time out, he refused and started attacking the teacher, another teacher had to get involved a physically put him in time out.

The other child wasn't hurt, but obviously this needs addressing.

We talked about how he need to use his words (he combated with the fact that he told him several times that he did NOT say poop, but the child kept saying over and over that he did) and how he needs to walk away (he couldn't because the class was lining up to get their mats for nap time) and how we can never resort to touching/hitting/grabbing.

He wrote letters to his teacher (sorry for being mean to the boy and for not listening to teacher) and to the boy (sorry for being mean). I made him do it 100% on his own, only telling him how to spell the words he wanted to write. He sealed them in envelopes and he told me he would apologize to his teacher and the boy and give them the letter.

When we got to class today he was acting out again. He was grabbing on to me, physically trying to make me stay with him. He wouldn't look at his teacher. I don't know what happened to his letters. I am so disappointed in him and in myself. What can I do to make this right? I really feel defeated, I thought everything was going to be better this morning.

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Old 07-28-2016, 10:57 AM
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Imagine you were forced to live in MTV'S house with six 18 years olds. You have to share everything, nothing in the house actually belongs to you. You want to please your husband, who wants you to finish this 12 month show. How long would it be until you snapped?

Sounds like DS is in an environment that is actually doing him more harm than good.

Sorry for blunt. It's hot and we just came in from water play. I am a bit worn out.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:02 AM
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I guarantee he was embarrassed this morning.

Is there an area where he can be away from the younger kids? Mixed age groups are often blamed, but I don't always agree with that as long as he has a chance to act his own age.

Where was the teacher? I am assuming there was a steady escalation before your son snapped. Kids often yell, say no, stop, etc before resorting to violence.

I would reward for good behavior at the end of the day (watching a show before dinner, going to the playground, etc) AND at that age I would remove something for poor behavior- losing tv time, playground, etc.

also- thank you for trying to support his teacher! That means the WORLD to us!
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:07 AM
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Where was the teacher? I am assuming there was a steady escalation before your son snapped. Kids often yell, say no, stop, etc before resorting to violence.
This was my over all concern as well.

DS has to be able to get away from these kids when he needs a break. Someone should have noticed he really needed one (a break) and intervened.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:18 AM
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The students were lined up getting their mats, I imagine his teacher would have been at the front of the line handing out mats as the kids got up front.

I agree that there was an escalation before he snapped.

Maybe I shouldn't have had him apologize first thing but let him do it on his own time?

Right now this is his class, it's not considered mixed age group, it is the 3-4year group and then there is a 4-5year group. He is 4 and a half. There are a couple of other kids in the same situation (about to move to the next class at the end of August)......but the children he considers his friends are all going to kindergarten this year. He does better with an older group. There are still kids who pee/poop their pants in his class.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:22 AM
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I don't want to place blame on the teacher, I'd rather use it as a learning opportunity. He was violent when he needed to use a different outlet.

I don't want to make excuses for him. I just want him to own up to it and do better next time.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:30 AM
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All while trying to keep in mind that he is only four...
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:47 AM
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I think it's great that you want to be proactive. The cheek scratching incident sounds pretty serious. It seems like your son is really struggling in his environment. At his age hopefully he can have some understanding of you have an open dialogue with him about his feelings and expected behaviour. I suggest keeping the topic open, discuss it often and validate the feelings he is having too. I agree the teacher should have been keeping a closer eye, he likely built up to that point and didn't jut start off o angry.

My own 4yo was having a very difficult time recently in my home daycare. What has helped is really making sure we have some one on one time, complimenting him when he has good/kind behaviour and talking about his feelings and what's going on in his world. I think a small reward for good behaviour will help and possibly a count down calendar until he gets to go to th big kids room.

