I was so excited to get 2 new kids in care this week! I thought it's about time something turns around for me after dealing with issues from the parents of the last 2 good kids I decided to let go.

Well 1st day in comes a 4 yr old dcg and a 6 yr old dcb. The days started with DCG not wanting to wash ehr hands after potty. I got "mah I'm done" I insisted we wash germs away and got "I said I'm DONE" ohhh ok so I wash her hands for her.

Later there is more back talk but it's the 1st day shes testing me right? DCB is great! Shares with the otehr kids and doesnt tattle or talk back or nag. DCG insists I give her popcicles all day. Nope... She runs and screams high pitched all day I keep warning her. She continues. She doesnt put things back she says she forgot and keeps playing with a new choice.... I deal with it all and move on.

Later we go for a walk to the playground. DCG is climbing the jungle gym up the side blocked with rails. I tell her to use the steps or climb on the rock wall side if she wants to climb. She said "no this is for climbing too" I correct her that it is not meant to climb but to block the edge for safety. "oh well I'm climbing anyway" OK enough. I call her over for a sit down talk. I explain that I don't like being talked back to and I only tell her she can't do certain things for her safety. She looks at me and says "Do you ever change?" Change what? "Do you ever change your clothes?" I said EXCUSE ME? YES I change my clothes. She says "Well it doesnt look like it to me." flips her hair and walks away. I told her to come back and explained that was not nice and she doesnt see me to even say that anyway. It is her 1st day here with me! She said I know and walked away.

Later in the day close to pick up time she is coloring with 3D chalk outside and using the green glasses. She comes over and looks all over me. I laugh and said what are you doing? She said "hmmm you look less fatter with these glasses on" I just gasped and couldnt believe this little girl! I said That is not nice at all. She said "sorry but you are fat" I explained even if someone is fat you don't say that. She then said ok then you aren't fat and skips away.

Again the brother is great! Puts things away is nice and all. I just fear I will have my hands full with this little girl all day and soon school will start she will be here all alone with me no kids to help distract her. I am not looking forward to it at all. I wonder what insults I will get tomorrow

Reply

That is completely disrespectful and straight-up mean. And she knows it!!

I've honestly never heard anything that bad from a child that young.

I'm curious to see what other members say. From me, she'd get "you WILL NOT speak to me that way" and immediately removed from whatever activity we were doing, every time she did it. If she purposely disobeyed or was rude again, when she came back, she'd be done for the day.

Reply

Wow. That girl has issues for her to deliberately hurt you like that and enjoy it.

Reply

She would be spending a good portion of the day thinking about manners

Reply

You need my motto......
Kids who dont listen dont get to have any fun. I'll do everything I can to help you have fun, all you have to do is listen. Plain short sweet and simple.
She needs to know who's boss and she gets no explanation.

I have delt with a child like this before. Her parents were are good friends and she was horrible to everyone, including adults. She spit in my face one day in the car. We were all on a road trip together. The parents had horrible parenting skills and didn't really do anything. I made my husband pull the car over and told her get out. Since you can't be nice, you can't enjoy riding in my car. So you can walk or you can apologize, get back in the car and be nice. She called my bluff so since mom Was not helping I said its your lucky day, mom is walking with you. I made them walk. Beside the car for about 10 minutes before she begged to come back in the car. Yes the parents were mad at me, but this 7 year old had done numberous things on a 7 hour car ride from Disneyland and we were only on the second hour of the car ride.

When we got back in the car she did not mutter a word to anyone. She never said sorry, but everyone in the car got a peaceful ride home.

I hope this child improves. I've read some of your past post and you have had some crazy parents to deal with. Good luck to you.

Reply

I can just picture them walking down the road next to the car. Perfect consequence for mom, too.

I agree with Hunni, remove her from the fun and tell her that she CANNOT speak to you that way and make her sit out for a few minutes. I would do it every single time she spoke rudely or talked back. Sounds like a very strong willed kid who needs to know she does not call the shots.

Reply

yup I agree with everyone, remove her from everything. Have a chair ready for her. She has learned that being mean is fine, I can see a bully already. Nows your chance to fix it before it gets bad.

Reply

I could see myself loosing my cool with this kid and calling mom to come and get her. There is no way I would deal with that level of disrespect from anyone let alone a child. What did the parents say when you told them what she did?

Reply

Sounds to me like she is very insecure. Some kids get meek when they're insecure and some get antsy and nutso--she sounds like the latter. She needs the limits shown again and again, but kindly. Firm, but kind. She needs to know that she's safe and that she's not going to have awful things happen when she misbehaves.

