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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Speaking of McD's Nuggets....
Crystal 12:41 PM 01-27-2012
15 years of nothing but nuggets...........

http://health.yahoo.net/experts/dayi...w-bad-are-they



I wonder if Mom will be investigated for allowing this? And, should she be?
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Breezy 12:45 PM 01-27-2012
That is neglect. I think she should for sure be investigated for child neglect. What lazy woman!!!!!!!!
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SilverSabre25 12:48 PM 01-27-2012
Will she be? Maybe.

Should she be? Maybe.

What ought to come of this but probably won't? A higher awareness of the extent to which some sensory issues can develop--this sounds like a highly extreme case of oral sensory issues. I'd be willing to put money on her having a wide variety of other sensory issues.

Picky eating is actually basically an eating disorder. Some people literally have a list of 6 or fewer foods that they are willing to eat, and it's not just stubbornness, they really seem to be incapable of eating other things. The things on those lists tend to be high in fat/sugar, white/light colored, and almost always include chicken nuggets. It's NOT always lazy parenting. It may not even MOSTLY be lazy parents. Some kids just. will. not. eat. and some parents/doctors don't have the awareness or education to stop and say "WHOA. Time out, something is WRONG and I need to find out what it is."

It sounds stupid to say, "Picky eating is a disorder" but it is very much linked to sensory issues, sensory processing issues, and autism.
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Cat Herder 12:51 PM 01-27-2012
And the Pediatrician was never consulted?

In 15 years.....
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Breezy 12:58 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
Will she be? Maybe.

Should she be? Maybe.

What ought to come of this but probably won't? A higher awareness of the extent to which some sensory issues can develop--this sounds like a highly extreme case of oral sensory issues. I'd be willing to put money on her having a wide variety of other sensory issues.

Picky eating is actually basically an eating disorder. Some people literally have a list of 6 or fewer foods that they are willing to eat, and it's not just stubbornness, they really seem to be incapable of eating other things. The things on those lists tend to be high in fat/sugar, white/light colored, and almost always include chicken nuggets. It's NOT always lazy parenting. It may not even MOSTLY be lazy parents. Some kids just. will. not. eat. and some parents/doctors don't have the awareness or education to stop and say "WHOA. Time out, something is WRONG and I need to find out what it is."

It sounds stupid to say, "Picky eating is a disorder" but it is very much linked to sensory issues, sensory processing issues, and autism.
You learn something new everyday! So, now you have me thinking because my little brother will only eat stuff like hot dogs, cheese, bologna, salami, etc. My mom has to make him a seperate meal. If they have spaghetti she has to take the meat out in order to get him to eat it. Picky eater? (hes 8) or something else going on?
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Ariana 12:59 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
Will she be? Maybe.

Should she be? Maybe.

What ought to come of this but probably won't? A higher awareness of the extent to which some sensory issues can develop--this sounds like a highly extreme case of oral sensory issues. I'd be willing to put money on her having a wide variety of other sensory issues.

Picky eating is actually basically an eating disorder. Some people literally have a list of 6 or fewer foods that they are willing to eat, and it's not just stubbornness, they really seem to be incapable of eating other things. The things on those lists tend to be high in fat/sugar, white/light colored, and almost always include chicken nuggets. It's NOT always lazy parenting. It may not even MOSTLY be lazy parents. Some kids just. will. not. eat. and some parents/doctors don't have the awareness or education to stop and say "WHOA. Time out, something is WRONG and I need to find out what it is."

It sounds stupid to say, "Picky eating is a disorder" but it is very much linked to sensory issues, sensory processing issues, and autism.
Although I do understand that this is an issue, at what point as a parent do you say "ok my kid has eaten nothing but chicken nuggets for a month....something is wrong"? I think when this mental process doesn't happen we're either dealing with a person of very low intelligence or someone who just couldn't be bothered to figure out a better way. Even if a multi-vitamin was provided it would have been better than nothing. I dunno the whole situation is so strange
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SilverSabre25 01:07 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by Ariana:
Although I do understand that this is an issue, at what point as a parent do you say "ok my kid has eaten nothing but chicken nuggets for a month....something is wrong"? I think when this mental process doesn't happen we're either dealing with a person of very low intelligence or someone who just couldn't be bothered to figure out a better way. Even if a multi-vitamin was provided it would have been better than nothing. I dunno the whole situation is so strange
That's the whole "parent/doctor lack of awareness" thing I mentioned. Many, many, MANY doctors would just shrug and say, "well at least she's eating," or, "she seems healthy," or "All you need to do is...", 'or "What do you want me to do? She's not sick!"