For what it's worth, I don't view a "good daycare parent" as one who gets their kid to stop any negative behaviours immediately. A good daycare parent listen to the concern, doesn't place blame elsewhere and try's to proactively improve the behaviour. Those are all things your doing. It's taken a lot of effort by my son is improving and I'm sure yours can too.
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Old 07-28-2016, 12:00 PM
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It really is not about blame. Simply a fact. The teacher will probably tell you that, as well.

Because I am out here in the virtual world, I can see that the only people who have the power to change this situation for your DS are the three adults (you + two teachers) who are putting the full onus on the child (time outs, apologies, letter writing).

It is honorable you want your son to be responsible for his actions, but going from no history of violence to something so extreme is a cry for help. This does not read like a tantrum and he is not 6.

IMHE, The reaction your son had was a clear sign, DS is too stressed in that environment or with that schedule. That does not mean it can't be corrected. His teachers will know exactly what to do. Small group time, individual time and large group time. Physical exercise, good food and rest.

I would talk more with the actual teacher instead of a secondhand story before doing anything else.
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Old 07-28-2016, 12:31 PM
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I agree that you need to talk to the teacher. I am not going to give your DS a free pass at all, but at his age he needs to be learning how to handle his anger, so he needs help learning that. I would want to know from the teacher have other less severe things been going on? How often is there an issue? Is it always with one child or with several? A certain time of day each time? I guess what I am saying is see if there is any pattern. That may help you and the teacher figure it out. If there is no pattern and this was truly a one time thing, then maybe you are over thinking it?
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Old 07-28-2016, 01:56 PM
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He has had several bouts of "not listening" lately, but never anything like this. He tends to get very upset (at home, too) when he feels that someone is not listening to (agreeing with) him.

He will argue with anything he doesn't agree with. I'd go to a point of saying he is an excessive arguer/negotiator and extremely articulate and good at it.

So while figuring ways to stop violent acts with him is good. Stopping him from feeling like no one is listening to him just because he doesn't agree is going to be more proactive. Just talking out loud. Thanks for brainstorming with me!
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Old 07-28-2016, 03:23 PM
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I believe your son is in a program that is not doing him any good. In my opinion, the teachers did not handle the original conflict well and it resulted in a child getting physically hurt and your son (and the other child) getting no guidance to how to manage a conflict better next time. The whole point of this environment is to develop social/emotional skills, right? Or what? What is he there for? If you want him to develop social/emotional skills, one of those (a big one) is conflict resolution and communication. The following links may be helpful to you and are methods that a good teacher should be using (in my opinion). Might I ask what education or experience the teacher has, that was there during the conflict? No, it may not mean everything, but it sounds like she can't safely manage a classroom or teach social/emotional skills.

http://www.janetlansbury.com/2010/04...-9-guidelines/

http://www.naeyc.org/files/yc/file/2...uidanceBTJ.pdf
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Old 07-28-2016, 04:03 PM
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She is in her mid-fifties and has been working with children for 3 decades. I honestly have a ton of respect for her, she works part time in my son's daycare center during the school year (she is also a head-start teacher) and full time in the summer.

I will definitely take a look at those links.

I really believe he has learned a lot of those skills from being in a daycare setting and that this was out of the norm for him to act this way, and I definitely try to sympathize with him, as he was accused of something that I know he did not do by another student and no one had his back.
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Old 07-28-2016, 05:01 PM
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I would wonder when was her most recent classes in ECE and why doesn't she work there full time during the year. Think about it- summer is second string staff at centers. Its true. The other teachers wanted time off, they gave the part timers their shifts. Why isn't she full time? She works at heard start? Is she a lead teacher or an assistant? Part time there? Why? I've worked at a few centers and fccs. I know what goes on. Parents don't realize. Hopefully she is great and this is a totally random tangent. But, it sounds like she has a hard time with conflict resolution and guidance if she is talking about time outs, letters and apologies when it isn't developmentally appropriate. I don't want to offend you or put her down. I guess I'm just trying to respond and this is the way it looks from my POV. In my opinion, I wouldn't feel comfortable having my own children in that environment. But every parent does things differently and has different expectations.
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Old 07-28-2016, 05:06 PM
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I thought the mother orchestrated the letters and apologies.

