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Daycare Center and Family Home Forum>Would You Do Anything Different?
morgan24 03:57 AM 04-14-2011
I could use some advice on my headstrong 3 year old dcg. Yesterday she came in crying and screaming because she didn't like her shirt. I sent her to the bedroom to lay on a blanket until she got control of herself. That took over and hour. When she is like that anything you say to her makes it worse or I leave her alone. She quits crying, I left her there for another 5 minutes and went and got her. She eats then, when I'm cleaning up they read books, before we get a chance to go downstairs to the playroom she asks to watch cartoons when I say no read your books. She starts up again, I send her to the bedroom again, this one last for another hour. Then we start the cycle again. In the mean time the other dcg refuses to play with her and that starts it again. She even has a fit at lunch because we didn't have pizza. She wants pizza every day. She had to leave the table until she quit crying, comes back for lunch. She took an 2 1/2 nap gets up and demands to watch cartoons. I said no and that starts it again. I don't let them watch much t.v. When we are upstairs they read or do art at the table and I don't have a t.v in the playroom. Anyway she throws a fit I sent her to the bedroom and it last at least an hour. I have had her since she was 1, the rules have always been the same it's just this school year that she has been awful. It happens at least 3 times a week where it will be an all day event. She goes home and tells her Mom all kinds of nonsense. When she is out of control I don't talk to her. I tell her on your blanket until your done. She says I called her a brat, told her to shut up, that she was getting on my nerves and on and on. I do think all those things but never say them. If you made it through this novel thanks and any advice will be helpful.
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kitkat 04:20 AM 04-14-2011
Wow! I thought my dcg was emotional...your's sounds worse! I really don't have any advice, but I feel your pain. What does mom say about it when you tell her how her day was? I'm assuming you tell her about the fits, right? What if you set a timer for her? Tell her she can throw her fit, but when the timer rings she's done or she'll lose a toy or something. That worked with mine when she would pull that stunt.
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MN Day Mom 04:53 AM 04-14-2011
Sounds like you have your hands full. Been there.

I think what you are doing with not talking to her is a good thing. She won't hear or process anything you say when she is in this state, so it is best to just let it run its course. Trying the timer is a good idea. Set it for a decent amount of time the first few times and then slowly start to shorten the time. Tell her you understand she is upset and she can be upset until the timer dings and then its time to stop crying and join the group again. This could help her learn to better regulate her emotions.

Good Luck!!!
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Mrs.Ky 05:04 AM 04-14-2011
Something does not sound right. An hour tantrum is NOT normal for even a head strong toddler. Did she always do this? Does she act normal for her age? Has she been checked by a doctor for an ear infection or other illness? Something could be wrong with her.
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nannyde 05:25 AM 04-14-2011
If I had a kid that old crying that much in one day I think a week of Cryapalooza would be in order.

Start here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvQ0BMUKGgE

The other kids will have this one learned by the fifteenth time of playing it. Bust into it at the first facial cry grimmace. Crank it up.... arms floating Swan Lake style.... Sway to the beat... and sing it as loud as you can. Do it in opera if you can pull it off... The more dramatic the better.

Then devote yourself to getting a whole host of one crying song after another. Little KD Lang who rules the universe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Cc8TI1KomU

Sing it with me.... "Then I saw you last night... when you held my hand so tight... and you stopped to say hello.... you were wishing me well... you couldn't tell... I was

Cry ah eye ing OVER YOU...

You get the idea.....

Don't have her leave... oh no

She stays and endures.....

We'll see who will be nominated for an Academy Award by the end of the week.

She needs to see that her fussing will just lead to you having a GREAT time. It means nothing to you because it means nothing.

She'll get it by the third day...... but I'd do a couple of "insurance policy" days after just to seal the deal.
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Lilbutterflie 05:35 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
If I had a kid that old crying that much in one day I think a week of Cryapalooza would be in order.

