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momma4many 11:11 AM 06-28-2011
Called a provider who just moved to my town the other day to see what her rates were. She is advertising all over town, and so I was curious. Here's the deal, I cannot see how she is making any $$, but she says she has been doing this in a nearby town (true, I looked her up on the state website and the info is there) for 25 years and has always done things this way.

She provides:

Any OTC medication, suscreen, bug spray, teething gel, etc.
Diapers and wipes
Extra clothes (if you want to bring your kids in jammies, don't worry about bringing clothes with them, she will provide them. Never heard of this, but maybe I'm not seeing how this would work without her getting ripped off unless they go back home in the jammies they came in)
Shoes (that stay at her house, seems like a large expense for each child?)
She is open 24 hours
All food and/or formula


Sounds like a GREAT deal for parents, especially since she is $5-$10 cheaper than every one else in town that I know of. I just cannot figure out how she is making money! That is so much expense for each child! I asked her flat out and she said the food program paid for food, formula, diapers and wipes. I am not enrolled in the food program yet, but I was pretty sure they don't pay for diapers and wipes.

Anyone else here operate like this? I would love to simplify things for my parents, like providing diapers and wipes (I already provide food), but I cannot see how the expense is worth it.
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Cat Herder 11:19 AM 06-28-2011
This is "New Provider Syndrome" at its finest.

She will be walked over and burnt out in under 24 months.

She has a bulls eye on her for daycare hoppers and licensing reps.

I have seen it many, many, many times.....
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Country Kids 11:24 AM 06-28-2011
Originally Posted by Catherder:
This is "New Provider Syndrome" at its finest.

She will be walked over and burnt out in under 24 months.

She has a bulls eye on her for daycare hoppers and licensing reps.

I have seen it many, many, many times.....
She has been doing it for 25 years! So she has something figured out. Doesn't Nannyde supply shoes for the kids? I thought I read a post about that. When I was on the food program I never did spend all the money on food because I made so much. So she might be taking the extra and buying the other stuff. Remeber everything she buys is a tax write off so maybe she restocks when she gets her taxes back. She has the upper hand because she offers all that and is cheaper and has 25 years experience.
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Cat Herder 11:30 AM 06-28-2011
Originally Posted by Country Kids:
She has been doing it for 25 years! So she has something figured out. Doesn't Nannyde supply shoes for the kids? I thought I read a post about that. When I was on the food program I never did spend all the money on food because I made so much. So she might be taking the extra and buying the other stuff. Remeber everything she buys is a tax write off so maybe she restocks when she gets her taxes back. She has the upper hand because she offers all that and is cheaper and has 25 years experience.
AHHH... She already owns everything to include her home and vehicles. Age has its benefits.

I also provide spare shoes, clothes, otc stuff, wipes, baby food.... But I would never offer 24 hour care, formula or diapers.

Does she like punishment or something???
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SandeeAR 11:33 AM 06-28-2011
How can one person offer 24 hour care? She has to sleep sometime.
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cheerfuldom 11:33 AM 06-28-2011
It is probably due to the fact that she is ALWAYS full. If its the best deal in town, shes not going to need to budget for open slots and such. Besides that, after 25 years, you can bet she has a huge stockpile of yard sale clothing and shoes in every size. Some people would rather charge less and be full all the time with daycare hoppers and such than go the other route. I would rather be picky, find families that are in here for the long run and keep my numbers as small as possible for the benefit of all. The other thing is that she might sort of let the kids run loose and the parents don't complain because of the great deal money-wise. I know a few daycares like that.
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Lianne 11:47 AM 06-28-2011
I supply wipes, bottles, pacifiers, sunscreen and bedding. I have a drawer full of clothes people have (purposely) left behind for me to use as spares. I have extra sunhats, sandals, snowboots, slippers, winter hats, mittens, snowsuits and rain boots. I don't necessarily have one of each thing for every child in my care but I have enough that if someone forgets something, I have something that likely fits them.

This, however, does not affect my fees in anyway.
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Mom_of_two 11:48 AM 06-28-2011
I provide food and formula (am on the food program.) That's it! Aside from art supplies etc.
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greenhouse 02:47 PM 06-28-2011
I stopped reading at "open 24 hours". She's clearly nuts.
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PitterPatter 07:37 PM 06-28-2011
WOW and I thought I supplied a lot. I am no where near her! I don't understand how she can afford it. Especially the diapers and wipes unless he doesn't have many in diapers.

