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  #1  
Old 10-26-2010, 12:18 PM
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Default Yup, DCM Again - Meal Schedule This Time

Okay so I vented on the vent thread but now I need to hear your thoughts. Before I had DCG that starts at 6am I was able to be flexible with a DCM and her DCB. She would get here at different times of the day (pays extra for this and this itself is not a problem) because she lays tile and works on a contractor schedule. Because of this she picks up at 6pm and so the earliest she can bring DCB is 8am. She never does though, she's usually here anywhere from 9:15-noon. Anyway, I could work with her and didn't mind feeding him whenever he got here before because he was the only kid that I had at the time or because other kids got here at the same time. The other two kids that I had on DCB's same schedule left and I only had him again until just a couple of weeks ago when I got a new DCG that arrived at 6am. I talked to DCM and told her that I needed to go back to a feeding schedule because I was doing nothing but preparing and cleaning up after snacks because everyone was arriving at different times now and then didn't think about it anymore.

Okay and a little bit more background. Every time she brings him she says he hasn't eaten, not kidding. Now what I mean by that is that he hasn't eaten real food, only breastmilk. So anyway, she gets here and says this and I make it a point to bring it up again that breakfast is at 7am but that snack is soon (she drops off at 8:15am and snack is at 9am). She gets upset and walks out, then texts me, then calls me upset and pretty much makes it seem like I'm not feeding him etc.

Here's my question. DCB is 15mo. The World Health Organization recommends breastfeeding for two years or more which is what she is planning on doing (I think) but I'm pretty sure that they also recommend solid foods. My meals follow the USDA food program guidelines and actually I feed slightly bigger portions than what they recommend (my DCK's always seem to still be hungry if I give them the recommended quantity and I think that the portions that the USDA food program requires are small) but they say nothing about BM after the 1st year so how would I know how much to feed DCB here etc? If he hasn't eaten solid food in the AM which is almost always and she tells me then I give him a cup with milk mixed with formula & infant cereal (flake) that she has provided and he's fine. He looks healthy, he's active and overall a good kid.

Also I need to address issues with this DCM because she seems to argue on a lot of policies and each time that I try to communicate with her she says that I need to put myself in her shoes, that I don't want to listen etc. How do I talk to her about these issues so that she'll actually get it and so that I don't have to go around in circles? Sometimes I feel like I have to talk to her like she's a 2yo because she doesn't want to get it and then she thinks I'm patronizing her . I don't want to term her but if that's her choice then so be it. I would rather have one more client before I give her notice.
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Old 10-26-2010, 12:31 PM
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BFing until 2 is fine, but I really don't think they mean as the only form of food. I contract to provide all food 12 months and up. I firmly believe he should be eating solid, table foods at this age. I would figure bm is equvalant to a cup of very healthy milk. This is my opinion, I am sure there are others.
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarinaVanessa View Post
Okay so I vented on the vent thread but now I need to hear your thoughts. Before I had DCG that starts at 6am I was able to be flexible with a DCM and her DCB. She would get here at different times of the day (pays extra for this and this itself is not a problem) because she lays tile and works on a contractor schedule. Because of this she picks up at 6pm and so the earliest she can bring DCB is 8am. She never does though, she's usually here anywhere from 9:15-noon. Anyway, I could work with her and didn't mind feeding him whenever he got here before because he was the only kid that I had at the time or because other kids got here at the same time. The other two kids that I had on DCB's same schedule left and I only had him again until just a couple of weeks ago when I got a new DCG that arrived at 6am. I talked to DCM and told her that I needed to go back to a feeding schedule because I was doing nothing but preparing and cleaning up after snacks because everyone was arriving at different times now and then didn't think about it anymore.

Okay and a little bit more background. Every time she brings him she says he hasn't eaten, not kidding. Now what I mean by that is that he hasn't eaten real food, only breastmilk. So anyway, she gets here and says this and I make it a point to bring it up again that breakfast is at 7am but that snack is soon (she drops off at 8:15am and snack is at 9am). She gets upset and walks out, then texts me, then calls me upset and pretty much makes it seem like I'm not feeding him etc.

