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Old 05-21-2013, 07:16 AM
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Default Biting.., When Is Enough, Enough?

DCB 2 yrs old bites same DCG at least once a week. Plays with her otherwise; this has been going on over 6 weeks. I understand biting is a normal behavior during the toddler years & dealing with it according to the experts. DCM of girl is mad. I've had talks with DCP & she just wants a head's up if I term him. What the what? I told DCP yesterday I will call to have him picked up if he does it again. I'm not sure when enough is enough. She seems to be more worried if I term him them helping with a solution.

DCP spends very little social time with her child. He is also the victim of biting from another child (her mother is friends with parent).

Thoughts?
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Old 05-21-2013, 07:20 AM
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by terming him your not really fixing the problem, not that it should be your problem to fix. I would either watch like crazy (which is hard to do) or I've sent them to time out. Talking with them doesn't work, its like reasoning with them, at 2 they don't get it.
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Old 05-21-2013, 07:24 AM
Willow Willow is offline
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Six weeks of biting incidents is unacceptable.

If you can't protect her by having him shadow you 100% of the time you need to term (and should have several weeks ago imho)
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Old 05-21-2013, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Willow View Post
Six weeks of biting incidents is unacceptable.

If you can't protect her by having him shadow you 100% of the time you need to term (and should have several weeks ago imho)
Exactly this. Three strikes you're out... The PARENT needs to fix this...
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Old 05-21-2013, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Willow View Post
Six weeks of biting incidents is unacceptable.

If you can't protect her by having him shadow you 100% of the time you need to term (and should have several weeks ago imho)
I agree.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:11 AM
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I have found the only thing that stops biting issues are to stop the bite before it happens. You have to find the kids trigger. What is going on right before the bite? You need to sit RIGHT next to the child 100% of the time when he is around other children, and take him with you wherever you go.

Biting issues suck! When DS was almost 4 he started to bite DD. It took forever to get him to stop. He had some delays, so I realize it is not typical to bite at his age. It only stopped when I watched him constantly to see what was setting him off and to swiftly remove him from the situation when I could see it coming. For him it was when DD was in his space trying to get something he had or he thought she was going to get something. He would scream DD's name and I knew it would be coming. Good luck!
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:17 AM
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When the victim's parent is MAD....it is time to term the biter. Which would you rather lose....the one who doesn't bite, ot the one who does?

And, biting is NOT "normal" in the toddler years. Out of all of the children I have cared for in the past 16 years, I can only remember two biters.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:58 AM
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I shadow the DCB. Last incident, we were all looking at a bug & he was jockeying for position to see. I just repositioned him to see & he bit her. It happened very quickly & he knew what he did was wrong. She wasn't in his way, just next to him & closer to the bug. He was removed from the group. I contacted DCP & she asked if I was terming him. I told her I was trying to work with HER, but if it doesn't stop that will be the end result. Frustrating.
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
When the victim's parent is MAD....it is time to term the biter. Which would you rather lose....the one who doesn't bite, ot the one who does?

And, biting is NOT "normal" in the toddler years. Out of all of the children I have cared for in the past 16 years, I can only remember two biters.

I agree!

I don't know why so many people believe it's not only normal but acceptable!
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:22 AM
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I have a 3 yr old dcg who has been with me since 3 months old. She bit someone when she was about 2 yr old, I didn't see the circumstances but I shadowed her for about a month, then about 2 weeks after I stopped shadowing her she did it again. I had to shadow her again and have her either go every where with me or be sure she was in her own area IF she couldn't go with me, did this for a long time then after months I stopped shadowing her and then just a couple weeks ago which again has been months actually almost a year she was sitting playing with someone and I was right there, and literally for NO reason she bent down and bit his hand, not hard but literally for no reason, boy was just sitting there, not talking, not playing anything it was like she just had an urge to taste his hand. She is 3 now mind you. She knew what she did because immediately she said your ok your ok I love you you're ok, in the meantime he started to kind of whine and say she bit him.
SO I've been keeping close watch and not allowing her to be alone with anyone like when I make lunch I don't leave her watching the movie on the couch with the others, she has to sit away from them.
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:27 AM
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I agree!

I don't know why so many people believe it's not only normal but acceptable!
ditto!!