Many parents would say the same thing. Many, many people just write it off, as several people have mentioned, as a lazy parent. Just like with colic and babies who scream for hours on end--"it's normal" "mom holds the baby too much" "babies are supposed to cry". When really, many times you're dealing with undiagnosed food allergies, sensory issues, etc.
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Ariana 01:13 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
That's the whole "parent/doctor lack of awareness" thing I mentioned. Many, many, MANY doctors would just shrug and say, "well at least she's eating," or, "she seems healthy," or "All you need to do is...", 'or "What do you want me to do? She's not sick!"

Many parents would say the same thing. Many, many people just write it off, as several people have mentioned, as a lazy parent. Just like with colic and babies who scream for hours on end--"it's normal" "mom holds the baby too much" "babies are supposed to cry". When really, many times you're dealing with undiagnosed food allergies, sensory issues, etc.
Yes I've definately heard of this too!! I guess I can only see things from my own point of view. I don't just blindly trust whatever a DR tells me...but obviously not everyone is like that.
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bice99 01:59 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by Breezy:
You learn something new everyday! So, now you have me thinking because my little brother will only eat stuff like hot dogs, cheese, bologna, salami, etc. My mom has to make him a seperate meal. If they have spaghetti she has to take the meat out in order to get him to eat it. Picky eater? (hes 8) or something else going on?
I HATED tomato sauce as a child, so I had a pile of ground beef and a pile of noodles with butter and parm cheese. Lots of kids are that way - not liking foods mixed/touching. My almost 10 year old still doesn't like tomato based items. Loves fresh tomatoes though.
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familyschoolcare 02:01 PM 01-27-2012
It is one thing to consider it negliect or endangerment at 2- 5 years old but at 17 the child is almost an adult and the parent no longer realy has controll over what they eat.

Yes the parent can still controll what is eaten at home, but a child that age goes to school, friends house, maybe has a job, is allowed to go for a "walk" (to the nearest 7-11) ect..

In my house sI can till when one of my teenagers has gotten ahold of a "munch" of junk food. However, it is not like I can do anything about it other than let them know why they should not eat that way.
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Daycaremomof2 02:25 PM 01-27-2012
I just got up and gave my daughter her multivitamin for the day...
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dave4him 02:30 PM 01-27-2012
We rolled up to a bank window once and my daugther yelled from the backseat "i want chicken nuggets"
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AmyLeigh 02:49 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
Picky eating is actually basically an eating disorder. Some people literally have a list of 6 or fewer foods that they are willing to eat, and it's not just stubbornness, they really seem to be incapable of eating other things. The things on those lists tend to be high in fat/sugar, white/light colored, and almost always include chicken nuggets. It's NOT always lazy parenting. It may not even MOSTLY be lazy parents. Some kids just. will. not. eat. and some parents/doctors don't have the awareness or education to stop and say "WHOA. Time out, something is WRONG and I need to find out what it is."

It sounds stupid to say, "Picky eating is a disorder" but it is very much linked to sensory issues, sensory processing issues, and autism.
Okay, I have a hard time swallowing this, but I'll take your word on this, as I have very little knowledge of sensory issues and the like. But....fast foods as we know them have not been around very long. We truly do not know the connection of the 'stuff' they put in fast food and health problems. Haven't there been families that noticed some symptoms of autism and aspergers was lessened with dietary changes?
So, my question would be...is choosing to eat only crap food caused by a disorder or is the disorder caused by the crap food?
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SilverSabre25 03:12 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by AmyLeigh:
Okay, I have a hard time swallowing this, but I'll take your word on this, as I have very little knowledge of sensory issues and the like. But....fast foods as we know them have not been around very long. We truly do not know the connection of the 'stuff' they put in fast food and health problems. Haven't there been families that noticed some symptoms of autism and aspergers was lessened with dietary changes?
So, my question would be...is choosing to eat only crap food caused by a disorder or is the disorder caused by the crap food?
Um....yes?

It's not so much exactly "choosing" to eat only crap food...it's more...they have a very limited profile of textures/flavors that are acceptable/tolerable to their palate.

