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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>What Do You Think About all the Regulations an Educational Requirments
jokalima 09:09 PM 05-31-2012
I have this question because when I worked in a center, planing for the kids was a hassle, "this is not appropriate", "not good", "has to be children oriented", "to difficult", "to easy", no crafts that are pre-cut but they don't know how to cut with scissors, only pictures of real people on wall etc... And then... the portofolios and all the arguing about them because such child could not be on this level, but based on observations he was. Arghh for me it was a pain. Sadly because of my lack of words in English I can't fully describe how bad it was.
Now that I have my Home DC, I have notice that kids learn so much easier if you just let them be, also I have learn that the child's interest is whatever I decide to make look like fun, or anything that is new, at least that's my case. Anyways the point is that DCM tells me that she was thinking of changing her daughter to "real preschool" when she turned 4, but now she changed her mind because her daughter learns so much in here, she tells me her mom works in a preschool and she tells her that the kids that are under her care don't know what this DCG knows and they are older. IDK if at the center where I worked they put us in so much stress that it reflected on the kids and affected their learning, but personally I really don't like it when I see all this books and levels and assessments for babies, I think is unrealistic and it does not help. I do agree in having a lesson plan with learning activities but in a more relaxed/realistic way.
What do you think?
Now that I have my Home DC, I have notice that kids learn so much easier if you just let them be, also I have learn that the child's interest is whatever I decide to make look like fun, or anything that is new, at least that's my case. Anyways the point is that DCM tells me that she was thinking of changing her daughter to "real preschool" when she turned 4, but now she changed her mind because her daughter learns so much in here, she tells me her mom works in a preschool and she tells her that the kids that are under her care don't know what this DCG knows and they are older. IDK if at the center where I worked they put us in so much stress that it reflected on the kids and affected their learning, but personally I really don't like it when I see all this books and levels and assessments for babies, I think is unrealistic and it does not help. I do agree in having a lesson plan with learning activities but in a more relaxed/realistic way.
What do you think?
Michael 09:13 PM 05-31-2012
We learned the same thing when homeschooling our children. Its a much more creative, condusive and positive environment.
itlw8 10:17 AM 06-01-2012
I agree with most of those things. We do art experiences not craft. I do not encourage commercial things like Mickey Mouse , Sponge Bob but use real art, people but I do use cartoon people as it is art also.
Each child is an individual and some Are way advanced and some behind.
I adapt the activity to fit each child and even let them take the materials and adapt it themselves.
I Luckily my state does not have guidelines for curriculum. My program may be a bit free and creative for some. My kids do get dirty. and paint on clothes. Heck I am thinking of building a mud kitchen. But my kids thrive and are ready for school.
Each child is an individual and some Are way advanced and some behind.
I adapt the activity to fit each child and even let them take the materials and adapt it themselves.
I Luckily my state does not have guidelines for curriculum. My program may be a bit free and creative for some. My kids do get dirty. and paint on clothes. Heck I am thinking of building a mud kitchen. But my kids thrive and are ready for school.
Heidi 11:21 AM 06-01-2012
When Wisconsin moved to a "Star" rating system, they included the idea of having a curriculum based on assessments in a 4 or 5 star program. They want us to do the assessments, set individual goals for our children, and then plan our curriculum around those goals (including infants).
My feeling is that for me, I would be spending way to much time planning, and not enough time DOING. The trend in this country right now (ala "no child left behind) is to quantify everything. Test, assess, quantify.
Personally, I have had countless children go through my program "kindergarten ready" without ONE bit of formal assessment or planning on my part. I have had children identified and assessed for special needs without a formal assessment process on my end. I know my kids, and I "plan" intuitively.
I am still making the same $110 per week per child I made 20 years ago. That was for caregiving; hugging, feeding, engaging, napping, changing, and playing with the children. Now, for the same money, with no regard to inflation, I am also supposed to assess, plan, and impliment a formal curriculum? When the children were already thriving without all that?
My feeling is that for me, I would be spending way to much time planning, and not enough time DOING. The trend in this country right now (ala "no child left behind) is to quantify everything. Test, assess, quantify.
Personally, I have had countless children go through my program "kindergarten ready" without ONE bit of formal assessment or planning on my part. I have had children identified and assessed for special needs without a formal assessment process on my end. I know my kids, and I "plan" intuitively.
I am still making the same $110 per week per child I made 20 years ago. That was for caregiving; hugging, feeding, engaging, napping, changing, and playing with the children. Now, for the same money, with no regard to inflation, I am also supposed to assess, plan, and impliment a formal curriculum? When the children were already thriving without all that?
Bookworm 01:40 PM 06-01-2012
Several years ago my center was trying for First Steps certification in order to get a grant for equipment. It was horrible. Just about everything we were doing in their eyes was wrong and they made us revamp our entire program. While some of the changes were for the better and very helpful, the rest were extremely time consuming. After planning and setting up projects according to their specifications there was no time left for the actual project. Nothing was getting done because all our time was spent making sure we met all of requirements for the project. We were told that we were not to direct the children in any way because they knew best about what they wanted to do. Time out or any punishment that would cause the child to feel shame was not to be used. As you can imagine, all H*** broke loose. It only took 2 weeks and my Director came to her senses and said no thank you.
