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  #1  
Old 06-25-2014, 03:38 AM
DeirdreLLogan DeirdreLLogan is offline
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Default Daycare Pushing For More Bottles / Low Pumping Production

Hi ladies!

I returned to work this week after 16 weeks of maternity leave. My son has been EBF on demand since day one. We've survived nasty reflux (that cause latching and production issues), horrible sleeping issues (never slept for more than 30 minutes) and through it all, I have kept up BFing.

I am now practically in tears because it seems like it may be coming to an end.

Aside from pumping to increase/maintain production during the worst of baby boys reflux, I have not pumped much since I came home from the hospital. But I NEVER had a problem. I even posted on here that I was EBFing nine to eleven times a day, and was pumping about 9oz "extra".

However, my return to work has been disastrous. I *barely* pump 12 oz... and that's if I'm lucky. And it's with the same pump I've had all along (Medela PISA). We have dedicated lactation rooms at work, though I am restricted to a tight 30 minute window. But I am able to pump 4 times a day, so my day goes like this.

around 6 or 6:30 - nurse baby
7:30 - drop to daycare
8:00 or so - pump
(9am - baby gets 6oz bottle at DC)
10:30 - pump
(12noon - baby gets 6oz bottle at DC)
1:00 - pump
(3:00 - baby gets 6oz bottle at DC)
3:30 - pump
5:00 - home and nurse baby
7:00ish - nurse / bath / nurse again
usually sleeps for 3 to 4 hours in an arms reach co sleeper
I go up to bed around 10 and once he awakes (around 11 or 12) I nurse him and we bedshare the rest of the night, nursing on demand... usually every 2 hours or so (i rarely bother to look at the clock, but I have been this week).

*** it does not matter if I spread the pumping out more than every 2.5 hours... I get 10oz at work regardless of if I pump 3 times or 4... then another oz or two when pumping in the evening after his two nursing sessions ***

So, by my numbers, he's nursing like... 8times a day with me AND getting three 6oz bottles.

Today, daycare told my husband that we need to send a 4th bottle. I think that sounds ridiculous. My son is 13lbs 8oz, so he's not exactly a huge baby. He's nursing A LOT... does he really need 24oz of milk at daycare??

I am also wondering if he's spitting up a lot. We would give him a bottle occassionally during my mat leave... just to make sure he'd take it... and while, yes, he WOULD suck down 6oz... he'd often times spit up. And even if he didn't... well... he was never getting three bottles back to back.

Anyway, there IS a question in here.

I have been pumping 4x a day at work and 2x at home (after nursing sessions) for 4 days now and I'm getting 12oz.

1. How can I increase my supply? (I have a hospital grade pump I've rented... should I try using that? It's not as convenient to drag to work, but I don't care. I'll do what it takes. I'm eating oatmeal and made lactation cookies. I'm trying to get as much water as is humanly possible. I have fenugreek but have not started taking it b/c I don't know how much too take.)

2. What do I do about daycare? I was considering sending four 4oz bottles tomorrow. They have 24oz of frozen milk in their freezer as well, so I do worry a little that they will just defrost and waste the breastmilk that I've given them. I don't know... I'm not trying to judge, but part of me wonders if they're just popping a bottle in his mouth anytime he cries. He's NOT a baby that likes to be put down... He'd never even been in a baby swing until about 2 weeks ago. He just hated every baby device on the market so I gave up and just wore him all the time / carried him . Anyway, I guess... what is reasonable of me to expect with daycare? I know I'm paying them to watch my kid... but I also recognize that they have several babies and they have to have SOME kind of structure. If i could afford a nanny to come and give individualized attention, I absolutely would, but it's just not an option. As it is... this in home daycare is costing me the same as my mortgage (gotta love Northern VA).