I would also be careful about your responses to the rude things she says/does--if you give a negative emotional reaction she WILL keep escalating; I can see escalation just in what you've written about yesterday. "Hey you look less fat," would probably get either a bland, "Oh really, huh. That's call an optical illusion when some looks different than it really is." or "oh cool, maybe everyone should wear those! Then I'd be skinny!" About the clothes changing I probably would have said, "Yep" initially and then "Okay, well that doesn't change the fact that I do. Go play." Giving either a bland response or one that's enthusiastic instead of angry (she wants angry) will confuse her and should eventually diffuse the need to be mean. Down the road a bit, when she's accustomed to the fact that you're NOT going to throw a bit emotional fuss when she says something "shocking", you can start talking about how those are not things people need to say.

I have a strong feeling that time out will do less than nothing for this child. You're probably going to have to find some other ways of dealing with her behavior. Time out is an easy solution, but not necessarily the one that is best for the child.

I'm kind of sad at the responses indicating some extreme reactions--children must be taught respect in order to give respect and the best way to teach it is to model it. To be displaying the behavior she is, imagine what she must have had modeled to her already...kids don't just come up with things like that (the clothes comment, the fat comment, etc).

Reply

I agree on this one.

She WANTS a reaction. If you don't give it, it will knock the wind out of her sails and she'll quit because it won't be interesting or worth it. Now, I wouldn't let it go completely though....take away the fun, but do it with a calm smile and demeaner. It'll get the message across that you are in control.

Reply

I think that must be a 4yo girl stage because I have noticed a lot of 4yos trying to hurt others feelings, usually other kids though. I would put her in a time out whenever she does that and explain about hurting others feelings. Ask her how she would feel if someone told her she was fat.

Reply

Hmmm.

I agree that the insults are more of attention-seeking and control ( I hurt you so I win) than anything, and that's not the big deal. That wasn't what I was referring to.

Its the rude disobedience that struck me ("Im going to climb here anyway"). I always have felt that a child who is blatantly disobedient with small things has the great potential to do the same thing when the provider says "there's a fire, we need to get out quickly" or "stay on the sidewalk, there's a car". In which case, I do think it's important that the child quickly understand who's in charge at daycare and that she needs to obey that person at all times.

Reply

I agree, imagine if there was an emergency and she doesn't listen then what. I really do think she is a bully, if she is saying this to you, imagine what she says to other people.

Reply

My guess is that she is the boss at home with one parent or with both. The children that have come in here with that attitude will slap their parents in the face, talk that way to them as they are leaving here, spit on them, etc. They are only 3 but they run the show ... at home.

If I get a snotty, "WHY?!" when I tell a child to do something (ex: Singing our song, "5 more minutes 'til we clean up our room, 5 more minutes will be here pretty soon!") then I tell them, "Because I am the boss." If it is an inquisitive why, I tell them. If it is an angry/rude/yelling why, then they get told that I am the boss. It has helped tremendously. So has simply nodding and smiling to rude comments meant to engage in the adult (whether that be in an angry way or not).

Reply

HERE IS HOW I DEAL WITH THE BOSSY KIDS. I LET THEM THINK THAT THEY ARE IN CHARGE BY GIVING THE POWER OF DECISION.

DCK- I don't want to wash my hands
DCP- washing hands is not a choice, would you like to wash your hands or would you like me to wash your hands? Let DCK decide. Count to 10 in your head and give them the chance to make a "Good decision like a big kid". If they don't do it, you do it for them and move on.

The park-

DCK you are not playing safe and I don't want to see you get hurt, if you would like to continue playing, you can play over here or you can come sit by me. Please make a good decision, because I really want you to have fun. Again count to 10, let them decide and then move on with their decision.

I often use the phrase, please show me that you can make a good decision.

If children struggle to make a good decision, I will LET (AKA MAKE) them go to a thinking mat where they can think about what they want to do....AKA TIME OUT......

As for the name calling, I would just down right ignore it form now on. She is trying to push your buttons.

Reply

The counting to ten is a great tactic; I do that a lot for things. I do count aloud though (helps teach them to count :P sort of, but it gives them the reminder that there *is* a deadline and they usually end up choosing by 8 or 9, or even by 1 or 2).