I too recall Nanny mentioning she supplies shoes. Keds I think if I'm not mistaken?
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DEBBIES DAYCARE 09:09 AM 06-29-2011
I supply pretty much everything. I buy diapers with a coupon or sale, stock up when I can. Sometimes I even buy generic diapers. I supply all diaper changing supplies, children motrin, baby cereal and baby food ( i make my own usually) and of course, meals. I am on the food program. It dosent pay for diapers and stuff but with smart shopping, coupons and home cooking, I never spend all of what is granted, on just food. Gotta love the dollar stores and bargain bins! I also use my tax ID to be a member of the local restaurant distributer depot and buy in bulk at wholesale AND I have a garden! I have a pile of old clothes from Good Will plus I accept hand me downs from everyone. I dont supply formula. My contract states I do supply these thing but the brands are at my discretion. If you prefer a paticular brand or do not approve of generic products, then you must supply it yourself.
I do this for 2 reasons. One is, I find it easier. I try to avoid the BS and aggravation. Forever reminding them to bring wipes, clothes to change into, diaper supplies...nag nag nag. I keep it simple. I even charge a flat rate for the day. You have all day, the whole day and it avoids adding hours up and late fees. The other reason I do this is because it justifies me to charge little MORE, not less. Quality care, drop off your child and go. Easy breezy.
I am not opened 24 hours but I do offer extended hours, weekend care, overnight care and drop in care, when available and at my convienience. I charge hourly. Everytime I offer, someone takes me up on it. If asked, I often say yes but not afraid to say no. I must be paid on the day of service. Its a nice bonus
I have 4 full timers and 1 part time and a couple of drop ins. Ive been doing this for years.
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MarinaVanessa 09:50 AM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by greenhouse:
I stopped reading at "open 24 hours". She's clearly nuts.
I couldn't stop laughing

But sadly it's true. I've been trying to raise my rates for a bit now from $155 to $160 per week for full time to new clients and I'm having a hard time of it. Most people around here are charging $155 or even $150 per week and offering all kinds of crazy extras like preschool program and 24 hour care.

It's hard to compete with that. These aren't your newbies either. These are providers that have been around the block and back. I know a provider that has been in business for 25 years and always had a waitinglist (large daycare home) and only has 6 DC kids. Everyone now wants more daycare for less money and it's the licensed providers that are offering everythin including the kitchen sink that makes it difficult. But hey, everybody has to pay their bills somehow.
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nannyde 10:10 AM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by PitterPatter:
I too recall Nanny mentioning she supplies shoes. Keds I think if I'm not mistaken?
http://www.nanshouse.com/apps/photos...toid=122398562

I dig Keds velcro. Easy on and built like a tank.
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jojosmommy 11:48 AM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by DEBBIES DAYCARE:
I supply pretty much everything. I buy diapers with a coupon or sale, stock up when I can. Sometimes I even buy generic diapers. I supply all diaper changing supplies, children motrin, baby cereal and baby food ( i make my own usually) and of course, meals. I am on the food program. It dosent pay for diapers and stuff but with smart shopping, coupons and home cooking, I never spend all of what is granted, on just food. Gotta love the dollar stores and bargain bins! I also use my tax ID to be a member of the local restaurant distributer depot and buy in bulk at wholesale AND I have a garden! I have a pile of old clothes from Good Will plus I accept hand me downs from everyone. I dont supply formula. My contract states I do supply these thing but the brands are at my discretion. If you prefer a paticular brand or do not approve of generic products, then you must supply it yourself.
I do this for 2 reasons. One is, I find it easier. I try to avoid the BS and aggravation. Forever reminding them to bring wipes, clothes to change into, diaper supplies...nag nag nag. I keep it simple. I even charge a flat rate for the day. You have all day, the whole day and it avoids adding hours up and late fees. The other reason I do this is because it justifies me to charge little MORE, not less. Quality care, drop off your child and go. Easy breezy.
I am not opened 24 hours but I do offer extended hours, weekend care, overnight care and drop in care, when available and at my convienience. I charge hourly. Everytime I offer, someone takes me up on it. If asked, I often say yes but not afraid to say no. I must be paid on the day of service. Its a nice bonus
I have 4 full timers and 1 part time and a couple of drop ins. Ive been doing this for years.
I thought you HAD to provide formula if you were on the FP?
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jojosmommy 11:52 AM 06-29-2011
I provide food/formula. In the summer I provide sunscreen but only so I don't have to manage who belongs to which bottle.

