I recently took on a child I had termed before for behavior at age 3(last straw was unbuckling car seat and climbing around moving vehicle). She has been through over 20 providers/centers in 5 years. I told mom we would give it another shot as she was 2 years older. After a month of trial I was about to term again and mom confessed she was finally willing to try medication. Child does have severe ADHD confirmed diagnosis.

Meds worked like a charm. She turned into an agreeable delightful child to be around. Helpful, focused, interested.

Fast forward 2 months. Mom decides she doesn't like child not being her "true" personality and last 3 out of 4 days in attendance (she is part time few days a week) child has been unmedicated and it's back to a nightmare. Mom cries when I tried to talk to her about issue.

I am perfectly willing to support this family of 2 by continuing to provide stable high quality care, IF she takes medication. If she's not going to continue meds or if she's just going to give them now and then, I want to give them their final termination notice.

Does anyone have any advice about how to explain this to mom? Or should I just stay away from the whole issue and just term them without any explanation or trying to work anything out. I do not need the money so that is not an issue. I just feel that I can not provide the level of care she needs if she is not medicated.

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I have a child that also has severe ADHD..... Dad has it too
Parents are divorced mom refuses to get the child help.

I finally told the mom that she has to understand a few things.
1. she is not helping her child by not getting him the help he needs
2. I understand that no one wants to label thier child and no one wants to know that thier child is different, but this does not mean that they will love them any less, just will have to learn to cope with them in different ways
3. when a child is not able to contorl themself, it puts all other children's saftey at risk as well as the child himself. Especially when they don't listen, like get off of the table before you fall and get hurt.
4. When all of the other kids see that the teacher disaproves of the child, they will also soon disaprove of the child too and will not want to be friends with them. Because children look to their parents and teachers for approval. If the teacher thinks a child is bad, then all of the children will think this too.... By this I mean that if the other children constatnly hear the teacher give out to the ADHD child, then this is why they will think they are bad.

This mom is not doing this child any favors. I understand that they don't want to medicate the child, but they need to find an alternative. They need to find something that will help the child. i think that it is a form of neglect by not getting the child the help that they need.

I feel for you, try to stand strong and do all that you can.... Today was a victory for me today, as I saw my ADHD child off to kinder. So I no longer will have to deal with it again....

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Any chance the parent is taking or selling the medicine?

Any chance she's saving the medicine for when the kid is on her clock?

Something is up. The "pure" personality reason and the tears don't add up.

I would tell her you need a note from the doctor stating the child is no longer being prescribed the medication. That way you can get medical confirmation that the child no longer needs it or it is just an as neccessary med and you can then base your expulsion on her behavior alone.

If the Mom wants to continue her care when she is having her pure personality time then she needs to provide an adult for the child to have one to one care while in your setting.

It's the parents issue to solve. You just need to give her the facts and let her decide what is best for her child. What she can't do is say words and do tearful discussions and have the kid in child care acting horribly. Her words and tears aren't going to make the child safe and happy in your group setting.

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I totally agree!!

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In some cases, ADHD or ADD is mislabeled. People will use it to classify a naughty misbehaved child. Other times, it is correctly identified. There are a lot of high professions that have ADHD people, including doctors and lawyers.
Medication does NOT prevent the child's true personality from coming out, quite the opposite! It's when the are medicated that they are more likely to show their true colors. All of the distractions that can plague a child of ADHD cause them to be overwhelmed, and how do most people feel when they are overwhelmed? Cranky, frustrated, snappish and so on. Medication is not for life either. It is to help the child cope through the barriers that are preventing from them from learning to their fullest potential. As the child matures, they should be removed from the medication to see how they do without it. Also, it should not be used alone, there are other things that should be done in combination, here are some things to consider: http://www.webmd.com/add-adhd/guide/...0%20%20%20%203
I can go on and on, and in some cases, medication is not the answer. For my son, I waited 2 yrs after he was diagnosed with ADD before putting him on medication. (He had no severe behavioral issues) after working with the school on a modified school plan.
In the best interest of her child's well being, she should be on medication. (Of course this is my opinion based on only the information I have received here)

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Thank you for the input thus far.