Families that have seen improvement with dietary changes usually have eliminated not "crap" so much as gluten and dairy, sometimes soy as well. and yes, eliminating those has the happy side effect of eliminating crap as well.

But, potatoes have been around for eons. Rice has been around for eons. Noodles have been around for a long time. The diets of people with these picky eating issues tend to be very bland, very light in color. They do not like flavorings or herbs/spices, even butter on rice or noodles, even salt on things sometimes.

YES the junk causes health issues. YES we don't know the full extent of them. YES the government approves stuff and touts it as being safe without actually knowing the full impact. NO the government does NOT have our best interest in mind (it has $$$ in mind).

NO a child refusing to eat more than a limited profile of foods does NOT equal a terrible, neglectful parent--sometimes people with the best, most varied and nutritious diets in the world have children who just will. Not. Eat. My sister has two of them. They just won't eat...and they don't resort to only fast food because they have hardly ever *had* the stuff, and they are NOT that extreme, but they are very picky kids. One has diagnosed sensory processing disorder.

Many, many reason can exist for extreme picky eating...

Children with autism often have sensory issues, extreme sensory issues, both sensory avoidant (like eating, sounds, certain fabrics) and sensory seeking (hand flapping, rocking, shrieking). It varies in every autistic person.

Some children are more or less born anorexic and have a very limited profile of foods and struggle *their whole lives* with eating enough to survive. I know someone whose DD is like this. She NEVER wanted to eat, even as an infant. Was diagnosed with anorexia at 3 or 5 or something like that. If she wants to eat something, the let her, they don't care...they're just glad she's eating *something* without a fight.

There are probably hundreds of other perfectly legitimate conditions and reasons for a child to be an extreme picky eater.

just because you've never experienced it, doesn't mean it's not real. Just because you don't know, or aren't yourself, a picky eater, doesn't mean that everyone who has a picky child is a moronic lazy parent who deserves to be thrown in prison or have their children taken from them.
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AmyLeigh 04:46 PM 01-27-2012
Originally Posted by SilverSabre25:
just because you've never experienced it, doesn't mean it's not real.
So true. That is the case with a lot of things.
Thank you for the information. It may prove to be helpful to me (and others) in the future.
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smb757 08:46 PM 01-27-2012
I'm wondering if "crap foods" is referring to dyes and such. My brother had ADHD behaviors that were GREATLY improved by taking out red & yellow dyes.
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Meyou 04:29 AM 01-28-2012
Silver, would you agree that children with eating related disorders (of any kind) are the exception, not the norm? I'm totally with you that some children have legitimate food related problems but I really think they are very rare.

It's a similar comparison for me to the children with real ADHD, ADD and OCD problems against the ones who's parents claim they have these problems to explain their child's out of control behavior. There are children really, really struggling with ADHD etc and it severely affects their lifestyle (and their family). And there there are the thousands who just need a timeout, healthy food and a nap.

The part I'm struggling with is how common food disorders can really be in children? The data is so convoluted with processed foods and chemicals in everything that how can we even determine what is environment and what isn't? I think it's safe to say that most of the children in 1st world countries eat a processed "poor" diet containing chemicals, genetically altered foods and preservatives. So where is the baseline?

When I first met my stepdaughter she was a much loved, much spoiled, running the show child. She has some severe health concerns (SB and tourettes) so I understand where their hearts and heads were when she was younger. My dh ran hoops to keep her happy both with entertainment and food. She ate pizza, KD, nuggets and very, very little fruit and veg. She was playing him like a sweet melody. Silly man. There was a night I was frustrated about him cooking something separate for her...again and I spoke to him about it. After much soul searching and guilt he finally agreed that making things "fair" around here wasn't going to kill her. lol My argument was that if he wanted her to have a normal life he had to treat her like a normal kid and let her sink or swim like the rest of them. If a 4 year old can unload my dishwasher, then a 10 year old should have no problem. If the dc kids eat whatever I put in front of them, then it won't kill her to try new things. He had very little defense living in a house with multiple very young children doing everyday tasks easily. Now several years later and many, many tears from her she's a pretty average kid when it comes to food, chores and life. He realizes that they (his ex and he) created their own problems to solve out of guilt.

I think THIS is more common that real food related disorders. Maybe that's too closeminded of me but I'm ready to be enlightened.
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Countrygal 10:44 AM 01-28-2012
Some really good information in this link that I'd be interested in following through with. Silver and Ariana, could you provide some links?