"I made him do it 100% on his own, only telling him how to spell the words he wanted to write."
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Old 07-28-2016, 05:35 PM
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Yes. You are right. Mom said to 'use your words' which doesn't really help. Children need you to just model the words right in front of them at the time of the incident and I guess we'll never know if that happened. Also 'walk away' doesn't really help because his entire upset was about not being heard. Walking away doesn't meet his need to be heard. What did- attacking the poor other guy! The teacher should have given him a platform to speak- before the physical attacking started. And we all make mistakes, so sure, maybe she missed the chance before hand. Did he ever get to say what he wanted? Did the otherboy get to speak? I guess we don't have enough details since we weren't there. But maybe if the actual teacher that was there tells you (mom) what went down in front of her, you'll know better how to respond to it.
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Old 07-29-2016, 08:50 AM
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I would wonder when was her most recent classes in ECE and why doesn't she work there full time during the year. Think about it- summer is second string staff at centers. Its true. The other teachers wanted time off, they gave the part timers their shifts. Why isn't she full time? She works at heard start? Is she a lead teacher or an assistant? Part time there? Why? I've worked at a few centers and fccs. I know what goes on. Parents don't realize. Hopefully she is great and this is a totally random tangent. But, it sounds like she has a hard time with conflict resolution and guidance if she is talking about time outs, letters and apologies when it isn't developmentally appropriate. I don't want to offend you or put her down. I guess I'm just trying to respond and this is the way it looks from my POV. In my opinion, I wouldn't feel comfortable having my own children in that environment. But every parent does things differently and has different expectations.
She is a lead teacher at head start. She works part time at the center and full time at head start. She's not picking up shifts from other teachers during the summer. She is in his classroom, full time from 6:30-4:00, as his teacher, this summer.

Head start is her priority; during the school year she works the evening shift and comes in after she does head start and works at the center until they close, she's been doing this for years according to the director (who would love to have her full time at the center). She already knows the kids, from working with them for those few hours in the evening. She really truly is a great lady. It definitely sounds like she missed her chance to intervene.

The letter/apology thing had nothing to do with his teacher. That was me, maybe not appropriate, I don't know. I really didn't know what to do. It seemed appropriate, maybe not for a typical 4 year old, but for a boy who can spell/read/write several words, it seemed appropriate to me. He's my oldest/first kid and I'm just trying to do my best.

He came home yesterday with this elaborate story of a boy who accused him of something minor (coloring on his page). He tells me "I told him I didn't do that, and then I told him again, and he still said I did, so I walked away and I didn't even hit him" So perhaps he learned, he had a lot of pride when he told me that he just walked away.

Adults and other kids don't always listen to him. He ALWAYS wants the floor. We are working with him to learn that sometimes he needs to let other people talk first and then he can have his turn. He is constantly talking over people and interrupting. Trust me, we have been working on it.

He has definitely had some aversions to the center though in the recent past, there's certain kids who just really bug him, but that's life. I work with people who really bug me, too

I talked to her and her story was the same one I got when I picked him up that day: The "bad word", then the attack, then he had to be restrained by a second because he was fighting his teacher so hard. She showed me where it happened and where she was and she was within ear shot and should have intervened. I'm sure she didn't think it would escalate since he's never done anything like that before.

He was so worked up over getting accused of something he hadn't done. It comes back to home though, my son is not getting enough sleep (we are talking about seeing a specialist because even though he is in bed at a decent hour, he lays there for sometimes 3+ hours before he is asleep at 11pm/midnight), he is so much better at controlling his emotions when he's had enough sleep, but he has such a difficult time falling asleep. His mind just races and he worries about things his little 4 year old mind shouldn't be worrying about.