Diapers, wipes, extra clothes, sun hats, meds, diaper cream are all your responsibility.

I just read an ad in our area that is open 24 provides tons of stuff and only charges 12.50 a day. ??????????? Desperate or nuts I'm not sure...???????

I prefer to keep the type of client willing and able to provide these things, respect my schedule, and pay me appropriately.
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Unregistered 12:51 PM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by DEBBIES DAYCARE:
I supply pretty much everything. I buy diapers with a coupon or sale, stock up when I can. Sometimes I even buy generic diapers. I supply all diaper changing supplies, children motrin, baby cereal and baby food ( i make my own usually) and of course, meals. I am on the food program. It dosent pay for diapers and stuff but with smart shopping, coupons and home cooking, I never spend all of what is granted, on just food. Gotta love the dollar stores and bargain bins! I also use my tax ID to be a member of the local restaurant distributer depot and buy in bulk at wholesale AND I have a garden! I have a pile of old clothes from Good Will plus I accept hand me downs from everyone. I dont supply formula. My contract states I do supply these thing but the brands are at my discretion. If you prefer a paticular brand or do not approve of generic products, then you must supply it yourself.
I do this for 2 reasons. One is, I find it easier. I try to avoid the BS and aggravation. Forever reminding them to bring wipes, clothes to change into, diaper supplies...nag nag nag. I keep it simple. I even charge a flat rate for the day. You have all day, the whole day and it avoids adding hours up and late fees. The other reason I do this is because it justifies me to charge little MORE, not less. Quality care, drop off your child and go. Easy breezy.
I am not opened 24 hours but I do offer extended hours, weekend care, overnight care and drop in care, when available and at my convienience. I charge hourly. Everytime I offer, someone takes me up on it. If asked, I often say yes but not afraid to say no. I must be paid on the day of service. Its a nice bonus
I have 4 full timers and 1 part time and a couple of drop ins. Ive been doing this for years.
I am just curious because a lady I know in my state was cited for this as major violation. Formula is really expensive and if there is a loop hole I would love hear about it.
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Unregistered 01:04 PM 06-29-2011
I supply diapers, wipes, diaper cream, sun screen, and even tylonol/motrin . I also open 1/2 hour earlier than most providers in my area and stay open longer. I don't charge for a set amount of hours per day. Your kid could be here 6-6:30 and pay the same as the kid who left at 3. I don't charge enrollment or deposit fees either. I let them take free vacation if I get at least 2 weeks notice as well. I also don't charge late fees for late pick ups if they call. I cover all meals and I have been known to purchase clothes for some of my DC kids. Normally though they just bring 2-3 outfits and I keep them washed and rotated as needed. I do all this at a rate that is $20-$40 less for infants in my area and $10-20 less for older children.

I have been really fortunate and picky with the clients I take. I have yet to have a parent abuse any privilege or take for granted my extras. I have been doing this for nearly 20 years
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CdnMumof4 01:10 PM 06-29-2011
WOWZA!!! that's insane....if I provided that stuff you better believe my rate would represent that, it wouldn't be cheaper than the rest. is this for real?

in the summer the parents all provide sunscreen- but we all share. I also use my own sunscreen, it basically depends on which bottle is closest at hand.

I would be skeptical of the type of care these daycares are offering- esp. 24hrs and only 12.50 a day? ...where's the catch ?
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nannyde 01:31 PM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by jojosmommy:
I thought you HAD to provide formula if you were on the FP?
Mine fp is that you have to offer A formula. I offer Kirkland formula and no one ever takes me up on it. I've never supplied formula for an infant.
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sharlan 01:39 PM 06-29-2011
I provide lots of hugs and kisses and a safe environment. I do not provide infant formula, baby food, diapers, or wipes. I ask my parents to provide an extra can of formula when the can in use is 1/2 full. I keep an extra supply of food, diapers and wipes, just in case.