Here's my question. DCB is 15mo. The World Health Organization recommends breastfeeding for two years or more which is what she is planning on doing (I think) but I'm pretty sure that they also recommend solid foods. My meals follow the USDA food program guidelines and actually I feed slightly bigger portions than what they recommend (my DCK's always seem to still be hungry if I give them the recommended quantity and I think that the portions that the USDA food program requires are small) but they say nothing about BM after the 1st year so how would I know how much to feed DCB here etc? If he hasn't eaten solid food in the AM which is almost always and she tells me then I give him a cup with milk mixed with formula & infant cereal (flake) that she has provided and he's fine. He looks healthy, he's active and overall a good kid.

Also I need to address issues with this DCM because she seems to argue on a lot of policies and each time that I try to communicate with her she says that I need to put myself in her shoes, that I don't want to listen etc. How do I talk to her about these issues so that she'll actually get it and so that I don't have to go around in circles? Sometimes I feel like I have to talk to her like she's a 2yo because she doesn't want to get it and then she thinks I'm patronizing her . I don't want to term her but if that's her choice then so be it. I would rather have one more client before I give her notice.
WOW!! Usually starting table food at 11 or 12 months old, sometimes sooner.
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Quincy View Post
BFing until 2 is fine, but I really don't think they mean as the only form of food. I contract to provide all food 12 months and up. I firmly believe he should be eating solid, table foods at this age. I would figure bm is equvalant to a cup of very healthy milk. This is my opinion, I am sure there are others.
Do you have this stated in your contract, if so can I ask how it is worded?
Thanks!!
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:08 PM
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I have a check list for center provided and parent provided items. "Formula and food for infants under 12 months of age" is checked as a Parent provided and "Food and Milk for children 12 months of age and older" is checked as center provided.

I should probably add that also in my text regarding meal times, though now that you ask.
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:19 PM
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It sounds like you are overdue for a nice sit down, face-to-face, frank discussion of all things daycare with this woman. She definitely needs to be reminded that communication (i.e., seeing things from the other's point of view) is a two way street. It's time for her to put her big girl panties on and discuss this like the adult that you would like her to be.
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:54 PM
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I don't know about Quincy's contract but I know that in my contract even though I no longer participate in the food program I follow their meals but do give slightly bigger portions (not on juice but I do water it down) and it says this. Like I said however, the food program doesn't say anything about BM and where it fits in if the child is over 1.

Also DCM almost never feeds him food before bringing him, she says so herself. She has said to me that he has not had breakfast every day this week and last week and she's arrived at these times starting from last Monday: 10:35, 8:15, 10:40, 8:25, 9:10, 8:50 and today 8:15. If she had no problem not feeding him anything except BM up until 10:40am then I don't see what the big problem is in him waiting 45 minutes for snack if I give him a cup with 4oz of milk, 2 scoops of Enfagrow Premium Next Step (Infant & Toddler Formula for 10-36 months with Iron) and scoop of cereal which he almost never finishes because I am assuming that he is full on BM. She provides the formula and cereal because she wants to continut giving it to him and I only provide it until the age of 1 <---In my contract!!

She also threw a fit because I don't give him food from baby jars. I give all of the kids healthy food ... um ... I follow the food program guidelines ... for his age, no salt, sugar free stuff, fresh fruit instead of juice most times etc. I mean I use fresh vegetables, fresh fruit etc. but if she wants me to give food from baby jars then fine but he'll be eating different meals than the rest of the kiddos which I know he will not like. That being said how do I make sure that he gets the recommended dietary needs?