3. I am wondering if a "duvet day" would help? Does skin-to-skin help at this point? I'm wondering if spending as much time between Friday evening post-work until Sunday in bed with baby, nursing completely on demand and following each session with a 15 minute pump session with hospital grade pump will help to "super charge" my supply. Is that a ridiculous concept? Daycare is pushing me to follow their schedule, but, not to be a b***h, I don't care about their schedule as much as I care about my baby getting the best food for him

Thanks so much in advance ladies. I'm so desperate... and I just cried today because baby just screamed at the breast in frustration for almost an hour before finally calming down and latching (and passing out almost immediately). He did fine nursing the rest of the evening though.

Sorry I'm all over the place with this post... I'm just so stressed / worried. With his reflux issues... formula is NOT an option for me.


EDITING TO ADD:

Baby is 16weeks old (will be 4 months on the 9th). He has many wet diapers a day. Prior to DC he was pooping every 2 - 3 days... and would usually have 2 BM's on that day. Now that he is in daycare, he's having blowout diapers every other day.
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  #2  
Old 06-25-2014, 06:09 AM
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That is a ridiculous amount of milk they are asking for. For his age I would do four oz. I don't take premade bottles. I just have parent bring a jug of milk and I keep 3 bottles here. That way I can make smaller bottles and just heat up an oz if baby wants more.

Maybe give slower flow nipples? Is he coming home with spit up clothes?

What are the hours he is there?

The part where you are carrying him around all the time and he is eating every two hours... well that's going to cause HUGE issues with daycare. You may find one that does that level of one to one but it's expensive.

You heard of kellysmom breastfeeding site? That's the go to site.

Join some Facebook mommy groups and they will help with production issues.

It sounds like he is raising hell at the daycare because he needs or wants his own adult. If that is the case it won't work. A daycare is going to give him about an hour of one to one total with feedings and changing. That depends on their numbers but that's an average.
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Old 06-25-2014, 06:30 AM
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Is he actually eating 6oz bottles or is some of it going to waste or being spit up? I don't generally get 4 month olds who will eat more than 4-5 oz at a time.
I am sure they exist, but it may not be necessary.

I generally get frozen milk in a ziploc style breast milk container. I ask for a variety of sizes from 1-5 oz. I will often try a 3 or 4 oz bag first, then see if baby wants more. I also second the slower flow nipple. Maybe send 4 oz bottles, and then an extra bottle. Ask them to feed 4 oz, wait a bit and give a bit more if he is still hungry. With the slower flow, that might do the trick.

As to pumping, I was always most successful with hand extraction. I imagine there are videos out there.

The baby can also feel your frustration, and it will affect your milk production, so relaxing is important.


Nannyde, how do your parents accomplish a "jug" of breastmilk? Do they not freeze it?
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Angelsj View Post
Is he actually eating 6oz bottles or is some of it going to waste or being spit up? I don't generally get 4 month olds who will eat more than 4-5 oz at a time.
I am sure they exist, but it may not be necessary.

I generally get frozen milk in a ziploc style breast milk container. I ask for a variety of sizes from 1-5 oz. I will often try a 3 or 4 oz bag first, then see if baby wants more. I also second the slower flow nipple. Maybe send 4 oz bottles, and then an extra bottle. Ask them to feed 4 oz, wait a bit and give a bit more if he is still hungry. With the slower flow, that might do the trick.

As to pumping, I was always most successful with hand extraction. I imagine there are videos out there.

The baby can also feel your frustration, and it will affect your milk production, so relaxing is important.


Nannyde, how do your parents accomplish a "jug" of breastmilk? Do they not freeze it?
Nope. They just pump and put all pumped milk into one jug. Makes it easier for us all. They leave a frozen stock in case of emergency.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:10 AM
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Are you certain about the amount of milk in those bags? There are days that I can put THREE "6 oz" bags of milk into ONE 8 oz bottle. It depends on how the milk was frozen. I have a child about the same age, about the same size at my home who can go through 4 bags of milk a day, but there is NO WAY any of those bags actually have 6 oz. in them.

