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  #1  
Old 03-29-2021, 09:27 AM
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I have this DCM who just constantly rubs me the wrong way. It's not even anything that bad, it's just that every interaction with her always leaves me going "Wait... What??"

One big thing is that she seems weirdly obsessed with being in my house. We use the back door for daycare and you get to the playroom right from that entrance. There is no need for anyone (parent or child) to go into the rest of the house. It is a completely separate section of the house and closed off from the rest by lockable doors. This Mom insisted on showing up at my front door even after numerous reminders to use the back door. You have to walk through the entire house to get to the playroom coming in that way. After the first two times I started answering the front door with my shoes on and walking her back outside and around to the back door. Both times we walked through the house, she put her child down and attempted to follow behind them when they ran off the main hall and tried to go running around my living and dining rooms. She carries the child everywhere every other time. I don't even understand what the issue could be as the back door is at the end of the driveway, just a couple feet from where she parks her car to do drop off. She literally was parking, then carrying the kid and all their stuff all the way around the side of the house and up the big front porch and then walking through my entire house, dropping off, then trying to get me to let her walk through my house again to leave. She actually tried to "argue" when I told her to leave through the back door and she paused, sighed, then gave in when I explained that she couldn't walk through my whole main floor again, alone, because she wouldn't be able to lock the front door behind her.

Even during our first interview, when she was leaving she stopped to look in the closet beside the playroom (it was locked and she unlocked it) and when she came to drop off the paperwork she asked to use the washroom. She lives less than 5 minutes away but ok... So I walked her to the bathroom and returned to the playroom and was waiting with all her paperwork to bring home. She seemed to be taking a while so when I went to check on her, I found her and her child sitting on my couch, reading a book from my own child's (non-daycare) stash of toys! She at least looked a little sheepish and said her child ran off so she went to get them and that this was their favourite book. (I took the book and said that the rest of the house wasn't child-proofed so we don't bring the children on this side).

But 6 months in, it's still happening. She's showed up to the front door a few more times and I've ignored the knocking and just told her come to the back when she's called/texted for me to open the door. There was one time when the child was having a meltdown at drop off and I said come, we'll wave at mommy through the window. This one was strange because the mom went from looking sad that her child was having a tough time to just absolutely beaming and was like "Ya! Wave in the window!" but when I carried the child to the window, the mom visibly hunched down looking disappointed and was like "Oh, not the living room window?". Like... What? That's at the front of the house and part of my PERSONAL SPACE.

She also asked that I let the child lay on my couch and watch TV one day when they were having (another) bad day. I don't really do screen time but they were the only one there that day. I said I had a little tv I could bring into the playroom and mom was like "Oh, uh well. She likes the big screen. And the couch will make her feel more at home." I reminded her that we don't use my personal home space during daycare hours and again, she visibly hunched down and looked disappointed.

Then, the other day we were playing outside when Mom showed up. She came to the fence and said she was going to get her kid's stuff and she'd be right back. After way too long, I grabbed the kids and we were just getting inside when the mom was coming through my side door. She said that she was just watching her kid through the kitchen windows. Just, why???? You could see them from the cubby area windows or even just come outside to see them. Why go through my house?!

She's also repeatedly asked that her child sleep in a separate room for naptime, away from everyone else. We don't have any naptime issues but she says they have trouble sleeping at home because of the other kids being there at naptime...? Every time I offer to set up their bed in the entrance/mudroom as it's separated by a door and I could just put up curtains in the window. Every time she suggests I use one of the bedrooms in the house, instead. And every time I decline and explain that I need to be able to supervise everyone and I can't have one kid alone on another floor on the other side of my pretty large house. So she says nevermind, it's fine. Until the next time she asks.

She also tried suggesting that I allow her 18 month old to eat at my dining room table as they're trying to get the child used to that at home. I double checked because I thought she had said the child still used a high chair at home (and ate in front of the TV) and she said yes, but they wanted to try to start eating at a table. I said awesome, because I have a toddler table that I use with the kids her age and the little chairs are perfect for table practice. She asked if I could put the table in the dining room and again I had to flatly say we don't use the home space during the day.