For example: a child age 1-2 for breakfast should be having
* 1/2 cup of milk
* 1/4 cup of a fruit or veggie
* 1/2 slice of bread OR 1/2 a buscuit OR 1/4 cup dry cereal OR 1/4 cup pasta

So to me that translates to giving him 4oz of milk, 2oz of baby food fruit or veggie and 2oz of infant cereal (the cereal can mixed into the milk or whatever). Are you kidding me?? The kid will starve. Nutritionally it's all in there but one of the reasons why I switched from giving him baby food from jars was because he wasn't satisfied. The pureed food wasn't filling him up. If I gave him what the older kids were eating but in his serving proportions he would be ok and would still be getting the nutritional needs required.

I could also give him GRADUATES LIL’ ENTRÉES and the 1/2 cup of milk which would also give him the nutritional requirements but each entree is $3 and I would need at least 2 a day for his lunch and supper. Financially it's just not smart of me and plus I'd still need to worry about his 2 snacks. Grrr, maybe I'm just overanalyzing this, she's driving me crazy!
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:57 PM
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BFing until two or even later is fine, but he definitely needs to be eating solid food as well. In fact, by 15 months, most of the calories are supposed to come from regular foods. Are you saying that he really isn't eating any "real" food besides the milk with formula in it?
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Old 10-26-2010, 02:01 PM
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I use this for my feeding guide and show my parents if they ever have questions.

http://westerndairyassociation.org/s...-parents-play/

Edited for another link.

Here is a summary that is in the brochure above.
http://www.oregondairycouncil.org/re...by-English.pdf
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  #10  
Old 10-26-2010, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by MyAngels View Post
It sounds like you are overdue for a nice sit down, face-to-face, frank discussion of all things daycare with this woman. She definitely needs to be reminded that communication (i.e., seeing things from the other's point of view) is a two way street. It's time for her to put her big girl panties on and discuss this like the adult that you would like her to be.
Oh believe me I have tried. Likewise I have told her over and over that if she wants to discuss things with me we can do it at the end of the day when there are no kids. I want to do it this way for a number of reasons 1) I don't want to discuss things during daycare hours because I need to be focused on the kiddos 2) I don't want to be interupted by a kid or another parent and 3) I want my fiance or someone else in the house as a sort of witness. She always wants to text me or call me. She starts at my house, quickly says something flippant, storms out and then calls me. Each time I tell her that I'll talk to her face to face at pick-up (she's my last pick-up) and each time she gives me a reason why she can't or doesn't want to. I have a feeling that it's because there's people home by then.

I think I'm just going to write it all out. Maybe when she sees how many things really complains about she'll be calmer ... maybe.
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Old 10-26-2010, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by SilverSabre25 View Post
BFing until two or even later is fine, but he definitely needs to be eating solid food as well. In fact, by 15 months, most of the calories are supposed to come from regular foods. Are you saying that he really isn't eating any "real" food besides the milk with formula in it?
At home in the morning he only has breastmilk whether she drops him off at 8am or 11am sometimes noon (noon rarely happens but it has happened). When he arrives here between 8-8:45 I give him the cup of milk and formula/cereal until snack which is at 9am. If he arrives 9:30 or later I do the same until we have lunch at 11:30am. For the rest of the day we go by our own regular meal schedule and meal plan. I give him solids here no matter what meal he is here for as long as he is here in time for them and I'm sure she gives him at least dinner at home because when I change a poop diaper I do see something that resembles table food.

