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  #1  
Old 03-28-2012, 06:25 PM
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Default Michael-Are There Rules For The Forum?

With alot of the "debates" going on lately and throughout the year, I was just wondering if there were any type of "rules" in place for using the forum?

Also, do alot of members quit because of the "debates" that go on? I know I haven't seen some of them here lately and was wondering if they aren't members anymore?
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Old 03-28-2012, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
With alot of the "debates" going on lately and throughout the year, I was just wondering if there were any type of "rules" in place for using the forum?

Also, do alot of members quit because of the "debates" that go on? I know I haven't seen some of them here lately and was wondering if they aren't members anymore?
Not Michael of course but I thought I could ask a question. I was wondering who you have seen missing recently after a debate? I've seen some members say they are going to leave and after a reflection time decide they still really like it and come back and move forward. I am not seeing members leave forever over debates???
Short respites but not completely.

I think Big Mama said she was going off the board but sometimes with a little space in between the debates they change their minds. You mentioned that the sprinkler thread got heated and "drama" as you say but when you look back on it there are about 25 posters in it and nearly all of them have posted in the last twenty four hours. A few of them in the last couple of weeks and one I could see three weeks ago Of posters that participated in that completely and still post here nine months later. It was VERY controversial but it netted some really great information and posters who have hung out and continued to contribute to other debates and regular conversations. I think debates can really strengthen a board...... like a family.... sometimes the tough descusions make the familiy unit stronger because the people in the family leave the debate upset maybe but understand a lot more of the others position and see value in that.
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Old 03-28-2012, 07:06 PM
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I am sure Michael will answer this, but as far as I can find, there are no ettiqette rules about the tone or content (besides the obvious cursing and such) of posts. In regards to people leaving, there is a member list that shows all the forum members so you can look someone up if you want to find them.

I think the member's public profile says the last date the person was active and signed in as well as their join date. Although some members stay logged in at all times. (I do).

I am sure that there are members who leave for many reasons, one being the drama that goes on now and then but I am also sure that most members fall into a few regular categories;
  • those that read and never really post,
  • those that drop in occassionally when they have a specific problem,
  • the ones who are fairly regular in posting but stictly in a business manner while staying out of the social aspect
  • and then the daily posters/readers, the ones here at one point or another every day .
so I am sure that even when members dislike the drama, most don't leave. I know some have but I would bet it isn't many.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:44 PM
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Some of the ones I haven't seen lately are: hooping lady, then i think another one her name was Danielle. Also, the gal who had some disablility and in her picture she had a baby I believe on her back-she believed in alot of attachment parenting. I know I haven't seen Jeep Girl for awhile.

Then like last week, it seems that someone said everytime they try to come back on the forum they feel like they are getting bullied or something like that.

Maybe these people are on alot and I just miss their posts. Since I've been sick I haven't read everything but was just wondering.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:49 PM
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Danielle...had a baby? I think?

I know who you're talking about with the baby on her back and I can't remember her name *blush* but I don't think she left. Maybe just got busy and hasn't been around much lately.

The third person you're talking about is probably mac60...who frequently gets upset about something and disappears for awhile, only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads, then gets upset when someone disagrees.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:58 PM
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The other one I was thinking about was hooping lady.

Then there was a sandra or something that started with an S I believe.

I know some people have changed their names on here for various reasons so that could also be it.
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:05 PM
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Reading this reminded me of where's waldo. Except where are the daycare providers..
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Old 03-28-2012, 09:34 PM
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I think it's important to just decide who you're going to engage with, and who you're not. Kind of like picking your battles with kids.
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Old 03-29-2012, 12:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
The other one I was thinking about was hooping lady.

Then there was a sandra or something that started with an S I believe.

I know some people have changed their names on here for various reasons so that could also be it.
There is also MarinaVanessa. I emailed her the other day because I like her avatar and have not seen it lately. She said she got super busy and is getting ready to tie the knot. She said she will be back.

This place is like a scond home to me. I would like to make it more like a virtual place but I have not figured out the best way to do that yet.

As far a rules......really? I think we handle ourselves pretty well here. If somethings out of place we as a group can handle it. I am always open to suggestions if there are any. PM me
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  #10  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Country Kids View Post
Also, the gal who had some disablility and in her picture she had a baby I believe on her back-she believed in alot of attachment parenting.
That members name was something like frogsonmysox (?)

I forgot to quote silver but I totally agree with her about mac. She says she will leave but she has a way of always coming back

I, for one, am totally addicted to this site. This for me is like a Facebook page for daycares

I may not sign in all the time but I am ALWAYS here!
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  #11  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:44 AM
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Danielle...had a baby? I think?

I know who you're talking about with the baby on her back and I can't remember her name *blush* but I don't think she left. Maybe just got busy and hasn't been around much lately.

The third person you're talking about is probably mac60...who frequently gets upset about something and disappears for awhile, only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads, then gets upset when someone disagrees.
REALLY???? And this is the crap she is probably talking about. Why do some of you like to use my name so much? And no, I don't "Frequently get upset" and "NO I don't disappear for a while only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads then get upset when someone disagrees". I never log out. REALLY? REALLY? REALLY? I wish some of you would quit using my name and just leave me alone.

I never question what some of you say, state names, etc. While I may make a comment to someone's post stating what I might or might not do in the situation, I do NOT state names and badger like some of you do, and I am sure you know who YOU are. SilverSabre, your post above is a perfect example. Does that make you feel "big, better and more important" when you make comments like that about me? You want to accuse me of posting strongly, well I will now. I seriously wish you and Crystal would just leave me alone. Quit using my name on this forum, and because I may do things different does not make me a bad person. Your ways are not the only ways and you are not always right.

While I may state my opinion on something, just like you do and many others here, you ladies are the ones that escalate it, not me. Because I would not handle a situation like you would, does not make me WRONG. Thing is, I DON"T badger you two ladies because your opinions are different than mine, but you sure have no problem doing it to me. I seriously am sick of it. I don't know if you get enjoyment out of it or what, but I think you both need to read up on bullying, because as far as I am concerned, this happens a lot on this forum and nothing gets done about it.

So Please, both of you, and you know who you are, just LEAVE ME ALONE and quit using my name. Keep "me" out of your post. If you feel the need to bully and badger me, do it in a PM.
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  #12  
Old 03-29-2012, 04:10 AM
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REALLY???? And this is the crap she is probably talking about. Why do some of you like to use my name so much? And no, I don't "Frequently get upset" and "NO I don't disappear for a while only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads then get upset when someone disagrees". I never log out. REALLY? REALLY? REALLY? I wish some of you would quit using my name and just leave me alone.

I never question what some of you say, state names, etc. While I may make a comment to someone's post stating what I might or might not do in the situation, I do NOT state names and badger like some of you do, and I am sure you know who YOU are. SilverSabre, your post above is a perfect example. Does that make you feel "big, better and more important" when you make comments like that about me? You want to accuse me of posting strongly, well I will now. I seriously wish you and Crystal would just leave me alone. Quit using my name on this forum, and because I may do things different does not make me a bad person. Your ways are not the only ways and you are not always right.

While I may state my opinion on something, just like you do and many others here, you ladies are the ones that escalate it, not me. Because I would not handle a situation like you would, does not make me WRONG. Thing is, I DON"T badger you two ladies because your opinions are different than mine, but you sure have no problem doing it to me. I seriously am sick of it. I don't know if you get enjoyment out of it or what, but I think you both need to read up on bullying, because as far as I am concerned, this happens a lot on this forum and nothing gets done about it.

So Please, both of you, and you know who you are, just LEAVE ME ALONE and quit using my name. Keep "me" out of your post. If you feel the need to bully and badger me, do it in a PM.


Sorry Mac that you are being "talked" about in this manner. I'm not quite sure why someone would bring your name into the conversation if only to do so in a negative manner. Seems very hurtful to me & if it were me I would probably leave or discontinue posting.

Last edited by Michael; 03-29-2012 at 11:38 AM.
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  #13  
Old 03-29-2012, 04:11 AM
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Originally Posted by SilverSabre25 View Post
Danielle...had a baby? I think?

I know who you're talking about with the baby on her back and I can't remember her name *blush* but I don't think she left. Maybe just got busy and hasn't been around much lately.

The third person you're talking about is probably mac60...who frequently gets upset about something and disappears for awhile, only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads, then gets upset when someone disagrees.
Wow! No disrespect but why would you bring up someone's name to only talk poorly about about her?
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  #14  
Old 03-29-2012, 04:27 AM
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The only rules are at the bottom of the page on the left. Here is the link:

http://daycare.com/forum/misc.php?do=showrules

I wanted to post a Youtube video recently and even though I know most of you would get a kick out of it, decided it was really too "Off color" for this forum.

Debates are just that - Debates. I've been over the top on a few posts and you all showed me your displeasure so I've reeled myself in a bit.

There are still those times of the month though...

I've been posting on forums for years and people come and go. Life gets in the way or the computer breaks. Best thing is to PM the person you care about and ask if they are OK. Eventually they may pop in and see your note.
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Old 03-29-2012, 04:47 AM
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Originally Posted by SilverSabre25 View Post
Danielle...had a baby? I think?

