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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Spots Opening Right Before Paid Vacation, Does Your Contract Protect You?
MCC 08:19 AM 06-21-2014
Good morning!
I have 3 spots opening up Aug 16, I have a week planned paid vacation, Aug 18 which I notified parents of in the middle of May. 3 of the spots are kids leaving for preschool, but the families had previously told me that they would be pulling them Sept 1. Last week both parents (one is a sib set) told me that they will have their last day be Aug 15, "since I'll be on vacation the next week" so they are just starting them at the preschool (basically a full time center) that week instead.
I'm am so hurt by this, as it seems really unfair, how would they like it if their boss came in 6 weeks before their vacation and said they are no longer going to get a paycheck for their vacation week??! I've had the sib set here for a year and a half, and last year I didn't have paid vacations.
I was thinking about ways I could have my contract protect me from this. In the future. Something like If you leave within a month of a scheduled vacation, you have to still pay for that week? Is this something that any of you have wrapped into your contract? How is it worded?
I have 3 spots opening up Aug 16, I have a week planned paid vacation, Aug 18 which I notified parents of in the middle of May. 3 of the spots are kids leaving for preschool, but the families had previously told me that they would be pulling them Sept 1. Last week both parents (one is a sib set) told me that they will have their last day be Aug 15, "since I'll be on vacation the next week" so they are just starting them at the preschool (basically a full time center) that week instead.
I'm am so hurt by this, as it seems really unfair, how would they like it if their boss came in 6 weeks before their vacation and said they are no longer going to get a paycheck for their vacation week??! I've had the sib set here for a year and a half, and last year I didn't have paid vacations.
I was thinking about ways I could have my contract protect me from this. In the future. Something like If you leave within a month of a scheduled vacation, you have to still pay for that week? Is this something that any of you have wrapped into your contract? How is it worded?
Blackcat31 08:23 AM 06-21-2014
My contract says parents need to give me a date of last day WHEN they submit their written notice of withdrawal.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
MCC 08:29 AM 06-21-2014
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
My contract says parents need to give me a date of last day WHEN they submit their written notice of withdrawal.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
Thanks for the feedback. My contract says parents need to give me a date of last day WHEN they submit their written notice of withdrawal.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
This situation is a total bummer.
Blackcat31 08:34 AM 06-21-2014
Originally Posted by MCC:
Thanks for the feedback.
This situation is a total bummer.
It is a bummer but really there isn't much you can do. Thanks for the feedback.
This situation is a total bummer.
Did the parents verbally tell you their leave date or did they put it in writing?
I've heard of some daycares that make parents pay for the entire years worth of closed days and vacation days if they leave but I am not sure how that works or how they convince parents it's the norm.
Maybe someone on the forum does this and can chime in and give you some ideas about how to work this.
Leigh 08:40 AM 06-21-2014
Originally Posted by Blackcat31:
My contract says parents need to give me a date of last day WHEN they submit their written notice of withdrawal.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
My contract says parents need to give me a date of last day WHEN they submit their written notice of withdrawal.
That way the date they will last attend in in writing and they owe until that day...even if they decide to end early.
In MY personal opinion, I would not include the clause that parents pay for my vacation if they leave a month prior. I don't think it's fair or professional.
If it works for you and is something most daycares do in your area, go for it. Every area works differently. It just isn't something I would personally do.
I agree. The only way I would say it was OK is if you clearly explained to parents in your contract that your vacation is accrued, and payable upon termination for any days not used. With this system, you could owe parents who leave before you have "earned" all of your vacation, too.
nannyde 08:58 AM 06-21-2014
I accrue paid time off in each slot. When a child leaves the parent is responsible for paying their child's slot pto.
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
NightOwl 09:03 AM 06-21-2014
I don't have any advice, but I wanted to say that's a low blow. I'm really sorry that happened. Just when you think you have a good relationship with a family, they go and do something like this. It's glaringly obvious this is an effort to save a few bucks, and at the expense of your feelings. I don't know why they thought they could convince you otherwise. It's just messed up.
KiddieCahoots 09:16 AM 06-21-2014
Oh, I'm sorry.
Yea....I feel it's unfair, and may be facing the same issue right now.
My two week deposit on contracting helps. The first portion going to the first week in advance, and the second going to the last week. So if anybody has instant withdrawal, or termination, then I consider that last week already paid.
Doesn't do much for the hurt feelings though.
Honestly, I have a really hard time getting my private clients to understand that they have to pay for every closure date the child care is closed. In my area, the state contract I sign for voucher recipients, they require us to charge for these dates. Just signed a recent contract allowing EEC coordinators to check our paperwork for this, or we can be fired from the state.
Yea....I feel it's unfair, and may be facing the same issue right now.
My two week deposit on contracting helps. The first portion going to the first week in advance, and the second going to the last week. So if anybody has instant withdrawal, or termination, then I consider that last week already paid.
Doesn't do much for the hurt feelings though.
