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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>DCM asked for payoff for withdrawal 1 week ago now wants to give notice a week later
aDCProvider 01:55 PM 08-28-2014
And pay the same amount.

I require a 4 week written notice period. Last Friday DCM said she "may be giving notice" and asked how much she'd owe to give notice. I quoted her the amount. Now a week later, she wants to give notice and payoff is 1 weeks tuition higher but she does not want to pay. She thinks she gave notice last week. I told her it must be written notice and that is the withdrawal form I told her I would send and did send.

How would you proceed?
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bklsmum 02:48 PM 08-28-2014
I would tell her that she never submitted the paperwork she was told she had to submit and she owes the amount due after she submits the paperwork.
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daycare 02:54 PM 08-28-2014
Originally Posted by bklsmum:
I would tell her that she never submitted the paperwork she was told she had to submit and she owes the amount due after she submits the paperwork.
ditto..

I also had this happen. Mom told me about it one day at drop off, even gave me the exact date, which was only 20 days, not 30. I remind mom to make sure she puts in her request for termination in writing.

Mom never follows through. 2 weeks go by and I am sending out the invoice for the month and mom says why are you giving me this, I already told you that we were leaving on xyz date. I responded I never got your notice in writing, I copied our contract, sent it to her and said, I understand you told me, however, per daycare policies, you failed to properly notify me.

I told her that since she did not give me written notice, that I assumed she had changed her mind. BOy was she mad as you know what....
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Blackcat31 02:58 PM 08-28-2014
"DCM, please refer to your handbook for proper withdrawal."

If your policies say you require WRITTEN notice for withdrawal, then she needs to provide WRITTEN notice.

Just because she asked a question about withdrawing wouldn't automatically mean she is withdrawing...kiwm?

I have kids that ask what's for lunch but that is no guarantee they are actually going to eat lunch.
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aDCProvider 04:22 PM 08-28-2014
Of course, I was just bombarded with novel length texts saying that I was closed the day she was going to drop off the withdrawal form (I closed Tuesday due to a stomach bug). Although, she could have easily left it in the mail box. She's resorting to calling me greedy!

I have zero energy to fight with this DCM who has fought me on every policy enforcement, and has always tried to bully me or threaten me with pulling to get her way. I told her I will not argue and that she can do whatever she thinks fair, to which she is still arguing with calling me Greedy. my final text said to do whatever you think fair and I'm hurt to see her resort to name calling and questioning my character and to just turn in the notice tomorrow with whatever payment she decides is fair and that I would like this to end nicely!

I can't fight this person anymore! I would like to enforce the termination policy which says that she can be terminated without notice for nonpayment, disrespect etc!
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cheerfuldom 04:37 PM 08-28-2014
Originally Posted by aDCProvider:
Of course, I was just bombarded with novel length texts saying that I was closed the day she was going to drop off the withdrawal form (I closed Tuesday due to a stomach bug). Although, she could have easily left it in the mail box. She's resorting to calling me greedy!

I have zero energy to fight with this DCM who has fought me on every policy enforcement, and has always tried to bully me or threaten me with pulling to get her way. I told her I will not argue and that she can do whatever she thinks fair, to which she is still arguing with calling me Greedy. my final text said to do whatever you think fair and I'm hurt to see her resort to name calling and questioning my character and to just turn in the notice tomorrow with whatever payment she decides is fair and that I would like this to end nicely!

I can't fight this person anymore! I would like to enforce the termination policy which says that she can be terminated without notice for nonpayment, disrespect etc!
I would term immediately. I wouldnt require anything other than payment up through today. You are backing down and letting her have care her way and pay what she wants AND dealing with the drama. why???? just get rid of her. she already wants to leave so just cut the cord, ignore all texts and get her and her stuff gone. I wouldnt let her come by for anything.
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sahm1225 06:38 PM 08-28-2014
Originally Posted by cheerfuldom:
I would term immediately. I wouldnt require anything other than payment up through today. You are backing down and letting her have care her way and pay what she wants AND dealing with the drama. why???? just get rid of her. she already wants to leave so just cut the cord, ignore all texts and get her and her stuff gone. I wouldnt let her come by for anything.
This.