I know who you're talking about with the baby on her back and I can't remember her name *blush* but I don't think she left. Maybe just got busy and hasn't been around much lately.

The third person you're talking about is probably mac60...who frequently gets upset about something and disappears for awhile, only to reappear and post strongly-worded opinions in controversial threads, then gets upset when someone disagrees.
I agree with momofboys...bringing up Mac60's name in this thread was uncalled for.
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  #16  
Old 03-29-2012, 04:51 AM
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I just stay out of the debates. I stay happier that way.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:01 AM
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*sigh*

I apologize mac. I will not bring up your name again.

Even though what I was saying was true, I shouldn't have said it.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:05 AM
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*sigh*

I apologize mac. I will not bring up your name again.

Even though what I was saying was true, I shouldn't have said it.
Wow, just wow. Do you never stop? Did it make you feel good to get that last dig in?
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:16 AM
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I just wanted to say that I love this forum! It helped me get through a time in my business a few months ago when I had a family who was not being the nicest it could be and reading all the posts here helped me figure out that it was not me, it was them. I was able to get over them and go on in my business knowing that it is okay to have my own rules and that I do not have to change them to keep a family happy. I thank you all for that! This forum helps me gain perspective when I am looking at something too emotionally.

Anywhere there are differing opinions, there will be at least a little bit of drama. IMO, it makes things interesting and can make me ponder another point of view. If you all think there is a lot of drama here, you should check out the QVC beauty forum. It is funny how a forum about beauty can get so ugly.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:21 AM
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I just wanted to say that I love this forum! It helped me get through a time in my business a few months ago when I had a family who was not being the nicest it could be and reading all the posts here helped me figure out that it was not me, it was them. I was able to get over them and go on in my business knowing that it is okay to have my own rules and that I do not have to change them to keep a family happy. I thank you all for that! This forum helps me gain perspective when I am looking at something too emotionally.

Anywhere there are differing opinions, there will be at least a little bit of drama. IMO, it makes things interesting and can make me ponder another point of view. If you all think there is a lot of drama here, you should check out the QVC beauty forum. It is funny how a forum about beauty can get so ugly.
I am going to check out the QVC beauty forum today!
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:21 AM
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In my opinion, I think this forum would have a more “family feel” if people were able to voice their opinions without getting jumped on. I learned early on that if you disagree with one of the regular posters, keep it to yourself. Since I had a difference of opinion with a regular poster a while back, I don’t feel super welcome here.

I’m guessing some people are either turned off by the treatment they receive for having a differing opinion, or are simply afraid to post for fear of being ostracized.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:23 AM
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*sigh*

I apologize mac. I will not bring up your name again.

Even though what I was saying was true, I shouldn't have said it.
Seriously?! What a backhanded apology. I agree with Mac and the others - this kind of thing is totally uncalled for.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:51 AM
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Originally Posted by saved4always View Post
Anywhere there are differing opinions, there will be at least a little bit of drama. IMO, it makes things interesting and can make me ponder another point of view. If you all think there is a lot of drama here, you should check out the QVC beauty forum. It is funny how a forum about beauty can get so ugly.
I've been on daycare and adoption boards since 98. Fourteen years and a number of forums and this board is very similiar to the ones back in 98. I met some of my good day care friends way back when and we STILL talk to each other every day. Fourteen years is a long time to talk child care.

For every person who I've seen say they will leave the board maybe one in ten or so actually do. Usually when people leave it's because life happens, they quit child care, or they get bored with talking about child care. A couple of years on one board and you see the same convo's over and over. It's pretty rare that something new actually comes up.

The debates are an integral part of a successful board especially in child care. People feel very pasionately about little kids and day care is HARD done well. This board is an excellent example of ways of doing child care that are vastly different and netting a successful long run of child care, happy and healthy kids, and satisfied customers. What would work with one provider wouldn't even be considered by another. One provider can build their entire business on a philsophy that another wouldn't dream of doing. Sorting that out can get downright complicated with strong debates and disagreements. Using the written word and a few emoticons complicates it even further.

It's not perfect but it's a good deal. Daycare.com hosts this board free of charge to us and I appreciate it. The advantages far outweigh the downsides IMHO.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:56 AM
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I agree with you Nannyde. What I don't understand is how/why some think it is okay to bully others, belittle them, etc. Disagreeing is one thing, attacking is a whole other issue.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:58 AM
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I agree with you Nannyde. What I don't understand is how/why some think it is okay to bully others, belittle them, etc. Disagreeing is one thing, attacking is a whole other issue.
You know you are one of the main persons here that got me to go from lurker to poster. I lurked for a REALLY long time and read the entire archives before I posted. I have never posted unregistered here.

I read every post your wrote. You made me think and laugh.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:59 AM
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I know a few people have been changing their usernames. Which isn't fun, because we form a bond with certain members, but once that name is gone, what we remember about them goes with it. But you could always creep into their posting history i guess.



As far as general rules and regulations here, I believe common sense and respect are 2 good rules.

It is not possible for anyone in this world to see things the same way as anyone else. Unless you are physically standing in their shoes, seeing through their eyes and processing the information with their brain. No one is going to see things as you do, but it is our job to HELP them understand our side of the story.

Rules of Engagement:
1. Everyone is always right
2. Everyone's greatest desire is to be right
3. You can't change another person's mind
4. You CAN help people shift their perspective.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:13 AM
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I know a few people have been changing their usernames. Which isn't fun, because we form a bond with certain members, but once that name is gone, what we remember about them goes with it. But you could always creep into their posting history i guess.


Or a few clicks into their posting history.

When their name is gone what we remember about them stays with them.

What happens on daycare.com STAYS on daycare.com ;-)

Last edited by nannyde; 03-29-2012 at 06:23 AM.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
In my opinion, I think this forum would have a more “family feel” if people were able to voice their opinions without getting jumped on. I learned early on that if you disagree with one of the regular posters, keep it to yourself. Since I had a difference of opinion with a regular poster a while back, I don’t feel super welcome here.

I’m guessing some people are either turned off by the treatment they receive for having a differing opinion, or are simply afraid to post for fear of being ostracized.
Cheeky, I definitely agree about the "family feel" and I wish members weren't "afraid" to post openly. Because I do think there are many who feel that way. I do think that differeing views and perspectives are super important, especially in this job where we are often homebound and not able to get out during the day. We become isolated from outside opinions or views that differ from ours.

I sincerely hope that the regular member you had a difference of opinion with with was not me.... I know we run our programs very differently but as a regular and active member of this board, I for one value what you have to say. I run my program more on the business side where as I am pretty sure you run yours more on the family-relationship side of things and I respect you for doing so.

I also want EVERYONE here to know that if you ever disagree or do not like something I have posted or said, please don't ever hesitate to call me out on it, post your honest response and/or PM me if necessary. I am human and I can lose sight of the point and let my feelings get in the way just as easily as anyone else.

I am a pretty outspoken person and I know I don't do things exactly the same as others (as we are ALL unique) but I would never personally want anyone to ever feel I was squashing their true feelings or thoughts for fear of any type of "flaming" in retribution. I just want to throw out there that I love this board and it really is my "outlet" for stress and helps me keep going on a regular basis.

I truly appreciate every single member here and I respect everyone for how they choose to run their businesses and for their thoughts AND opinions....ESPECIALLY when they are different from mine.

I love seeing things from another person's viewpoint. It gives us all a chance to evaluate our actions, thoughts and words which is a good thing since we all know that no two kids, days and/or situations are the same.

I think that we should all take a step back and re-read the posts we write. We all need to double check that our words aren't hurtful or mean towards any one. It is awesome if we want to disagree but we need to do it in a respectful manner. Kind of like how we teach our daycare kids, be nice or don't play together. Really NOT that hard to do.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:28 AM
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Cheeky, I definitely agree about the "family feel" and I wish members weren't "afraid" to post openly. Because I do think there are many who feel that way. I do think that differeing views and perspectives are super important, especially in this job where we are often homebound and not able to get out during the day. We become isolated from outside opinions or views that differ from ours.

I sincerely hope that the regular member you had a difference of opinion with with was not me.... I know we run our programs very differently but as a regular and active member of this board, I for one value what you have to say. I run my program more on the business side where as I am pretty sure you run yours more on the family-relationship side of things and I respect you for doing so.

I also want EVERYONE here to know that if you ever disagree or do not like something I have posted or said, please don't ever hesitate to call me out on it, post your honest response and/or PM me if necessary. I am human and I can lose sight of the point and let my feelings get in the way just as easily as anyone else.

I am a pretty outspoken person and I know I don't do things exactly the same as others (as we are ALL unique) but I would never personally want anyone to ever feel I was squashing their true feelings or thoughts for fear of any type of "flaming" in retribution. I just want to throw out there that I love this board and it really is my "outlet" for stress and helps me keep going on a regular basis.

I truly appreciate every single member here and I respect everyone for how they choose to run their businesses and for their thoughts AND opinions....ESPECIALLY when they are different from mine.

I love seeing things from another person's viewpoint. It gives us all a chance to evaluate our actions, thoughts and words which is a good thing since we all know that no two kids, days and/or situations are the same.