Reply

This is exactly what I do - at least not when I'm frazzled to distraction!!! It works every time for me. I used it several times today. New dcb would not be quiet for our "nap" quiet time. I gave him the choice. Quiet or lay down longer. He chose to lay down longer. OK, his choice. The next time he chose to be quiet ( ) Did the same thing with lunch. I know you want to play, but I said it is time to wash hands for lunch and to line up. You may make the choice. Do you want lunch or would you like to skip lunch today? Guess what he did? Lined up, of course. I won't do this indefinitely, and certain things need to just be done eventually, but I figure with the new ones I need to give them some slack.

As for the clothes comment - she couldn't possibly know - she's repeating something she heard someone(probably mom or dad) say to someone else, imo. The "fat" comment - I've had that one before - for me, it's true. Kid's are sometimes honest to a fault. It's rude, yes, but it's a teachable moment!

Reply

Yes, this is very important, too. She needs to respect your authority in everything so that you know she will listen when there is an emergency.

Reply

Thanks for all the great advise everyone! I tried a few different things today I think the sit down talk did well. Today I heard "wow shes big" when I left the room. When the boys told on her she came and admitted it. I just said ok thank you for telling the truth. Then she added "but I wasnt calling you fat I said big because you are an adult not fat because you aren't fat right?" LOL I explained again I am overweight but it is rude to call someone fat. She said OK and walked away. At lunch she said "looks like you still didnt change your clothes but I know you do now right?" I just laughed and said right. Later, on our walk a bald man had a bandage on 1/2 of his head. She pointed up and yelled EWWW whats on his head?? I apologised to him and reminded her of manners and pointing out other peoples problems.

As for the flower picking battle it's still going on. She picked 3 today and ripped each up after I told her 3 times before not to do it again. I put her in a quiet chair so she could think about why she is not listening to me. She said she wants to have a flower but it's not as pretty as she wants so she rips it and finds another. OK just dont pick anymore of my garden.

We did hit a bump at the end of the day when I told her to stop screaming and running around the dog. She said "I hate dogs" I said if that is true then you may not like it here for very long because Ebony is here to stay. She said nasty "WHY" with hands on hips. I said because she is MY dog and this is MY home and MY dog comes first. I got the spinning hair flip and stomping away. Sorry but my dog (still puppy at that) does come first! Especially against a new DCK with an attitude problem.

Reply

I still don't know, I think she's playing you. I think she's telling you what you want to hear. I would never agree with her when she called you big, she's belittling you but in her way. I would have said, "you hurt my feelings by calling me big, even if I'm an adult, we don't make fun of peoples sizes"

Reply

I would tell her ugly words and attitudes are not welcome at childcare. If she would like to begin using nice words and nice attitudes, then she can play, of not she will have to sit by herself until the ugly goes away.

Reply

I have dealt with the disrespect all summer long. We took one week to focus on manners! And this is with SAC's! I told them that hand stamps are not only for following the rules but also for showing me your manners. Saying, "please" and "thank you" also for saying nice things to your friends at daycare, instead of mean things. Also for choosing to speak nicely to me! I had one dcg that liked to tell me "I hate this daycare," or "I hate dcg," every time she couldn't do what she wanted. I responded calmly and said, "I'm sorry you feel that way, maybe you would have more fun if you treated your friends, my house, etc, a little nicer and then you could get stamps, stickers, etc." It worked. She really turned it around. Just testing me I guess. It was funny, toward the end of summer she would correct other's rude behavior by saying, "that wasn't nice!"

Reply

I have never tried hand stamps I will have to try it and see how that works. Glad it worked for you.

Reply

When I worke with school age I did this

Draw a traffic light in permanent marker on a nice size white board
Give each kid a car magnet and write their name on it

You will also let each child make a pretend driver license.
On the DL you will make 10 boxes on it that you will use later to check off or whole punch. I chose to laminate the cards and check the boxes.

I also purchased a cute treasure chest with goodies and coupons that allowed special stuff. Like Popsicles.

How I managed it.

All cars start on the white board. First time you catch a child doing going you ask them to place their car magnet on the green light. Don't forget to praise them.

Kid is having some listening issues or behavior issues, they have to place their car on yellow.

And of course bad behavior that continues goes to red.

Now here's where the driver license comes in. If they stayed in green all day, they get their licensed punched two times. Do this all week, you get a treasure chest prize and coupon.

If you end up in yello, you only get 1 whole punch/box checked off. At the end of the week if you have at least 5 points on your card you can chose 1 coupon from the chest.

If you get into the red at anytime, no whole punch and you get a ticket sent home telling mom/dad....

It worked wonders for me. I use this when I coach sports too, just a little different way.

Reply