I understand the concern re:the selling/disappearing meds. I highly, highly doubt that is an issue in this case. I know it is a widespread problem and some of my other clients...yes that would be the case, but not this one.

Mom is just truly torn over how "medicine" could be the answer. She would rather have child fight these hurdles herself I guess which I do agree with the pp who said it's a form of neglect. It's really sad. Sad for the mother/daughter relationship and sad for the child who has to constantly readjust to new care givers. Sad too that she is not liked by the other children and they groan when they hear that she is expected.

I think I will just say, "If you aren't going to give her the assistance she needs with controlling her behavior, you need to find a one on one situation for her care. My group care program is not the right spot at this time."

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What you want to tell her sounds perfect!

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I understand not wanting to use the medication. Maybe she would qualify for an at home helper? Onene that would help to teach the child behavior as well as serious behavoir counseling would help a lot. Otherwise, if she wants to continue care with you, let her know she needs to use the medication consistently. I feel bad for the child being in so many different centers at such a young age

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It is also possible that she needs to change meds.

While on Adderal my son had horrible nightmares, could not eat, and had no joy in life. He did not laugh at jokes or smile hardly at all.

Vyvanse turned my son into a drone with a quick temper. NOT his usual personality. He is a clown/prankster by nature...

On Intuniv he is funny, happy, has a great appetite, a positive outlook, is able to hang out with/make new friends and still does exceptionally well at school.

Not every med will work the same on every child.

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I'd be honest...meds or termination. The choice is hers. I'd be honest and tell her that without meds, you are no longer to provide the high level of care her child requires.

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Oh, I feel so sad for this mom. I can completely understand her thinking that medication cannot be the only answer. We had this same struggle with our own DS. My DH and I refused to medicate. Like Catherder said, meds work differently for every person and doses are important to. Children are difficult to medicate because as soon as you figure out what dosage and what medication works, their bodies change and it seems that you need to start all over again. This cycle is frustrating and exhausting for not only the child but the parents and caregivers as well.

Since my DH and I refused to medicate our son, (but also refused to be in denial about the help he needed) we began working closely with our pediatrition and a nutritionist and behavior counselor. We learned that many children who suffer from ADD/ADHD process fats and carbs in their diets differently than most people. We read alot about how diet and what we eat effect our learning and behaviors. We ultimately decided to try to treat his ADD with diet changes.

We found a nutritionist that worked with us in creating a tailor made diet for our son to help him manage his ADD. We changed his diet, helped him with tips and tricks to stay focused and have better time management and organizational skills. Behavior management must be done by ALL parties involved. My son, us, his teachers, his health-team, and anyone else who acted as the caregiver for him.

It was a long road but my son managed to graduate school, make friends and live a pretty normal life. He is beginning his 2nd year of college in a few weeks.

I won't lie. It wasn't and isn't easy. It was a long road of discovery, trial and error and some all out tears of frustration and exhaustion but I truly believe I did what was best for MY child by not medicating him.

If anyone is interested, here is a quick link that talks a bit about this.http://borntoexplore.org/nutrition.htm

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You may want to consider that people are giving her a hard time about medicating her child. My child is medicated and I often get very negative reactions for choosing to medicate. He isn't hyper, he is inattentive...people often think medication is the "easy" way out and infer that it is simply a lack of parenting. I've tried every alternative and unless I want the poor kid to flunk out of school medication in combination with a tutor and after school program are the only for him to find academic success.

FTR, we did try nutritional changes and found them not to be successful for our child, although we continue to closely monitor his diet, diet alone did not work for him.

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I have gotten that before, too. My son is not on the hyper or disciplinary issue side of the spectrum either. My own parents were the worst to give me a hard time about having him diagnosed.

I am also ADD (I bet nobody here figured that out, yet, right...) once I got out of my parents house (who tried to spank and ground it out of me ) I got a diagnosis. It was empowering.

I went from C's in high school to a 4.0 in college with Adderal XR. Yep, I mailed EVERY report card home blown up into poster size at kinko's for the first few semesters to torment my Mom.

Your experience with your son sounds just like ours.