If keeping up with production is a problem (and it is for many women), I recommend supplementing with formula.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:12 AM
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They bring me what they pumped at work that day and on the way home. Alot pump in the car.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:35 AM
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My babe (same age as OP's baby) is eating roughly 2-3 of the 4 oz bottles per day depending on whether or not there was a morning feeding before drop off.

Attendance times are 7 a.m. to 2 p.m.

Mom brings me 4-6 of the 4 oz bottles each day.
She pumps at work and brings me what she pumped that day at pick up.

Some days the baby drinks 3 bottles but usually only 2 but never more than that.

My babe is bottle fed here (obviously) and BF at home.

Rarely is more than 4 oz per feeding consumed.

Baby is also fed on demand so the feedings aren't necessarily spaced out over exact times or intervals.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:42 AM
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I am a nursing mom of 3 who ebf all 3. I pumped exclusively with baby 1 while working outside the home. I quit work with baby 2 and started a daycare, and ebf both. I suggest that you pump as often as possible, and supply the extra milk requested if at all able. It sounds like a lot of milk, but who is to say that the baby isn't going through a growth spurt? Are you feeding at night still? I would continue night feeds, and nurse in the am. Pump after you nurse, and throughout the day. The more you pump the more milk you will produce over time. Oatmeal helps with production, wheat beer, mothers milk tea, and lots of water. Good luck mama, it's hard! And you aren't defeated if you have to supplement. Even a drip of breathing is better than nothing.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:45 AM
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There are ways to increase your milk production some supplements some mothers take. relax and increase your water intake. but to me it sounds like enough milk for the day. Ask them to describe the problem

baby is draining the bottle
baby is not finishing bottle but wants to eat more frequently
baby is fussy so they comfort with a bottle.
is or is not spitting up maybe has gas


Just sending more does not fix it if you do not know what the problem is exactly. DAd may not have know what to ask when they said MORE MORE MORE>
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
Nope. They just pump and put all pumped milk into one jug. Makes it easier for us all. They leave a frozen stock in case of emergency.
Interesting. Makes sense, though. All I have ever done is the frozen bags. Though I did have one mom come feed whenever needed. THAT was interesting.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:49 AM
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Interesting. Makes sense, though. All I have ever done is the frozen bags. Though I did have one mom come feed whenever needed. THAT was interesting.
So much easier. Each baby has their own jug o milk so I don't have to worry about making a mistake. Less messy. More accurate oz. Freshly sqoozed daily and just swap jugs at the end of the day.
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Old 06-25-2014, 07:51 AM
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...drop of breastfeeding milk... autocorrect
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Old 06-25-2014, 08:04 AM
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That does seem like quite a bit of milk to be bringing each day. My guess is that if he is still on demand fed, they are trying their best to keep up with his demands, but if he's not finishing a bottle, they toss what remains. On demand is extremely difficult to do in a daycare setting, if this is something you really want to continue, one on one care will likely be best. Daycares usually run on a schedule and try to get all the children on one as well.
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Old 06-25-2014, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
So much easier. Each baby has their own jug o milk so I don't have to worry about making a mistake. Less messy. More accurate oz. Freshly sqoozed daily and just swap jugs at the end of the day.
sqoozed...lol That is an awesome word! Even if it was a typo, I am stealing that word.
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Old 06-25-2014, 09:41 AM
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sqoozed...lol That is an awesome word! Even if it was a typo, I am stealing that word.
Made that up. Thankyouverymuch
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Old 06-25-2014, 11:03 AM
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I definitely think 6oz of breastmilk is TOO much for a 4 month old baby to be taking. I would make 3-4oz bags of the milk and provide that for them. I would find a new provider if necessary. This is ridiculous. Are you off for the 4th of July? I would try and do the skin to skin all weekend and nurse and nurse and then pump during nap time or after feedings.
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Old 06-25-2014, 01:40 PM
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I definitely think 6oz of breastmilk is TOO much for a 4 month old baby to be taking. I would make 3-4oz bags of the milk and provide that for them. I would find a new provider if necessary. This is ridiculous. Are you off for the 4th of July? I would try and do the skin to skin all weekend and nurse and nurse and then pump during nap time or after feedings.