Honestly, I have a really hard time getting my private clients to understand that they have to pay for every closure date the child care is closed. In my area, the state contract I sign for voucher recipients, they require us to charge for these dates. Just signed a recent contract allowing EEC coordinators to check our paperwork for this, or we can be fired from the state.
nothingwithoutjoy 10:53 AM 06-21-2014
Originally Posted by MCC:
Good morning!
I have 3 spots opening up Aug 16, I have a week planned paid vacation, Aug 18 which I notified parents of in the middle of May. 3 of the spots are kids leaving for preschool, but the families had previously told me that they would be pulling them Sept 1. Last week both parents (one is a sib set) told me that they will have their last day be Aug 15, "since I'll be on vacation the next week" so they are just starting them at the preschool (basically a full time center) that week instead.
I'm am so hurt by this, as it seems really unfair, how would they like it if their boss came in 6 weeks before their vacation and said they are no longer going to get a paycheck for their vacation week??! I've had the sib set here for a year and a half, and last year I didn't have paid vacations.
I was thinking about ways I could have my contract protect me from this. In the future. Something like If you leave within a month of a scheduled vacation, you have to still pay for that week? Is this something that any of you have wrapped into your contract? How is it worded?
I faced this for several years with kids leaving for kindergarten, as I like my vacation week to be between one "school year" and the next, so always take the last week of August. I feel those parents ought to be paying for the vacation just like everyone else who was here all year, but of course they don't see it that way. I finally solved it by having parents pay the year's vacation pay ahead of time--half in Nov., half in March. Then when the vacation rolls around, they don't pay me, because they have already.Good morning!
I have 3 spots opening up Aug 16, I have a week planned paid vacation, Aug 18 which I notified parents of in the middle of May. 3 of the spots are kids leaving for preschool, but the families had previously told me that they would be pulling them Sept 1. Last week both parents (one is a sib set) told me that they will have their last day be Aug 15, "since I'll be on vacation the next week" so they are just starting them at the preschool (basically a full time center) that week instead.
I'm am so hurt by this, as it seems really unfair, how would they like it if their boss came in 6 weeks before their vacation and said they are no longer going to get a paycheck for their vacation week??! I've had the sib set here for a year and a half, and last year I didn't have paid vacations.
I was thinking about ways I could have my contract protect me from this. In the future. Something like If you leave within a month of a scheduled vacation, you have to still pay for that week? Is this something that any of you have wrapped into your contract? How is it worded?
rosieteddy 01:35 PM 06-21-2014
My contract states if you are here in April you owe for two weeks vacation.I have not had a problem yet .
TwinKristi 03:13 PM 06-21-2014
I had a mom give me her last day about 2 months prior to pulling and calculated it so she didn't have to pay for any days off in December. He didn't start school til the 7th of Jan but they found other people they know to take the kids when she had to work random a couple days each week. Both mom and dad some took time off so they didn't have to use daycare before going to preschool for those 3wks. That's all fine and dandy but it's like they went out of their way and totally juggled the kids around everywhere so she didn't have to pay me for a couple holidays and days they may not have used. It was a little insulting.
But I don't have anything in my contract about pulling prior to a holiday or scheduled vacation so I'm not protected.
But I don't have anything in my contract about pulling prior to a holiday or scheduled vacation so I'm not protected.
Rachel 04:40 AM 06-22-2014
Where we live August is the standard vacation, anywhere from 2 weeks to a month. Also parents have to pay up front for the month, and leave a 1 month's notice when leaving. STops a lot of the "games." As far as August, I work 2 weeks (1st - 11th, so depending on weekends more or fewer actual days) and the parents have to pay the whole month. A parent who leaves early (or joins later in the school year) has to pay out August when they leave. I think it's 1.5 days for every month.
Kimskiddos 07:03 AM 06-22-2014
I have my vacation weeks already figured into my tuition (50wks x wkly $$ divided by 12= monthly tuition. I set my rates at a place where I am happy and it really does pay for my vacations ;o) ). Technically my dcf's get 2 free weeks each year.
I am paid monthly in advance and tuition is the same every month. Don't think I have ever had a family try and stiff me for any time off. Guess I'm lucky with the dcf's I have.
I have a kiddo leaving for K the 3rd week of August and I am taking vacation the first week of August, it will be interesting to see if the family will try to get out of paying for the weeks in August before school starts (try to shuffle her around with family). I don't think they will as they are planning for baby #2 within the next year and I know they want a spot with me.
I am paid monthly in advance and tuition is the same every month. Don't think I have ever had a family try and stiff me for any time off. Guess I'm lucky with the dcf's I have.
I have a kiddo leaving for K the 3rd week of August and I am taking vacation the first week of August, it will be interesting to see if the family will try to get out of paying for the weeks in August before school starts (try to shuffle her around with family). I don't think they will as they are planning for baby #2 within the next year and I know they want a spot with me.
MCC 07:02 AM 06-23-2014
Originally Posted by nannyde:
I accrue paid time off in each slot. When a child leaves the parent is responsible for paying their child's slot pto.