I understand that she might want to get a feel for the space her child is in during the day, but I also feel I've made it very clear that my home and my business are separate. The doors stay closed and the children are in the daycare spaces only. I just can't think of any other reason why she'd always be trying to get herself or her child into my personal spaces.

Humbly, my daycare space is great! It's all developmentally appropriate, inviting, clean and everything is in good working condition. Everyone walks in and is like "wow, this space is amazing!" so why is this one lady so obsessed with the rest of my house?!
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  #2  
Old 03-29-2021, 10:03 AM
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If I were you, I would write a letter to all parents and explain the rules and state that you've had a few instances of people not following the rules and I would tell them that it's against minimum standards to allow anyone into other spaces not occupied by the daycare because of them not being made safe for the children
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  #3  
Old 03-29-2021, 10:09 AM
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I know that the first reaction in this case would be to think of Dcm as very disrespectful towards you, and your private space, but actually, she might not even realize that she is crossing the line.

You need to lay it out straight, and now " Dcm, I don't mean to be disrespectful, but parents and children, are only allowed to be on daycare grounds that's been approved by Licensing.

(unlocking a closet? seriously? )
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  #4  
Old 03-29-2021, 10:13 AM
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Because.... you told her no.

Drama Mama's love oppositional circular arguments. Feeds their need for conflict so well.... yummy, yummy.



The more you discuss it, the more she likes it. Use as few words as possible, be repetitive.
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  #5  
Old 03-29-2021, 12:50 PM
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I would do the letter for everyone.On hers I would call her out.Seems like she is not getting it.Next time just say something like"sorry ,that doesn't work here".Then just stare at her.Try not to engage. If she continues trying to go through house I would term.
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  #6  
Old 03-29-2021, 01:36 PM
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Hmmmm........Since a year ago I have not let parents come any further than my front porch to drop off or pick up their kids. I know, if you haven't been doing a "contactless" pick up and drop off previously, it might seem weird to start it now but it's a good idea since we're not done with this virus yet. Just an idea.......
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  #7  
Old 03-29-2021, 02:00 PM
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Also, I find her behavior weird..
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Old 03-29-2021, 02:06 PM
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Personally I’ve found the only way to eliminate issues with parents like this is straight up telling her not to do x or y or risk termination.

What’s she’s doing is rude and disrespectful
She is telling you via her actions that she will do as she pleases in your house and she is.

TELL her she must stop and stop now or you will term on the spot.

I would term, as a parent that disregards simple manners isn’t a client I care to work with at all.
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Old 03-29-2021, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Blackcat31 View Post
Personally I’ve found the only way to eliminate issues with parents like this is straight up telling her not to do x or y or risk termination.

What’s she’s doing is rude and disrespectful
She is telling you via her actions that she will do as she pleases in your house and she is.

TELL her she must stop and stop now or you will term on the spot.

I would term, as a parent that disregards simple manners isn’t a client I care to work with at all.
I agree! I get being curious about the rest of your house but what you've described is ridiculous. You've made it clear that your home is off limits - not once but over and over again - and she's still pushing to get in to your home for whatever reason. As much as I don't like confrontation, I like being disrespected even less. I would tell her if she can't respect my boundaries, she will need to look elsewhere for child care. Good luck.
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Old 03-29-2021, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Cat Herder View Post
Because.... you told her no.

Drama Mama's love oppositional circular arguments. Feeds their need for conflict so well.... yummy, yummy.



The more you discuss it, the more she likes it. Use as few words as possible, be repetitive.
TRUE THIS! Since I have had my sign in/out outside, there are two moms that are constantly trying to get a foot in the door.....I just politely/firmly step out so that can't happen. It is a 'control' thing. No one, including me sometimes, likes to be told what to do
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Old 03-29-2021, 04:45 PM
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I’d be leaning toward terming, too! If you don’t want to term, you could completely ignore her at the front door....even hang a sign on it, stating, “Daycare families, use back door”. Is there a door separating your daycare space from the rest of the house?
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  #12  
Old 03-29-2021, 06:56 PM
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I would tell her directly "since you are unable to follow my rules, all drop offs and pick ups must be done outside. Please text me upon arrival and I will meet you at the daycare room door." If she shows up and tries to come in, remind her and let her know you will terminate for disrespect.
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Old 03-29-2021, 08:03 PM
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Beyond what's already been said (which is all great), I definitely would not let her alone in your house again.