I would not do this. WHY decrease a childs milk by two ounces per feeding if the child is drinking 6 ounces. YES 4 ounces may be normal for many 4 month old BF babies. but many drink more. Mine had to be in the hospital for 10 days at birth because of an infection. He was drinking 4 ounces of BM before he left the hospital and 6 ounces by 3 months.

No way would I DECREASE the amount but increasing may not be needed either.
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Old 06-25-2014, 01:46 PM
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The first question I would ask is if baby finishes each 6 oz bottle.

We are told that we must dump any bottle that baby does not finish and begin next feeding with a fresh, unused bottle. No refrigerating and using that last ounce or two.
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Old 06-25-2014, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by DeirdreLLogan View Post
However, my return to work has been disastrous. I *barely* pump 12 oz... and that's if I'm lucky. And it's with the same pump I've had all along (Medela PISA). We have dedicated lactation rooms at work, though I am restricted to a tight 30 minute window. But I am able to pump 4 times a day, so my day goes like this.
Is there some kind of law or rule that allows a woman who is breast feeding to take the time to pump during the day without restrictions?

Just curious as my BF'ing mom said she is legally allowed to take as much time as she wants but has to clock out of work if she uses more than 30 minutes.

She said she would still have to get her 8 hour work day in but can clock in and out as often as she wants IF the purpose is to pump.
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Old 06-25-2014, 02:08 PM
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Is there some kind of law or rule that allows a woman who is breast feeding to take the time to pump during the day without restrictions?

Just curious as my BF'ing mom said she is legally allowed to take as much time as she wants but has to clock out of work if she uses more than 30 minutes.

She said she would still have to get her 8 hour work day in but can clock in and out as often as she wants IF the purpose is to pump.
I was going to mention this too. My BF just had a baby and this is what is happening with her at her job. They have to allow her a private space and time to be able to do it. I think she said that she is allowed to do this for the first year of babies life...
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Old 06-25-2014, 05:33 PM
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I would not do this. WHY decrease a childs milk by two ounces per feeding if the child is drinking 6 ounces. YES 4 ounces may be normal for many 4 month old BF babies. but many drink more. Mine had to be in the hospital for 10 days at birth because of an infection. He was drinking 4 ounces of BM before he left the hospital and 6 ounces by 3 months.

No way would I DECREASE the amount but increasing may not be needed either.
I can't really find the link now but I have researched this for a long time and may have to go back and do more digging to find it but breastfed babies CAN drink more than 3-4oz but that doesn't mean they should. Babies will over eat and suck for comfort but most babies at that age aren't drinking 6oz breastmilk bottles multiple times a day. In fact, I didn't give my own breastfed son more than a 4oz bottle EVER in 13mos. Even at 8-12mos the babies I watched weren't taking more than 6oz. This is simply my experience and advice. I would advise offering 3-4oz bottles MORE OFTEN rather than fewer 6oz bottles or you really sabotage breastfeeding for mom if her body isn't able to keep up with that as quickly. If mom isn't able to pump enough to feed baby she may need to supplement unnecessarily if smaller bottles more often are more like nursing which is what I've been told to try and mimic with younger babies. Mom can't always produce 6oz of milk at a time if baby isn't normally consuming that when nursing or pumping. When I was pumping I was able to get 16oz sometimes but my babies were only taking 2oz at a time but more often. As they got older they ate more per feeding less frequently.

http://kellymom.com/bf/pumpingmoms/e...reastfed-baby/
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Old 06-25-2014, 05:59 PM
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I was drying up at 3 months with my dd. The mother's milk tea worked wonders for us! In 48 hours, I went from barely enough milk to having enough to easily satisfy twins!
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Old 06-25-2014, 09:46 PM
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I'm betting it's regs and poor understanding of breastmilk. Regs will say that they can't reoffer the milk after like 30 minutes. Which is dumb for breastmilk because it has natural stuffs in it that keep it safe for HOURS at room temp. But, regs are regs.