I think that we should all take a step back and re-read the posts we write. We all need to double check that our words aren't hurtful or mean towards any one. It is awesome if we want to disagree but we need to do it in a respectful manner. Kind of like how we teach our daycare kids, be nice or don't play together. Really NOT that hard to do.
I had this conversation with Cathearder on the phone a few months ago and she explained this to me in a way I could really get it.

She said that in the daycare world that we are so isolated that the adult contact we have on a day to day basis WEIGHS more to our brains and our hearts than normal people who work out in the real world and deal with adults all the time. She said after years of doing this business that we adapt to having little adult contact BUT the heaviness on our minds of the adults that DO talk to us daily gets higher and higher the longer you do the business.

So I keep this in mind with my daycare parents first. I have even HAD this convo with a daycare parent when we had a long convo about something that came up. When I explained it to her she readily understood. She said she felt that way for the few weeks she was on maternity leave and that was nuttin compared to doing childcare for 18 years.

To me, it makes sense.

We are a bit more hypersensitive because we naturally crave age mates or work mates in some capacity... so when we GET that here it matters to us a lot more than it would if we were all each one of forty work mates in an office.

That make sense?
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:39 AM
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I had this conversation with Cathearder on the phone a few months ago and she explained this to me in a way I could really get it.

She said that in the daycare world that we are so isolated that the adult contact we have on a day to day basis WEIGHS more to our brains and our hearts than normal people who work out in the real world and deal with adults all the time. She said after years of doing this business that we adapt to having little adult contact BUT the heaviness on our minds of the adults that DO talk to us daily gets higher and higher the longer you do the business.

So I keep this in mind with my daycare parents first. I have even HAD this convo with a daycare parent when we had a long convo about something that came up. When I explained it to her she readily understood. She said she felt that way for the few weeks she was on maternity leave and that was nuttin compared to doing childcare for 18 years.

To me, it makes sense.

We are a bit more hypersensitive because we naturally crave age mates or work mates in some capacity... so when we GET that here it matters to us a lot more than it would if we were all each one of forty work mates in an office.

That make sense?
It absolutely makes sense! Look how many times a member has said something along the lines of their DH or SO or BFF makes fun or makes a comment about their sentences starting with "Well on the daycare.com forum.....". We are naturally drawn to others who have shared interests or common ground.

We definitely place a value on our friends (even virtual ones) because it is human nature to seek others out who "understand" or know where we are coming from. Even our family members don't always "get it".

We place ALOT of value on the opinions of members here because in an essence everyone here is a co-worker of mine. I have never met anyone on this board in person, I have talked to a few on the phone and I know what many of you actually look like but I wouldn't recognize anyone if I was standing in line next to them in Target...but some how, you are ALL my friends. VALUED friends.

Friends I look forward to talking to every day.
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:42 AM
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it absolutely makes sense! Look how many times a member has said something along the lines of their dh or so or bff makes fun or makes a comment about their sentences starting with "well on the daycare.com forum.....". we are naturally drawn to others who have shared interests or common ground.

We definitely place a value on our friends (even virtual ones) because it is human nature to seek others out who "understand" or know where we are coming from. Even our family members don't always "get it".

We place alot of value on the opinions of members here because in an essence everyone here is a co-worker of mine. I have never met anyone on this board in person, i have talked to a few on the phone and i know what many of you actually look like but i wouldn't recognize anyone if i was standing in line next to them in target...but some how, you are all my friends. Valued friends.

Friends i look forward to talking to every day.
amen sistah!
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Old 03-29-2012, 06:54 AM
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I had this conversation with Cathearder on the phone a few months ago and she explained this to me in a way I could really get it.

She said that in the daycare world that we are so isolated that the adult contact we have on a day to day basis WEIGHS more to our brains and our hearts than normal people who work out in the real world and deal with adults all the time. She said after years of doing this business that we adapt to having little adult contact BUT the heaviness on our minds of the adults that DO talk to us daily gets higher and higher the longer you do the business.

So I keep this in mind with my daycare parents first. I have even HAD this convo with a daycare parent when we had a long convo about something that came up. When I explained it to her she readily understood. She said she felt that way for the few weeks she was on maternity leave and that was nuttin compared to doing childcare for 18 years.

To me, it makes sense.

We are a bit more hypersensitive because we naturally crave age mates or work mates in some capacity... so when we GET that here it matters to us a lot more than it would if we were all each one of forty work mates in an office.

That make sense?
SOOOOO makes sense! Thanks for this!
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Old 03-29-2012, 07:37 AM
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I just think we all need to remember that looking at printed text (as in emails, forums, and text messages) we don't know the person's tone. I am a really sarcastic person and always have to add smiley faces or something like that after text messages or my friends think I am being rude.

I know we all take this seriously as it is our profession and our job, but not everyone agrees. I think if we all work hard on disagreeing 'nicely' we will be fine. I do feel as though sometimes we may be too sensitive to something someone has posted...perhaps before posting back (kind of like yelling) we should take a step back before we just fire off a response. There are times I look at this and think, "Jeez, can't we all just get along?!". I know there are times I have disagreed with people, and them with me....and I sure there are times people think I am a moron. But meh, it is life...I keep coming back, and I know this has been a great resource for me. But then again, I am not the one to take things personally.

Although I did receive an email from an old HS classmate telling me she was unfriending me on facebook because I did nothing to benefit our relationship....excuse me?! You have 653 friends...are they all benefitting you? Just unfriend me, don't tell me you did it. I would have even noticed. It reminded me of the commercial when the teen girl calls the boy to tell him she is giving him the silent treatment. I was mad about that!
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Old 03-29-2012, 07:39 AM
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Although I did receive an email from an old HS classmate telling me she was unfriending me on facebook because I did nothing to benefit our relationship....excuse me?! You have 653 friends...are they all benefitting you? Just unfriend me, don't tell me you did it. I would have even noticed. It reminded me of the commercial when the teen girl calls the boy to tell him she is giving him the silent treatment. I was mad about that!
I have a 4.5 yr old DCB who will tattle on his friends and I will usually respond that if he doesn't like what they are saying to ignore them.

He will march right over to them and say "Guess what? I am ignoring you."
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:10 AM
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SOOOOO makes sense! Thanks for this!
Cathearder is brilliant. She teaches much.

I think one more aspect of this board that complicates things is that it draws every kind of child care. There are professional child care providers, teachers, center staff workers, sometimes nannies, and babysitters like me. Those are all VERY different jobs. We get in here together but sometimes I think there isn't enough distinction with our positions on what we actually DO every day and what kind of business we offer.

I can relate to being a nanny and a babysitter. I can't really fully understand what it is like to be a professional child care provider, center worker, or a teacher. I don't have the experience in the latter. I can understand SOME of the day to day of a center worker... pro child care provider... or a teacher.. but my understanding is limited.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:11 AM
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I've been on daycare and adoption boards since 98. Fourteen years and a number of forums and this board is very similiar to the ones back in 98. I met some of my good day care friends way back when and we STILL talk to each other every day. Fourteen years is a long time to talk child care.

For every person who I've seen say they will leave the board maybe one in ten or so actually do. Usually when people leave it's because life happens, they quit child care, or they get bored with talking about child care. A couple of years on one board and you see the same convo's over and over. It's pretty rare that something new actually comes up.

The debates are an integral part of a successful board especially in child care. People feel very pasionately about little kids and day care is HARD done well. This board is an excellent example of ways of doing child care that are vastly different and netting a successful long run of child care, happy and healthy kids, and satisfied customers. What would work with one provider wouldn't even be considered by another. One provider can build their entire business on a philsophy that another wouldn't dream of doing. Sorting that out can get downright complicated with strong debates and disagreements. Using the written word and a few emoticons complicates it even further.

It's not perfect but it's a good deal. Daycare.com hosts this board free of charge to us and I appreciate it. The advantages far outweigh the downsides IMHO.
Yes...I totally agree that the advantages outweigh the downsides. I love being able to get other points of view and ideas that I never would have thought of if I did not come on here. And when something difficult comes up in childcare, it is wonderful to have a group of providers to "talk to" who have also been through difficulties in their business and can give perspective, advice and sympathy when needed. My dh just doesn't have the patience or interest to provide those things effectively in this part of my life.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:17 AM
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It absolutely makes sense! Look how many times a member has said something along the lines of their DH or SO or BFF makes fun or makes a comment about their sentences starting with "Well on the daycare.com forum.....". We are naturally drawn to others who have shared interests or common ground.

We definitely place a value on our friends (even virtual ones) because it is human nature to seek others out who "understand" or know where we are coming from. Even our family members don't always "get it".

We place ALOT of value on the opinions of members here because in an essence everyone here is a co-worker of mine. I have never met anyone on this board in person, I have talked to a few on the phone and I know what many of you actually look like but I wouldn't recognize anyone if I was standing in line next to them in Target...but some how, you are ALL my friends. VALUED friends.

Friends I look forward to talking to every day.
I know my bff's are probably sick of me starting my sentences with "I saw on the daycare forum that someone said....." I quote the people on this forum to them all the time...lol! They are both also child care providers in thier homes so I just feel the need to impart all of the gems that I get on here.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:27 AM
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Cathearder is brilliant. She teaches much.