IME, Once your child has test scores to back up what you believe in your heart, the other parents can no longer make you feel like you are making the "easy" choice.

ADD is not a behavioral thing like many believe.

Behavioral issues are not always ADD, either.

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While I can understand the Mother not wanting a young child on medication, she has to realize that her child has a problem and she's expecting others to just deal with it.

Being exited from 20 facilities tells me the child has bigtime issues. While she needs to learn how to socialize properly with other children, she needs individual care - someone to constantly have an eye on her and only her. Group care isn't going to work as evidenced by her history.

She has a choice, medication, a Nanny or become a SAHM.

I chose not to medicate my child and it wasn't easy. First week of school there was always a phone call - that new adjustment to a new class never went well. There were calls and conferences during the year and while my child wasn't perfect, there was teasing and bullying that was allowed that shouldn't have been.

Thankfully as my son matured, he learned to cope better. By High School level I would go in for a conference and the Teachers would all look puzzled as to why I was there. He was an honor roll student. I would warn them that he has ADHD and when his typical melt down period was - it's always sometime in March. His Physics teacher told me "All boys have ADD!" He's found his niche somewhat and is studying Engineering. He's still not perfect but who is?

Let her go and enjoy being a Childcare Provider again.

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That's tough. I feel for the Mom and her child...some children are harder to care for then others, especially when there are medical issues, and Mom must have some rough days too.

I know lots of parents don't want to medicate and that is totally something they need to decide on their own, so you throwing that at her might not be best, BUT I do get from you that you don't feel you can properly/safely care for this child with the issues at hand...that's ok...Mom needs to know that plain and simple.

I think what you already have thought of telling her is fair (I cannot provide the level of care your child needs), and I'd leave out the part of medicate your kid of don't come, since it is harsh and might very well upset her. Maybe talk to her about why in person and offer a pretty simply worded term letter?

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I would not link terming the child to med. you can not prove wither or not the child is medicated and you are not a doctor so you can not deiced that it is in his best interest (not saying it is not, just that you are not qualified to say so). I would link it to the child behavior and keep a log or daily report of everything the child does including when the child has good days and let mom deiced how to handle it.

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We've been struggling since Kindergarten when I finally gave in last year...
in 5th grade. His end of the year test scores were the FIRST year he has ever tested (on standardized testing) on target for his age group. It's was AWESOME to have him see that and start to believe in himself again. I actually feel bad that I resisted for so long; I made things a lot harder for him than I needed to.

We don't medicate when he's not in school and we will be keeping the tutor, but I am feeling really hopeful this year!

I love hearing stories like yours! They are really inspiring!

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let us know how it goes. I know this decision for the mom is a tough one but after 20 providers, how can she not see that her little girl needs more than what the average provider/teacher can give?

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Dont!! Oh, please don't

My parents were not afraid of the medication effects. They were convinced it was laziness.

It was the 70-80's...THAT was the label they gave kids like me because once I got in trouble for talking in class/fidgeting/not completing classwork and was sent to ISS (isolation/in school suspension) I blew away all the school work without any effort.

They did not get that I could not hear the teacher in class because of his tacky tie, freaky bike handled mustache that kept tickling his nose and making his eye water or that the kids were sniffing, shuffling in their seats and smacking on their pencils.

It was too much I tell you....

To this day if I am writing something and someone talks to me, I write what they say, not what I was doing. I can't tell you how many book fair checks I have signed "hurry up mom" as they were rushing me to catch the bus.

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Ok, I'm not understanding why all of you are saying your kids ON meds made their scores better, they listened better, had more friends...but if they are not at school, or just don't want to give them meds anymore.

I know meds aren't anyones first choice, but some ppl NEED them. If it makes them a better person, then give them the meds.

Sorry, just drives me batty seeing you all say you would not medicate for certain reasons when you clearly state it helped. It's like a kid with strep throat, you can get over it yourself, but its easier with meds!

I would tell the parent in person how you are feeling. It is too hard to deal with without meds...so meds or gone. And you can keep a log and know if the meds are in their system. If things really change and she says she is giving meds, she needs to call doc.

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LOL! You're still too much...but in a good way!!!