I'm sad and embarrassed.
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Old 07-29-2016, 09:07 AM
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I'm sorry to hear you are sad and embarrassed to be going through this. Who called "poop" a bad word? Everything you are saying just tells me the teacher is at fault. Sleep or not. I have seen quality programs and the teachers know how to handle conflict and at such programs I have never seen a child have to be restrained. I have also seen programs where the teachers do not know what they are doing and there, I have seen teachers holding physically, onto children. In some extreme case, I'm sure it could be necessary- I highly doubt this is that. Just change programs already. Once you do, I bet you will be so happy. But find a good one. I meant it when I asked what is the purpose of his being there- at that program. Is it childcare because you are at work and there is no where else possible? Are you choosing this place for his enrichment? It doesn't sound like a good place for your son. Did you look at the links I gave?
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Old 07-29-2016, 09:24 AM
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I'm sorry to hear you are sad and embarrassed to be going through this. Who called "poop" a bad word? Everything you are saying just tells me the teacher is at fault. Sleep or not. I have seen quality programs and the teachers know how to handle conflict and at such programs I have never seen a child have to be restrained. I have also seen programs where the teachers do not know what they are doing and there, I have seen teachers holding physically, onto children. In some extreme case, I'm sure it could be necessary- I highly doubt this is that. Just change programs already. Once you do, I bet you will be so happy. But find a good one. I meant it when I asked what is the purpose of his being there- at that program. Is it childcare because you are at work and there is no where else possible? Are you choosing this place for his enrichment? It doesn't sound like a good place for your son. Did you look at the links I gave?
We use the word poop at my DC, so I don't see that as a bad word. But, if the child was hitting and kicking the teacher, I can Understand why the child was restrained by someone. I would never allow a child to hit me for any reason.
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Old 07-29-2016, 09:42 AM
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Just change programs already. Once you do, I bet you will be so happy. But find a good one. I meant it when I asked what is the purpose of his being there- at that program. Is it childcare because you are at work and there is no where else possible? Are you choosing this place for his enrichment? It doesn't sound like a good place for your son. Did you look at the links I gave?
Thank you, yes I did. It is because I work, he came from a home daycare and she was incredible. I keep him there for stability, and because it is comfortable (read, lazy). Thanks for the kick. I will look at other local programs.

It was a 3 year old who said "poop" was a bad word. DC center has a rule the poop is only to be said in the bathroom (at least that's what my son told me).
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Old 07-29-2016, 09:56 AM
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But why would it have ever gotten to that point? There are extreme cases where a child has these issues and I have faced some difficult kids- one I worked with had a diagnosed explosive whatever disorder a million years ago. But this is a typically developing 4 year old who has never had such issues. Ok so he is a little cranky from a lack of sleep. But I think this environment is the obvious problem. It seems obvious from my POV. Mom thinks he stays up at night from worry and stress well, where is that coming from? Why can he write letters of apology? Does he get a chance to free play, child directed, for good long stretches of time? Does he have competent leaders teaching him how to communicate and cooperate and negotiate with peers? Mom, have you LOOKED at any other programs? Programs that are playbased, with plenty of outside time? I bet if you go see one or two, your outlook will change. 'problem' children are created when they are placed in situations that they cannot preform what is asked. Put him in a situation where he can be successful and just see how happy you both can be. When I said 'inappropriate' I didn't mean 'socially bad' like when someone will say something like 'fart jokes are inappropriate' lol. I meant developmentally it is not what his mind and body can do. He needs a developmentally appropriate program. It's also a buzz word. Programs love to use the words "developmentally appropriate" when they are completely not. Real developmentally appropriate for your 4 year old is child directed (teachers didn't direct the way they play), free play, outdoors. I might sound extreme on this spectrum, I understand that. It is because the children need it and the adults need to hear it. Too many programs rob children of this basic need - in the name of education. It literally ruins the child's educational development. Research Peter Gray. He has a lot to say on the subject. He links the increase in teen suicide and depression to lack of free play in early childhood. I would love to hear back from you, Mom. I am truly curious if this teacher is really the 'lead' at the other program and if she has a recent ECE class at all. And I would love to know if you go look at 2, at least 2, New programs that are play based and what your reactions to those are. Find true factual answers not what the director says off handedly in an intentionally misleading way. I know you don't want to believe it, but the director has a business to run and she will vaguely say what she has to if it keeps parents happy. She isn't lying if she says 'i believe' she is the lead, etc.
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Old 07-29-2016, 10:16 AM
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I am currently looking at other programs.