It's a liability, simply a risk. Too many variables on what could happen. Plus, if you are licensed, that space is likely unlicensed and you won't be covered under your business liability insurance.

But yes, she needs an ultimatum and she needs it honestly- no beating around the bush. She also needs it to be told to her directly.
"Sally, we need to talk about the boundaries of business and personal space. It's become very apparent that it is upsetting to you that I won't allow clients in my personal space. If you are not happy with what I offer within the ABC daycare space, I understand and will submit your notice to terminate your contract for you. There will be no hard feelings."

After that, if she asks anything that's uncomfortable again, just refer to this conversation and ask if she needs to find alternative care.
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Old 03-30-2021, 04:15 AM
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Yep, lots of terrific advice and ideas. Just wanted to add oh boy, she sounds like fun. Snooping into locked closets beats all IMO.

It's definitely up to you to confront her and speak up loud and clear now, put a stop to it. I know I never handled confrontation very well and would shake in my boots just thinking about it. BUT you need to reclaim your business and privacy(of your home, family and dcfs as well!) ASAP. If it's difficult for you to immediately change things from what she's been used to up till now, just tell her you've not been handling this the best up until now BUT you've been giving her actions a lot of thought and THIS is going to be how it's done from now on. Then threaten her with terming if she oversteps those boundaries that you mark off for her. It sounds more like spying and snooping, just waiting to find out something negative about you. Please do NOT be afraid of calling her on it because you will end up being miserable and not respect yourself in the end if you let this go. You can be nice as well as professional. What she's doing is oh so wrong.
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Old 03-30-2021, 04:18 AM
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One more thought, you're running a business involving group care. Don't do special because it'll become the normal for her, then all the other dcfs catch on and you'll be running yourself into a dark deep burn-out. Fastest way to burn-out is catering to dcfs.
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Old 03-30-2021, 09:07 AM
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I should say this surprises me, but it doesn’t.

Dcm needs to be told, in no uncertain terms, drop-offs and pick-ups are to be done at your daycare entrance only. Your personal living quarters are off-limits to daycare kids and parents. Violation of this policy will result in immediate termination.

Add it to your written policy, if it isn’t already there, and have DCPs sign and date a statement that they have received and agree to your updated policy.
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  #17  
Old 03-30-2021, 12:27 PM
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I feel for you, this is stuff that my sister will pull and she is bi polar. She doesn't get it when I tell her that there has to be a line, she disagrees with me and tells me that there shouldn't be a line blah blah.

My advice is rinse and repeat.

If she goes to the front door continue to ignore her. Start out side pick up and drop off. (My dcp text pick up and drop off from their car and then send the older kids and bring the younger ones to my door.) Beat her to the door, work your schedule so that you can greet her at the door before she gets out of the car. (Get a drive alarm, they have good inexpensive ones at harbour freight online)

Play outside at pick up time. Have the kid packed and ready to go with there things out side with you. Lock your deadbolts when you are outside/ leave a note on the door. "We are out back playing, bags all packed." Then meet the at the gate, if you have one.

Just keep blocking her, rinse and repeat.

She like my sister just thinks of herself and how there should be no rules for her, even if there is rules for others.
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Old 03-30-2021, 02:37 PM
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This woman would creep me out and be asked to leave. I have enough to do with kids who like not to listen. I won't deal with adults that behave the same way.
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Old 03-30-2021, 05:12 PM
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I agree with PP, this is creepy. Just term her and be done with it.
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Old 03-31-2021, 06:59 AM
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I'm not a fan of making additional rules and sending notes to the whole group every time one person has an undesirable behavior. It needs to be said just to them, in private, with no arguing or negotiation. Pick a phrase, like one of these:

"This daycare is inside my home, and you are not respecting my home when you linger, poke around, and exit the daycare space. You are welcome here, in the designated space, long enough to drop off and pick up."

And after that: "You are welcome here, in the designated space, long enough to drop off and pick up."

