So this year my business has been slow. I have lost several kids due to parents losing jobs, one going to school and one that I could no longer meet the needs of. Currently, I am down to two part time kids that together make up a full time spot, and two full timers. Which one of them will leave in the fall for kinder.

So my only full time kid that is staying after the fall, the DCP comes to me to tell me that they are having a really hard time with thier work schedules and will need to do one of two things:1. find a daycare closer to their jobs or 2. ask me to extend my hours an hour later than I am open now..(7:00pm) They would also start bringing their other child here as well, so I would have two full time kids. In panic mode thinking about the income loss, I agree to do it. I think to myself, well if it does not work out I can always let them know and term......

So now I am sitting here thinking wow did I just do that for one family? I know I shouldn't have but I did. My next thing is how much do I charge this family? BOth kids would be here for 10.5 hour days. My current contract says no more than 9.5 hour days. I would also need to feed these kids dinner, as we eat at 6:30 every night. This would mean that these kids would be here for 5 meals a day....

Right now my hours of operation are all messed up, but will go back to normal in the fall...I will be open from 7:45 to 6:00 pm daily.... All but for this family.

What would you charge and please don't tell me I'm nuts, I alreay know I am....lol

But thanks in advance for your help!!!

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so its 10 extra hours total and 5 meals (for both kids)?

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Yes. That's correct.
Omg my husband is Gonna kill me.... Lol

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Daycare, What were you thinking? You shouldn't feed your daycare kids for dinner. The parents need to feed their kids for dinner. I wouldn't feed my daycare kids for dinner at all.

I would charge extra for 10.5 hours if you really need income to support your family.

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lol safechner, I don't think I was thinking...lol
Seeing that the kids would be here until 7pm nightly and my family eats dinner at 6:30, I would not eat infront of these kids and without giving them food. Plus, they would be starving. My PM snack is at 3:30.

I just need to sit down and figure out the extra cost......

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I certainly understand needing the money. I just finished watering our new lawn, and because all of the outside work we did came in way over budget (but will fortunately benefit the daycare as much as it will us), I was thinking about how to pay the bill before the interest catches up with us. I'm going to have to stop being so picky about clients and maybe start going after the part time business that's so prevalent out there. My first horrible client helped me grow a much thicker skin, so I know I can always replace them if they don't work out!

But as for you, if the kids will be there an extra 10 or so hours per week per child, why don't you just figure out what your daily rate is and up the overall rate by one day per week per child? And on top of that, I would add another $80 - $100 for meals charges per month. Dinner is an important meal; the parents shouldn't be missing that one. Would that work?

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I had that same problem with the dinner. 1 kid I fed EVERY meal because I had to, he was here. He didn't arrive until 8:00 but he was pulled from sleep thrown in the car then I was told by DCM he needs fed breakfast and of course the snacks and lunch and dinner because he was here until 6:30- 7:00 pm and our dinner time is 5:00.

I think the food program should make adjustments to help more if the children are in care for 10 hrs or more. What are we supposed to do, not feed them? I even asked the food prog and she said something like "Sadly we cannot allow any more meals but u cant let a child go hungry or eat in front of him so u will have to feed him dinner as well or terminate the contract." So I fed him every meal and DCM was happy and proud to say she saves on groceries because she only had to feed him on weekends!

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So I charge $5.00 an hour which becomes Thierry daily rate x5.
so that would be an xtra $50.00 a week per child???
Plus an additional $100 monthly for food for both?
That would be an additional $250 per child right?
I'm so bad at math!!

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Lord gotta love it!! Yeah I'm aware the food program won't help past 2 meals and 1 snack.
I have to figure out the cost to see if it's even worth it..
If the cost is too high I'm sure they will go else where for care

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Well I too was in need of money so I accepted it and just dealt with it. I didn't mind too much as far as the money. I wasn't allowed to charge anything extra. I am paid $20 for the day and the food prog was $5 per day. It was the loss of our only family meal together. After I took him on there were no more private family meals except for weekends. We had to deal with the food throwing, food spitting, spilling etc just like lunch time. It wasn't everyday but it did happen. I would just run over everything again and be sure it's what u want to do. I actually termed that child last month and now have our family meals back!! What a difference a couple hours made! If nothing else u can take them on for a trial basis and see how it works for u. Good luck!