This program definitely isn't academic based. The curriculum isn't advanced at all, they teach age appropriate stuff. He is very bright and learned how to write at home, but he is not academically challenged at all at preschool (which is fine by me, but maybe I'm too passive), the outdoor and indoor play areas are the biggest reason I chose this center in the first place. They have a great outdoor area. They play outside 4 times per day (length of time is dependent on the weather) up to 40 minutes, they have nap time, indoor play time, circle time (teacher reads to them), and then they do a few basic work sheets/coloring pages, projects with cutting/glue/playdoh/painting. The kids have a lot of independence in how they play as well.

I just wish he was able to play with older kids. He clashes with 3 year olds, haha.
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Old 07-29-2016, 10:55 AM
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I am currently looking at other programs.

This program definitely isn't academic based. The curriculum isn't advanced at all, they teach age appropriate stuff. He is very bright and learned how to write at home, but he is not academically challenged at all at preschool (which is fine by me, but maybe I'm too passive), the outdoor and indoor play areas are the biggest reason I chose this center in the first place. They have a great outdoor area. They play outside 4 times per day (length of time is dependent on the weather) up to 40 minutes, they have nap time, indoor play time, circle time (teacher reads to them), and then they do a few basic work sheets/coloring pages, projects with cutting/glue/playdoh/painting. The kids have a lot of independence in how they play as well.

I just wish he was able to play with older kids. He clashes with 3 year olds, haha.
Your son sounds very similar to mine, he's 5 and the oldest here. He has just now started to turn a corner with removing himself from a situation with younger kids when he gets frustrated with them. Keep at it, he'll get there too. Honestly, it sounds like you're a great mom It stinks when our kids do things like this, but hes got you and what sounds like some good teachers to help him through it. And if you do stay, it's not too much longer until he be with the older kids.
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Old 07-29-2016, 11:36 AM
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Honestly, it sounds like you're a great mom It stinks when our kids do things like this, but hes got you and what sounds like some good teachers to help him through it. And if you do stay, it's not too much longer until he be with the older kids.
Thank you!

He really knows better than to be mean to other people. We need to work on his short temper and we all need to listen to him better.

I don't even know how to look for a program. All I feel like I am looking at is places. How do you get to know a program in just an interview?
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Old 07-29-2016, 11:39 AM
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How do you get to know a program in just an interview?
I am not sure... I would guess maybe talk to other families that attend, ask to volunteer as a classroom helper or volunteer maybe...

I would think that current and past families would be the best source of what a parent's experience is for that program.

Otherwise, it seems it is just an endless string of trial periods... I'm sorry I wish I had better advice.
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Old 07-29-2016, 11:55 AM
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It's hard.

I know Montessori programs are well known for being "good" and a local one has great parent reviews, but I don't know how well he'd do with the multi-aged thing -- except he has a baby brother that he loves and adores and I also think it'd be hard to separate them.
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Old 07-29-2016, 12:18 PM
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I am currently looking at other programs.