And if you have to repeat it again, or if she argues, terminate care.
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Old 03-31-2021, 07:15 AM
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Boy, she is a stubborn one. I agree that a general letter isn't the way to go, it sounds like she'll ignore that too. In her case, the fewer words the better. Much like a child, too much explanation gets lost in the message. Short messages "pickup and dropoff at other door please" "the rest of my home is private." When she tries to enter the rest of your home, "Stop, that's private." If she can't get it, she needs to gol
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Old 03-31-2021, 07:46 AM
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Some parents are so weird! Since Covid began, everything has changed in my house. Parents are allowed in my front entry with their children one family at a time with a mask. That's is far as they go. They leave their child and the next parent comes in. It keeps the morning conversations to a minimum as well. As far as all of her rules, just yes her to death and kick her out!

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I have this DCM who just constantly rubs me the wrong way. It's not even anything that bad, it's just that every interaction with her always leaves me going "Wait... What??"

One big thing is that she seems weirdly obsessed with being in my house. We use the back door for daycare and you get to the playroom right from that entrance. There is no need for anyone (parent or child) to go into the rest of the house. It is a completely separate section of the house and closed off from the rest by lockable doors. This Mom insisted on showing up at my front door even after numerous reminders to use the back door. You have to walk through the entire house to get to the playroom coming in that way. After the first two times I started answering the front door with my shoes on and walking her back outside and around to the back door. Both times we walked through the house, she put her child down and attempted to follow behind them when they ran off the main hall and tried to go running around my living and dining rooms. She carries the child everywhere every other time. I don't even understand what the issue could be as the back door is at the end of the driveway, just a couple feet from where she parks her car to do drop off. She literally was parking, then carrying the kid and all their stuff all the way around the side of the house and up the big front porch and then walking through my entire house, dropping off, then trying to get me to let her walk through my house again to leave. She actually tried to "argue" when I told her to leave through the back door and she paused, sighed, then gave in when I explained that she couldn't walk through my whole main floor again, alone, because she wouldn't be able to lock the front door behind her.

Even during our first interview, when she was leaving she stopped to look in the closet beside the playroom (it was locked and she unlocked it) and when she came to drop off the paperwork she asked to use the washroom. She lives less than 5 minutes away but ok... So I walked her to the bathroom and returned to the playroom and was waiting with all her paperwork to bring home. She seemed to be taking a while so when I went to check on her, I found her and her child sitting on my couch, reading a book from my own child's (non-daycare) stash of toys! She at least looked a little sheepish and said her child ran off so she went to get them and that this was their favourite book. (I took the book and said that the rest of the house wasn't child-proofed so we don't bring the children on this side).

But 6 months in, it's still happening. She's showed up to the front door a few more times and I've ignored the knocking and just told her come to the back when she's called/texted for me to open the door. There was one time when the child was having a meltdown at drop off and I said come, we'll wave at mommy through the window. This one was strange because the mom went from looking sad that her child was having a tough time to just absolutely beaming and was like "Ya! Wave in the window!" but when I carried the child to the window, the mom visibly hunched down looking disappointed and was like "Oh, not the living room window?". Like... What? That's at the front of the house and part of my PERSONAL SPACE.

She also asked that I let the child lay on my couch and watch TV one day when they were having (another) bad day. I don't really do screen time but they were the only one there that day. I said I had a little tv I could bring into the playroom and mom was like "Oh, uh well. She likes the big screen. And the couch will make her feel more at home." I reminded her that we don't use my personal home space during daycare hours and again, she visibly hunched down and looked disappointed.

Then, the other day we were playing outside when Mom showed up. She came to the fence and said she was going to get her kid's stuff and she'd be right back. After way too long, I grabbed the kids and we were just getting inside when the mom was coming through my side door. She said that she was just watching her kid through the kitchen windows. Just, why???? You could see them from the cubby area windows or even just come outside to see them. Why go through my house?!

She's also repeatedly asked that her child sleep in a separate room for naptime, away from everyone else. We don't have any naptime issues but she says they have trouble sleeping at home because of the other kids being there at naptime...? Every time I offer to set up their bed in the entrance/mudroom as it's separated by a door and I could just put up curtains in the window. Every time she suggests I use one of the bedrooms in the house, instead. And every time I decline and explain that I need to be able to supervise everyone and I can't have one kid alone on another floor on the other side of my pretty large house. So she says nevermind, it's fine. Until the next time she asks.