I feel the same way about excessive hitting for no reason....
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme View Post
I shadow the DCB. Last incident, we were all looking at a bug & he was jockeying for position to see. I just repositioned him to see & he bit her. It happened very quickly & he knew what he did was wrong. She wasn't in his way, just next to him & closer to the bug. He was removed from the group. I contacted DCP & she asked if I was terming him. I told her I was trying to work with HER, but if it doesn't stop that will be the end result. Frustrating.
I have a little girl who is being shadowed now because she likes to push my babies. For us, shadowing means she is never close enough to another child to push. If we are looking at something all the other kids stand to my right but she stands to my left (my dominant hand). She sits arms reach from everyone else at circle time, and she doesnt get to sit on tye bench at the kitchen table with the other preschoolers.

For us, shadowing is to prevent injury but also to show the child that its not much fun to the a pusher/biter.

I also have a three strikes rule for biting before I term.
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnneCordelia View Post
I have a little girl who is being shadowed now because she likes to push my babies. For us, shadowing means she is never close enough to another child to push. If we are looking at something all the other kids stand to my right but she stands to my left (my dominant hand). She sits arms reach from everyone else at circle time, and she doesnt get to sit on tye bench at the kitchen table with the other preschoolers.

For us, shadowing is to prevent injury but also to show the child that its not much fun to the a pusher/biter.

I also have a three strikes rule for biting before I term.


I tell people that *true* shadowing is exhausting because there is NO "But I just turned my head for a minute!" excuse. You have a known biter. They are never near the other children - you always need to be between them and the others. This means the child who is biting (of hitting or whatever) might NOT get to see the spider, or have to wait until everyone else has cleared the area. IMO, that's a reasonable consequence for the behavior. When I can't be *right* with the child they are put out of the reach of others (be in in a high chair with some toys while I make lunch, a super play yard out of the play area but still in my eye sight, etc. All my parents are aware that shadowing is a LAST resort intervention and that if there is no improvement, I will have to let them go.
That said, to me there is a huge difference between someone saying a behavior is "age appropriate" and condoning the behavior. I am more likely to work with a child of 2 who is hitting or biting than a child of 4, KWIM?
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  #14  
Old 05-21-2013, 10:40 AM
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I think 6 weeks shows that you cannot change this behavior OP. We can't fix everything. Now you have other daycare parents upset. I would type up a term notice immediately.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:09 AM
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I'm very torn because he is otherwise a good kid & single mom lacks parenting skills. Like I said, he is being bitten by a bigger kid away from here. He is a very, very small 2 yr old, not that it matters. I have a conference with the DCP today.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willow View Post
Six weeks of biting incidents is unacceptable.

If you can't protect her by having him shadow you 100% of the time you need to term (and should have several weeks ago imho)
Absolutely. I would be livid if my child had been bitten once a week for six weeks.

I also think 2-year-olds are fully capable of knowing not to bite. But, that's just me.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Willow View Post
I agree!

I don't know why so many people believe it's not only normal but acceptable!
I send home an incident report for a biter and have the parent sign it. If it happens more than ONE time, it's a big problem and I have a paper trail that will be attached to a behavior plan.


Quote:
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme View Post
I'm very torn because he is otherwise a good kid & single mom lacks parenting skills. Like I said, he is being bitten by a bigger kid away from here. He is a very, very small 2 yr old, not that it matters. I have a conference with the DCP today.
Please don't take this rudely, because I'm not meaning it to be rude.
When I met my son he was being beaten and he never beat others. Just because a behavior is being modeled doesn't mean the child is permitted to get away with it, too. On the flip side, what Mom intentionally brings her small 2-year-old child around a larger child who continues to bite him???? That's poor judgement and poor parenting.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme View Post
I'm very torn because he is otherwise a good kid & single mom lacks parenting skills. Like I said, he is being bitten by a bigger kid away from here. He is a very, very small 2 yr old, not that it matters. I have a conference with the DCP today.
It is not your responsibility to fix this because you feel badly for the Mom. It IS your responsibility to protect ALL of the children in your care and by NOT stopping this, no matter what that entails, you are NOT protecting the other child. No amount of "conferences" is going to fix this.

If I were the parent of the vicitim, I'd pull my child without notice for failure to adequately protect her.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolconfidentme View Post
DCB 2 yrs old bites same DCG at least once a week. Plays with her otherwise; this has been going on over 6 weeks. I understand biting is a normal behavior during the toddler years & dealing with it according to the experts. DCM of girl is mad. I've had talks with DCP & she just wants a head's up if I term him. What the what? I told DCP yesterday I will call to have him picked up if he does it again. I'm not sure when enough is enough. She seems to be more worried if I term him them helping with a solution.

DCP spends very little social time with her child. He is also the victim of biting from another child (her mother is friends with parent).

Thoughts?
The only solution I ever found was to shadow constantly. It is a real pain but I did it because the biter was my grandson. I also had another biter one time but just shadowed her. The other thing I did was to have the child that was bitten wear long sleeves/pants to lessen the impact of the bite.