I agree that children learn best in a relaxed environment where everything is not regimented. I maintain as casual a class as possible with out letting the inmates run the asylum.
I agree that children learn best in a relaxed environment where everything is not regimented. I maintain as casual a class as possible with out letting the inmates run the asylum.
AmyLeigh 02:18 PM 06-01-2012
Originally Posted by Bookworm:
I agree that children learn best in a relaxed environment where everything is not regimented. I maintain as casual a class as possible with out letting the inmates run the asylum.
I agree that children learn best in a relaxed environment where everything is not regimented. I maintain as casual a class as possible with out letting the inmates run the asylum.
Me too!!
jokalima 03:47 PM 06-01-2012
When I say only pics of real people is just an example. I have on my wall a board of chameleons of different colors, the kids love it and learn colors from it but in the Center I used to work I would not be able to put that on a wall. I agree with the person that says that when we used to plan that much almost nothing got done.
Heidi 07:35 PM 06-01-2012
ok...so here's my take on the whole thing:
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
Bookworm 04:25 AM 06-02-2012
Originally Posted by Heidi:
ok...so here's my take on the whole thing:
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
Heidi, I love you. This is exactly how I think. This also applies to 60% of the DSS regulations in my state.ok...so here's my take on the whole thing:
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
magsgma 04:38 AM 06-02-2012
Originally Posted by Heidi:
ok...so here's my take on the whole thing:
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
Well put... I understand that the objectives of these programs are to ensure that each child has the opportunity for Quality care, however they need to also take into consideration that this is OUR HOME... We are NOT a center for a reason. For me - I worked in a center. I did not want a center in my home. If I wanted a CENTER I would open one. I wanted my home to be a safe comfortable place where children didn't feel like a fish out of water. That they were able to feel like they were with a family member. Learning takes place in so many everyday activities. Even though I bought into the "preschool" room in my home I am working on bringing back the Home into my Family child care HOME.... I don't need the huge yellow calendar (that I just HAD to have by the way) for children to learn the months of the year or counting days.... Is this the type of calendar in their homes? NO! Is this a calendar that they will use for the rest of their lives - NO! We look out the window to talk about the weather for the day. I had those weather pieces that go on the wall. Some of them quite honestly give such a negative opinion on rain and storms that quite frankly from a child's perspective must be quite frightening. We learn about nature and the cycle of life right in my back yard. We were blessed with two birds nests last year - one with robins and one with doves. We have bunnies that visit us from time to time, not to mention a bevy of bees and butterflies. I did the butterfly habitat last year too. But they just love running around the yard "chasing" they butterflies (can you say gross motor?) But yet because I do not have a Master's degree in ECE I will never get a 4 STAR rating.... What about 30+ years of hands on experience of working with children in both a center (Head Start) and in families homes and then my own... Some celebs get honorary degrees from schools they never attended. I think we deserve far more recognition for hands on experience than we receive. Child CARE is just that CARE of children, not paper and pen reports and documentation... Yes that is important but not what I want to spend the majority of my time doing I left HS because that is ALL I got to do, I didnt' take ECE classes to spend my time at a desk!ok...so here's my take on the whole thing:
In many things, researchers and experts in the field spend countless hours gathering facts and "emperical data", With this data, they come up with some sort of wish list, or best-case scenario. Then, they try to re-create this perfect storm with some sort of criteria.
Except that human beings can't be quantified and controlled that way. Each group of people; adults, children, and the enviroment, has their own dynamic. No one can quantify that, IMO.
Except that, in MOST cases, the researchers don't work day after day with a group of children 50+ hours a week.
As caregivers, it's our job to figure out what works for our dynamic. The children AND the adult in the environment. No one gets presidence. The adult's needs are no less valid or important as the children's. It's not all rainbows and unicorns, as the experts would like to think.
So, for most of us, we resent the interference of the so-called experts. They have the theoretical knowledge, but we are the ones on the front lines. It's not that we don't have anything to learn from the experts. It would just be nice if there were just some practicality to the whole thing, and a little respect for the folks actually doing the job.
Kind of reminds me of "under cover boss"....
jokalima 06:47 AM 06-02-2012
LOL, I remember when I was in the center we were planing, the Head Teacher told me that I could not plan for a child that was at age 2 drawing happy faces, she said is not age appropriate, I told her I understood that but the girl was doing this on her own, why not encourage her to keep doing it? I was told no, "you are not the expert, the experts say we don't do that here" , I remember telling her something about how I hated the "experts" because they don't spend the time I spend with the kids and those experts did not know my bright 2 year old, I also told her that most of the brightest minds known in the world today were probably not guided by the "experts" guidelines when they were toddlers, but I loss my battle because the experts know my kids better than I do.
Soccermom 01:23 PM 06-02-2012
I think kids are sometimes overdaycared and completely overstimulated nowadays. They have no idea how to entertain themselves anymore because everythins is WAY too structured. Kids learn from being kids. They learn from boredom and find ways to create their own learning experiences. Kids get enough structure at school when they turn 5. I believe if you provide children with the material and opportunity to be creative with a little help and encouragement they can do amazing things.