I think one more aspect of this board that complicates things is that it draws every kind of child care. There are professional child care providers, teachers, center staff workers, sometimes nannies, and babysitters like me. Those are all VERY different jobs. We get in here together but sometimes I think there isn't enough distinction with our positions on what we actually DO every day and what kind of business we offer.

I can relate to being a nanny and a babysitter. I can't really fully understand what it is like to be a professional child care provider, center worker, or a teacher. I don't have the experience in the latter. I can understand SOME of the day to day of a center worker... pro child care provider... or a teacher.. but my understanding is limited.
Nanny De-I disagree....lol. You always underestimate yourself IMO. I know sometimes it's a matter of semantics, babysitter, dcp, teacher. You and I are both all 3. You feel like you don't need the title, and that's ok. I think, based on your answers, carefully thought out philosophies, blog, and website, that you are certainly a professional. I don't always agree with everything you say, but I certainly respect you as a babysitter, AND daycare provider, and as a teacher!
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:29 AM
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I love the comments that this thread has brought out.

One of the number one things I get from this forum is helping me gain perspective. In this job alot of lines can become blurred. (Ie staying flexible/yet sticking to policies) This forum helps me redraw and fill in those blurred lines a little darker. KWIM?

In my own business I strive to stay on the fence. Halfway between strictly business and all fun. Sometimes I may get off the fence on one side or another but as long as I always get back on I consider myself successful.

This forum also has helped me learn that there is no 1 right way to run a successful daycare. I love the difference of opinions, and a little of the drama! I know shoot me. But hey I suppose its better than watching soaps and eating bonbons.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:30 AM
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#1 rule on being on a forum, don't take everything to heart.

It's impossible to see the body language on a monitor.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:32 AM
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Nanny De-I disagree....lol. You always underestimate yourself IMO. I know sometimes it's a matter of semantics, babysitter, dcp, teacher. You and I are both all 3. You feel like you don't need the title, and that's ok. I think, based on your answers, carefully thought out philosophies, blog, and website, that you are certainly a professional. I don't always agree with everything you say, but I certainly respect you as a babysitter, AND daycare provider, and as a teacher!
Well that was nice. I needed that

I'm not tho. I'm a babysitter. That's all.. no more ... no less.

I like being a babysitter. I think it's a nobel job. I do think it gets confuseled here because we have the mix of different KINDS of child care providers. When I read posts of posters I know I try to think: Okay she's a professional child care provider... she's a teacher... she's a nanny... or a center worker. They ARE so different.. the day to day is different and the responsibility and pay is COMPLETELY different. Most of us have similiar age groups but what we DO every day can be totaly different from the poster responding to what we do.
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Old 03-29-2012, 08:58 AM
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Well that was nice. I needed that

I'm not tho. I'm a babysitter. That's all.. no more ... no less.

I like being a babysitter. I think it's a nobel job. I do think it gets confuseled here because we have the mix of different KINDS of child care providers. When I read posts of posters I know I try to think: Okay she's a professional child care provider... she's a teacher... she's a nanny... or a center worker. They ARE so different.. the day to day is different and the responsibility and pay is COMPLETELY different. Most of us have similiar age groups but what we DO every day can be totaly different from the poster responding to what we do.
Not only do we have different titles, views and ways of running a child care, a majority of us are parents too and we have to consider our own parenting philophies in this too!

Some are old school, some are AP, some are blended, some are single, some are new, some are older and some are a mixture of a bunch of it all rolled together.

We also have to consider geopgraphical locations too....what is the norm in one area is unheard of in another. In my community, transporting child care children is absolutely not the norm. I don't think many parents here would be ok with that but I know in other areas, it is not only the norm but expected.

Same goes for licensing rules/regs in the different states. I cannot suggest to someone in Cali to use an excersaucer or swing if they aren't allowed to use them. So like every other aspect, little things have an effect on what we say, believe, feel and post.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:11 AM
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Not only do we have different titles, views and ways of running a child care, a majority of us are parents too and we have to consider our own parenting philophies in this too!

Some are old school, some are AP, some are blended, some are single, some are new, some are older and some are a mixture of a bunch of it all rolled together.

We also have to consider geopgraphical locations too....what is the norm in one area is unheard of in another. In my community, transporting child care children is absolutely not the norm. I don't think many parents here would be ok with that but I know in other areas, it is not only the norm but expected.

Same goes for licensing rules/regs in the different states. I cannot suggest to someone in Cali to use an excersaucer or swing if they aren't allowed to use them. So like every other aspect, little things have an effect on what we say, believe, feel and post.
That so true. Doing child care in California is SO very different than here. I would never open a child care there because I believe in the use of confining equipment for other than sleep or eat. I use bouncy seats, play yard baby zones, swings when they are teeny tiny and new, strollers, high chairs, etc.

Just THAT alone would make your day completely different.
What one state says is illegal... another state has no opinion on at all. Something like that can define your day pretty easily.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:20 AM
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Cheeky, I definitely agree about the "family feel" and I wish members weren't "afraid" to post openly. Because I do think there are many who feel that way. I do think that differeing views and perspectives are super important, especially in this job where we are often homebound and not able to get out during the day. We become isolated from outside opinions or views that differ from ours.

I sincerely hope that the regular member you had a difference of opinion with with was not me.... I know we run our programs very differently but as a regular and active member of this board, I for one value what you have to say. I run my program more on the business side where as I am pretty sure you run yours more on the family-relationship side of things and I respect you for doing so.
It wasn't you, Blackcat - and thank you for your kind words.

I have felt a bit like a pariah (here) since the incident. It’s unfortunate that I am perceived as a troublemaker, when in “real life” I am a big softie and truly the easiest person to get along with.

The only reason I continue to post here is because I am not easily intimidated AND I like to give my input – even if it isn’t always well received.

If there is one thing that would make this board more enjoyable, is the freedom to disagree (in a civil manner) without consequences.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:27 AM
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You know you are one of the main persons here that got me to go from lurker to poster. I lurked for a REALLY long time and read the entire archives before I posted. I have never posted unregistered here.

I read every post your wrote. You made me think and laugh.
I lurked for a very long time, then I posted unregistered and someone called me a brat- probably I was at the time- sorry. I got to know many of the peeps here, through what they put out for all to see. I still want my privacy- not because of all of you, but because of where I live and other providers I know in this field. I trust the few people that have my information. I am highly opinionated because I come from years of experience in many avenues. I am not always right- This field is ever growing and changing from one day to the next, so I come here to learn, share and escape and see how my friends are doing. Everyone brings something to the table. Even if I don't agree or use it in my program. What works for me doesn't have to work for the next person, work or personal life. I happen to find the providers with years of experience to be very helpful to me, because they have learned through trial and error, they are in it for the long hall as am I. Adults are just big grown up kids for the most part......that's why these little board spats happen. We all need to remember to play nice on the playground. I think our love for these kiddo's just makes us very passionate on where we stand on things.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:39 AM
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Can I just say that for me...if I didn't have this forum I would be lost...

I come and go from here not bc I'm bored or upset from a post...but bc daycare sometimes doesn't leave me much time to get on here. And, I am going through a lot of personal things...things you all know I am not above putting out there..lol!! And right now I am sick but watching the kiddo's anyway...I share everything about my life. I am a open book and bc of that I open my self up to criticism. But that is good. I like all kinds of feed back and some of it isn't always going to be good. I am not overly sensitive and I can take the bad with the good. I already know i don't run a typical state ran daycare...I am not typical by any means judging on reading a lot of posts. But, I've learned that I can better my program here by your all's advice. And I recognized I still have a lot to learn.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:40 AM
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"Cheeky, I definitely agree about the "family feel" and I wish members weren't "afraid" to post openly. Because I do think there are many who feel that way. I do think that differeing views and perspectives are super important, especially in this job where we are often homebound and not able to get out during the day. We become isolated from outside opinions or views that differ from ours.

I sincerely hope that the regular member you had a difference of opinion with with was not me.... I know we run our programs very differently but as a regular and active member of this board, I for one value what you have to say. I run my program more on the business side where as I am pretty sure you run yours more on the family-relationship side of things and I respect you for doing so.

I also want EVERYONE here to know that if you ever disagree or do not like something I have posted or said, please don't ever hesitate to call me out on it, post your honest response and/or PM me if necessary. I am human and I can lose sight of the point and let my feelings get in the way just as easily as anyone else.

I am a pretty outspoken person and I know I don't do things exactly the same as others (as we are ALL unique) but I would never personally want anyone to ever feel I was squashing their true feelings or thoughts for fear of any type of "flaming" in retribution. I just want to throw out there that I love this board and it really is my "outlet" for stress and helps me keep going on a regular basis.

I truly appreciate every single member here and I respect everyone for how they choose to run their businesses and for their thoughts AND opinions....ESPECIALLY when they are different from mine.

I love seeing things from another person's viewpoint. It gives us all a chance to evaluate our actions, thoughts and words which is a good thing since we all know that no two kids, days and/or situations are the same.

