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  #1  
Old 11-21-2011, 11:34 AM
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Default This Child Is Gonna Give Me Grey Hair!!

Decided this afternoon that I am going to have to go ahead and advertise. I will fill his and his brothers spot with just one child. At nap time I'm going to work on an add. Just can't let one child continue to hit and show aggressive and bad behaviors. I'm small and like it that way. I just have 4 kids but this will cut it down to 3 plus my 6 year old. I can take them places with that group. I hate it but I am just not equipped with the skills to deal with this child. This morning when his mom brought him he takes off running out the door in the rain while mom chased him. Lol ugh this is one of the problems with this child he does whatever he wants at home. My 6 year old would appreciate an older little girl to play with. Probably 4 years old or so would be greeeeaaat! Keeping my fingers crossed on it. I just know that I can't do the difficult one any longer. If I have to loose 120 a week then so be it. I don't count on it for bills anyways. It almost feels like I have failed because I have never had a child I couldn't care for.
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Old 11-21-2011, 11:51 AM
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Is this the little guy who may also be intellectually gifted?

If so, read this:

http://www.stephanietolan.com/is_it_a_cheetah.htm

here is a great website for parents and educators of gifted children:

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/characteristics.htm

I know terminating will be tough. It may be easier for his parents to hear if you tell them you suspect he may be gifted. Young Bart Simpson may do better in a program designed for young Bart Simpsons, if such a thing exists in your community!


I had a child like him many years ago that I terminated. I really felt I could not meet his needs in my program. He is now 13, and once identified as gifted (by his school system), did much better.

Good luck to you in your search for a new client that is a better fit. Best wishes to this family who will hopefully find what their child needs.
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Old 11-21-2011, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by mommiesherie View Post
Decided this afternoon that I am going to have to go ahead and advertise. I will fill his and his brothers spot with just one child. At nap time I'm going to work on an add. Just can't let one child continue to hit and show aggressive and bad behaviors. I'm small and like it that way. I just have 4 kids but this will cut it down to 3 plus my 6 year old. I can take them places with that group. I hate it but I am just not equipped with the skills to deal with this child. This morning when his mom brought him he takes off running out the door in the rain while mom chased him. Lol ugh this is one of the problems with this child he does whatever he wants at home. My 6 year old would appreciate an older little girl to play with. Probably 4 years old or so would be greeeeaaat! Keeping my fingers crossed on it. I just know that I can't do the difficult one any longer. If I have to loose 120 a week then so be it. I don't count on it for bills anyways. It almost feels like I have failed because I have never had a child I couldn't care for.
I have to add this...


DO NOT feel bad because you failed. You did not fail. You know your limitations, and you want what is best for this little boy. What good would it do either one of you if you continued to muddle through? It can't be any fun for him, either, feeling misunderstood. You are doing the right thing for BOTH of you!
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Old 11-21-2011, 11:58 AM
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you ARE doing the right thing. the mature response is to know your limits and stop before you go over that. Plus you have to consider the other kids safety and environment. aggressive and rowdy behavior from one really does affect the rest.
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Old 11-21-2011, 11:59 AM
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Gifted or not, he still needs to learn how to listen and be safe. If he's a spontaneous runner leaving your place or arriving then Mom needs to hold his hand until he can be trusted. It's why God made hands IMHO. The gifted child needs to learn to read faces, they need to learn things that to others may be common sense.

If his own Mom doesn't have a handle on it then it's not a good sign. Not worth the liability.
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Old 11-21-2011, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbo View Post
Is this the little guy who may also be intellectually gifted?

If so, read this:

http://www.stephanietolan.com/is_it_a_cheetah.htm

here is a great website for parents and educators of gifted children:

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/characteristics.htm

I know terminating will be tough. It may be easier for his parents to hear if you tell them you suspect he may be gifted. Young Bart Simpson may do better in a program designed for young Bart Simpsons, if such a thing exists in your community!


I had a child like him many years ago that I terminated. I really felt I could not meet his needs in my program. He is now 13, and once identified as gifted (by his school system), did much better.