Oh that reminded me that she also made a comment about how yesterday he didn't poop in the evening only in the morning (I also didn't get a poop diaper which I relayed to DCB's dad, DCM could not pick-up). Well she implied said that then he wasn't eating enough and implied that I was the reason that DCB didn't have his regular evening poop (hence, I don't give him breakfast). I take that accusation very seriously and told her that I wanted to sit down with her and talk about the situation and she told me that she was busy tonight and had to work late etc.
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Old 10-26-2010, 02:42 PM
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IDK, sounds like even though you are having a feeding issue, you are having an even bigger communication issue with the mom. I would think that part needs to be addressed first because until she comes to terms with your policies and is respectful of them, she isn't going to work with you in regards to anything else. I think writting out a letter to her and expressing your concerns about not following your policies is a first step. If she thinks she is acting like an adult by making flippant comments as she walks out I would call her out on it. (Ooooh I would be sooo mad...sounds like a teenager right before they slam their door!!) It is your business and you need to run things in a way that works for your group as a whole and not be subject to a parent who is obviously unwilling to put herself in your shoes! Maybe she should hire a nanny for in-home care. Those are the only people I know that work exclusively for one family. Bottom line is the communication issue needs to be addressed first. Good Luck!
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Old 10-26-2010, 03:32 PM
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Bottom line is the communication issue needs to be addressed first. Good Luck!
Oh yes, agreed 100%. I already thought about a letter. Will do it tonight and give it to her in the AM. And yes, I'm mad. Not only for this issue but for the thing about how she said that me not giving DCB breakfast was the reason that he did not go poop last night or this morning. Um... hello, we've been following this schedule for weeks so that would mean he'd have problems since then if I wasn't feeding him properly.

I was so flippin mad that I called licensing to make a report in case she wanted to do something stupid like accuse me of malnutrition or neglect. Grrr.
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Old 10-26-2010, 03:35 PM
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Not to hijack the thread but.....

We once had a 12 month old. This baby was at the center 630 a.m. to 630 p.m., sometimes later (yes THAT family) All this baby had was formula all day. He would cry and cry because he would see the other babies eating. It would break my heart because he was such a good baby.

These parents also had a communication problem. Anyway, I purposely waited until a Friday to talk to the mother because that way it would give her the weekend to calm down lol

I just said, hey L, we need to talk. Is there a way you can bring K a little box of cereal? He really needs to be on solid food." Mom gave me this blank stare and I just wanted to slap her. I said.."K is here 12 hours a day, ALL day long, with no food. I don't think we would like that as adults more or less a baby would!"..Her response..."um yeah sure I will" She stormed off as usual.

I really didn't think she would. Come Monday, she brought in a HUGE WalMart bag full of (2nd stage with a few 3rd stages in there!) meats, cereals, fruits, veggies, etc.. I was like.."we request that you try a new food at home just in case of an allergic reaction." Her response, again I wanted to slap her..."oh he has been on this for months, we didn't think you guys would feed him!" I was so angry, I just took the bag and turned away from her.
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Old 10-26-2010, 11:32 PM
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I really didn't think she would. Come Monday, she brought in a HUGE WalMart bag full of (2nd stage with a few 3rd stages in there!) meats, cereals, fruits, veggies, etc.. I was like.."we request that you try a new food at home just in case of an allergic reaction." Her response, again I wanted to slap her..."oh he has been on this for months, we didn't think you guys would feed him!" I was so angry, I just took the bag and turned away from her.
Do you have any forms that require parents to state what their child has tried until they're a certain age and when they first tried it?
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Old 10-27-2010, 04:23 AM
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Not to hijack the thread but.....

We once had a 12 month old. This baby was at the center 630 a.m. to 630 p.m., sometimes later (yes THAT family) All this baby had was formula all day. He would cry and cry because he would see the other babies eating. It would break my heart because he was such a good baby.

These parents also had a communication problem. Anyway, I purposely waited until a Friday to talk to the mother because that way it would give her the weekend to calm down lol

I just said, hey L, we need to talk. Is there a way you can bring K a little box of cereal? He really needs to be on solid food." Mom gave me this blank stare and I just wanted to slap her. I said.."K is here 12 hours a day, ALL day long, with no food. I don't think we would like that as adults more or less a baby would!"..Her response..."um yeah sure I will" She stormed off as usual.