This program definitely isn't academic based. The curriculum isn't advanced at all, they teach age appropriate stuff. He is very bright and learned how to write at home, but he is not academically challenged at all at preschool (which is fine by me, but maybe I'm too passive), the outdoor and indoor play areas are the biggest reason I chose this center in the first place. They have a great outdoor area. They play outside 4 times per day (length of time is dependent on the weather) up to 40 minutes, they have nap time, indoor play time, circle time (teacher reads to them), and then they do a few basic work sheets/coloring pages, projects with cutting/glue/playdoh/painting. The kids have a lot of independence in how they play as well.

I just wish he was able to play with older kids. He clashes with 3 year olds, haha.
I must be missing something because I don't see where the program He's in is a bad program?

My nephew is the same way as you described your son. Incredibly intelligent, very articulate, active, and sometimes can have a short temper. He's 6 now and In school full time. His birthday is in late September and in our state, he was past the cut off when the kids can start kindergarten. His daycare friends all left for school and he was the only one left with the 3-4 year olds (he was 5). He struggled at first. There were usually warning signs that he was getting upset and I needed to intervene.

I do believe the teacher missed the warning signs from your little guy. The fact that a second teacher had to be called to help to restrain him tells me that by the time they intervened your poor little guy had lost all control in the situation and didn't know how to behave.

I would talk to the teacher to come up with a plan on what to do when he's feeling overwhelmed. He has already told you how he handled a similar situation differently and that's great. I would also see if the teacher can give him extra responsibility since he will be transferring to the other class in a few weeks anyway. I would put my nephew in charge of writing the names on the parents daily sheets in the morning, he loved doing laundry so he was in charge of gathering the daycare laundry, he also loved to set the table during meals. It was simple things that helped remind him that yes he is older but he can still play and have fun with the 'littles'as he called them.

Good luck! I think you're an amazing mom from what you e said on here. And totally random but I once had my 5 year old daughter draw a card for her kindergarten teacher after she had a difficult day with not listening.
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Old 07-29-2016, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by sahm1225 View Post
I must be missing something because I don't see where the program He's in is a bad program?

My nephew is the same way as you described your son. Incredibly intelligent, very articulate, active, and sometimes can have a short temper. He's 6 now and In school full time. His birthday is in late September and in our state, he was past the cut off when the kids can start kindergarten. His daycare friends all left for school and he was the only one left with the 3-4 year olds (he was 5). He struggled at first. There were usually warning signs that he was getting upset and I needed to intervene.

I do believe the teacher missed the warning signs from your little guy. The fact that a second teacher had to be called to help to restrain him tells me that by the time they intervened your poor little guy had lost all control in the situation and didn't know how to behave.

I would talk to the teacher to come up with a plan on what to do when he's feeling overwhelmed. He has already told you how he handled a similar situation differently and that's great. I would also see if the teacher can give him extra responsibility since he will be transferring to the other class in a few weeks anyway. I would put my nephew in charge of writing the names on the parents daily sheets in the morning, he loved doing laundry so he was in charge of gathering the daycare laundry, he also loved to set the table during meals. It was simple things that helped remind him that yes he is older but he can still play and have fun with the 'littles'as he called them.

Good luck! I think you're an amazing mom from what you e said on here. And totally random but I once had my 5 year old daughter draw a card for her kindergarten teacher after she had a difficult day with not listening.
Well all of this made me tear up. Thank you. I am trying to teach him also that he doesn't have to be friends with everyone, but he does have to be nice to everyone.

I really look forward to him being moved to the next level class. The teacher in that class (is actually the one who was asked to help in this situation as well as the teacher who talked to me at pick up the day it occurred) has been his favorite since he started at this daycare center a year ago. He always talked about her, before I had even met her, finally when I did it was like 'OOOOH, YOU'RE MISS B! My son tells me you are his favorite teacher" -- she said it was funny because she hadn't worked with him very often. He knows that he will be moving to her class soon and is very excited about it.