Good luck to you in your search for a new client that is a better fit. Best wishes to this family who will hopefully find what their child needs.
It is that child. I will go read that. I asked his mom when I was putting him in his car seat friday if she had ever suspected that he is gifted. She said his dad is very intelligent. I will stick in there for a short time to see if I can fill spot because its so close to christmas and I can use the cash. Knowing its just until the first of the year will help though. I am gonna have to just be sure he is playing by himself all the time so he isn't hurting anyone else in the process. I hate it but I have to protect others and he has to know its not ok
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Old 11-21-2011, 12:08 PM
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I agree with Kaddidle....even if this child is "gifted" in some way, that does not excuse the behavior or mean that the provider is then expected to alter her services to his needs. If he doesn't fit in well with her program, which seems to be the case, it would be in the best interest of everyone that he move on to a situation that does fit. I agree with the link that not every child is perfectly situated to fit into traditional environments, like a classic school environment, but if a kid needs something else, it is the parent's responsibility to figure that out and find it for him. On a different note, I am sure we all know children that are not gifted in anyway, they are just regular kids that need structure and consistency to change their bad behavior. (I am not implying that that OP does not have structure or consistency....but the parents may be creating a little monster)
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Old 11-21-2011, 01:47 PM
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Oh, I wasn't saying that because he is gifted, he doesn't need to follow the rules, or can go around clobbering people!

There are some children who aren't a good mix for us. I personally, adore gifted school-agers, but have struggled with a few preschoolers over the years with the same label. They can be extremely sensitive, or extremely contrary. They can be "Bart Simpson", as I said earlier. They may potty train themselves at 18 months, read at 3, but also be aggressive and not "get" some things.

There are people with many types of abilities. There are people with special needs. I would say that we need to acknowledge that, but it does not excuse poor behavior. If a child is developmentally delayed, for example, we wouldn't say "hey, you are special, you can go around hitting everyone". But, we would understand that it is part of their condition, and maybe give a little consideration.

Another possibility is that he may have sensitivities. He might perceive light, sound, or touch much more than most of us do (sensory integration issues).

OP needs to decide if she has the interest, ability, and resources to deal with all this. It's ok if she doesnt! I don't know if I would! If not, then she needs to be honest, and use whatever resources she can find to get through until then. If she tell the parents what she sees, they may be able to find a better fit for him vs. him going through one dc after another for the next year-and-a-half.

Gosh, I didn't mean to give a speech, just trying to clarify!
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  #9  
Old 11-21-2011, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbo View Post
Oh, I wasn't saying that because he is gifted, he doesn't need to follow the rules, or can go around clobbering people!

There are some children who aren't a good mix for us. I personally, adore gifted school-agers, but have struggled with a few preschoolers over the years with the same label. They can be extremely sensitive, or extremely contrary. They can be "Bart Simpson", as I said earlier. They may potty train themselves at 18 months, read at 3, but also be aggressive and not "get" some things.

There are people with many types of abilities. There are people with special needs. I would say that we need to acknowledge that, but it does not excuse poor behavior. If a child is developmentally delayed, for example, we wouldn't say "hey, you are special, you can go around hitting everyone". But, we would understand that it is part of their condition, and maybe give a little consideration.

Another possibility is that he may have sensitivities. He might perceive light, sound, or touch much more than most of us do (sensory integration issues).

OP needs to decide if she has the interest, ability, and resources to deal with all this. It's ok if she doesnt! I don't know if I would! If not, then she needs to be honest, and use whatever resources she can find to get through until then. If she tell the parents what she sees, they may be able to find a better fit for him vs. him going through one dc after another for the next year-and-a-half.