I really didn't think she would. Come Monday, she brought in a HUGE WalMart bag full of (2nd stage with a few 3rd stages in there!) meats, cereals, fruits, veggies, etc.. I was like.."we request that you try a new food at home just in case of an allergic reaction." Her response, again I wanted to slap her..."oh he has been on this for months, we didn't think you guys would feed him!" I was so angry, I just took the bag and turned away from her.
on the flip side - the first daycare i took my daughter to (she only went to two - she and my son both went to the same one FOREVER after this) did a couple of things that annoyed me - one being mixing in her dirty, puke clothes with her clean clothes in her cubby. the OTHER being that when she started eating, i had been sending baby food on a regular basis and putting it in the fridge for about two-three weeks. i picked her up one day and there was a note that said, "does J eat baby food? she should be eating solids and we need you to send some," and i FLIPPED MY LID! i went into the director's office and had her follow me to the fridge before showing her the note. so, my kid had been basically starving all this time and they had the nerve to send me a note when they obviously had been feeding my food to some other kid!

that's when i took her out and went to a new daycare.
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Old 10-27-2010, 07:52 AM
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So DCM ended up coming to pick up DCB afterall (she had told me that she couldn't because she would be working). She knocked on my screen looking really embarrased and walked in with her tail between her legs. She apologized for what she said and did and pretty much chalked it up to her being stressed out (DCD is having trouble finding regular work and paying his share of the rent, her work has slowed down and has had to let DCD move in with her to split rent etc.). I chalked it up to ... lady is crazy and bi-polar and needs to be on drugs or has done way too many drugs in her youth .

I talked to her about how she needed to review the policies again and that I didn't appreciate her storming out each time that she didn't like something and then calling me on the phone to talk to me during DC hours instead of after-hours and about how I didn't appreciate her tone and having her raise her voice at me. She said that she wasn't trying to "yell" at me, that she was "being passionate". Good lordy, I just told her "Well I dodn't appreciate you being passionate towards me" and that if she wanted to talk we could do so but that she would have to stay calm and collected.

She then apologized again and told me that she appreciated me and that she was sorry and that she knew that she wouldn't someone that would take care of her son as well as I could or find a daycare that would spend as much time as I did with him and how advanced he is blah blah blah. Something about how I spend more waking hours with him than she does and how she feels guilty etc. then got all teary eyed and emotional and I just remember thinking OMG really? Lady, I was in your shoes 5 years ago, deal with it or change it. YOU decided to have the child, YOU decided to bring him into this world knowing your circumstances. It just bothers me that people can have kids and then think that because they have them and they have to sacrifice that it gives them the right to complain and play victim. How many mother's are out there that have had their kid "happen" to them and they just eccept it and deal with it? PLENTY!She left in better spirits and I went upstairs and my fiance just looked at me and told me he couldn't wait for the day that we could get rid of her lol.
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Old 10-27-2010, 08:00 AM
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Glad it worked out for you!
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Old 10-27-2010, 08:29 AM
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Glad it worked out for you!
HA! For now lol. Meaning until the next time she goes berserk!
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Old 10-27-2010, 09:00 AM
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Im wondering why is she giving him formula still even thou they make it for toddlers they DONT need it they need COWS MILK and if she is so worried about him having breast milk why doesnt she do half milk and half breastmilk when he is at your house. He NEEDS to eat 3 meals and 2 snacks a day. Mom should breastfed him in the morning and then give him some breakfest then bring him to daycare then you could do milk/breastmilk and food at lunch and same for dinner, an for snacks give juice or water. Some parents are totally CLUELESS.
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Old 10-27-2010, 09:15 AM
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"Well I dodn't appreciate you being passionate towards me"
HAHAHA!!!! Had a good hearty laugh over that...good comeback! It sounds like you stuck to your guns (as we like to say here) and it worked out well. It's always nice to have the chips fall that way.
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Old 10-27-2010, 05:23 PM
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Im wondering why is she giving him formula still even thou they make it for toddlers
Good question. I have no clue. I just give it because she wants me to. I mix it with the milk that I'm supposed to give him according to the USDA food program guidelines I received when I used to actually be in the food program.
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they DONT need it they need COWS MILK
Not to completely hijack my own thread here (is that even possible??) but I hate to disagree here. Any good pediatrician will tell you that cows milk is just that, for baby cows. Yes it has some things that kids need but those needs can be easily met by other things such as fresh fruits and veggies and other healthy foods. We don't NEED milk and neither to children, plus it has cholesterol. If anything soy milk has just as much of what milk has and has absolutely no cholesterol.
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if she is so worried about him having breast milk why doesnt she do half milk and half breastmilk when he is at your house.
Another good question. She used to pump at home and bring me the bottles of BM and I would feed him that here and she technically could bring me BM even now but I just don't think she wants to or can take the time while at work to do this (remember she lays tile for a living).
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He NEEDS to eat 3 meals and 2 snacks a day. Mom should breastfed him in the morning and then give him some breakfest then bring him to daycare then you could do milk/breastmilk and food at lunch and same for dinner, an for snacks give juice or water. Some parents are totally CLUELESS.
I agree 100% with this. I mean really? Nothing but BM everyday until at least 9am? If he was sleeping I could understand but he's up by then. Why not give him breakfast first and then give him BM? Well then again this is the DCM that adamantly believes that BM magically gets better and better and somehow turns into some kind of super-BM as the child gets older .... I mean really? And my whole point to begin with was:

Why are you so upset that I am making him wait 45 minutes to eat a snack and not breakfast when you regularly bring him at 9am or later anyway and he hasn't eaten anyway?

Why is it my responsibility to make sure that he has had breakfast regardless of what time you bring him?

Why not get up earlier and make him breakfast yourself if you're so upset that a) he has to wait to have food and b) that he'll be getting a snack and not an actual breakfast?

I am not the parent, YOU are.
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Old 10-28-2010, 08:31 AM
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Good question. I have no clue. I just give it because she wants me to. I mix it with the milk that I'm supposed to give him according to the USDA food program guidelines I received when I used to actually be in the food program.

Not to completely hijack my own thread here (is that even possible??) but I hate to disagree here. Any good pediatrician will tell you that cows milk is just that, for baby cows. Yes it has some things that kids need but those needs can be easily met by other things such as fresh fruits and veggies and other healthy foods. We don't NEED milk and neither to children, plus it has cholesterol. If anything soy milk has just as much of what milk has and has absolutely no cholesterol.

Another good question. She used to pump at home and bring me the bottles of BM and I would feed him that here and she technically could bring me BM even now but I just don't think she wants to or can take the time while at work to do this (remember she lays tile for a living).

I agree 100% with this. I mean really? Nothing but BM everyday until at least 9am? If he was sleeping I could understand but he's up by then. Why not give him breakfast first and then give him BM? Well then again this is the DCM that adamantly believes that BM magically gets better and better and somehow turns into some kind of super-BM as the child gets older .... I mean really? And my whole point to begin with was:

Why are you so upset that I am making him wait 45 minutes to eat a snack and not breakfast when you regularly bring him at 9am or later anyway and he hasn't eaten anyway?

Why is it my responsibility to make sure that he has had breakfast regardless of what time you bring him?

Why not get up earlier and make him breakfast yourself if you're so upset that a) he has to wait to have food and b) that he'll be getting a snack and not an actual breakfast?

I am not the parent, YOU are.
I haven't served breakfast here for about 4 yrs. I have had many mothers come in and say oh by the way I haven't fed them their bottle yet, it's sometimes 8:30 drop off. They are just way too busy getting ready to feed them a bottle, so they thought it was my responsibility in the am. Until I had 2 mothers do it all the time- they came between 7:45 and 8:00am- Now both babies are screaming wanting fed, plus I have the school agers inc. my own daughter trying to get ready for the bus every am. Plus I have 2 parents still coming in the am- it was crazy, and they kept doing this, til I put my foot down and wrote them both letters and said I am only one person- please have babies dressed, changed, and first bottle given before coming to daycare. If that meant they had to get up 15-30 min. earlier every am, so be it!! I was so mad over all of this!!!!!
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