I provide sunscreen, rash cream, and items like that.
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kathiemarie 01:55 PM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by MarinaVanessa:
I couldn't stop laughing

But sadly it's true. I've been trying to raise my rates for a bit now from $155 to $160 per week for full time to new clients and I'm having a hard time of it. Most people around here are charging $155 or even $150 per week and offering all kinds of crazy extras like preschool program and 24 hour care.

It's hard to compete with that. These aren't your newbies either. These are providers that have been around the block and back. I know a provider that has been in business for 25 years and always had a waitinglist (large daycare home) and only has 6 DC kids. Everyone now wants more daycare for less money and it's the licensed providers that are offering everythin including the kitchen sink that makes it difficult. But hey, everybody has to pay their bills somehow.

I'm in the same town as you and I charge 170 to 180 full time and 125 afterschool. I get it and I'm full.
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MarinaVanessa 03:02 PM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by kathiemarie:
I'm in the same town as you and I charge 170 to 180 full time and 125 afterschool. I get it and I'm full.
Lucky you! I FEEL like I already charge way too low which is why I'm trying to raise my rates. It seems like people will call from the R&R and sound really interested until they come to the interview and ask about price. I'm at the point where when I make an ad on CL I post my rate right on there so that there are no surprises and I still get people trying to negotiate on the price. The good thing is that Im on no hurry to fill my spot. If they don't like my rate there's plenty of other places they can go.

Kathiemarie what area are you in? Maybe I've met you?
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DEBBIES DAYCARE 06:36 PM 06-29-2011
Originally Posted by Unregistered:
I am just curious because a lady I know in my state was cited for this as major violation. Formula is really expensive and if there is a loop hole I would love hear about it.
no loop hole, except I would offer generic and the parents usually want a paticular brand. I state in my contract, paticular brands are not offered. My infant before that was breast fed. Shes my toddler now.
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MarinaVanessa 01:20 AM 06-30-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
Mine fp is that you have to offer A formula. I offer Kirkland formula and no one ever takes me up on it. I've never supplied formula for an infant.
Not to hijack but Nan where do you purchase your shoes? And what are the shoes called? (I know they're Keds but do they have a model name?). I've been thinking about supplying the shoes as well. I'm tired of tying laces over and over. I was looking online for Velcro unisex shoes. White preferably like you have. Do they only go to a size 8-8 1/2? I was hoping for Velcro shoes all the way up to my 4yo.
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nannyde 04:25 AM 06-30-2011
Originally Posted by MarinaVanessa:
Not to hijack but Nan where do you purchase your shoes? And what are the shoes called? (I know they're Keds but do they have a model name?). I've been thinking about supplying the shoes as well. I'm tired of tying laces over and over. I was looking online for Velcro unisex shoes. White preferably like you have. Do they only go to a size 8-8 1/2? I was hoping for Velcro shoes all the way up to my 4yo.
http://www.keds.com/store/SiteContro...ultOption=true

They go up to ten in whole sizes only. I bought mine from sears.com They were on sale with free shipping. I can't remember now the exact amount per shoe but I'm thinking in the low twenties.

I bought two pairs of each shoe from size six to ten and then bought from their sale shoes one pair in size eleven and twelve that had velcro closures. They are not as nice as the Keds but they will do. My four year old is in size twelve now. I'll be buying some size one and two here soon just to top off the stock.

The Keds are AWESOME. They are really worth it.
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momma4many 08:22 AM 06-30-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
http://www.keds.com/store/SiteContro...ultOption=true

They go up to ten in whole sizes only. I bought mine from sears.com They were on sale with free shipping. I can't remember now the exact amount per shoe but I'm thinking in the low twenties.

I bought two pairs of each shoe from size six to ten and then bought from their sale shoes one pair in size eleven and twelve that had velcro closures. They are not as nice as the Keds but they will do. My four year old is in size twelve now. I'll be buying some size one and two here soon just to top off the stock.