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So we can't charge for the fact that we will have to serve 5 meals but only get compensated for 3 of those 5? Ugh

Yeah I think I should have asked my husband first, but he does not get off work until 10pm 2-3 days a week so I didn't think to ask him.

I know I won't do it with out increasing the price.

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You minght be able to. Here we are not allowed to charge anything extra. Just recentky we are allowed to charge for late pick ups! That wasn't permitted last year! Everything varies from state to state so I would just ask and be sure and if u can then go for it if it works for u. I know none of my clients would pay extra. I fight to get the darn co-pay half the time! I know if it was MY kid I would gladly pay for quality care! Daycare is NOT the place to save money! I hope it works out for u!

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If I follow, you charge $5/hour? That's $52.50 for 10.5 additional hours per week. Multiply by 2 for 2 kids, and that's $105/week for extra hours, and make it easy and say $25/week for meals for both kids. That's $130 additional per week. That should be enough to cover your additional costs and the cost of cutting into family time. Plus the stress of working extra long days.

Hopefully, you'll find more clients that can work within your open hours. I'm routing for ya daycare!

eta: and if the cost is too high, you can use that $130/week figure and discount it however you want. I think it's more than fair though, since they're asking for what amounts to two extra days of work per week (one day per kid), and 10 additional meals per week.

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I don't do any state pay, only private. I chose not take it years ago and am super happy I did because California is always behind on their payments.... Ugh

I'll call and ask about the food program tomorrow. Thanks for all of your help.

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So you think $130 extra a week is fair per child??

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You can't charge for anything extra? Why? Isn't it your business, or does this have something to do with state clients?

And I have to totally agree with the bolded sentence. One of my major issues with this field of work is that people devalue the service so much. Who in their right mind thinks it's ok to pay someone $1-$2/hour to take care of their child all day? It's not the place to pinch pennies. It's the place to put all of your additional money. If all you can afford is $1/hour, that's one thing, but you should be ashamed of yourself if you think that's all it's worth.

/soapbox. And sorry for derailing.

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Yes that's it exactly. U can't charge them for any extras. We didn't even have the late pick up fees until recently. We have an option to take them and so if we agree we abide by their policies. They are "here to help people" but they tend to forget the providers need help too at times. We don't get paid for days off, sick days, or any vacation. If they aren't in care we don't get paid. AND if they are here under 4 hrs we only get 1/2 days pay. Like 3 hrs and 59 mins they would take it down to $10 for the day. It's rare that happens to me tho. I usually have the opposite, long hours. I usually only get state paid in here because they set the income guidline so high almost anyone can get assistance. I had a parent in here that made $1,800 every month ans she still only paid $2.00 per day for her co-pay!

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I charge 55 for 2 kids up to 9 hours, and then 7 dollars for every hour after that. So for your 10.5 hours that would be 65.50 every day for both children. What do the parents do that they need to work wierd hours. Do both parents work those hours. I always ask because most parents don't work at the same place or same job does one finish earlier than the other. I had kids who were here for dinner everyday for 5 days a week, I hated it, my dh liked to eat dinner with his kids not someone elses kids. Call around and see what others would charge too.

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So my current rate is $50 potty trained $55 not PT.
I was thinking that an additional $75 a week more would be fair ?

What do you think?

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I honestly think I'd close down my daycare before I went to keeping kids till 7pm. I feel bad for those kids, they will practically live at your house, just going home to sleep.

Are any daycare centers in your area even open till 7pm? I think the latest I've seen around here is 6:30. If there aren't any till 7pm and you are willing to do this I think you should charge a good $5-7/hr. for the "extra" time and then tack on more for dinner.
Now, if you really need this family and the centers in your area go till 7pm then you may lose them if your rate is too high so you may have to take the "loss" if you want to keep them. Personally for me no amount of money is worth cutting into my family time to that extent.

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Daycare: I would have felt pressure to say yes then as well. Now make them a new contract, tell them to think it over and to get back to you regarding all this new information you will be giving them.