I know for a fact that my grandson didn't 'get it'. I could see it in his eyes and he has a great mom and grandma for that matter. I don't agree with those who said maybe somehow the mom is lacking. Could be whether or not he is biting but I'm not for blaming the parent if a child bites.

I would have a really hard time terming because neither the child nor mom can really help it. I 'never' left him alone with the other children. If I had to change a diaper he went to his high chair with toys till I was finished. If I had to go to the bathroom he went with me....that sort of thing. Really hard but necessary.

Laurel
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:02 PM
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I have an 19 mo right now who is biting. He only bites one child, a 27 mo who is rather aggressive (body-checking, taking toys). "Chompers" puts everything in his mouth right now anyway, so I think the biting is a go-to reaction to frustration or anything else he's feeling.

We have given him a teething toy to wear on a pacifier strap (as a re-direct)with some success. Since 27mo is only here 3 mornings a week, I keep a VERY close eye on them, or remove Chompers to a safe place if I can't have my eyes on him. We are also trying very hard to encourage him to talk more; he's a little slow in that area.

Once he becomes more verbal and less oral, I'm confident the biting will stop. It is normal, but it's certainly not ok!

Chompers mom is absolutely mortified, and willing to try anything to get it to stop.
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidi View Post
I have an 19 mo right now who is biting. He only bites one child, a 27 mo who is rather aggressive (body-checking, taking toys). "Chompers" puts everything in his mouth right now anyway, so I think the biting is a go-to reaction to frustration or anything else he's feeling.

We have given him a teething toy to wear on a pacifier strap (as a re-direct)with some success. Since 27mo is only here 3 mornings a week, I keep a VERY close eye on them, or remove Chompers to a safe place if I can't have my eyes on him. We are also trying very hard to encourage him to talk more; he's a little slow in that area.

Once he becomes more verbal and less oral, I'm confident the biting will stop. It is normal, but it's certainly not ok!

Chompers mom is absolutely mortified, and willing to try anything to get it to stop.
this is excellent advice! you truly understand children and why they do things..
giving them something to bite/chew is a good idea
when they are more verbal, usually the biting stops
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:55 PM
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this is excellent advice! you truly understand children and why they do things..
giving them something to bite/chew is a good idea
when they are more verbal, usually the biting stops
There are certainly stategies for stopping the behavior, but when is "enough, enough?" (as the OP asked) 6 weeks is a LONG time for a child to not "get it", and a VERY long time for the victim to be victimized. There is also a significant dfiierecnce, developmentally, between a 19 month old and a two year old.

IMO, there is NEVER a good enough reason to tolerate excessive biting, and (at least once) weekly biting incidences for OVER 6 weeks is EXCESSIVE.
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heidi View Post
I have an 19 mo right now who is biting. He only bites one child, a 27 mo who is rather aggressive (body-checking, taking toys). "Chompers" puts everything in his mouth right now anyway, so I think the biting is a go-to reaction to frustration or anything else he's feeling.

We have given him a teething toy to wear on a pacifier strap (as a re-direct)with some success. Since 27mo is only here 3 mornings a week, I keep a VERY close eye on them, or remove Chompers to a safe place if I can't have my eyes on him. We are also trying very hard to encourage him to talk more; he's a little slow in that area.

Once he becomes more verbal and less oral, I'm confident the biting will stop. It is normal, but it's certainly not ok!

Chompers mom is absolutely mortified, and willing to try anything to get it to stop.
Ha ha, I love that name "Chompers".

I agree that once they get more language that helps. I had some success with a teething toy too.

Laurel
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:54 PM
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It is not your responsibility to fix this because you feel badly for the Mom. It IS your responsibility to protect ALL of the children in your care and by NOT stopping this, no matter what that entails, you are NOT protecting the other child. No amount of "conferences" is going to fix this.

If I were the parent of the vicitim, I'd pull my child without notice for failure to adequately protect her.
absolutely.

frankly, I am surprised that the daycare family has put up with this for 6 weeks (the victims family). As for further "conferences", you already said this mom has shown herself to have poor parenting skills. Do you really think anything is going to magically change with one more discussion about it? Is she all of a sudden going to step up and have ideas about working this out when she never has before? besides that, there is only so much a parent can do to support what is going on at daycare. A huge part of it is just you doing your job. If you cant get this worked out and you cant keep each child safe in your care, its your responsibility to make changes. Just be honest about what you can and cant do. We all have great daycare kids that we have had to term because of one issue that could not be overcome.
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