Gosh, I didn't mean to give a speech, just trying to clarify!
I honestly just don't have the want to. Lol. I mean at one point in my life I would have but at this moment I just want a small group ok kids that are not demons. Lol. At first I would talk to mom about his behavior but found out it did nothing but go in one ear and out the other. I think a lot of his issue is parents allowing bad behavior. The other is I do think he is gifted and needs challenged more than I am willing to do. I hate to loose his infant sibling because he is precious but yeah I'm gonna have to terminate. If I can replace that's great and if not oh well. Today I told him to go to the potty. He protested because he doesn't like to go. Sent him in there he refused to go and stood in front of toilet and peed in his pants. He know better. He is smart very smart. I swear I think he just does stuff to pi** me off. Lol he really is potty trained and knows when he has to go. He just is defiant and was gonna win that fight. He will try to win at all cost
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:34 AM
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So this morning his mom came in to bring them. She always stays like 15 minutes ugh. Anyways she said it takes her 2 and a half hours to get him in bed at night. He gets up she spanks and puts him back. That goes on for that long. Then he finally goes to sleep wakes up and continues to come to her room and she spanks and puts him back until about 2 am when she is too exhausted to even do it anymore. I told her he spent a lot of time in time out yesterday. She said yeah he gets lots of spankings at home because he is pretty bad. She said he will do something bad and run to his time out spot. He honestly is not phased by any consequence. Whew this poor mom. Lol
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Old 11-22-2011, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mommiesherie View Post
So this morning his mom came in to bring them. She always stays like 15 minutes ugh. Anyways she said it takes her 2 and a half hours to get him in bed at night. He gets up she spanks and puts him back. That goes on for that long. Then he finally goes to sleep wakes up and continues to come to her room and she spanks and puts him back until about 2 am when she is too exhausted to even do it anymore. I told her he spent a lot of time in time out yesterday. She said yeah he gets lots of spankings at home because he is pretty bad. She said he will do something bad and run to his time out spot. He honestly is not phased by any consequence. Whew this poor mom. Lol
He does eventually end in her bed though right?
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:08 AM
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He does eventually end in her bed though right?

Yes he does. I almost said well then all the work you did before is out the window. Then I realized that it would do no good and I wasn't gonna waste my breath!!!!!!! Yes he tries to win at all cost even if it means repeated spankings. I refuse to let him win with me. Lol I am like not here mr. I am the boss and I will win this so don't even try. I can't imagine going through that exhausting event every night!!!!! Then to just give in to him!!! I'm not a spanker but I honestly think by this time he would be getting a spanking he would not soon forget!
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Old 11-22-2011, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by mommiesherie View Post
Yes he does. I almost said well then all the work you did before is out the window. Then I realized that it would do no good and I wasn't gonna waste my breath!!!!!!! Yes he tries to win at all cost even if it means repeated spankings. I refuse to let him win with me. Lol I am like not here mr. I am the boss and I will win this so don't even try. I can't imagine going through that exhausting event every night!!!!! Then to just give in to him!!! I'm not a spanker but I honestly think by this time he would be getting a spanking he would not soon forget!
It's a horrible method that will never work. It sets up a pyramid of high toxic energy that gets attached to bedtime.
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Old 11-22-2011, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by mommiesherie View Post
Yes he does. I almost said well then all the work you did before is out the window. Then I realized that it would do no good and I wasn't gonna waste my breath!!!!!!! Yes he tries to win at all cost even if it means repeated spankings. I refuse to let him win with me. Lol I am like not here mr. I am the boss and I will win this so don't even try. I can't imagine going through that exhausting event every night!!!!! Then to just give in to him!!! I'm not a spanker but I honestly think by this time he would be getting a spanking he would not soon forget!
We had family friends when I was young who had 3 children. Girl, boy 1, boy 2. Girl and boy one where compliant, got good grades, and generally did not challenge their parents. Boy 1, on the other hand, was a different animal. He was highly intelligent. As long as he could use this power for good, he did. He'd find jobs (at 12 he was helping roofers in the neighborhood), he'd go fishing for money at the laundrymat under the washers, (always found some, too), or whatever. If he was bored, he would break windows, or cause other sorts of mayhem.

His father (a college professor) handled all this with a belt. He literally tried to beat it out of him.

At 16, he stole a car. He went to jail for a little while. At 18, he joined to Army. He was dishonorably discharged. Now-a-days, he is a handsome, 47 yo man that can get walk out of any bar with a lady on his arm. But, he's also still just as likely to get into a fist fight about something stupid, and he often drinks until he pukes.