I think that we should all take a step back and re-read the posts we write. We all need to double check that our words aren't hurtful or mean towards any one. It is awesome if we want to disagree but we need to do it in a respectful manner. Kind of like how we teach our daycare kids, be nice or don't play together. Really NOT that hard to do. "

I could have wrote most of the above- except I try to strike a balance with the business end and the family relationships. Everything is so multi faceted that I find myself spinning some days like a disco ball and bouncing back the reflections of the mirror images on each facet- We have to be, we wear so many hats in this job and in our lives outside of the job. All in all I hope my honey comb hide out has a special place in the nest/hive just as you all have that special place too- 3Cents
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:51 AM
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My opinion and experience only, take it for what it's worth.

Between this and another forum I am on, the posts I have learned the most from were the ones that offended me at first. Once I 'got over it', I went back, re-read the post and saw the invaluable advice in it. They forced me to look at a situation in a completely different way. That is how we learn, isn't it?
The debate threads here crack me up, actually. I was literally laughing outloud at the sprinkler thread yesterday. Kiddos were looking at me like I was nuts.
The other forum I am on has recently changed and now everyone is afraid of hurting each other's feelings. They water their points down soooo much, that no one can get anything out of it. There used to be a couple of straight shooters that got the ball rolling with some good posts, but they are gone now. That's what I appreciate about Nan, Blackcat, Crystal, and the many others that aren't afraid to post things as they see them. We can take what we can use and leave the rest. I have never seen anyone tell another that 'you must do as I do.' It's more like, 'this works for me.'
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:53 AM
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Well that was nice. I needed that

I'm not tho. I'm a babysitter. That's all.. no more ... no less.

I like being a babysitter. I think it's a nobel job. I do think it gets confuseled here because we have the mix of different KINDS of child care providers. When I read posts of posters I know I try to think: Okay she's a professional child care provider... she's a teacher... she's a nanny... or a center worker. They ARE so different.. the day to day is different and the responsibility and pay is COMPLETELY different. Most of us have similiar age groups but what we DO every day can be totaly different from the poster responding to what we do.
no your not a babysitter. Your a childcare provider- Babysitters get paid much more then we do Babysitting is once in a while- you don't grow the same bonds that you have with your steady kids. I agree with BBO- you might not have a written title to all those things, teacher etc... but the experience brings you into those titles with out the certificate. The same for many of us here.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:59 AM
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no your not a babysitter. Your a childcare provider- Babysitters get paid much more then we do Babysitting is once in a while- you don't grow the same bonds that you have with your steady kids. I agree with BBO- you might not have a written title to all those things, teacher etc... but the experience brings you into those titles with out the certificate. The same for many of us here.
Well every year at Christmas when the bonus checks come rolling in it says "babysitter" in the bottom left hand corner of the check next to "memo".



so I'll go with that....
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Old 03-29-2012, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
Well every year at Christmas when the bonus checks come rolling in it says "babysitter" in the bottom left hand corner of the check next to "memo".



so I'll go with that....
I am guessing you correct the parents real quick in time of needing too
check in hand not being one of those times-

My daughter babysits- she gets paid far better then I do for her time and efforts. I'm ok with that
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  #52  
Old 03-29-2012, 10:30 AM
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My check memos say daycare
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  #53  
Old 03-29-2012, 11:18 AM
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I don't care what mine say, As long as they don't bounce, we're all good.
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  #54  
Old 03-29-2012, 12:06 PM
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I’m guessing some people are either turned off by the treatment they receive for having a differing opinion, or are simply afraid to post for fear of being ostracized.
I would say "let it roll off your back". Don't give it legs. If you get worked up about it you give the comment energy that manifests itself into something else. After 24 hours there is really little that stays with me from what I read here. Move on. ( I need a male cheerleader smiley)

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Originally Posted by SilverSabre25 View Post
*sigh*

I apologize mac. I will not bring up your name again.

Even though what I was saying was true, I shouldn't have said it.
Kind of reminds me of driving on the freeway. Don't turn on your turn signal. The other driver will just rush up and not let you in. Just jump in (with a Hummer is preferred)

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Originally Posted by saved4always View Post
I just wanted to say that I love this forum! It helped me get through a time in my business a few months ago when I had a family who was not being the nicest it could be and reading all the posts here helped me figure out that it was not me, it was them.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! It is time consuming but this forum has become a second home for me. I'm glad you appreciate it.

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#1 rule on being on a forum, don't take everything to heart.

It's impossible to see the body language on a monitor.
Exactly what I was saying in the first quote. Tomorrow is another day. Leave the crap behind.
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  #55  
Old 03-29-2012, 12:30 PM
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I know a few people have been changing their usernames. Which isn't fun, because we form a bond with certain members, but once that name is gone, what we remember about them goes with it. But you could always creep into their posting history i guess.



I should have probably alerted everyone that I changed my username. It had NOTHING to do with wanting to become someone else in this forum. One of my moms told me she found a great website with lots of info on kids in daycare, (not sure if it was THIS one, but could be) and I wanted to separate my internet life from my professional life (ya know... in case I post a gripe and they figure out it's me!! lol) .... so I changed my username. I FULLY knew that you guys could VERY EASILY go back and read my old posts. In fact, I actually didn't say anything about the new name because I figured that's exactly what most of you would do!! Bottom line, I just didn't want it where a dc mom could google my name, and up pops a gripe about her!! LOL
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  #56  
Old 03-29-2012, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucy View Post
I should have probably alerted everyone that I changed my username. It had NOTHING to do with wanting to become someone else in this forum. One of my moms told me she found a great website with lots of info on kids in daycare, (not sure if it was THIS one, but could be) and I wanted to separate my internet life from my professional life (ya know... in case I post a gripe and they figure out it's me!! lol) .... so I changed my username. I FULLY knew that you guys could VERY EASILY go back and read my old posts. In fact, I actually didn't say anything about the new name because I figured that's exactly what most of you would do!! Bottom line, I just didn't want it where a dc mom could google my name, and up pops a gripe about her!! LOL
when we all got on the website kick, everyone was posting their website links, and all that. then reality hit that if you google the website, it will lead you to daycare.com and parents, especially potential clients, would be able to see your username, and go into your history.

you have to be very careful never to disclose anything on here that you don't want the whole world knowing.
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  #57  
Old 03-29-2012, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucy View Post
I should have probably alerted everyone that I changed my username. It had NOTHING to do with wanting to become someone else in this forum. One of my moms told me she found a great website with lots of info on kids in daycare, (not sure if it was THIS one, but could be) and I wanted to separate my internet life from my professional life (ya know... in case I post a gripe and they figure out it's me!! lol) .... so I changed my username. I FULLY knew that you guys could VERY EASILY go back and read my old posts. In fact, I actually didn't say anything about the new name because I figured that's exactly what most of you would do!! Bottom line, I just didn't want it where a dc mom could google my name, and up pops a gripe about her!! LOL
Makes sense to me...I recently had a moderator remove some identifying info on a few of my posts. I don't want someone googling my dc and finding me here. I don't really have anything to hide, and honestly, if someone tried hard enough, they could figure it out. I just prefer to share my feeling here sometimes with people who get it, knowing that it doesn't mean I don't enjoy my job, and realize it's a privilege to have these kiddos in my life. Never-the-less, we do get frustrated!
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  #58  
Old 03-29-2012, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by bbo View Post
Makes sense to me...I recently had a moderator remove some identifying info on a few of my posts. I don't want someone googling my dc and finding me here. I don't really have anything to hide, and honestly, if someone tried hard enough, they could figure it out. I just prefer to share my feeling here sometimes with people who get it, knowing that it doesn't mean I don't enjoy my job, and realize it's a privilege to have these kiddos in my life. Never-the-less, we do get frustrated!
Yes... exactly. I have nothing to hide, but I've complained about my one PITA family (whose kids I ADORE, btw, but mom & dad are clueless), and it's just not stuff I would say TO them, so I don't want them reading it here. I post it here because you all "get me". That's the only reason I changed it. People want to put a whole lot of mystery and intrigue into it, and be proud of themselves when they bust the code, but it just isn't like that. So... whatever....
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  #59  
Old 03-29-2012, 02:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael View Post
I would say "let it roll off your back". Don't give it legs. If you get worked up about it you give the comment energy that manifests itself into something else. After 24 hours there is really little that stays with me from what I read here. Move on. ( I need a male cheerleader smiley)

Michael,

Believe me, I have no problem letting things roll off my back. I get on these boards KNOWING that I will not agree with every opinion, nor will everyone agree with me. I was only stating that when I disagreed with a well-known poster – her and her friends jumped on me like gangbusters. Since then, I haven’t felt welcome here.

I’d also like to add, I am not afraid of a little friendly debate, or even a huge debate, but when I am personally attacked for giving MY opinion, I think that’s where the moderators should jump in and not allow the bullying or intimidation.

In closing, I think that giving a differing opinion does not bode well on this forum and I (personally believe) that many posters leave this board, stop posting (and begin lurking), or are simply too afraid to post. I think that is a shame because there is so much to gain by interacting with men and women who work in the same field.

Thank you for listening…
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  #60  
Old 03-29-2012, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
Michael,

Believe me, I have no problem letting things roll off my back. I get on these boards KNOWING that I will not agree with every opinion, nor will everyone agree with me. I was only stating that when I disagreed with a well-known poster – her and her friends jumped on me like gangbusters. Since then, I haven’t felt welcome here.