One thing I'd try, OP, is send like, 6 bottles that are all 3 oz. Or some 4 oz and some 2 oz bottles. That should help avoid the dumping problem.

Another thing--yes I'd do the "duvet day" thing like you described but maybe without the pumping. Just snuggles and a quiet weekend at home to just be together and help maintain that supply.

dont' try to schedule his feeds at home the way they do it at daycare...that's dumb for them to request. Really. To get the best long-term nursing success a mama needs to demand feed at night (yes at night!!!) and on the weekends to help keep up that supply.
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Old 06-26-2014, 04:13 AM
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Quote:
I'm betting it's regs and poor understanding of breastmilk. Regs will say that they can't reoffer the milk after like 30 minutes. Which is dumb for breastmilk because it has natural stuffs in it that keep it safe for HOURS at room temp. But, regs are regs.

One thing I'd try, OP, is send like, 6 bottles that are all 3 oz. Or some 4 oz and some 2 oz bottles. That should help avoid the dumping problem.
This. I always feel bad because as a mom who nursed and pumped I know how hard it is

That said, I have had babies that were BIG eaters, and yes, mostly breast fed babies. But both were also BIG babies (9 and 10 lbs at birth).
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Old 06-26-2014, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
So much easier. Each baby has their own jug o milk so I don't have to worry about making a mistake. Less messy. More accurate oz. Freshly sqoozed daily and just swap jugs at the end of the day.
nannyde, what kind of "jug" are you using? Trying to visualize and maybe implement this myself. It sounds like a great way to store the milk with the least amount of waste.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:06 AM
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I don't know if this will any help bit I have a 6 month old who drinks two 8 oz bottles with me and two at home. She also gets rice cereal. She bumped up from 6 oz to 8 oz bottles around 5 months.
Baby girl is a peanut! 6 months and still in 3 month clothing.
I think some babies just drink more than others.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:17 AM
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nannyde, what kind of "jug" are you using? Trying to visualize and maybe implement this myself. It sounds like a great way to store the milk with the least amount of waste.
A pop top one. I prefer those for easy pour. I just return whatever is left but our system is good enough that most days we are on the money of what the mom pumps during the day is the exact amt needed for next day.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by itlw8 View Post
I would not do this. WHY decrease a childs milk by two ounces per feeding if the child is drinking 6 ounces. YES 4 ounces may be normal for many 4 month old BF babies. but many drink more. Mine had to be in the hospital for 10 days at birth because of an infection. He was drinking 4 ounces of BM before he left the hospital and 6 ounces by 3 months.

No way would I DECREASE the amount but increasing may not be needed either.
I agree. I remember at 3 months, my child drank 8oz bottles of pumped milk. I'd rather always err on the side of too much than not enough at that age.

I agree with some of the posts about regulations. If they are dumping liquid gold, then send more, smaller bottles and take home the leftovers.
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Old 06-26-2014, 09:50 AM
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I have a 6 month old who is drinking 3 8 ounce bottles here and at least 3 others at home each day. When he was 3 months, he was chugging 3 4-6 ounce bottles with me and easily could have done a fourth... but I was trying to stretch him out a little bit so that we could do 3 8 oz. instead of 4 6 oz, if that makes sense.

The important thing to do is to ASK your provider if the child is actually finishing the entire bottle. I've only had one infant that would over eat and then spit it up, but I think that was because they were using nipples that were too fast.

Every baby is different. Also, what you're producing doesn't necessarily correlate to what the baby needs.