And thank you....I try not to dwell on it. You know, I said he shouldn't move on to first grade, I said he needed summer school every year...but when I met resistance, it was hard to know if my instincts were correct, or the schools were. Most teachers were HAPPY to write him off as disinterested so long as he wasn't disrupting the classroom

But that whole deal is part of what led me to Community Psychology and Education. Now I am the person staffing the Alternative to Suspension room! Hopefully my experiences as a parent will help me reach some of the kids that come my way! I got to see my classroom today and this weekend I get to order furniture for it! I am beyond thrilled! Everything for a reason for a reason!!!

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My daughter was diagnosed with Oppositional Defiant Disorder a little over 4 years ago. After being hospitalized for 4 days (for threatening to kill herself, possessing a knife and kicking our pregnant nanny in the stomach), she was put on Zoloft. While I was getting better behavior results at home, I was getting calls from the school saying she was falling asleep in class. I knew right then that it had to be the medication because her sleeping habits were and have always been good. I chose because her education was crutial, I would eliminate the meds.

Over the past 4 years things have gotten far worse. We've visited phychologists, psychiatrists, therapists, counselors, medical doctors, pediatricians, etc only to be forwarded to another doctor, then another, then another. We had really hoped that we would be able to get her on a medication that wouldn't have an effect on her education. They all said the same thing...counseling and therapy are best and that they won't prescribe meds.

Now that she's a pre-teen...I wish someone would give meds to this kid!!! I wish doctors would understand my frustration and realize that medicating her isn't only going to help her but it will help everyone in this household.

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Are you talking about my posts??

My son and I both take ADD meds. We just had to try several different ones until we found what worked best for us.

It is a constant process working hand in hand with our physician.

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I wanted to thank you again for the replies. It's hard to find time to log in here every day working 75 hours a week. Yikes.

I did have the conversation with mom that night without giving any type of termination notice because mom claimed (through tears) that she did realize child needed it and would begin giving it regularly.

Well, child showed up today (second visit since conversation) unmedicated and threw playground gravel at another child's head. Deliberately. This makes me so sad but I know I don't have any choice. Despite what mom claims, she is not going to consistently medicate her.

Like my husband tells me, I can't "save" everyone. (HUGE SIGH)

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No you can't. But you can save your other Daycare children from the abuse of this child.

Give yourself 24 hours (cool down period) to make your decision and then do what you have to do.

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My whole family (me, DH & DD) all have ADHD and we're all medicated for it!

Just imagine what our house looks like

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I guess the television remote ends up in your refrigerator, too, then??

It does strengthen a sense of humor and adds a little zing to life doesn't it?

I love that you guys can support one another, though. I makes it easier to live with.

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I do baskets.. a basket for the remotes, a basket behind the door for keys. And... I'm the only one that uses them!

If they'd only use the baskets, life would be soooo much easier around here! Getting an ADHD person to actually put something back in it's place is a blooming miracle!

I even bought hubby a key chain that beeps when you whistle - he's never taken it out of the box.

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Three words... DE NI AL

It will get easier for him to accept a little "help" as he gets older...

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Yesterday the remote was in the dryer because I got distracted by the telephone ringing and I was emptying the dryer at the time and just left the remote in the dryer

Also, once my husband put his wallet in the fridge!!!

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OMG! Is that a sign of ADD? I am so in trouble then!!

Yesterday, I was talking with my DS on the phone and tried to leave work while continuing the conversation at the same time. The phone went dead about 60 seconds after walking out the door. I made several attempts to redial the dropped call. No go. I was like WTH? I even started to call Verizon to see what was up with my service.....then I realized it was my cordless phone from the house and obviously it won't work when I am 4 blocks from it's base!

Today, I arrived at work WITH my remote control....and I have also devoted ALOT of time looking for my sunglasses when they are usually on my head.

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Don't feel bad. I was recently talking to my son on my cell telling him I was on the way home while frantically searching my handbag for my phone. DUH!

I'm pretty sure we've all got some sort of ADD here. My husband was left back in 2nd grade due to "immaturity". Yeah... they just didn't have another name for it then.

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These both made me laugh outloud!

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