I’d also like to add, I am not afraid of a little friendly debate, or even a huge debate, but when I am personally attacked for giving MY opinion, I think that’s where the moderators should jump in and not allow the bullying or intimidation.

In closing, I think that giving a differing opinion does not bode well on this forum and I (personally believe) that many posters leave this board, stop posting (and begin lurking), or are simply too afraid to post. I think that is a shame because there is so much to gain by interacting with men and women who work in the same field.

Thank you for listening…
Here's a tip. PM me when something like that arises. Those that first make me aware of a situation will get me involved on thier side in viewing the conversation. If I see something that seems unfair or unwarranted, on either side, I will always PM or email those that are leveraging the forum in improper ways. I have a certain climate I want for this forum and no one member is bigger than it as a whole.
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  #61  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucy View Post
I should have probably alerted everyone that I changed my username. It had NOTHING to do with wanting to become someone else in this forum. One of my moms told me she found a great website with lots of info on kids in daycare, (not sure if it was THIS one, but could be) and I wanted to separate my internet life from my professional life (ya know... in case I post a gripe and they figure out it's me!! lol) .... so I changed my username. I FULLY knew that you guys could VERY EASILY go back and read my old posts. In fact, I actually didn't say anything about the new name because I figured that's exactly what most of you would do!! Bottom line, I just didn't want it where a dc mom could google my name, and up pops a gripe about her!! LOL
I also changed my user name recently - anyone who I was "friends" with knows its still me but when I found this board silly me thought I should use my daycare name as my user name. I really don't have many complaints about my daycare but even the little ones I don't want someone searching my daycare name and coming up with my posts on this board. It was just poor judgement on my part when joining here but since I was listing my daycare in the listings I thought it was "normal" to use that name in here.

I've been on message boards since the mid-90's - have seen it all and really just don't get involved in the drama. There are people on here (and every board I'm on) that just really rub me the wrong way and I just ignore their posts. I love when boards have the "ignore" option - don't think this one does though.
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  #62  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Crazy8 View Post
I love when boards have the "ignore" option - don't think this one does though.
The option is under the UserCP I think .
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  #63  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Crazy8 View Post
I love when boards have the "ignore" option - don't think this one does though.
You can lost this board too. It has an ignore list. Everyone should use their User CP (user control panel) to update their accounts. The ignore list is on the left side of your Control Panel. PM me is you need more information. I can also be led to the Chat area if need be.
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  #64  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by MyAngels View Post
The option is under the UserCP I think .
Too funny, you beat me to it and truncated her quote the same as I did! Great minds think alike.
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  #65  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
Michael,

Believe me, I have no problem letting things roll off my back. I get on these boards KNOWING that I will not agree with every opinion, nor will everyone agree with me. I was only stating that when I disagreed with a well-known poster – her and her friends jumped on me like gangbusters. Since then, I haven’t felt welcome here.

I’d also like to add, I am not afraid of a little friendly debate, or even a huge debate, but when I am personally attacked for giving MY opinion, I think that’s where the moderators should jump in and not allow the bullying or intimidation.

In closing, I think that giving a differing opinion does not bode well on this forum and I (personally believe) that many posters leave this board, stop posting (and begin lurking), or are simply too afraid to post. I think that is a shame because there is so much to gain by interacting with men and women who work in the same field.

Thank you for listening…
I'm guessing you are talking about me so if not... let me know.

Cheeky are you talking about the sprinkler thread? I've searched my name and your name together in a search (both ways) to see every post where you and I have backquoted each other and I can only find a few that there was any debate????

I reread all the threads today and I can't for the life of me figure out which one you are talking about. I've searched the posts to see "friends" that have jumped on you and I'm not recognizing the opposing posters as my friends. I have three friends on this board.... BlackCat... Cathearder... and WDMMom that I know in real life.

Can you post to me or pm to me the thread you are talking about? I can't fix what I don't understand... and I don't get where in any of the longer debate threads we have been on together where any of my three friends on her gangbusted you.
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  #66  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael View Post
Great minds think alike.
Why thanks, that's the nicest thing anybody's said to me all day (Of course, I mostly hang out with 1, 2 and 3 year olds...)
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  #67  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael View Post
You can lost this board too. It has an ignore list. Everyone should use their User CP (user control panel) to update their accounts. The ignore list is on the left side of your Control Panel. PM me is you need more information. I can also be led to the Chat area if need be.
Also this is how you use the Ignore List. Maybe some of you have used it and don't read the whole conversation because someone is blocked? Just thinking out loud here:

Can I block posts, emails and messages from specific users?
If there are particular members that bother you and you do not want to see their posts or receive Private Messages and Emails from them, then you can add these members to your 'Ignore List'. There are several ways to do this:
Through your User Control Panel: User CP, Settings & Options, Edit Ignore List. Then, type their name into the empty text box and click 'Okay'.
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  #68  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:40 PM
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Although I did receive an email from an old HS classmate telling me she was unfriending me on facebook because I did nothing to benefit our relationship....excuse me?!
Seriously? hah! What a dweeb! Bet you don't miss her one bit do ya?

I didn't go to my last High School reunion because you know what? Anyone from High School that I cared to remain friends with is still my friend and I'm still in contact with them. There are not many.

3 words - Facebook Is Evil

It's like a contest to see how many "friends" you can collect. REALLY? 653 friends... Wow... she needs to really get off the computer and get a life!

Quote:
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( I need a male cheerleader smiley)
Always up for the challenge!




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  #69  
Old 03-29-2012, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaddidle Care View Post
Seriously? hah! What a dweeb! Bet you don't miss her one bit do ya?

I didn't go to my last High School reunion because you know what? Anyone from High School that I cared to remain friends with is still my friend and I'm still in contact with them. There are not many.

3 words - Facebook Is Evil

It's like a contest to see how many "friends" you can collect. REALLY? 653 friends... Wow... she needs to really get off the computer and get a life!



Always up for the challenge!




I see a gender bias..... I need a "smaller" smiley like the one we use. Good effort though...
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Old 03-29-2012, 04:00 PM
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I may be able to shrink it - hmm - got to locate that website again where I did it for someone else.

Sorry Michael - I know there is a way to do it but I used to use Gimp and now it's all downloads. I don't download until hubby (aka big computer geek) sees it first.
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Old 03-29-2012, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
Michael,

Believe me, I have no problem letting things roll off my back. I get on these boards KNOWING that I will not agree with every opinion, nor will everyone agree with me. I was only stating that when I disagreed with a well-known poster – her and her friends jumped on me like gangbusters. Since then, I haven’t felt welcome here.

I’d also like to add, I am not afraid of a little friendly debate, or even a huge debate, but when I am personally attacked for giving MY opinion, I think that’s where the moderators should jump in and not allow the bullying or intimidation.

In closing, I think that giving a differing opinion does not bode well on this forum and I (personally believe) that many posters leave this board, stop posting (and begin lurking), or are simply too afraid to post. I think that is a shame because there is so much to gain by interacting with men and women who work in the same field.

Thank you for listening…
I haven't spent time on here for quite awhile and when I read this I couldn't agree more!
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  #72  
Old 03-29-2012, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by mom2many View Post
I haven't spent time on here for quite awhile and when I read this I couldn't agree more!
Well I am going to work on this but I need members to work with me. Communication is important and you can always PM me.
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  #73  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael View Post
Here's a tip. PM me when something like that arises. Those that first make me aware of a situation will get me involved on thier side in viewing the conversation. If I see something that seems unfair or unwarranted, on either side, I will always PM or email those that are leveraging the forum in improper ways. I have a certain climate I want for this forum and no one member is bigger than it as a whole.
Thank you. I will certainly do that.
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  #74  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:53 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
I'm guessing you are talking about me so if not... let me know.

Cheeky are you talking about the sprinkler thread? I've searched my name and your name together in a search (both ways) to see every post where you and I have backquoted each other and I can only find a few that there was any debate????

I reread all the threads today and I can't for the life of me figure out which one you are talking about. I've searched the posts to see "friends" that have jumped on you and I'm not recognizing the opposing posters as my friends. I have three friends on this board.... BlackCat... Cathearder... and WDMMom that I know in real life.

Can you post to me or pm to me the thread you are talking about? I can't fix what I don't understand... and I don't get where in any of the longer debate threads we have been on together where any of my three friends on her gangbusted you.

It was definitely the sprinkler thread…

I just looked back and the heated posts were deleted. I clearly remember a post where you said that we could never be friends because we were too different, another post where you tried to embarrass me by bringing up my tax questions/problems from a completely different thread, a post where you talked down to me because I was a new provider (which I wasn’t), etc. Oh, and all of the posts where people were attacking me for standing up to you were deleted. Ironically, the posts that were NOT deleted were the ones that made it appear as if I were picking on you for no apparent reason. Interesting...

Anyhoo… It’s all water under the bridge now and that is why I didn’t single you out in my opinion on how (I feel) these boards could improve.
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Old 03-30-2012, 03:55 AM
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I haven't spent time on here for quite awhile and when I read this I couldn't agree more!
I think a lot of us feel this way. Hopefully things will change for the better.
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  #76  
Old 03-30-2012, 05:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Crazy8 View Post
I also changed my user name recently - anyone who I was "friends" with knows its still me but when I found this board silly me thought I should use my daycare name as my user name. I really don't have many complaints about my daycare but even the little ones I don't want someone searching my daycare name and coming up with my posts on this board. It was just poor judgement on my part when joining here but since I was listing my daycare in the listings I thought it was "normal" to use that name in here.