I actually thought about seeing if there was a way for him to start Kindergarten this year. I think he would excel but my research tells me no school in the county would accept a 4 year old with a March birthday. Plus he is on the extreme small side, he'd look pretty silly in kindergarten (he is only 36" tall and wears size 18-24m or 2T clothes and size 7 shoes).
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Old 08-02-2016, 12:25 PM
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Daycare has acknowledged that he needs to be moved to the next level. They say they can not officially move him until the school year starts on Aug 29th.

That isn't too far off.

His teacher apologized that she didn't catch the incident sooner. I had a chance to talk to her more in depth about it yesterday and she said "sometimes these things just happen once and they learn from it the first time"

I think that was the case, but she also says that he hasn't been listening as well as he could. We are working on that =)
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Old 08-02-2016, 11:51 PM
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What is he not listening about? Any examples?
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Old 08-03-2016, 09:44 AM
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"Come on out of the car"
"I want to go out a different door"
"Nope, this is the door that I have opened for you"
*climbs over and into the front seat* "I want YOUR door"


"Put your shoes on"
*doesn't acknowledge that I've asked him*
"come on, bud, it's time to put your shoes on"
"after I finish...."
"no, it's time to put your shoes on"
"well, if I put my shoes on can I get a snack?"

Just every day things, he doesn't listen.
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Old 08-03-2016, 09:45 AM
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These are at home examples by the way. I know at daycare he delays nap time (sometimes by nearly an hour).
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Old 08-03-2016, 01:51 PM
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Hi again! Your examples sound like totally normal testing, and exploring autonomy. The teacher should not have a difficult time with that at all. I mean it really should be easy and automatic for her to respond to situations like that and she should know it's developmentally appropriate and completely expected! It's very strange that she is complaining about him not listening. It's like a kindergarten teacher complaining the student doesn't know division. This is what he is learning- to contribute to the social group, to cooperate, and also be is developing independence and autonomy so he will want to make his own decisions. As his adults, we would do best do let him make as many decisions for himself as we can (which door do you want to climb out). In addition to learning social expectations AND developing his own autonomy, he will test limits because that is what children (and teens) do to find out the boundries. Set firm boundaries (the teacher should know how and shouldn't have any problem doing this and should expect to do this all day, everyday). Firm boundaries are best placed on safety (keep people, things and self safe- emotionally and physically as Black Cat mentioned recently in a nearby post!). So, the shoes example: "time for shoes" "no." which shoes do you want to wear, these or these" "none" (now you decide if shoes are a must for this outing yes or no, if yes for safety then you must intervene, if no then let it go) "well, you have to wear shoes because the gravel will cut your feet. I take care of you and I won't let you cut your feet on the gravel. So, you can pick a pair of shoes or I can pick a pair and put them on you. What do you choose?" etc etc!
This is a short article (as well as useful information from the author in the comments section) on testing, autonomy, choices, testing and saying "NO".
http://www.janetlansbury.com/2011/07...ddlers-say-no/
In a play based program, he would have free choice to explore, create and develop and would not need to be forced to do any crafts, worksheets, etc and would therefore not have demands of "listening" to directions for no real purpose. Truly, again I ask what is the purpose of his attendance in that program? Enrichment, that isn't enriching. And play based programs have more than 40 min stretches of free play. I'm trying to tell you, the problem here is not your child! If you look at ONE just one play based program, I bet you'll love it.
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Old 08-03-2016, 03:33 PM
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My husband and I work full time M-F.

I have two children in daycare from 8:30 to 5:15, 5 days a week.

Honestly I think he benefits from the structured program. All of these links you have provided are talking about little 2 year old children. We definitely use choices and consequences and are consistent. His biggest trouble is sleeping (going to bed and taking a nap), he can lay for hours before falling asleep and this is where he generally is "not listening" at school. Not wanting to take a nap, not being still and quiet, etc.

We have talked a lot on how to be the teachers helper and how he can always help by doing what is asked of him. He is very bright, argumentative and always pushing limits
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Old 08-03-2016, 04:00 PM
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Well, sounds like you are happy with the outcome. That's good!
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