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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>How Do You Handle a Little Guy Just Not Getting Along With Others?
DancingQueen 10:13 AM 09-13-2010
I am seriously struggling with a 2.5 year old that i have in my care.
He has been with me since March 1st.
Seemingly sweet kid - with a chaotic home life (mom lives with her parents - dad lives with his parents and grandparents at both homes are doing most of his care)
since the beginning I've dealt with hitting and pushing. For a brief time it was pretty hard core hitting but now it is light hitting and light pushing but it is constant.
Mom and I had worked out an agreement where he was basically on probation and he really came around. We were not messing around and we were all on the same page.
but it all only lasted about 2 months and now we're so out of control (for about the past month) that my days are miserable.
again this is all light hitting and pushing with an occasional bite or scratch thrown in. He also takes toys away from kids constantly.
We do time outs. He has to sit on a chair facing my back door for 3 minutes after each offense. this morning he was there 8 times before 10am
Every single time I turn around he is doing something like this and I just don't know what to do about it any more.
It is so constant that he puts me in a foul mood
And I try to handle each incident as a new one but it is really really hard
He has been with me since March 1st.
Seemingly sweet kid - with a chaotic home life (mom lives with her parents - dad lives with his parents and grandparents at both homes are doing most of his care)
since the beginning I've dealt with hitting and pushing. For a brief time it was pretty hard core hitting but now it is light hitting and light pushing but it is constant.
Mom and I had worked out an agreement where he was basically on probation and he really came around. We were not messing around and we were all on the same page.
but it all only lasted about 2 months and now we're so out of control (for about the past month) that my days are miserable.
again this is all light hitting and pushing with an occasional bite or scratch thrown in. He also takes toys away from kids constantly.
We do time outs. He has to sit on a chair facing my back door for 3 minutes after each offense. this morning he was there 8 times before 10am
Every single time I turn around he is doing something like this and I just don't know what to do about it any more.
It is so constant that he puts me in a foul mood
And I try to handle each incident as a new one but it is really really hard
SilverSabre25 10:25 AM 09-13-2010
I would say that time outs are most definitely NOT working for this guy and you need to find another solution. 8 times is a lot for an entire DAY, let alone before 10 AM! I also think it sounds like maybe what he needs is more *positive* reinforcement and encouragement. Have you taken the time to really get down and walk him through other solutions to his problems? Like, if he just took a toy that Timmy was playing with, you get down with him and walk him through a better solution:
"Johnny, I see that you took this toy from Timmy. We don't take toys. Give it back to him [hand over hand help Johnny give the toy back]. Thank you! Now, Tell Timmy, 'I want to play with that when you're done, okay?' [Let's assume Timmy agrees here]. Thank you Timmy, when you're done, give it to Johnny. Now, until he's done, Johnny, let's you and me play with his over here!
If something like that doesn' work, perhaps isolating him in a playpen or something.
What was working for those 2 months?
"Johnny, I see that you took this toy from Timmy. We don't take toys. Give it back to him [hand over hand help Johnny give the toy back]. Thank you! Now, Tell Timmy, 'I want to play with that when you're done, okay?' [Let's assume Timmy agrees here]. Thank you Timmy, when you're done, give it to Johnny. Now, until he's done, Johnny, let's you and me play with his over here!
If something like that doesn' work, perhaps isolating him in a playpen or something.
What was working for those 2 months?
DancingQueen 12:07 PM 09-13-2010
I was doing the positive reinforcement, have discussed (especially after a time out when everything is calm again) what the offense was - and even discussed how to handle if it happened again, I catch him about 70% of his offenses. In those 70% I stop the action and I remind him gently and I either redirect or give him the words that he needs. The other 30% I don't catch - and those are the ones that end in time out while I attend to someone's tears. And I'm sad to say that those 30% are the 8 before 10am. It is THAT much.
During the 2 months that things were good all I did was the time out and we discussed behavior in front of him during pick up.
Nothing has changed on my end - I handle every single thing the same as I did when it was going well. He knows the rules - I don't waiver and I'm so incredibly clear about them. But he spends about 90% of his day interacting negatively with the kids.
During the 2 months that things were good all I did was the time out and we discussed behavior in front of him during pick up.