I guess my point is that beating it out of him did not work. I have no problem with the occasional swat on the rear as and exclamation point. But, if a child is being spanked on a daily basis, then SOMETHING IS NOT WORKING!

Mom (and caregivers) need to get this child evaluated, and FIND SOME TOOLS to work with him. Yes, the adults should be in charge. But, this boy needs something other than power struggles and punishment. There is a key there somewhere. It is his mom's job to find it!
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Old 11-22-2011, 12:12 PM
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We had family friends when I was young who had 3 children. Girl, boy 1, boy 2. Girl and boy one where compliant, got good grades, and generally did not challenge their parents. Boy 1, on the other hand, was a different animal. He was highly intelligent. As long as he could use this power for good, he did. He'd find jobs (at 12 he was helping roofers in the neighborhood), he'd go fishing for money at the laundrymat under the washers, (always found some, too), or whatever. If he was bored, he would break windows, or cause other sorts of mayhem.

His father (a college professor) handled all this with a belt. He literally tried to beat it out of him.

At 16, he stole a car. He went to jail for a little while. At 18, he joined to Army. He was dishonorably discharged. Now-a-days, he is a handsome, 47 yo man that can get walk out of any bar with a lady on his arm. But, he's also still just as likely to get into a fist fight about something stupid, and he often drinks until he pukes.

I guess my point is that beating it out of him did not work. I have no problem with the occasional swat on the rear as and exclamation point. But, if a child is being spanked on a daily basis, then SOMETHING IS NOT WORKING!

Mom (and caregivers) need to get this child evaluated, and FIND SOME TOOLS to work with him. Yes, the adults should be in charge. But, this boy needs something other than power struggles and punishment. There is a key there somewhere. It is his mom's job to find it!
Your story does sound so much like this child. I agree its NOT working!!! I am not a spanker but I think they are just at the point where they don't know what else to do. Yes he is being spanked more than once a day I'm sure. I think its too much also but honestly if her were mine I would wanna beat him! Lol. Today the 2 year old I keep pooped in potty so I went and got a sucker and said good job goin poop in my potty!!! So then I sent my difficult child to potty. He screamed and protested at first but then actually pooped in potty with no screaming at all!!! I was like omg wow. Before I have offered rewards to him. That didn't work. But when I gave it to the other child and didn't even mention it to him he just went to poop! Wow that was a break through!!!! He pooped and he didn't scream like he was being beaten. One tiny tiny little accomplishment!! Lol I am going to talk to mom about having him tested when its the right time.
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Old 11-22-2011, 01:05 PM
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Sometimes offering a reward is all in the way you say it.

We had a boy that if you told him "If you do this... you'll get a sticker". He would ignore you. If you told him "You'll get a sticker.. if you do this." he would do it. He was only hearing the first phrase and if it was something he didn't want to do he'd ignore the rest.

Experiment a little and see if that helps.

Positive reinforcement does work. There were times when I spanked my own as well because it was the punishment my parents chose and you tend to fall back on the past.

With my oldest, we would take away priveleges. But then it got to the point where I had nothing left to take away. So we changed it up a bit. He would have to earn TV/Video time and I made little TV tickets for him.

It's all trial and error. Do what works for you. If you see progress, then tell Mom.
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Old 11-22-2011, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaddidle Care View Post
Sometimes offering a reward is all in the way you say it.
Ha ha, this reminded me of my own DS when he was about 3-4 yrs old.

If we went to a store and I knew there was a possibility of mis-behavior, I would tell my DD that she could have a $1 at the check out and she could either keep it or spend it on a treat (a treat for us back then was a Little Golden book..NO candy). Anyways, my DD understood and complied every time.

Then when my son came along and he couldn't have cared less about the "promise" of reward. So one day, I decided to approach the idea a bit differently. I gave him 4 quarters when we entered the store and told him that everytime I had to reprimand him, he would need ot give me one of his quarters. If he had any quarters left at the check out he could buy a treat or save the money.

Shopping became a whole new thing because he totally got it and complied!!!!!

I 100% agree that rewards do work at times and how you deliver the reward or go about it makes all the difference.

My dd understood, "do=get" while my son understood "have=take away". Either way, I still got the desired outcome.
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