Start here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvQ0BMUKGgE

The other kids will have this one learned by the fifteenth time of playing it. Bust into it at the first facial cry grimmace. Crank it up.... arms floating Swan Lake style.... Sway to the beat... and sing it as loud as you can. Do it in opera if you can pull it off... The more dramatic the better.

Then devote yourself to getting a whole host of one crying song after another. Little KD Lang who rules the universe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Cc8TI1KomU

Sing it with me.... "Then I saw you last night... when you held my hand so tight... and you stopped to say hello.... you were wishing me well... you couldn't tell... I was

Cry ah eye ing OVER YOU...

You get the idea.....

Don't have her leave... oh no

She stays and endures.....

We'll see who will be nominated for an Academy Award by the end of the week.

She needs to see that her fussing will just lead to you having a GREAT time. It means nothing to you because it means nothing.

She'll get it by the third day...... but I'd do a couple of "insurance policy" days after just to seal the deal.
LMAO! I am picturing that scene right now in my head! Yes, do this!!! If nothing else, everyone else will have lots of fun singing and dancing!
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morgan24 05:39 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by Mrs.Ky:
Something does not sound right. An hour tantrum is NOT normal for even a head strong toddler. Did she always do this? Does she act normal for her age? Has she been checked by a doctor for an ear infection or other illness? Something could be wrong with her.
She does act normal. Every year at the beginning of the school year she would do this for a couple of weeks until she adjusted to the routine again. This year has been out of control. She's not sick. She is the boss at her house and tries to carry it over to here and I don't put up with it and she gets really mad. The madder she is the longer the tantrum.

Nannyde...I will be trying that. I'll let you know how it works.
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MG&Lsmom 05:53 AM 04-14-2011
Three was a very trying year for me with my DD. It's harder than 2. I love Nan's advice always. We did this a couple of times with my DD last year and it did work. Every now and again she gives us a 'tude and I mimic her drama, even sat down in the aisle at Walmart throwing a tantrum. Ended her reign real quick
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nannyde 05:54 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by morgan24:
She does act normal. Every year at the beginning of the school year she would do this for a couple of weeks until she adjusted to the routine again. This year has been out of control. She's not sick. She is the boss at her house and tries to carry it over to here and I don't put up with it and she gets really mad. The madder she is the longer the tantrum.

Nannyde...I will be trying that. I'll let you know how it works.


And while you are at it listen to this: You need a blessing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_Npx...eature=related
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missnikki 06:06 AM 04-14-2011
Cryapalooza! Now THAT's what we should name or 'forum cycle'!

I got tears in my ears from lyin' on my back cryin' over yooooooou!
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nannyde 07:44 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by missnikki:
Cryapalooza! Now THAT's what we should name or 'forum cycle'!

I got tears in my ears from lyin' on my back cryin' over yooooooou!
And if you need any moves to go with your cryin songs... check the doggie on the right:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugeztWg-RCI
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dEHmom 09:29 AM 04-14-2011
ok sorry hijacking this thread....

I have a 1 yo dcb, he just got over a really bad chest infection, and all that, and has been a little sucky because of it. of course I never really gave into it, and even when he was sick he didn't really cause any commotion. NOW! he is back to throwing tantrums stronger than ever. Mom seems a little upset that I used the playpen (he bangs his head and such when screaming bloody murder) because I wont' hold him, and when I walked away, literally 1 ft away, he melts down. She doesn't want the playpen associated with discipline. Now, I just explained to her for safety purposes I use the playpen so he's not banging head on table, floor, or walls, etc (i don't have carpeting to cushion head banging either), but she threw in there that none of the daycare she worked at ever used that method (she worked at centers).

Am I wrong? He figured it out in less than an hour, that when he stops crying, i take him out, but he didn't seemt o figure out that when he cries he goes back in. make sense?

eta: mom said i need to do what I need to do and she is fine with that, but i sort of sensed a bit of upsetness in the tone.
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morgan24 09:49 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by dEHmom:
ok sorry hijacking this thread....