She's leaving anyway, cut your losses now and tell her that because of her complete disrespect you felt it was 'fair' to just end it now. Mail her the supplies, don't allow that dcm in your home again
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MarinaVanessa 10:48 PM 08-28-2014
Originally Posted by cheerfuldom:
I would term immediately. I wouldnt require anything other than payment up through today. You are backing down and letting her have care her way and pay what she wants AND dealing with the drama. why???? just get rid of her. she already wants to leave so just cut the cord, ignore all texts and get her and her stuff gone. I wouldnt let her come by for anything.
Yup this. I'd text and/or email her and say as of RIGHT NOW she has no more daycare. I'd end the text with "... without any further payment to ensure you that I am not greedy and do not need your money."

Good riddance.
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aDCProvider 03:51 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by MV:
Yup this. I'd text and/or email her and say as of RIGHT NOW she has no more daycare. I'd end the text with "... without any further payment to ensure you that I am not greedy and do not need your money."

Good riddance.
How would you handle the fact that she is paid up for 3 weeks (next week and the 2 week deposit that I require when starting)?

I rarely deal with the mom unless she gets pissed then she's a text bully/harasser. I feel like I would have less issues if I just let her child come next week and be done with it.

The worst part is that she says she been a good client and friend. Ha! If this is how your treat your friends I'd hate to be your enemy!
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Meyou 04:19 AM 08-29-2014
I would refund all the money and return her child's possessions just to be done with her. It would teach her a valuable lesson on being polite and following a contract. Sometimes it's better to take a financial loss than let a DCP get away with bad behavior.
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coolconfidentme 04:34 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by Meyou:
I would refund all the money and return her child's possessions just to be done with her. It would teach her a valuable lesson on being polite and following a contract. Sometimes it's better to take a financial loss than let a DCP get away with bad behavior.
Not trying to pick a fight, but I don't understand this. How would refunding her money teaching her to follow the contract she signed & agreed to? She probably will not be polite over it either. She sounds like a right fighter. She thinks she is right & giving a refund proves it to her in her mind.

If I ever learned anything on this forum, I learned this: If I don't follow my contract, why should my clients?

Give her a term letter, with the notice you require per contract. If she doesn't pay, take her to small claims. I'm sure the local judge will agree with you.
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Meyou 04:43 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme:
Not trying to pick a fight, but I don't understand this. How would refunding her money teaching her to follow the contract she signed & agreed to? She probably will not be polite over it either. She sounds like a right fighter. She thinks she is right & giving a refund proves it to her in her mind.

If I ever learned anything on this forum, I learned this: If I don't follow my contract, why should my clients?

Give her a term letter, with the notice you require per contract. If she doesn't pay, take her to small claims. I'm sure the local judge will agree with you.
She needs care for the next 3 weeks. She wants it on her terms. By refunding and not allowing her back into the house the provider is telling her, "No, it's my terms OR it's my terms." DCM loses her power and her childcare.

Don't get me wrong...in most cases I would advocate for the provider to fight but this Mom is intimidating the OP and causing her to lose sleep. It's in the OP's best interest to end things quickly IMO.
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coolconfidentme 05:34 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by Meyou:
She needs care for the next 3 weeks. She wants it on her terms. By refunding and not allowing her back into the house the provider is telling her, "No, it's my terms OR it's my terms." DCM loses her power and her childcare.