NEXT TIME as a bit of advice anytime a parent throws in your direction a change in hours to meet their needs and goes against your contracted hours always say, "I WILL HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THIS and WILL GET BACK TO YOU." This will help you to not give those quick YES answers that leave you second quessing yourself. And will allow time for you to maybe say yes with some conditions to allow yourself an out. ALWAYS leave yourself an OUT when you are really going against your contracted hours and needing the money. You never know the second you agree to go out of your contracted hours is the time when things could start to turn around and you get families in that go with what WORKS for you and your family.

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I have not been able to sleep over this. I think I made the wrong decision saying yes. I dont really see too many positives. I'm just worried because business has been slow and I am having a hard time filling spots. My husband will be quitting his job next month to finish his last two years of medical school, so timing could not be worse.

All centers here close at 6:30, but the other option they would have is to use a DC that is closer to their work.

I'm so lost over this.. My family does need the money, but I don't want my family to suffer over it...

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Lol I told myself I would say that but then didn't!!

I think I still have an out, as my husband did not really agree with me on extending my hours. I'm already doing it for a family now except at 6am. He sees the effect it has on me and our son. So after a sleepless night I think I am going to think about it for one more day before signing a new contract with them.

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I would tell DCF to supply breakfast everyday so you can claim lunch and dinner. Give them a list of acceptable breakfast foods or have them feed the DCK's before they come each morning.

As for the rate, I would increase $100 a week. If they want you to itemize it for them, $10 an hour for the 1st child, $5 for the 2nd plus $5 for dinner each night. It's going to cost them an additional $20 per day for that extra hour.

If they ask you why so much, explain to them that you are still closing at 6pm and that by continuing to work for them, they aren't eligible for they daycare rate but a babysitters rate.

(It really surprises me that they have absolutely NO one that could come pick up the kids each day for an hour! I bet it they don't like that rate, someone will be showing up by 6pm every night!)

It's always easier to ask the provider than ask family...I just don't understand that!

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Daycare,

I know it won't help right at this moment but remember that any extra meals you make and feed the child you can keep write off on your taxes. Keep track of all the extra meals and let you your tax person know ***xx snack, ***xx dinner. You would be surprised how it might help you at tax time.

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What about them having a babysitter come and pick up the kids at your closing time, and take the kids back to their house to watch them til the parents get home? Is that an option at all?

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If you are on the food program I would suggest you presenting these options to the DCP:

a) You figure out how much you think they would eat (will one extra snack and dinner be enough to keep them from being hungry etc) and how much it would cost you. Then figure out how much you want to charge for the extra time that they will be there and combine the two and give the parents THAT price. Don't say that it's $X for extra hours plus $X for food equals $XX ... just say that it will be $XX to stay open later for them.

b) If they would like to provide the extra meals (be specific as to how many snacks and meals) you could offer to give them a discount of $X so they would need to pay $X etc. to stay open.

This is key especially if you are on the food program. We can't charge DCP's extra for meals, it has to be included in our price and so you need to present it like this. I had an issue like this once before and my food program rep told me to do it like this. If you're not on the food program ... well then none of what I just said matters

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Being that I am on the food program I cant have any outside food unless I ask that they not be apart of the program and bring all of thier food for all of their meals. HOwever, I prefer to not offer this to families, because then you get into the argumnets of why one kid has something another does not.

Yes, they have no family to help out...and i can relate because I don't either....my parents live 5000+ miles away and my in-laws wont help us and they only live 35 minutes away. My parents see my children more than my In-laws do its sad.

So their options are staying later with me or finding another provider near thier jobs.... Mom owns chain stores, just bought another one and is way over worked. Dad is also self employeed, but has an office about 30-45 min away depending on traffic. So the dad is the one who will have to pick up the kids and he cant leave his office until 6:00-6:15 at the latest.....

As for the fees, I think that it would be cheaper for them to just move DCs. I love this family and I know that they really love their children being here. I just don't think that I can work until the time they need me.