Nothing has changed on my end - I handle every single thing the same as I did when it was going well. He knows the rules - I don't waiver and I'm so incredibly clear about them. But he spends about 90% of his day interacting negatively with the kids.
kidkair 12:25 PM 09-13-2010
One tactic you could try is having him next to you at all times. If you are doing something where he cannot be directly next to you have him sit on the floor by himself for a bit with a toy. I did this with a child (20mo) who was biting so much that I couldn't trust him with the other kids. It was a pain in the butt to drag him around all day but he got the message and quit biting within a few days. Other than that continually teach turn taking and expressing feelings with words rather than hands.
missnikki 12:27 PM 09-13-2010
Has his home life changed somehow? How does he do AFTER 10am? Could it be a hunger/ sleep deprived/ person who dropped off issue?
Sounds like something beyond your control that has shifted the momentum- maybe he needs a slow start to his morning, like quiet storytime or go the other direction and do a group dance or wiggles out...
He definitely sounds like he needs attention andget that mom back on your page ASAP.
Sounds like something beyond your control that has shifted the momentum- maybe he needs a slow start to his morning, like quiet storytime or go the other direction and do a group dance or wiggles out...
He definitely sounds like he needs attention andget that mom back on your page ASAP.
DancingQueen 05:29 PM 09-13-2010
The keeping him by my side might be my next step.
Mom knows things are rough. she can't figure out why he acts that way but admits that he is never around other children. He is an only child, and only grandchild on both sides and has no cousins or anything that he plays with regularly.
After 10 he remains the same. It was just around 10 when I made my original post and I was actually counting time-outs today. It was ALL DAY. I do see improvement if we are outside but I can't be outside all day. although we do go outside every single day (weather permitting).
Mom has always been at a loss - but does talk to him about it. I don't know how much more she does. She said he does occasionally hit her and she does time outs but he screams the entire time he is there but at my house he just sits there. As the matter a fact sometimes I will hear someone cry and as I go to investigate he comes walking past me and gets in the time out chair - already knowing he was going to get sent there. And he sits there just fine.
I don't know of any house changes around the time things got bad again. Although last week dad left for florida for quite a long trip. But the behavior started well before that and he didn't have any knowledge of the trip so it wasn't anxiety about it.
I will say that most of the events are based on him wanting in on what someone else is doing. If you watch him carefully you can see him look across the room at something someone has and he just goes to take it. he will take it out of their hand and walk away.
Other times he will be walking down the hall and if someone gets too close passing him in the hall he will just turn towards them adn shove as hard as he can. this is a common one too - anytime any one enters his space. Even if they have entered his space because he has walked closer to them.
Another thing is if he sees 2 kids playing with something he will go and sit on one of them to get in on it.
Or if 2 kids are sitting next to eachother on the couch reading books he will get up next to one of them and push them down and sit in their spot.
It is like a teenager with a false sense of entitlement or something - except he is TWO
Mom knows things are rough. she can't figure out why he acts that way but admits that he is never around other children. He is an only child, and only grandchild on both sides and has no cousins or anything that he plays with regularly.
After 10 he remains the same. It was just around 10 when I made my original post and I was actually counting time-outs today. It was ALL DAY. I do see improvement if we are outside but I can't be outside all day. although we do go outside every single day (weather permitting).
Mom has always been at a loss - but does talk to him about it. I don't know how much more she does. She said he does occasionally hit her and she does time outs but he screams the entire time he is there but at my house he just sits there. As the matter a fact sometimes I will hear someone cry and as I go to investigate he comes walking past me and gets in the time out chair - already knowing he was going to get sent there. And he sits there just fine.
I don't know of any house changes around the time things got bad again. Although last week dad left for florida for quite a long trip. But the behavior started well before that and he didn't have any knowledge of the trip so it wasn't anxiety about it.
I will say that most of the events are based on him wanting in on what someone else is doing. If you watch him carefully you can see him look across the room at something someone has and he just goes to take it. he will take it out of their hand and walk away.
Other times he will be walking down the hall and if someone gets too close passing him in the hall he will just turn towards them adn shove as hard as he can. this is a common one too - anytime any one enters his space. Even if they have entered his space because he has walked closer to them.
Another thing is if he sees 2 kids playing with something he will go and sit on one of them to get in on it.
Or if 2 kids are sitting next to eachother on the couch reading books he will get up next to one of them and push them down and sit in their spot.
It is like a teenager with a false sense of entitlement or something - except he is TWO
Preschool/daycare teacher 05:13 PM 09-14-2010
Originally Posted by sbschildcare:
The keeping him by my side might be my next step.
Mom knows things are rough. she can't figure out why he acts that way but admits that he is never around other children. He is an only child, and only grandchild on both sides and has no cousins or anything that he plays with regularly.