I've been on message boards since the mid-90's - have seen it all and really just don't get involved in the drama. There are people on here (and every board I'm on) that just really rub me the wrong way and I just ignore their posts. I love when boards have the "ignore" option - don't think this one does though.
I did this too...used my daycare name. I keep meaning to have Michael change it and I keep forgetting.
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  #77  
Old 03-30-2012, 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
It was definitely the sprinkler thread…

I just looked back and the heated posts were deleted. I clearly remember a post where you said that we could never be friends because we were too different, another post where you tried to embarrass me by bringing up my tax questions/problems from a completely different thread, a post where you talked down to me because I was a new provider (which I wasn’t), etc. Oh, and all of the posts where people were attacking me for standing up to you were deleted. Ironically, the posts that were NOT deleted were the ones that made it appear as if I were picking on you for no apparent reason. Interesting...

Anyhoo… It’s all water under the bridge now and that is why I didn’t single you out in my opinion on how (I feel) these boards could improve.
I don't remember any posts getting pulled in the sprinkler thread. The other things you are speaking of are still here in the archives if you care to search or I can link you to them. I spent yesterday reading all of our exchanges and they are still here just a different thread. What you believe has been deleted is just in another thread.

It's pretty rare for posts to get pulled here. Happens now and then but most of the interchanges remain unchanged. I think it's a good idea to go through old posts whenever an exchange like this occurs. Learn from it and see the sum total of experiences the other person had.

I wanted to address the "friends" thing with you because it's something that just dawned on me yesterday and you brought it up here so it's obviously on your mind a bit too.

You said: I clearly remember a post where you said that we could never be friends because we were too different

What I said in the old exchange is that I could never earn your respect because we are so different. I didn't use the word friend or friendship at all in the exchange. Not once.

In a post in this thread you said: I was only stating that when I disagreed with a well-known poster – her and her friends jumped on me like gangbusters.

I think there is a very common misconception on this board that I have a posse of friends to be there to support my viewpoints. As I said above, I only know Cathearder, BlackCat, and WDMMom. I have done consulting work for some of the daycare.com members but that has primarily been a paid service.

BlackCat and I speak on the phone every three or four months. She would never spend a minute here agreeing with me for the sake of agreement. We disagree on a lot... maybe as much as we agree upon. Cathearder and I talk whenever she has the time for me... and that's more for my sake. She's my go to guy when I need help. She is definitely my friend and my mentor and would be more likely to come behind if she thought I was in a bad spot. WDMMom is a former client of two years and is the only one here who has met me IRL. She's my friend and we agree on most things. We talk every day, sometimes multiple times. We text and complain about our own kids pretty much daily.

Other than those friendships... I don't have any other on this site. I don't even private message people unless they ask something of me or I think there is a real life safety thing going on that I can help in.

When someone comes along to support they are just as random as someone coming along to oppose. I don't have any way of monitoring or even knowing who is going to be who in a particular thread. I don't engage the other posters in real life. I don't call them on the phone. I don't Facebook with them. I don't do chat. I don't endear them to myself or my viewpoints in any way.

I have great friends in the daycare world who I HAVE been in a friendship with for fourteen years. Vet providers who met me back in the day in the Rainbow Room and Parentsplace. We've stayed together as a group and most are my age. We have our own board and have been talking child care for fourteen years.

I've only been here for two years. I don't have friendships with the posters because we are all still very new to each other.

So please... when you feel ganged up on by posters who agree with my posts... you must know they are not personal friends of mine nor do they have any stake in my outcome on this board. I don't have a say in their feelings or their responses.

All I'm asking is for you to realize that when they feel differently than you do and it appears as if they feel the same as me... that you take their difference as THEIR difference with you and not as a rallying for my "side". They have no dog in the fight. They are the same to me as the dissenters are to me.... women with their OWN oppinion that just happens to be the same as mine on this thread at this time.

I never suggested that I wouldn't be friends with you nor offered friendship to the average everyday poster here. I don't expect that. I truly only have three friends on this board IRL and I've explained as well as I can what I think of their participation in any given thread.

It's not that I don't LIKE the ladies on this board... the ones who come behind and agree. Of course, I'm flesh and blood and I like my ideas to be liked. I like sharing them. But the truth is... that what I like the most are the ones who don't agree. They are very interesting to me. The more you disagree... the more I like it.

So that young lady would put you in the like position because we rarely agree.

See?

Last edited by nannyde; 03-30-2012 at 07:14 AM.
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  #78  
Old 03-30-2012, 10:09 AM
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Here's a tip. PM me when something like that arises. Those that first make me aware of a situation will get me involved on thier side in viewing the conversation. If I see something that seems unfair or unwarranted, on either side, I will always PM or email those that are leveraging the forum in improper ways. I have a certain climate I want for this forum and no one member is bigger than it as a whole.
I wasn't aware till the other day that we could actually PM you! It took me a little while to figure out how to do it but it was actually nice to now that you are available to us when we need you for things like this.
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Old 03-30-2012, 10:39 AM
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Nan,

I don't remember any posts getting pulled in the sprinkler thread. The other things you are speaking of are still here in the archives if you care to search or I can link you to them. I spent yesterday reading all of our exchanges and they are still here just a different thread. What you believe has been deleted is just in another thread.

PLEASE send me a link. I do believe the sprinkler thread is where things got incredibly heated, but I could be wrong. Looking back on that thread, it looks like a one-sided debate when in reality, it was FAR from that.

I think there is a very common misconception on this board that I have a posse of friends to be there to support my viewpoints.

You may not have a posse of “friends” – but you certainly have a posse of followers. You work for this website, write a blog, and post often. You are well known and respected here. Many posters DO agree with nearly everything you say – right or wrong – and they come out in full force when people disagree with you.

All I'm asking is for you to realize that when they feel differently than you do and it appears as if they feel the same as me... that you take their difference as THEIR difference with you and not as a rallying for my "side". They have no dog in the fight. They are the same to me as the dissenters are to me.... women with their OWN oppinion that just happens to be the same as mine on this thread at this time.

Again, I do feel many posters agree with you simply because you are who you are. If you said, “I feed my DCK’s rotten egg sandwiches with fish eyes" they would ask for the recipe. BUT, I also agree with the fact that many posters agree with you, simply because they see things as you do. What I have a problem with, are those posters who attack those of us who disagree
with you.


Because we rarely agree.

We FINALLY agree on something.
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Old 03-30-2012, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
Nan,

I don't remember any posts getting pulled in the sprinkler thread. The other things you are speaking of are still here in the archives if you care to search or I can link you to them. I spent yesterday reading all of our exchanges and they are still here just a different thread. What you believe has been deleted is just in another thread.

PLEASE send me a link. I do believe the sprinkler thread is where things got incredibly heated, but I could be wrong. Looking back on that thread, it looks like a one-sided debate when in reality, it was FAR from that.

I think there is a very common misconception on this board that I have a posse of friends to be there to support my viewpoints.

You may not have a posse of “friends” – but you certainly have a posse of followers. You work for this website, write a blog, and post often. You are well known and respected here. Many posters DO agree with nearly everything you say – right or wrong – and they come out in full force when people disagree with you.

All I'm asking is for you to realize that when they feel differently than you do and it appears as if they feel the same as me... that you take their difference as THEIR difference with you and not as a rallying for my "side". They have no dog in the fight. They are the same to me as the dissenters are to me.... women with their OWN oppinion that just happens to be the same as mine on this thread at this time.

Again, I do feel many posters agree with you simply because you are who you are. If you said, “I feed my DCK’s rotten egg sandwiches with fish eyes" they would ask for the recipe. BUT, I also agree with the fact that many posters agree with you, simply because they see things as you do. What I have a problem with, are those posters who attack those of us who disagree
with you.


Because we rarely agree.

We FINALLY agree on something.
You wouldn't want a rotten egg sammmmwhich recipe would ya?
(that was a good one)

I'll pm you a link to the thread... don't want to rehash it here but you will see that you are combining two threads into one experience. They were time wise close to each other so I can see how you would think that.

One thing tho... it's kind of a negative to the others who have the same core philosphy I have that they don't have a complete mind of their own. I've explained to you as far as I can who I really have a relationship with and how you perceive the others involvement in my posts isn't something I can do much about.

I've had numerous convos with providers who are on this site that I consult for and they have expressed concern that they feel like they CAN'T chime in when they agree for fear of being labeled or thought of as you have described. So the feeling does go BOTH ways. We wouldn't want the people who are in agreement with a belief or technique or supportive of a care philosophy to not be able to express themselves for fear of being seen as a member of a gang instead of their own unique individual with a mind of their own.