She also tried suggesting that I allow her 18 month old to eat at my dining room table as they're trying to get the child used to that at home. I double checked because I thought she had said the child still used a high chair at home (and ate in front of the TV) and she said yes, but they wanted to try to start eating at a table. I said awesome, because I have a toddler table that I use with the kids her age and the little chairs are perfect for table practice. She asked if I could put the table in the dining room and again I had to flatly say we don't use the home space during the day.

I understand that she might want to get a feel for the space her child is in during the day, but I also feel I've made it very clear that my home and my business are separate. The doors stay closed and the children are in the daycare spaces only. I just can't think of any other reason why she'd always be trying to get herself or her child into my personal spaces.

Humbly, my daycare space is great! It's all developmentally appropriate, inviting, clean and everything is in good working condition. Everyone walks in and is like "wow, this space is amazing!" so why is this one lady so obsessed with the rest of my house?!
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Old 03-31-2021, 07:50 AM
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We have enough loss of privacy already with licensors poking into our homes telling us what we have to and can’t do when kids are and are not present.

While I can understand a parent wants to know that where they’re sending their child to is clean and well-maintained, they’ll have to make that judgement based on the appearance of the outside of our home and our daycare space.

Even landlords get the benefit of requesting references when renting a place. We don’t get to go to a family’s house to see how they live so we can judge whether we want them in our homes or not.

Unlocking a locked closet would be a real concern for me. I’d be afraid she was trying to steal something.
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Old 03-31-2021, 09:03 AM
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OP here

Thanks to everyone for the great advice! I was mostly just ranting but it's nice to see others find it as unacceptable as I do and that I'm not being overly sensitive.

I stopped answering the front door after giving her those initial reminders. I thought about putting a sign on the door but she's the only one that "forgets". I also try to keep my home and daycare separate and decided against ruining my front porch decor for one intrusive parent. She's called a few times and I've told her to come to the daycare door and then hung up before she could try to change my mind. I don't give into her.

The daycare is separate from the house and I keep the doors locked. The time she went and snooped through my kitchen I had left the door open because the windows were open and letting fresh air in. I had a baby gate to keep the kids out but I hadn't been expecting her to miss the visual cue. I usually (and since) make sure that door is locked when I'm done with it so it was just silly that she seemed to have leapt at the first opportunity she found to invade my personal space.

I've started locking the door when we go outside too. It feels silly because we're right there and you have to go through my gate to get to the door anyway but obviously this lady needs very direct signals. She showed up again while we were outside and I asked her to wait while I got her daughter's things. She tried to open the door anyway (it was locked) and I told her again to wait, I'd get the stuff. She tried to follow me in and ended up standing awkwardly in the doorway, holding the door open when I kept my body in her way. I had to actually say "excuse me" and wait for her to back up when I tried to walk back out.

I just don't get her obsession with being in my home!

There have also been a couple times that she's picked up late and I've met her on the porch with the door locked and her kid ready to go and she's tried to get back inside. She's claimed that she wanted to check the menu for the next day, wanted to check out her kid's art, that she wanted to "check something else"... I've never allowed her back in and actually did end up adding a part of the handbook saying that once the daycare hours ended, all belongings left behind and in-person communications are forfeited until the next day (she tried to get in for a "lost toy" a few times even when I knew it hadn't been brought to daycare - I have a no toys from home policy).

I'm actually a lot more direct with this mom than anyone else. After the sit on my couch and play with my toys thing happened before she even started, I haven't been too worried about making her want to leave. I don't like confrontation but I don't know... Maybe I'm on some weird power trip because I think I actually enjoy being able to tell her no. Honestly, it just feels like another one of my kids that I just have to work a little harder to set up for success and limit opportunities for misbehavior lol
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Old 03-31-2021, 12:47 PM
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OP here

Thanks to everyone for the great advice! I was mostly just ranting but it's nice to see others find it as unacceptable as I do and that I'm not being overly sensitive.

I stopped answering the front door after giving her those initial reminders. I thought about putting a sign on the door but she's the only one that "forgets". I also try to keep my home and daycare separate and decided against ruining my front porch decor for one intrusive parent. She's called a few times and I've told her to come to the daycare door and then hung up before she could try to change my mind. I don't give into her.