Also, I'm curious why formula is an absolute no-go because of the reflux? She has reflux with breast milk, so I guess I'm just wondering why formula would be worse? It's awesome that you have been able to provide breast milk for your child and I totally get not wanting that to end, but if your child eventually needs formula then it just is what it is.

Back to the OT: long story short, open communication with your provider is the most important key element in a provider/parent relationship.


ETA: the baby I was talking about above is exclusively formula fed, fwiw
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:02 AM
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I don't know if this will any help bit I have a 6 month old who drinks two 8 oz bottles with me and two at home. She also gets rice cereal. She bumped up from 6 oz to 8 oz bottles around 5 months.
Baby girl is a peanut! 6 months and still in 3 month clothing.
I think some babies just drink more than others.
I agree. I have a five month old who is drinking 6 1/2 oz three times per day, plus eating cereal and veggies twice per day. She's been doing this for a while now, and I expect she will bump up to 8 oz before long.
I believe the food program says 4-8 oz for 4-8 month olds for meals, and 4-6 oz for snacks.
Some babies will be on the lower end and some on the higher end.
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Old 06-26-2014, 11:00 AM
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I agree with sending smaller portioned bottles if they require sending pre-filled bottles. Otherwise see if they will let you send a jug like nannyde does. This way they only use what they need. (hopefully)
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Old 06-26-2014, 08:23 PM
skybluepink02 skybluepink02 is offline
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I agree with the smaller portioned bottles. It sounds like they might be encouraging comfort feeding, and he probably doesn't actually need that much.

Now, for the pumping... I can give my experiences. I exclusively pumped for 18 months for my twins, because they never got the hang of latching after an extended NICU stay. I would say ABSOLUTELY use the hospital grade pump. It's simply light years better than the at home models. I got a full 3 oz more per pump via the hospital pump, and it helped to increase my supply because it emptied me out better.

Also, after you pump, take a minute and massage your breast tissue. It's called breast compression and it helps you get the last bits out.After compression, pump a bit more until nothing comes out. Here's a link that describes it. http://www.lowmilksupply.org/compression.shtml

Make sure that, if you want to increase your supply, that you are dry pumping for a bit after you have gotten all your milk out. The body senses the stimulation and reads the dry-pumping as needing more milk. It's what tells your body to make more milk. If you simply stop pumping when you have no more milk, your body assumes that you have as much as you need. It's the additional pumping after you are dry that signals the need for more production.
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Old 06-27-2014, 04:16 AM
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Great advice so far.

My guess is that they are dumping the extra milk that baby is not eating

AND/OR

comforting with a bottle which means your child is likely crying a good part of the day and that is why they are trying to comfort.

Either way, you need details before making this decision. Are you getting good feedback about how feedings are going? How is your child's moods during the day? If you are co-sleeping and on demand feeding at home, most babies will have a rough transition into care and cry a lot.
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Old 06-27-2014, 05:24 AM
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There are so many factors that could be at play here to NEED an additional bottle at daycare. I would ask that they give 4oz instead of 6 at a time, possibly lower the nipple to a slower flow so baby has to work harder.

How is baby doing at daycare? Sleeping ok? Crying?

As pp said it could be a comfort thing.

Bottles also go faster than BFing. Does/will baby take a paci for more sucking and some paci/snuggles for comfort instead of a bottle?

Could baby be going through a growth spurt?