The Keds are AWESOME. They are really worth it.
Just curious Nan, but what is your reason for providing shoes? I don't know if you already said, but I was trying to decide if this is something I should look into doing in the future.
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MarinaVanessa 09:37 AM 06-30-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:

The Keds are AWESOME. They are really worth it.
Thanks Nan. I'll go there. I found a few websites but none had all of the sizes that I needed at once. I want something easy to clean or wash that will last a long time and it seems these are the perfect fit. I figure that I'll start with a pair for each DC kid in a size bigger than what they are and when they outgrow them I'll put the old away and buy new ones and that will start my shoe supply. Do you think that's a good idea? With the sharing of the shoes I mean. Do you buy the shoes new for each child or pass them down as the get outgrown?
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nannyde 09:52 AM 06-30-2011
Originally Posted by MarinaVanessa:
Thanks Nan. I'll go there. I found a few websites but none had all of the sizes that I needed at once. I want something easy to clean or wash that will last a long time and it seems these are the perfect fit. I figure that I'll start with a pair for each DC kid in a size bigger than what they are and when they outgrow them I'll put the old away and buy new ones and that will start my shoe supply. Do you think that's a good idea? With the sharing of the shoes I mean. Do you buy the shoes new for each child or pass them down as the get outgrown?
I have two pairs of each size so when they outgrow them they just go up to the next size. We run them through the wash on hot and then just air dry them in the sun between kids.

If they get dirty when they are outside we just wipe them off with a wet rag. We take a small pair of nail scissors to clean out the grids of the velcro. That's SUPER important to keep in good shape.

You should get many years worth of use out of them if you take care of them. I couldn't afford to just buy a pair of them for each kid in each size without raising rates. As long as they are clean between kids and in really good shape they should be able to be passed down.

Some providers feel you shouldn't provide them because each kid should have their own new shoes for every size. I have to weigh out the quality and EASE of the shoes/flip flops/sandals/crocs that the kids come in to the downside of wearing a clean pair of used high quality shoes I supply. For me, the benefit of always having them here and having them FIT and be in excellent condition far outweighs the benefit of using shoes from home.

My fave part is not ever having to have shoe/coat/gloves/snowsuit etc. convos with parents. I don't care what they bring their kid in. I have everything I need every day for every kid. They can come in cowboy boots in July or flip flops in December for all I care. I provide ALL of the outerwear and shoes so I never have to discuss it with parents.

My second fave part is the time it takes my staff to get them ready. Having everything here and having it all fit perfectly and easy on saves me SO much money. It's a big outlay to buy what I need for here but it pays itself off in staff time long before the stuff wears out.

My third fave part is that the kids wear them from when they start walking on. Same shoe style and fit all the way to four. We don't have blister problems or tripping on your shoes problems here. NO injuries because they have grown up wearing the same shoe.
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MarinaVanessa 12:06 PM 06-30-2011
Awesome. Thanks Nan. That's what I was thinking about doing too. I will deffinetely be ordering some this weekend. I'm thinking of supplying shoes for the same reasons you say. I have a DCM that forgets to bring shoes sometimes. How you can forget shoes I don't know but she does it often. I also hate when their 1yo comes in with tie up shoes. Having these Keds will solve my problem. I'm working on the clothes. I have girl clothes in each size because of my daughter and now I'm working on boy clothes by saving my 7mo old's clothes. My boys DCP's donate too so I should have clothes in every size soon too. It makes it easier to just supply everything.
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Crazy8 12:17 PM 06-30-2011
wow, I couldn't imagine supplying all this stuff!! First off, the clutter in my house would drive me insane (we seem to be bursting at the seams already) but I don't think my dc parents would even WANT me to provide that stuff. I have parents who are very particular about wearing certain brands of shoes, etc.

I do provide wipes and sunscreen but if they require specific brands then they need to bring them from home and I have at least 1-2 families that do.
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kidkair 01:28 PM 06-30-2011
Some day I'd like to provide more than I do so I have everything on hand. One of the biggest things I'd like to offer is cloth diapers so I don't have to keep using the ones that fill up landfills for hundreds of years. Parents would still have to supply whatever diaper they want to use for pick up time though.
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Unregistered 03:39 PM 06-30-2011
I dont supply shoes but I do supply a lot of things. Diapers, wipes, meals, and formula. I usually buy clothes off the discount racks or second hand store (to use as spare clothes) b/c parents are forever forgetting to bring these things in. I have had to remind parents for upto 3 weeks before they bring in any thing. I also have a policy that if I have to buy any of the things that I have had to remind parents about then they get a receipt stapled to there statement. (that has only happened twice). I went to supplying my own stuff to simpliy things for the parents and me. Its worked out pretty well so far!
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Tags:beware too many promises, child warehousing, provider - burnout risk, rate - fair and reasonable
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