The daycare is separate from the house and I keep the doors locked. The time she went and snooped through my kitchen I had left the door open because the windows were open and letting fresh air in. I had a baby gate to keep the kids out but I hadn't been expecting her to miss the visual cue. I usually (and since) make sure that door is locked when I'm done with it so it was just silly that she seemed to have leapt at the first opportunity she found to invade my personal space.

I've started locking the door when we go outside too. It feels silly because we're right there and you have to go through my gate to get to the door anyway but obviously this lady needs very direct signals. She showed up again while we were outside and I asked her to wait while I got her daughter's things. She tried to open the door anyway (it was locked) and I told her again to wait, I'd get the stuff. She tried to follow me in and ended up standing awkwardly in the doorway, holding the door open when I kept my body in her way. I had to actually say "excuse me" and wait for her to back up when I tried to walk back out.

I just don't get her obsession with being in my home!

There have also been a couple times that she's picked up late and I've met her on the porch with the door locked and her kid ready to go and she's tried to get back inside. She's claimed that she wanted to check the menu for the next day, wanted to check out her kid's art, that she wanted to "check something else"... I've never allowed her back in and actually did end up adding a part of the handbook saying that once the daycare hours ended, all belongings left behind and in-person communications are forfeited until the next day (she tried to get in for a "lost toy" a few times even when I knew it hadn't been brought to daycare - I have a no toys from home policy).

I'm actually a lot more direct with this mom than anyone else. After the sit on my couch and play with my toys thing happened before she even started, I haven't been too worried about making her want to leave. I don't like confrontation but I don't know... Maybe I'm on some weird power trip because I think I actually enjoy being able to tell her no. Honestly, it just feels like another one of my kids that I just have to work a little harder to set up for success and limit opportunities for misbehavior lol
OP this is great. I hear ya on loving telling her no, I love it too, it is like a buzz/high when you are assertive and don't back down. When she leaves you may miss that feeling, haha but not her.

She is like one of the kids and she is harder to deal with because she's an adult that has long past the chance for all this to click. Like I said rinse and repeat is all that you can do.

Keep doing what you are doing and come back and update us.
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  #26  
Old 04-01-2021, 04:01 AM
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Josiegirl Josiegirl is offline
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Good for you for standing up to her and her demands. I cannot wrap my head around someone who thinks and acts like that. Do they think you're hiding something? Does she want to find something incriminating? Is she that desperate to know what goes on in her child's life all day long? Is she completely nosey generally? I just don't understand it. Unlocking your closet took some balls.

I had 1 dcm that crossed a few boundaries and thankfully she didn't last long. She was very controlling except when it came to her dd; she let her dd do anything she wanted to. Yep, not a favorite dcm.
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Old 04-01-2021, 06:17 AM
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For most of these young Mom's it is the first time they taste power. More than likely it will be the only perceived power they hold. Being "Mom" suddenly gives them a sense of accomplishment that they have not actually earned. It is culturally based. Until they had a kid, they were like everyone else. Suddenly "Mom knows best" rhetoric makes them feel exalted.

Same reason small people are rude to wait staff and housekeepers.
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Old 04-01-2021, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat Herder View Post
For most of these young Mom's it is the first time they taste power. More than likely it will be the only perceived power they hold. Being "Mom" suddenly gives them a sense of accomplishment that they have not actually earned. It is culturally based. Until they had a kid, they were like everyone else. Suddenly "Mom knows best" rhetoric makes them feel exalted.

Same reason small people are rude to wait staff and housekeepers.
Right! And the mommy message boards & blogs tell them to do these things.
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Old 04-02-2021, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Rockgirl View Post
Right! And the mommy message boards & blogs tell them to do these things.
You got this, you are a great mamma.

You know best.
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Old 04-07-2021, 05:29 PM
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This is one of the more baffling things I’ve heard I’ve seen tons of parents behaving badly but this seems to have no cause or endgame. Just weird engagement and boundary-pushing.

Like someone else said, she probably read on some dumb mommy blog that in-home dcps should treat her and her child like “family” and her poor baby is being “cheated” by being relegated to one back room . Gross.
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