As far as supply, rent a hospital grade pump, add in another pumping session, or increase the times on your current pumping (dry pump). There are also herbal remedies proven to increase
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:31 AM
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How's it going DL?
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Old 06-27-2014, 04:05 PM
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When I was nursing I could always pump more at night time than during the day. I'm thinking maybe b/c I was more relaxed? Not sure, but I could pump same amount in 10 min that I would get after 30 min of daytime pumping. I know you are already tired with the night time nursing but you might try to pump for 10 min once or twice during the night & see if that makes a difference. I agree with the others who said to offer 3 oz bottles & then add more if needed if baby is still hungry. I've heard great things about the fenugreek. A friend swears
by it! Something to keep in mind is that ebf babies who are new to daycare will typically have a harder time adjusting. Not only are they experiencing a new environment, but breastfeeding is such a special bonding time with mommy that they miss that as well. Nursing isn't just about food for the baby. The day care provider will have to be very patient & understand that crying doesn't necessarily mean hungry. I applaud you for your commitment to your baby. A lot of moms give up breastfeeding when they go back to work. Its wonderful that you are so determined to make it work! Can you try holding a special blanket between you & baby when you nurse in the morning & then send that to daycare each day. It would have your scent on it & they could put it next to baby when they get fussy. That sometimes helps baby feel comforted when missing you. Best of luck!!!
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Old 06-27-2014, 04:21 PM
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A lot of people don't understand that the amount (ounces) of breastmilk does not always increase as a baby gets older. Mostly it is the composition of the breastmilk that changes and increases in nutrients per ounce instead of increasing the amount in ounces.

breastfed babies are used to a lot more one on one time and will have a harder time if that need can't be met.

and just my opinion - I know you said that you don't care about the daycare's schedule etc. but if you must use daycare it is way easier on your child to adhere to the daycare's schedule because they cannot always accommodate each parents wishes. And it isn't because they simply don't want to.
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Old 06-27-2014, 09:08 PM
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but just because it does not always increase some people forget that for some it does. my bf babies were very happy eating every 3 to 4 hours normally 3.5 hours and when I pumped and gave a bottle drained a 6 ounce bottle one took a paci and one did not.... no they were not tiny both around 8 lbs and 21 to 22 inches at birth

When I was a baby mothers used to weigh the baby before nursing and then again afterwards so they could tell how much the baby ate. So fretting about infants and their intake is nothing new. Just in the 50's few mothers pumped and too may listened to Dr Spock and believed you should only feed them every 4 hours on schedule..

The important thing to remember is every child is different
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Old 06-27-2014, 11:17 PM
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I am a former exclusive pumper - I pumped every 3 hours (8x per day) around the clock for a year to keep my supply up. I was producing 50 to 60 ounces per day and was able to donate over 7,000 ounces by the time I stopped. I took fenugreek (3 pills 4x per day), blessed thistle (can't remember the exact dosage...2 pills 3x per day maybe?) and when I felt like spending the extra money I'd take Mother's Milk capsules on top of that. I had a hands-free pumping bra which helped make pumping less stressful and YES - you need a hospital grade double electric pump!

My daughter would gladly chug a 8 ounce bottle of breast milk in once sitting...she had no "off" button...except when she'd spit it all up 5 minutes later :-/ Bottle-fed babies have a more difficult time telling when they've had enough versus feeding at the breast. I'd stick to 3-4 ounce bottles every 3-4 hours and she'd spit up much less and she stuck to the exact same growth curve all the way through - she was obviously gaining weight perfectly with me monitoring how much she was intaking. I'd give her an extra 1-2 ounce bottle in between feeds if I felt she was honestly hungry. I think sometimes providers are quick to think that if a baby fusses it must mean they need a bottle :-/

A baby that age should be getting around 25 ounces per day - http://kellymom.com/bf/pumpingmoms/pumping/milkcalc/
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Old 06-28-2014, 06:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daycarediva View Post
There are so many factors that could be at play here to NEED an additional bottle at daycare. I would ask that they give 4oz instead of 6 at a time, possibly lower the nipple to a slower flow so baby has to work harder.

How is baby doing at daycare? Sleeping ok? Crying?

As pp said it could be a comfort thing.

Bottles also go faster than BFing. Does/will baby take a paci for more sucking and some paci/snuggles for comfort instead of a bottle?

Could baby be going through a growth spurt?