I run a children's program at our local community center one morning per week for children and their families and am appauled by the amount of parents obsessed with the overall look of the craft instead of the experience of actually cutting, gluing and coloring. Half the time the parent ends up doing the craft while the child gets bored and runs off. Sad.
I don't know who makes up all the rules and regulations for daycares and schools but whoever they are, they have obviously completely forgotten what it is life to be a child.
Here we sing, we craft, we cook, we go on outdoor adventures and I play games with the little ones but we go with the flow and everyday is something different. I also am a huge advocate of free play. Free play is extremely important for kids.
I run a children's program at our local community center one morning per week for children and their families and am appauled by the amount of parents obsessed with the overall look of the craft instead of the experience of actually cutting, gluing and coloring. Half the time the parent ends up doing the craft while the child gets bored and runs off. Sad.
I don't know who makes up all the rules and regulations for daycares and schools but whoever they are, they have obviously completely forgotten what it is life to be a child.
Here we sing, we craft, we cook, we go on outdoor adventures and I play games with the little ones but we go with the flow and everyday is something different. I also am a huge advocate of free play. Free play is extremely important for kids.
jokalima 01:26 PM 06-02-2012
Originally Posted by Soccermom:
I think kids are sometimes overdaycared and completely overstimulated nowadays. They have no idea how to entertain themselves anymore because everythins is WAY too structured. Kids learn from being kids. They learn from boredom and find ways to create their own learning experiences. Kids get enough structure at school when they turn 5. I believe if you provide children with the material and opportunity to be creative with a little help and encouragement they can do amazing things.
I run a children's program at our local community center one morning per week for children and their families and am appauled by the amount of parents obsessed with the overall look of the craft instead of the experience of actually cutting, gluing and coloring. Half the time the parent ends up doing the craft while the child gets bored and runs off. Sad.
I don't know who makes up all the rules and regulations for daycares and schools but whoever they are, they have obviously completely forgotten what it is life to be a child.
Here we sing, we craft, we cook, we go on outdoor adventures and I play games with the little ones but we go with the flow and everyday is something different. I also am a huge advocate of free play. Free play is extremely important for kids.
I think kids are sometimes overdaycared and completely overstimulated nowadays. They have no idea how to entertain themselves anymore because everythins is WAY too structured. Kids learn from being kids. They learn from boredom and find ways to create their own learning experiences. Kids get enough structure at school when they turn 5. I believe if you provide children with the material and opportunity to be creative with a little help and encouragement they can do amazing things.
I run a children's program at our local community center one morning per week for children and their families and am appauled by the amount of parents obsessed with the overall look of the craft instead of the experience of actually cutting, gluing and coloring. Half the time the parent ends up doing the craft while the child gets bored and runs off. Sad.
I don't know who makes up all the rules and regulations for daycares and schools but whoever they are, they have obviously completely forgotten what it is life to be a child.
Here we sing, we craft, we cook, we go on outdoor adventures and I play games with the little ones but we go with the flow and everyday is something different. I also am a huge advocate of free play. Free play is extremely important for kids.
Heidi 05:11 PM 06-03-2012
Originally Posted by Bookworm:
Heidi, I love you. This is exactly how I think. This also applies to 60% of the DSS regulations in my state.
I'll let you in on a secret-I was on my 3rd beer when I wrote this! Heidi, I love you. This is exactly how I think. This also applies to 60% of the DSS regulations in my state.
Apparently, words flow better under the influence....
Dont drink and type, ladies
Blackcat31 06:19 PM 06-03-2012
Originally Posted by Heidi:
I'll let you in on a secret-I was on my 3rd beer when I wrote this!
Apparently, words flow better under the influence....
I'll let you in on a secret-I was on my 3rd beer when I wrote this!
Apparently, words flow better under the influence....
Way toooooo funny!! Keep drinking....I like the way it makes you think!
Bookworm 02:26 PM 06-04-2012
Originally Posted by Heidi:
I'll let you in on a secret-I was on my 3rd beer when I wrote this!
Apparently, words flow better under the influence....
Dont drink and type, ladies
I raise my glass to youI'll let you in on a secret-I was on my 3rd beer when I wrote this!
Apparently, words flow better under the influence....
Dont drink and type, ladies
Countrygal 02:55 PM 06-04-2012
I don't see one single word in any of these posts that I don't agree with 100%. Like Michael, that is why I homeschool(ed).
My issue is trying to "walk the tightrope". I think I made a mistake when I got certified, but in our state you have to be certified AND licensed to have more than 3 kiddos. (At least legally). How do you tow the line and do what they say you have to do when you don't agree with it at all?? I feel I compromise my beliefs and my common sense almost every single day.
I'll raise one to you as well, Heidi!
My issue is trying to "walk the tightrope". I think I made a mistake when I got certified, but in our state you have to be certified AND licensed to have more than 3 kiddos. (At least legally). How do you tow the line and do what they say you have to do when you don't agree with it at all?? I feel I compromise my beliefs and my common sense almost every single day.
I'll raise one to you as well, Heidi!