Don't get me wrong...in most cases I would advocate for the provider to fight but this Mom is intimidating the OP and causing her to lose sleep. It's in the OP's best interest to end things quickly IMO.
I do see your point, truly I do. What if she gave her a term letter & request payment in full before care is given. If she doesn't pay, she doesn't come.
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cheerfuldom 05:45 AM 08-29-2014
My contract allows me to terminate immediately for any reason so regarding my advice, if I termed immediately, I would not be breaking my own contract. A contract shouldn't hold you hostage. Revamp it so that it gives you the power and the best end of the deal. Thats just business. Yes it is to inform parents and commit to times/rates/etc. but don't let it box you in and result in situations where you have to deal with a parents like this!
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aDCProvider 07:38 AM 08-29-2014
DCM only needs care for next week and then is gone. I never see or hear from DCM unless the has something to complain about. My DH made a good point, if I were to term immediately this woman would lose it! She would harass me as she has done before and she is very vindictive and would not put it past her to do something!

DH thinks its not worth the risk of her becoming unhinged and just dealing with one more week. BTW her child and DH are awesome and she's very friendly and nice if she's getting her way.

I don't want to deal with the next steps which I can see happening if I term on the spot (harassment, vindictive behavior, bad mouthing me).
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Second Home 07:41 AM 08-29-2014
I don't want to deal with the next steps which I can see happening if I term on the spot (harassment, vindictive behavior, bad mouthing me).

Chances are she is going to do this anyway .
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MarinaVanessa 07:41 AM 08-29-2014
Ok, so the DCM is all paid up and in fact she is paid in advance for the next 3 weeks. DCM paid for the following week in advance and you have the mom's 2 week deposit which is used for the final 2 weeks correct?

If you don't want to term immediately and don't want to refund any money then absolutely insist that she pay for that remaining week that she is obligated to pay for as per the contract that she signed and because of the fact that you reminded her that you needed her notice in writing and she did not supply it.

If you have a text which shows that you told her about giving notice in writing then take a snapshot and send that to her as well. She doesn't attend until she has paid everything that is owed. Do you have a no pay/no play policy?

"Susan, setting everything that has happened aside I am still willing to work with you. I am still requiring payment for the last week of care that you owe ... and yes you owe that ... and I will continue to do daycare for you until the end of your termination period.

I reminded you when you verbally told me that you were terminating our contract that I needed it in writing. Up to this point I have upheld our contract. It was your responsibility to turn in your 2 week notice in writing and you did not. You have never had a problem with me or the level of care that I have given your child until I enforce policies that you agreed to follow when you signed the contract.

This has nothing to do greed and everything to do with the fact that you have a responsibility to uphold your part of the contract because I have upheld my part. You once called me a friend and I am surprised at your behavior because I for one would never do or say the things to a friend that you have done and said to me and I would never try to take advantage of one of my friends or shortchange them.

You can pay for the week that you owe on Monday morning when you drop little Suzie off and finish out your termination period and we can be grown adults and be civil or you can choose not to pay for that remaining week that you owe and be in breach of contract which means YOU are immediately terminating the agreement. It's your choice.

I adore little Suzie and I never wished anything but the best for you or your family. I understand that it may not be what you want however you must also understand that what you want is affecting what is legal and fair for me. I do not know what I have done to deserve that from you because I have always given your child excellent care. I want things to end on a good note and I will leave it up to you to decide what you want to do."

This is what I would want to say anyway
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MarinaVanessa 07:42 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by aDCProvider:
BTW her child and DH are awesome and she's very friendly and nice if she's getting her way.
This my dear is called an adult tantrum.
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mom2many 07:44 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by MV:
Yup this. I'd text and/or email her and say as of RIGHT NOW she has no more daycare. I'd end the text with "... without any further payment to ensure you that I am not greedy and do not need your money."

Good riddance.
Yes! No amount of $ is worth dealing with this!
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KiddieCahoots 07:49 AM 08-29-2014
My contract allows me to terminate on the spot without any reimbursements.

I had a dcm that withdrew on Monday, after I had arranged an immediate meeting on Friday to correct issues.
She had a week deposit in her account, and had just given me a check on Friday for the following week of care. That was two weeks of payment, and I kept all monies.
Even though I had a two week, written withdrawal/termination notice required of parents in my hb, didn't foresee having them continue childcare for those two weeks being beneficial to anyone.