Being a person who can't eat gluten, dairy or msg, I can tell you first-hand that diet can effect EVERYTHING! What effects you as an individual is just as individual as you are!

I can also attest that things like bacteria within the system cause many problems as well. Many, many things are not known fully in the medical world, especially about diet and nutrition, medications, pesticides and herbicides, preservatives, etc. They are not easily followed to prove anything. For example, does a cow sprinkled with a pesticide carry that pesticide in their system? Does it get transmitted in very minute, unmeasurable quantities into their products - be it beef, milk, whatever.... If so, how much of it comes out in the end product? And then, if we eat those products with that indeterminate miniscule amount of pesticide, taken in a body, over the course of 50 years, does it cause any damage?? Does it have anything to do with the increased rate of things like cancer, intestinal illnesses, behavioral issues and disorders, eating disorders, things like autism, ADHD, tourettes, the list goes on....

Noone knows the answers. All you can do is what you think is best for your family. A friend of mine liked to use this quote "all we can do is go with the light we are given". I've considered this a good rule to follow.
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familyschoolcare 12:27 PM 01-28-2012
Originally Posted by Meyou:
Silver, would you agree that children with eating related disorders (of any kind) are the exception, not the norm? I'm totally with you that some children have legitimate food related problems but I really think they are very rare.

It's a similar comparison for me to the children with real ADHD, ADD and OCD problems against the ones who's parents claim they have these problems to explain their child's out of control behavior. There are children really, really struggling with ADHD etc and it severely affects their lifestyle (and their family). And there there are the thousands who just need a timeout, healthy food and a nap.

The part I'm struggling with is how common food disorders can really be in children? The data is so convoluted with processed foods and chemicals in everything that how can we even determine what is environment and what isn't? I think it's safe to say that most of the children in 1st world countries eat a processed "poor" diet containing chemicals, genetically altered foods and preservatives. So where is the baseline?

When I first met my stepdaughter she was a much loved, much spoiled, running the show child. She has some severe health concerns (SB and tourettes) so I understand where their hearts and heads were when she was younger. My dh ran hoops to keep her happy both with entertainment and food. She ate pizza, KD, nuggets and very, very little fruit and veg. She was playing him like a sweet melody. Silly man. There was a night I was frustrated about him cooking something separate for her...again and I spoke to him about it. After much soul searching and guilt he finally agreed that making things "fair" around here wasn't going to kill her. lol My argument was that if he wanted her to have a normal life he had to treat her like a normal kid and let her sink or swim like the rest of them. If a 4 year old can unload my dishwasher, then a 10 year old should have no problem. If the dc kids eat whatever I put in front of them, then it won't kill her to try new things. He had very little defense living in a house with multiple very young children doing everyday tasks easily. Now several years later and many, many tears from her she's a pretty average kid when it comes to food, chores and life. He realizes that they (his ex and he) created their own problems to solve out of guilt.

I think THIS is more common that real food related disorders. Maybe that's too closeminded of me but I'm ready to be enlightened.
This was/is my toughts on the matter.

People in western society are very quick to lable and explain things with a disorder rather than "fix" the problem. When realy the label should be used to help "fix" the "problem".
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AmyLeigh 09:14 PM 01-28-2012
Originally Posted by Meyou:
Silver, would you agree that children with eating related disorders (of any kind) are the exception, not the norm? I'm totally with you that some children have legitimate food related problems but I really think they are very rare.

It's a similar comparison for me to the children with real ADHD, ADD and OCD problems against the ones who's parents claim they have these problems to explain their child's out of control behavior. There are children really, really struggling with ADHD etc and it severely affects their lifestyle (and their family). And there there are the thousands who just need a timeout, healthy food and a nap.

The part I'm struggling with is how common food disorders can really be in children? The data is so convoluted with processed foods and chemicals in everything that how can we even determine what is environment and what isn't? I think it's safe to say that most of the children in 1st world countries eat a processed "poor" diet containing chemicals, genetically altered foods and preservatives. So where is the baseline?

.....I think THIS is more common that real food related disorders. Maybe that's too closeminded of me but I'm ready to be enlightened.
That is how I feel at times, too. Labeling is far to easy to do rather than discipline in some, and I stress some, cases. There are those who legitimately have a disorder and need to learn to adjust to the world (since the world won't adjust to them) and there are others who are just playing the power game.
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