As far as supply, rent a hospital grade pump, add in another pumping session, or increase the times on your current pumping (dry pump). There are also herbal remedies proven to increase


I also want to speak to the common misconception that dc providers are somehow misinterpreting babies signals and over feeding them. My two breast fed babies would start SCREAMING about and hour and a half or so after their last feed. Not fussing, or whimpering, SCREAMING. Holding them close, taking walks, pacifiers, heck - swings, bouncer seats, etc were all used to try to comfort and soothe. Meanwhile the other kids kind of hung out while I tried to stretch out babies feeding. They wanted mom and her boob, period. Sorry, but they did.

One of the reasons I *despise* our ridiculous leave policy in the US is because I believe infants under a year belong HOME with mom being nursed on demand.
It is almost impossible to replicate that nursing relationship in a day care setting.

I like nannyde's "jug o milk" and I may just do that in the future to reduce waste. But if baby is SCREAMING and a small bottle is the only thing that makes them content, I'm going to feed the baby.
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Old 06-28-2014, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
A pop top one. I prefer those for easy pour. I just return whatever is left but our system is good enough that most days we are on the money of what the mom pumps during the day is the exact amt needed for next day.
That sounds wonderful! I think I'll suggest this to bf moms during interviewing. Thanks!
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Old 06-28-2014, 03:44 PM
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I also want to speak to the common misconception that dc providers are somehow misinterpreting babies signals and over feeding them. My two breast fed babies would start SCREAMING about and hour and a half or so after their last feed. Not fussing, or whimpering, SCREAMING. Holding them close, taking walks, pacifiers, heck - swings, bouncer seats, etc were all used to try to comfort and soothe. Meanwhile the other kids kind of hung out while I tried to stretch out babies feeding. They wanted mom and her boob, period. Sorry, but they did.

One of the reasons I *despise* our ridiculous leave policy in the US is because I believe infants under a year belong HOME with mom being nursed on demand.
It is almost impossible to replicate that nursing relationship in a day care setting.

I like nannyde's "jug o milk" and I may just do that in the future to reduce waste. But if baby is SCREAMING and a small bottle is the only thing that makes them content, I'm going to feed the baby.
Emphasis on SMALL bottle. I 100% agree and this can easily be solved with your method of a small bottle. 2-3oz even as a topper in between feeds is totally normal for young infants. They nurse for comfort not just feeding but get a small amount of milk as well. Their tummy gets full and they get the comfort they need. But giving three 6oz bottles doesn't accomplish that. Perhaps baby may only need three 4oz bottles and two 2 oz bottles in between. Sure that's more feeds but it's more like nursing and may help mom not feel unable to nurse. Also, I would try to have a hungry baby at pickup time so she can nurse as soon as she's home instead of a full baby and full mama also cutting out one feeding. It's not easy, that is for sure. But breastfeeding moms and babies need a little more work than a formula fed baby.
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Old 06-28-2014, 06:16 PM
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Emphasis on SMALL bottle. I 100% agree and this can easily be solved with your method of a small bottle .It's not easy, that is for sure. But breastfeeding moms and babies need a little more work than a formula fed baby.
I agree, but the work should not be all on the dc providers. Mom has to problem solve too. Maybe it means more bottles with less in them or a smaller nipple, etc. I've heard the "day care providers need to learn how to soothe a baby without feeding them!" line one too many times to be comfortable. It smacks of the "we pay THEM, so they work for US!" mentality that I find offensive.

After my last two breast fed babies I swore off infant care. I DO think breast fed babies are a lot more work - and often the finger pointing that goes with it (you're feeding too much! You're wasting "liquid gold!" You have to find other ways to comfort baby! He takes a bottle for everyone else! etc etc etc) just adds to an already stressful situation.

FWIW, I think breast feeding is WONDERFUL and should be encouraged. I do think there are real benefits to it - I did it for my kids.
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