So maybe......keep the deposit, and give her back the last payment she made, then terminate instantly on the grounds of inappropriate behavior of the parent.
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aDCProvider 08:01 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by MV:
Ok, so the DCM is all paid up and in fact she is paid in advance for the next 3 weeks. DCM paid for the following week in advance and you have the mom's 2 week deposit which is used for the final 2 weeks correct?

If you don't want to term immediately and don't want to refund any money then absolutely insist that she pay for that remaining week that she is obligated to pay for as per the contract that she signed and because of the fact that you reminded her that you needed her notice in writing and she did not supply it.

If you have a text which shows that you told her about giving notice in writing then take a snapshot and send that to her as well. She doesn't attend until she has paid everything that is owed. Do you have a no pay/no play policy?

"Susan, setting everything that has happened aside I am still willing to work with you. I am still requiring payment for the last week of care that you owe ... and yes you owe that ... and I will continue to do daycare for you until the end of your termination period.

I reminded you when you verbally told me that you were terminating our contract that I needed it in writing. Up to this point I have upheld our contract. It was your responsibility to turn in your 2 week notice in writing and you did not. You have never had a problem with me or the level of care that I have given your child until I enforce policies that you agreed to follow when you signed the contract.

This has nothing to do greed and everything to do with the fact that you have a responsibility to uphold your part of the contract because I have upheld my part. You once called me a friend and I am surprised at your behavior because I for one would never do or say the things to a friend that you have done and said to me and I would never try to take advantage of one of my friends or shortchange them.

You can pay for the week that you owe on Monday morning when you drop little Suzie off and finish out your termination period and we can be grown adults and be civil or you can choose not to pay for that remaining week that you owe and be in breach of contract which means YOU are immediately terminating the agreement. It's your choice.

I adore little Suzie and I never wished anything but the best for you or your family. I understand that it may not be what you want however you must also understand that what you want is affecting what is legal and fair for me. I do not know what I have done to deserve that from you because I have always given your child excellent care. I want things to end on a good note and I will leave it up to you to decide what you want to do."

This is what I would want to say anyway
you have it correct, she is paid up for 3 weeks but leaving after next week and was "floored and outraged that I would charge her for a week her child wouldn't even be there". The extra week being the 4th week of the notice period.the text exchange we had she asked on Friday if she could confirm withdrawal on Tuesday after meeting her kids preschool teacher. I said yes! She asked if she would still owe the same amount if confirmed Tuesday, I said yes. I then never heard anything until yesterday (Thursday). She's blaming me being closed for why she didn't confirm and drop off the form. She very easily could have left it in my mailbox like she's done dozens of times with her tuitition check.

This woman is a BULLY and gets nasty when crossed and I have ZERO energy to put up her crap anymore. To give you an idea of how mean she can be....her child started going through a phase of not wanting to leave home and come to daycare (very normal), she started questioning me on what happened at my house to make her not want to come. She then starts blaming my newborn for why she doesn't want to come. Asking if I don't give her any attention or was only paying attention to my baby. And said ever since you had that baby, she doesn't like coming to your house, what are you doing?

I don't want to deal with anymore of her tantrums and harassing! They are gone in a week!
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MOM OF 4 10:57 AM 08-29-2014
Originally Posted by aDCProvider:
you have it correct, she is paid up for 3 weeks but leaving after next week and was "floored and outraged that I would charge her for a week her child wouldn't even be there". The extra week being the 4th week of the notice period.the text exchange we had she asked on Friday if she could confirm withdrawal on Tuesday after meeting her kids preschool teacher. I said yes! She asked if she would still owe the same amount if confirmed Tuesday, I said yes. I then never heard anything until yesterday (Thursday). She's blaming me being closed for why she didn't confirm and drop off the form. She very easily could have left it in my mailbox like she's done dozens of times with her tuitition check.