After 10 he remains the same. It was just around 10 when I made my original post and I was actually counting time-outs today. It was ALL DAY. I do see improvement if we are outside but I can't be outside all day. although we do go outside every single day (weather permitting).
Mom has always been at a loss - but does talk to him about it. I don't know how much more she does. She said he does occasionally hit her and she does time outs but he screams the entire time he is there but at my house he just sits there. As the matter a fact sometimes I will hear someone cry and as I go to investigate he comes walking past me and gets in the time out chair - already knowing he was going to get sent there. And he sits there just fine.
I don't know of any house changes around the time things got bad again. Although last week dad left for florida for quite a long trip. But the behavior started well before that and he didn't have any knowledge of the trip so it wasn't anxiety about it.
I will say that most of the events are based on him wanting in on what someone else is doing. If you watch him carefully you can see him look across the room at something someone has and he just goes to take it. he will take it out of their hand and walk away.
Other times he will be walking down the hall and if someone gets too close passing him in the hall he will just turn towards them adn shove as hard as he can. this is a common one too - anytime any one enters his space. Even if they have entered his space because he has walked closer to them.
Another thing is if he sees 2 kids playing with something he will go and sit on one of them to get in on it.
Or if 2 kids are sitting next to eachother on the couch reading books he will get up next to one of them and push them down and sit in their spot.
It is like a teenager with a false sense of entitlement or something - except he is TWO
I would love to know of a solution to this! We also have a 2 1/2 yr old who acts JUST like this, except he won't sit in time-out unless we stay right there with him, close enough to reach him if he tries getting up (which is impossible with several other children, and so much to do, plus we'd be sitting beside him all day, like you, if we sat him in time-out EVERY time he did something. Plus he has random scream fests. Nothing else is going on, he just randomly starts screaming for the fun or it. Or spitting. The keeping him by my side might be my next step.
Mom knows things are rough. she can't figure out why he acts that way but admits that he is never around other children. He is an only child, and only grandchild on both sides and has no cousins or anything that he plays with regularly.
After 10 he remains the same. It was just around 10 when I made my original post and I was actually counting time-outs today. It was ALL DAY. I do see improvement if we are outside but I can't be outside all day. although we do go outside every single day (weather permitting).
Mom has always been at a loss - but does talk to him about it. I don't know how much more she does. She said he does occasionally hit her and she does time outs but he screams the entire time he is there but at my house he just sits there. As the matter a fact sometimes I will hear someone cry and as I go to investigate he comes walking past me and gets in the time out chair - already knowing he was going to get sent there. And he sits there just fine.
I don't know of any house changes around the time things got bad again. Although last week dad left for florida for quite a long trip. But the behavior started well before that and he didn't have any knowledge of the trip so it wasn't anxiety about it.
I will say that most of the events are based on him wanting in on what someone else is doing. If you watch him carefully you can see him look across the room at something someone has and he just goes to take it. he will take it out of their hand and walk away.
Other times he will be walking down the hall and if someone gets too close passing him in the hall he will just turn towards them adn shove as hard as he can. this is a common one too - anytime any one enters his space. Even if they have entered his space because he has walked closer to them.
Another thing is if he sees 2 kids playing with something he will go and sit on one of them to get in on it.
Or if 2 kids are sitting next to eachother on the couch reading books he will get up next to one of them and push them down and sit in their spot.
It is like a teenager with a false sense of entitlement or something - except he is TWO
We really really don't want to terminate either, though, because we can't afford to lose any kids right now. But then, we might lose some if this behavior doesn't stop soon! It's been going on for almost a year, but as the months go by, and he gets older, the behavior gets worse. I wish you luck!
DancingQueen 06:23 PM 09-14-2010
So I kept him in the same room as me all day and that limited our time outs.
It wasn't as exhausting as I thought it was going to be.
When he asked if he could go to the playroom (while I was making lunch) I said "no" and when he asked "why?" I told him that he wasn't playing nicely with his friends and t hat I needed to watch him closely. He shrugged and stayed put. I was sure to be with other kids as much of the day as possible to be fair - but there times when I couldn't and he missed out on what they were playing.
It wasn't as exhausting as I thought it was going to be.
When he asked if he could go to the playroom (while I was making lunch) I said "no" and when he asked "why?" I told him that he wasn't playing nicely with his friends and t hat I needed to watch him closely. He shrugged and stayed put. I was sure to be with other kids as much of the day as possible to be fair - but there times when I couldn't and he missed out on what they were playing.