I have a 1 yo dcb, he just got over a really bad chest infection, and all that, and has been a little sucky because of it. of course I never really gave into it, and even when he was sick he didn't really cause any commotion. NOW! he is back to throwing tantrums stronger than ever. Mom seems a little upset that I used the playpen (he bangs his head and such when screaming bloody murder) because I wont' hold him, and when I walked away, literally 1 ft away, he melts down. She doesn't want the playpen associated with discipline. Now, I just explained to her for safety purposes I use the playpen so he's not banging head on table, floor, or walls, etc (i don't have carpeting to cushion head banging either), but she threw in there that none of the daycare she worked at ever used that method (she worked at centers).

Am I wrong? He figured it out in less than an hour, that when he stops crying, i take him out, but he didn't seemt o figure out that when he cries he goes back in. make sense?

eta: mom said i need to do what I need to do and she is fine with that, but i sort of sensed a bit of upsetness in the tone.
I don't think your wrong. He needs a safe spot to have his temper and you provided it. I don't think it will take long of putting him in when he's having a tantrum and taking him out when he's done. Did she say what other methods they used at the center? I don't know about you but I'm open for any suggestions they may have to help correct the problems I'm having. Seems parents want their children to stop throwing tantrums but they don't want to do anything to stop them.

I wish my princesses mom would quit complaining about how bad princesses behavior is and do something about it. I feel like I'm the only one climbing that mountain. I'll make some progress and then it's the weekend and on Monday I get to start all over.
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dEHmom 09:54 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by morgan24:
I don't think your wrong. He needs a safe spot to have his temper and you provided it. I don't think it will take long of putting him in when he's having a tantrum and taking him out when he's done. Did she say what other methods they used at the center? I don't know about you but I'm open for any suggestions they may have to help correct the problems I'm having. Seems parents want their children to stop throwing tantrums but they don't want to do anything to stop them.

I wish my princesses mom would quit complaining about how bad princesses behavior is and do something about it. I feel like I'm the only one climbing that mountain. I'll make some progress and then it's the weekend and on Monday I get to start all over.
Thanks! Glad to hear someone say i'm right. or at least not wrong.

the mom is nothing but a great mom. But she knows he has temper tantrums, and she usually just ignores them. Like she should. But then she says stuff about after he's sick he's always like this, etc. So usually justifies the tantrums. She explained at drop off that he did this last night, and they just ignored him. But I don't see it, kwim? I don't know if they are ignoring meaning they just don't respond to him verbally, physically, or whatever. Or if they actually just pretend like he's not there and that they don't see the bad behavior, or if they go and sit there watching him have the tantrum (which is feeding into it right?) because he originally starts because mom or I walk away from him to do something.

OY! I just feel bad like she's not happy with how I dealt with it. And I will discuss with her, but rather do it in person tomorrow than over text, kwim?

She did not offer any advice on how to deal with it, other than make sure nothing to hurt himself on, and let him work it out on his own. true, but he's a head banger and I can't have him doing that. I can't take my floor away.
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nannyde 10:11 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by dEHmom:
ok sorry hijacking this thread....

I have a 1 yo dcb, he just got over a really bad chest infection, and all that, and has been a little sucky because of it. of course I never really gave into it, and even when he was sick he didn't really cause any commotion. NOW! he is back to throwing tantrums stronger than ever. Mom seems a little upset that I used the playpen (he bangs his head and such when screaming bloody murder) because I wont' hold him, and when I walked away, literally 1 ft away, he melts down. She doesn't want the playpen associated with discipline. Now, I just explained to her for safety purposes I use the playpen so he's not banging head on table, floor, or walls, etc (i don't have carpeting to cushion head banging either), but she threw in there that none of the daycare she worked at ever used that method (she worked at centers).