I thought about it all night and I feel like I am ripping off my own kids. If the DCKs stay until 7, then it will be 8-8:30 by the time I get done cleaning up from the dinner mess and all of the DC mess. Which means that I get very little face time with my own kids and won't be able to help them with their home work, attend their sports events and etc.
No one could pay me enough to miss out on all of that....

I think letting them go is going to be my only option......

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Is this by any chance the same family that asked you to watch their children on the weekend of your sons birthday party?

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country you are soooo good!! why yes it is..
You know we just came back from a field trip and I got to thinking on the drive home.
Its really sad how much this family works... I know its none of my business, and we have all debated about having kids in care for hours on end......
but this family is sooo disconnected from thier kids, I already know that I don't want to have to work for a family like this....

Normally if I sent an email to the family, I would get a same day response or at least the next day. I have sent 4 of them and it has been over a week and still no response to any of them. I asked the mom yesterday did you get my emails and she said yes, but I don't have time right now to reply to them....

This just went to show me that she does not have time for her childs matters and that she just wants me to deal with them. Even though some of the emails were just information. Like your kids must wear closed toe shoes for our field trip this week. Her child showed up in Flip Flops, which is a BIG NO NO NO!!.

I am still really thinking about this. I think that what I may do is just try it out and see what happens and how I like it. I guess the best part is that I can always term. Plus I have not even written anything up yet, so there is nothing in writing that says I will be changing my hours for them.

What do you think?? Would you even start it? Part of me is doing it to keep income, and the other part of me is just trying to be nice....

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After reading more here I would let them go. Let them move on. Stick to your hours that work for you. You set YOUR hours to apease you and your family. Put YOUR family first and I feel everything will work out for you. You will get families to fit your hours.

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So I told the DCM today that if the kids are picked up by 6:30, I will not need to feed them dinner and the rate would be reduced by $5.00 per day per child.

Funny how she said she can make sure that somoene picks them up by 6:15-6:30.... So it looks like its only going to be 16- 30 minutes instead of an hour, which I can handle............

however, I am charging a full $10.00 extra a day per chld for having to go over into my personal time.... As someone suggested, I told her that it would not be considered daycare time but would be considered my family time fee.

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Ya, I do. I think it's more than fair. We don't make a lot of money in this business, and if someone likes the care where their kids are, then they should pony up if they want them to stay for every single meal and cut into your family time at night. But I read to the end of the thread, and I'm glad you came to an arrangement with her without losing the client. I just wonder why all of a sudden she's able to pick them up before 7pm?

That just stinks!

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IMHO, you don't really sound comfortable with the change of hours. I think it would be best if you let them find other care if they can't pick up on time.

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I'm ok with 6:30 and not having to do dinner.
I was feeling doubtful about it to have to cook dinner every night and have pick up at 7. We all know that 7 turns into 7:15 by the time they leave. If they are still eating when parent arrives then it could be later, but thats not going to happen now.
Also I was thinking at first that 7:15 would mean another hour of cleaning the dishes and daycare, meaning not Getting done until after 8, but again that's not happening.

Now that dcp and I figured it out I'm ok with it. I wouldnt take on something I didn't think I could Handel or was not comfortable with.

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You have to look at this as a business. I know we need the money and get scared when this kind of thing happens to us, but it usually works itself out pretty well. If you worked for anyone else, would you except that kind of pay check? Then have to spend your money on food for other peoples children?
My daycare opens at 7:30. I have already made 1 exception and he gets here at 7. No earlier. 5 pm is closing time. Mostly everyone is out by 4:30
I have kids of my own and I won't sacrifice my dinner and time with them. You really can't let people take advantage. I have and have paid for it in the end.
7-5 is the cutoff for me Period. It's not fair to yourself or your children.. Just my thoughts. I've been doing this for 13 yrs now. Good luck

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I personally would never go back to 11-12 hrs. daily!! I did this for about 2 yrs. and I hated it!!
I have 9 1/2 hrs. now that I am open, and what a world of difference it has made.
When your children have activities, such as dance, gymnastics, swimming lessons, tee ball, softball, baseball, soccer, and so on and so on- you will miss out on all of this, if you do not close at a certain time and make sure everyone is picked up by that time!!
My time after pick up time, is my time with my family alone!!!

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