This woman is a BULLY and gets nasty when crossed and I have ZERO energy to put up her crap anymore. To give you an idea of how mean she can be....her child started going through a phase of not wanting to leave home and come to daycare (very normal), she started questioning me on what happened at my house to make her not want to come. She then starts blaming my newborn for why she doesn't want to come. Asking if I don't give her any attention or was only paying attention to my baby. And said ever since you had that baby, she doesn't like coming to your house, what are you doing?

I don't want to deal with anymore of her tantrums and harassing! They are gone in a week!
I would let her know that you are terming immediately, and WHY, and no refund. If she gets any nastier, and continues her harassing behavior, I'd let her know you'll get a restraining order. You can also write a cease and decist letter if she is trying to badmouth you. She'll do it whether or not you finish the last week out.

I'd seriously tell her to get lost. NO MORE CARE because MOM doesn't deserve it. She's ALREADY accusing you of things, and that won't stop, even when she leaves.
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aDCProvider 01:53 PM 08-29-2014
Hahahaha! DCD didn't have the withdrawal form at pick up, said DCM will drop it off "at some point" and said "I'm not even sure what form she was talking about". So I explained the situation and that notice isn't given until the form is received. I also told him DCM was not too happy about being told about an extra week of tuition because she hadn't yet turned in the withdrawal form. DCD said well if those are the rules, I'll let her know.

Now I'm waiting for DCM to show up here in person to hand in the withdrawal form. I'm going to make sure I'm not here and if I am I will not be opening the door. I don't know what this woman is capable of and frankly her unbalanced behavior frightens me!
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NightOwl 08:29 PM 08-29-2014
I know you're exhausted dealing with this lady, but please don't back down. Don't refund her money. Give her deposit back AFTER the child is already gone, just like you originally said, since she will have a credit.

Backing down tells her she's right. Just like with a toddler. If you back down, you've just taught them that their behaviors work and that you are a pushover.
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aDCProvider 07:19 AM 08-30-2014
Originally Posted by Wednesday:
I know you're exhausted dealing with this lady, but please don't back down. Don't refund her money. Give her deposit back AFTER the child is already gone, just like you originally said, since she will have a credit.

Backing down tells her she's right. Just like with a toddler. If you back down, you've just taught them that their behaviors work and that you are a pushover.
I don't refund deposits and never agreed to refund her anything.

The issue here is that she's claiming she gave notice last Friday when she "texted" (which she is claiming in written notice, nope not "written") that she "may be" giving notice. She wanted her payoff amount as of last Friday which for the 4 week notice period was $8. She asked if she confirmed Tuesday if the amount would be the same, I said yes, however, she never confirmed or turned in her notice form. She claims because I was closed Tuesday for a sick day she couldn't turn in her notice. She still hasn't turned in notice. DCD showed up yesterday and was supposed to have had the form (according to mom) but didn't and knew nothing about it.

In my agreement it is stated "notice is not considered given until a written discharge letter is received". She is responsible for 4 weeks tuition (1 paid now, her credit for 1 week which is already paid, and her deposit covers the last 2 weeks) if the notice was handed in yesterday.

She also now owes a late pick up charge from Thursday In the amount of $10 which I told her needed to be paid ASAP, she said she would pay Friday (yesterday) and didn't. My agreement states "payments are due no later than Friday, if not made they begin to accrue a $10/day late fee until paid". So, now her $10 late pick up charge is $20. DCK doesn't come again until Tuesday. When DCD tries to drop off the amount due will be $50 ($10+4 days late fee). I will tell him that I cannot accept drop off until that payment is made.

At this point, it seems she's trying to stick it to me by not paying or turning in her written notice.

DCD is a reasonable person and will probably try to settle up with me since he understands that rules are rules and said so at pick up yesterday.

I won't term immediately because I adore their child and don't want to miss my last few days with her and I don't want to hurt DCD, since DCM would not be the one effected by losing childcare.