Am I wrong? He figured it out in less than an hour, that when he stops crying, i take him out, but he didn't seemt o figure out that when he cries he goes back in. make sense?

eta: mom said i need to do what I need to do and she is fine with that, but i sort of sensed a bit of upsetness in the tone.
Somebody came up with the idea that small children could associate separation based on the PLACE you put them in. It's soared thru child care training and state regs. It's kind of like the minute for age for time out. Somebody made it up and society adopted it as a "must do" for child care.

It's not true.

Babies .... up to little kids.. think very basic. They are either IN or they are OUT. Period.

Saying a child who has his bed used as a time out place will then fear or associate bad things with bed is like saying this:

Little Johnny is outside playing. His Mom says to "come in the house". Johnny wants to stay outside playing. His Mom says it's time to come in.

Now Mommy brings him inside the house and Johnny throws a fit.

Now the "inside of the house" will be a place where Johnny associates "bad" or "in trouble".

See how silly that is?

Johnny doesn't care WHERE he comes in. He cares about not being OUT. That's it. He wants to be OUT and he's told to be IN.

It doesn't matter if you have them have their "me" time in a playpen used for sleeping. Johnny only knows he is IN. He wouldn't be happy with any other kind of IN cuz he wants OUT.

Using bed/playpen doesn't affect their happiness or comfort in a bed/playpen in ANY way. Most babies and young children don't want to go to bed. They want to be up and out. It doesn't matter to them WHY you are using that piece of furniture or sleeping equipment. What matters to them is that they are confined.

The chances of something good, comforting, fun, exciting, happy is much higher when a child is OUT. They figure this out as infants. They want out because out means that the adults DO them... or they can DO the environment. That's what is best for their happiness. Being confined means that it isn't fun, happy, exciting, comforting, good etc. It means four walls around them and a base. That's the place where they have the lowest liklihood of getting an adult and getting to DO the environment.

She has a point about Centers though.. but it's not why she thinks. In Centers... if you give the staff the ability to confine they will confine even when it's not necessary. They won't supervise a confined kid. Centers purposely have twelve month olds and older on a cot because that is what FORCES the staff to supervise. They don't want the staff to confine them because history and experience shows them that once the child is confined the staff take them off of their "to do" list. It's to their benefit to confine so allowing ANY confinement can cause them to use it a lot.

It's just one of those examples where someone thought this up and society said "oh that makes sense" or "that's what's best for the babies" and then it worked it's way into care manuals and state regs.

It's not true. Kids are not that complicated. They see things VERY minute to minute and their happiness is based on what they want and what they get. Using a bed for time out or confinement doesn't affect the baby/child's perception of bedtime or sleep. They don't want that either. They just want to be up and out.

Since they can't safely decide when it's time to be up and out... we have to. What equipment we use to do IN doesn't affect the child's perception of whether IN is good or whether they are happy about IN. Most kids most of the time will just want to be OUT.
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dEHmom 10:18 AM 04-14-2011
whoa! lol, right on nanny, thank you, that is what I needed. And thank you so far to all that have agreed with me, and not gone against me I second guessed whether I should post because of the forum cycle,

Thank you thank you!

Oh nanny, do you have these all templated somewhere? or did you actually type that all up just now??
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nannyde 10:26 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by dEHmom:
whoa! lol, right on nanny, thank you, that is what I needed. And thank you so far to all that have agreed with me, and not gone against me I second guessed whether I should post because of the forum cycle,

Thank you thank you!

Oh nanny, do you have these all templated somewhere? or did you actually type that all up just now??
No I just made it up like the person who made up a minute for time out.
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dEHmom 10:32 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
No I just made it up like the person who made up a minute for time out.
hahaha. I am going to have all that ready for dcm when we have discussion. If I feel she doesn't understand why I did it, then I will show her and tell her the daycare provider guru nannyde told me so. :P
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morgan24 10:40 AM 04-14-2011
Originally Posted by nannyde:
No I just made it up like the person who made up a minute for time out.
I admire how creative you are
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Tags:3 year old, drama queen
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