Check your p.m. box here in a bit and I'll send you the link.
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  #81  
Old 03-30-2012, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by small_steps View Post
I did this too...used my daycare name. I keep meaning to have Michael change it and I keep forgetting.
PM me. I'll change it.
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  #82  
Old 03-30-2012, 11:44 AM
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Origianlly posted by Nan: I've had numerous convos with providers who are on this site that I consult for and they have expressed concern that they feel like they CAN'T chime in when they agree for fear of being labeled or thought of as you have described. So the feeling does go BOTH ways. We wouldn't want the people who are in agreement with a belief or technique or supportive of a care philosophy to not be able to express themselves for fear of being seen as a member of a gang instead of their own unique individual with a mind of their own.

Same here.....I cannot tell you how many PM's I get asking questions or for advice because memebrs feel they cannot post it on the open forum for fear of being "ganged up on". And I can tell you, every one of them feel they will get "ganged up on" by you and your "followers".

Yeah....it does go both ways.
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  #83  
Old 03-30-2012, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
Origianlly posted by Nan: I've had numerous convos with providers who are on this site that I consult for and they have expressed concern that they feel like they CAN'T chime in when they agree for fear of being labeled or thought of as you have described. So the feeling does go BOTH ways. We wouldn't want the people who are in agreement with a belief or technique or supportive of a care philosophy to not be able to express themselves for fear of being seen as a member of a gang instead of their own unique individual with a mind of their own.

Same here.....I cannot tell you how many PM's I get asking questions or for advice because memebrs feel they cannot post it on the open forum for fear of being "ganged up on". And I can tell you, every one of them feel they will get "ganged up on" by you and your "followers".

Yeah....it does go both ways.
Crystal, you've done enough venting. Let's drop this. PM Nannyde instead.
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  #84  
Old 03-30-2012, 02:25 PM
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Crystal, you've done enough venting. Let's drop this. PM Nannyde instead.
Wow, really? This is my first post in this thread. I know I posted a couple of comments in other threads a couple of days ago, but I don't think they were really venting, only commenting on what was clearly unfair treatment of a couple of members.

I won't pm nannyde....that only makes it fair game for her to make more outrageous comments without it being obvious to the public..... but I will drop it.

As much as I'd like to put her on ignore.....that would chop nearly every thread in this forum up, making them hard to follow....so even that is not an option.
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  #85  
Old 03-30-2012, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Crystal View Post
Wow, really? This is my first post in this thread. I know I posted a couple of comments in other threads a couple of days ago, but I don't think they were really venting, only commenting on what was clearly unfair treatment of a couple of members.

I won't pm nannyde....that only makes it fair game for her to make more outrageous comments without it being obvious to the public..... but I will drop it.

As much as I'd like to put her on ignore.....that would chop nearly every thread in this forum up, making them hard to follow....so even that is not an option.
Crystal, I've posted on about six of the threads today out of about forty and two of them have my name on the title line. There are SO many threads on this board that could use your good advice.

I have only p.m.'d you a hand full of times and I've never disclosed publicly or privately anything you and I have ever talked about. I never discuss p.m.'s publicly.

Last edited by nannyde; 03-30-2012 at 03:07 PM.
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  #86  
Old 03-30-2012, 02:51 PM
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Hey Nan....I've been asked to drop it, so I will decline any further comments. Have a BEAUTIFUL day
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  #87  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:22 PM
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Michael, isn't it true that you can not "ignore" Nannyde and other moderators/administrators?

Not that I want to ignore you Nanny!!!....but I have wanted to ignore another moderator/administrator but the program would not let me
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  #88  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:25 PM
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Michael, isn't it true that you can not "ignore" Nannyde and other moderators/administrators?

Not that I want to ignore you Nanny!!!....but I have wanted to ignore another moderator/administrator but the program would not let me
I did not know that. I will see if I can change it. There is still 80% of what this forum can do that I have no clue to. I didn't even know what invisible was.
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  #89  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:27 PM
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I did not know that. I will see if I can change it. There is still 80% of what this forum can do that I have no clue to. I didn't even know what invisible was.
Now I'm curious - what is "invisible?"
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  #90  
Old 03-30-2012, 03:46 PM
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Now I'm curious - what is "invisible?"
I think it allows a user to be present but not show up on the members list. There are some great How To instructions in the FAQ section: http://daycare.com/forum/faq.php?faq...b3_board_usage

I also allowed the Invisible option for registered members. It wasn't available before but is now.
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  #91  
Old 03-30-2012, 04:32 PM
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I like the lack of written rules. Forces women to wear their big girl panties and say only what they mean.
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  #92  
Old 03-30-2012, 05:33 PM
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I like the lack of written rules. Forces women to wear their big girl panties and say only what they mean.
You Texas girls come right out of the starting gate. Welcome to the forum.
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Old 03-30-2012, 07:02 PM
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I like the lack of written rules. Forces women to wear their big girl panties and say only what they mean.
Right on! Best quote of the entire thread
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  #94  
Old 03-30-2012, 07:31 PM
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You Texas girls come right out of the starting gate. Welcome to the forum.
Texans mesh well with New Yorkers & their honesty (my husband & I have no issues in saying what we feel).
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Old 03-30-2012, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Live and Learn View Post
Michael, isn't it true that you can not "ignore" Nannyde and other moderators/administrators?

Not that I want to ignore you Nanny!!!....but I have wanted to ignore another moderator/administrator but the program would not let me
you are correct.... you can not ignore a moderator. That may be why I was thinking this board didn't have the ignore feature.
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Old 03-31-2012, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Live and Learn View Post
Michael, isn't it true that you can not "ignore" Nannyde and other moderators/administrators?

Not that I want to ignore you Nanny!!!....but I have wanted to ignore another moderator/administrator but the program would not let me
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy8 View Post
you are correct.... you can not ignore a moderator. That may be why I was thinking this board didn't have the ignore feature.
Ya know I think if people are wanting to ignore a moderator that the issue should be brought to Michael's attention because if there are many members upset with a mod, then maybe that mod should not be a mod....kwim?

Being a moderator comes with certain responsibilties and expectations. I don't think that members should be so unhappy that they ignore one and not have the issue addressed.

Just my opinion.

Last edited by Blackcat31; 03-31-2012 at 08:03 AM.
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Old 03-31-2012, 07:28 AM
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Nan,

You will see that you are combining two threads into one experience.

You are absolutely right. I have NO memory of posting in that thread. Time to up my dosage of Ginkgo.

One thing tho... it's kind of a negative to the others who have the same core philosphy I have that they don't have a complete mind of their own.

I believe a lot of people have your same core philosophy and the majority of posters on this forum have a mind of their own. I also think there are a few who would drink the koolaid if you wanted them too.

I've had numerous convos with providers who are on this site that I consult for and they have expressed concern that they feel like they CAN'T chime in when they agree for fear of being labeled or thought of as you have described.

Really??? I (personally) have never seen anyone that agrees with you get ganged up on. It has always been the other way around. BUT, I probably read 20% of what goes on here, so you could very well be right.

Check your p.m. box here in a bit and I'll send you the link.

Thank you very much.
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  #98  
Old 03-31-2012, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by CheekyChick View Post
I believe a lot of people have your same core philosophy and the majority of posters on this forum have a mind of their own. I also think there are a few who would drink the koolaid if you wanted them too.
What I have been trying to express is the ones who have the same core philosophy other than the ones I mentioned as IRL friends don't have any connection to me anymore than they have a connection to you.

Calling my theories and practices koolaid is a pretty loaded statement. I make my living off of that koolaid and I think I'm doing well with it. I don't write anything here that I don't believe in. I give my time to this site and I make part of my living off of consulting by serving up that koolaid. I also USE the practices in the care of children and their parents pay for it AND read this site.

Keep calling it that and I will end up having a truckload of Koolaid packets arriving at my house. I'll never hear the end of it from my "clients" both in home and consulting... so can we find another word?

Disclaimer: I do not serve Koolaid. I have never purchased Koolaid and do not endorse the giving of Koolaid to preschoolers, toddlers, infants, and especially not newborns.
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Old 03-31-2012, 10:15 AM
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Ya know I think if people are wanting to ignore a moderator that the issue should be brought to Michael's attention because if there are many members upset with a mod, then maybe that mod should not be a mod....kwim?

Being a moderator comes with certain responsibilties and expectations. I don't think that members should be so unhappy that they ignore one and not have the issue addressed.

Just my opinion.
What she said!

I kind of look at public forums like people chatting back and forth at a meeting. When the conversation turns to 2 people going at each other it's sort of like yelling at each other in front of a crowd. Ick!

I also like to see shorter posts. When they start looking like a page from a book I tend to lose interest. (it's the ADD in me)
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Old 03-31-2012, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by nannyde View Post
What I have been trying to express is the ones who have the same core philosophy other than the ones I mentioned as IRL friends don't have any connection to me anymore than they have a connection to you.

Calling my theories and practices koolaid is a pretty loaded statement. I make my living off of that koolaid and I think I'm doing well with it. I don't write anything here that I don't believe in. I give my time to this site and I make part of my living off of consulting by serving up that koolaid. I also USE the practices in the care of children and their parents pay for it AND read this site.

Keep calling it that and I will end up having a truckload of Koolaid packets arriving at my house. I'll never hear the end of it from my "clients" both in home and consulting... so can we find another word?

Disclaimer: I do not serve Koolaid. I have never purchased Koolaid and do not endorse the giving of Koolaid to preschoolers, toddlers, infants, and especially not newborns.
Good answer.
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