DCM just dropped off notice and texted that she will be paying her final week once she pays for her child's preschool. Payment is due this coming Friday. She also claimed to not be notified that her late pick up charge could accrue late fees. Um, read your agreement! For 2 years you have been aware that all payments are due on Fridays and are subject to late fees if not paid by Friday. We will see if she transfers the payment with the late fee added. DCD must have had a talk with her because suddenly she's being reasonable and agreeing to pay the additional week for the notice period.
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NightOwl 09:04 AM 08-30-2014
Wow. So she just slapped her signature on the contract and apparently didn't read any of it. That's not your problem, that's her problem. I'm really sorry you're dealing with this. And especially because you seem to really love the child. If she continues to ride the crazy train, can you insist on only dealing/speaking with dcd for the duration of the notice period? He seems like the level headed one.
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KiddieCahoots 11:38 AM 08-30-2014
Originally Posted by Wednesday:
Wow. So she just slapped her signature on the contract and apparently didn't read any of it. That's not your problem, that's her problem. I'm really sorry you're dealing with this. And especially because you seem to really love the child. If she continues to ride the crazy train, can you insist on only dealing/speaking with dcd for the duration of the notice period? He seems like the level headed one.
.......Good idea!
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aDCProvider 08:52 PM 08-30-2014
DCM failed to add her $10 fee for late payment to the amount she transferred. Obviously the full payment still has not been made. How would you ladies handle this? Should she continue to accrue late fees for not making the full payment since she left out the late payment fee? This is what I feel should happen! Or just tell her to pay the $10. If no late fee is attached to the payment then she can essentially pay whenever, with no penalty.
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JoseyJo 05:19 AM 08-31-2014
Originally Posted by aDCProvider:
DCM failed to add her $10 fee for late payment to the amount she transferred. Obviously the full payment still has not been made. How would you ladies handle this? Should she continue to accrue late fees for not making the full payment since she left out the late payment fee? This is what I feel should happen! Or just tell her to pay the $10. If no late fee is attached to the payment then she can essentially pay whenever, with no penalty.
Honestly, at this point I would let it go. She is totally paid out except that $10 right? As long as she picks up on time for the rest of the notice period I would be good with that....

Just my opinion!
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aDCProvider 10:21 AM 08-31-2014
Originally Posted by JoseyJo:
Honestly, at this point I would let it go. She is totally paid out except that $10 right? As long as she picks up on time for the rest of the notice period I would be good with that....

Just my opinion!
No, she still owes a week of tuition due Friday.
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NightOwl 11:54 AM 08-31-2014
I would insist on the $10. This had become a war of the wills. Don't back down! Someone needs to put this woman in her place.
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KidGrind 04:23 PM 09-01-2014
Originally Posted by aDCProvider:
No, she still owes a week of tuition due Friday.
The child would not attend until her account is current. If she didn’t/doesn’t pay Friday then the child cannot attend.
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aDCProvider 03:34 PM 09-08-2014
DCKs last day was Friday. I received their withdrawal form on 8/30 a whole 8 days after DCM TEXTED that she "may be giving notice". I reminded her because of the delay in confirming her notice she would be responsible for an additional week of tuition to round out her 4 week notice period, which was due Friday (9/5). Today I text DCM and DCD and let them know that their payment is 3 days late and payment is now $30 higher due to late fees and I said I would waive the late fee if payment was made today before 5pm. I get a text back from DCM that she told me the payment would be late and she will only be paying the tuition amount and no late fee. And that she "thinks we both know that the added tuition charge on top of the 2 week deposit is a ridiculous charge considering a miscommunication (so she says) and the closing (me closing for a sick day) and that DCK won't be there anymore". she also said she will be paying the tuition amount "against her better judgment and that is all she will be paying me and I can proceed as I feel necessary".

This has got to be a joke!!! How do people like this survive in life not paying their bills?! If i do get payment I'm not going to take her to small claims for late fees, but geez, grow up and pay your damn bills!

I am so thankful I am closing in a few weeks! I can't stand these childish and irresponsible parents anymore!!!!
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Unregistered 04:41 PM 09-08-2014
WOW!! She sounds absolutely lovely
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