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
This is an excellent idea. I am going to look into adding this into my contract. Thank you very much.I accrue paid time off in each slot. When a child leaves the parent is responsible for paying their child's slot pto.
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
MCC 07:04 AM 06-23-2014
Thank you all for the replies! It seems like this is kinda a common issue. I am hoping that the parents just don't even realize that they are putting me in a sticky spot, but that's just me giving them more morals than they probably have.
Crazy8 09:57 AM 06-23-2014
I have had that happen to me a few times too. The only thing I added to my contract is their free vacation week could not be used after giving their notice (because I had them try that).
Unfortunately if you are on vacation Aug 18th and their last day is Aug 16th - all of which is still 6+ weeks away I don't see how you can "make" them pay for it. But since that week is now going to be an "unpaid" vacation week anyway I would probably schedule myself a nice little paid vacation in mid-July - as long as that works with your notice policy.
Unfortunately if you are on vacation Aug 18th and their last day is Aug 16th - all of which is still 6+ weeks away I don't see how you can "make" them pay for it. But since that week is now going to be an "unpaid" vacation week anyway I would probably schedule myself a nice little paid vacation in mid-July - as long as that works with your notice policy.
MCC 11:10 AM 06-23-2014
Originally Posted by Crazy8:
I have had that happen to me a few times too. The only thing I added to my contract is their free vacation week could not be used after giving their notice (because I had them try that).
Unfortunately if you are on vacation Aug 18th and their last day is Aug 16th - all of which is still 6+ weeks away I don't see how you can "make" them pay for it. But since that week is now going to be an "unpaid" vacation week anyway I would probably schedule myself a nice little paid vacation in mid-July - as long as that works with your notice policy.
One of the moms exact words was "we have a spot for E started Aug. 25th at the preschool. Since you are on vacation Aug 18-22, her last day will be Aug 16th, and DCD will stay home with her that week." I totally get why they would want to not have to pay for that last week, but it really is not fair to me at all. I have had that happen to me a few times too. The only thing I added to my contract is their free vacation week could not be used after giving their notice (because I had them try that).
Unfortunately if you are on vacation Aug 18th and their last day is Aug 16th - all of which is still 6+ weeks away I don't see how you can "make" them pay for it. But since that week is now going to be an "unpaid" vacation week anyway I would probably schedule myself a nice little paid vacation in mid-July - as long as that works with your notice policy.
I'm thinking about adding in my contract that if term date backs up against a scheduled vacation, you must still pay for the vacation week.
mim 12:28 PM 06-24-2014
Originally Posted by nannyde:
I accrue paid time off in each slot. When a child leaves the parent is responsible for paying their child's slot pto.
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
Not sure if I quoted right. Nannyde I am curious how you put this into your contract. How it's worded and if it makes sense to the parent. Also how would this work for clients that start for example in April. I accrue paid time off in each slot. When a child leaves the parent is responsible for paying their child's slot pto.
I take 18 days paid off.
I take 10 days vacation, 8 paid holidays.
I accrue pto at 1.5 days per month. 1.5 x 12 months equals 18 days.
So if it is June and the kid leaves I would have earned six times 1.5 which is 9 days.
I would have taken NEW years, and memorial day off by then. That would leave seven days I have earned but not taken.
So the parents would owe one months notice plus seven paid days.
I have done this system for about 17 years and it STOPPED cold the parents leaving right before my paid time off.
I take ten of the eighteen days off in the six weeks between thanksgiving and new years. I take thanksgiving, day after thanksgiving, Christmas eve, Christmas, five vacation days and New year's.
So I had parents pulling out mid November because they didn't want to pay two of six weeks paid and they had used all their days off. They would wait till it was getting close to deal with it and get care lined up. It was easier and cheaper to find new daycare then to find someone to do free at the Holidays.
Now they have to pay their slots time off whether they are here or not. It stopped the vacation loss and it helped me a ton to retain kids. It also stopped them taking me days.
For part time kids of three days a week... I accrue one day per month. I had a problem with them wanting Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday for the week of thanksgiving making it so I didn't get my paid two days. They would try the same thing if I had any days working the week before I took xmas off depending on the day it hit and the weekafter new years depending on what day it hit.
So they pay twelve days a year and if they want to come Monday Tuesday Wednesday before thanksgiving they can but they pay an additional two days for Thursday Friday.
I
Thanks.
AmyKidsCo 04:04 PM 06-24-2014
Originally Posted by MCC:
Thanks for the feedback.
This situation is a total bummer.
It is, and it's wrong on their part but there's not much we can do about it without looking bad ourselves. Last year I had 3 families leave for 4K - all before my scheduled time off. Thanks for the feedback.
This situation is a total bummer.
The only way I can think of to get around it would be to give 2 just weeks notice of vacation, that way they can't get their 2 weeks notice of termination in. But I don't think it would be worth it to upset all the parents just in case some are planning to leave, kwim?