10-Day Probationary Period????

[Little Star75]

hi everyone! most of you remember the thread about dcp with 2 dcg that I decided to terminate during our 10-day probationary period? Well.... when I terminated her i told her on the e-mail explaining the whole thing and that I would only care until Friday which was last Friday the 17. When DCP picked up the dcg on Wednesday we talked about the emial and she agreed that Friday would be the girls last day.
On Thursday I leave my house at 3:30pm to pick up the girls and at 3:36pm she sent a text from parent (I didnt read it until 3:45pm I was driving) saying "Do not pick up the girls. yesterday was your last day. I spoke to my worker and told her that yesterday was your last day not today" I replied back when I was already at the school waiting for the girls "Oh I wished you would of text me earlier I'm already here but ok."

I left it at that but I was and tried calling the worker since last Thursday and still no answer.

My question here, can dcp terminate services 20 min before Im scheduled to pick up the girls? My contract reads as followed: "The first 10-days are probationary period for the provider, parent, and child. This agreement may be terminated at any time during this period"

Should I changed it to something else? Cause apparently the dcp is viewing it as "any time during the day" and not "by the day"

Another issue here is that dcp signed a contract where I specifically wrote down that any portion not paid by the agency parent is responsible. SHe stopped by today to signed the time sheets and tried arguing about the 10-day, that she right and that I wont get paid blah, blah also mentioned for the 100th time that she studying law and if I wanted to take this to court I will lose I am like really?? I agree but you don't terminate 20 minutes before. Per our conversation it sounded like she already knew she was going to terminate services Thursday which I would of agreed per my contract but only if she would of notified me earlier during the day.

I need some advice please

Thank you

[wdmmom]

I don't take state paid clients but if you have it in your contract that either party can terminate at any time within the ten day probationary period, than what she did is legal. She isn't required to give you any type of notice and while it would make more sense to tell you the day before rather than the day of, she can still terminate whenever she chooses.

In the future, require all terminations be in writing and have the last day of care documented in the notice. That way there is no question. If a family agrees to stay with you until the 31st and leaves the 24th, they owe you through the end of the agreement.

[Hunni Bee]

I don't quite understand. If you terminated them by email earlier in the week, then you terminated. She was already terminated, she just decided not to bring them the last two days. Technically, during a probationary period, either party can terminate at any time without notice, right? It was just stinky that she wasn't truthful when agreeing to a last day, and decided to wait til the last minute to tell you.


And I don't get why she is arguing about the time sheets. Does your contract have parents paying by the day or for the spot? Her kids were still taking up a spot on Thursday and Friday, regardless to whether she brought them or not.

As for the 20 minute heads up, it was rude but it doesn't sound like it really affects anything. She was already terminated and she's still liable for whatever time her kids were enrolled.

[Little Star75]

Originally Posted by Hunni Bee

I don't quite understand. If you terminated them by email earlier in the week, then you terminated. She was already terminated, she just decided not to bring them the last two days. Technically, during a probationary period, either party can terminate at any time without notice, right? It was just stinky that she wasn't truthful when agreeing to a last day, and decided to wait til the last minute to tell you.


And I don't get why she is arguing about the time sheets. Does your contract have parents paying by the day or for the spot? Her kids were still taking up a spot on Thursday and Friday, regardless to whether she brought them or not.

As for the 20 minute heads up, it was rude but it doesn't sound like it really affects anything. She was already terminated and she's still liable for whatever time her kids were enrolled.

I charge regardless of attendance and she's very aware of that. She will have a bill coming from me by the end of next month. I get paid through this agency on the 20th of every month for the following month after care was provided. My thing here is, she had already agreed that Friday was going to be their last day but because she was upset she decides to terminate "me" on Thursday the 16th notifying me at 3:36pm when I was already at the school picking them up.
Is this even legal?

[Little Star75]

Originally Posted by wdmmom

I don't take state paid clients but if you have it in your contract that either party can terminate at any time within the ten day probationary period, than what she did is legal. She isn't required to give you any type of notice and while it would make more sense to tell you the day before rather than the day of, she can still terminate whenever she chooses.

In the future, require all terminations be in writing and have the last day of care documented in the notice. That way there is no question. If a family agrees to stay with you until the 31st and leaves the 24th, they owe you through the end of the agreement.

I had already terminated her and dcg last day was scheduled for Friday the 17th.

[wdmmom]

Originally Posted by Little Star75

I had already terminated her and dcg last day was scheduled for Friday the 17th.

Once notice is given, you agree to watch until a specified date but they don't have to stay til then.

Do you charge regardless of attendance? If so, I would tell her she is liable for Thursday and Friday but good luck collecting on that.

I know Iowa pays up to 4 days per month even if the kids aren't in attendance. I would check with your state's rules when it comes to absences and payments.

In the future when terminating, I would require families to pay in advance to the last date of care. If they are state paid clients, I would have then sign something stating that they assume financial liability in the event the state refuses payment or cuts you short for whatever reason.

[Hunni Bee]

Originally Posted by Little Star75

I charge regardless of attendance and she's very aware of that. She will have a bill coming from me by the end of next month. I get paid through this agency on the 20th of every month for the following month after care was provided. My thing here is, she had already agreed that Friday was going to be their last day but because she was upset she decides to terminate "me" on Thursday the 16th notifying me at 3:36pm when I was already at the school picking them up.
Is this even legal?

Its legal, because it didn't mean anything. It was just something she was trying to do to hurt you. Once you termed her, she couldn't then term you back. Once you term a parent, they can agree to keep the kids there through the notice period, and turn and walk away and never come back, and its legal. The only thing they have to do is pay you based on what your contract says. That's your real issue with her...but like wdmmom said, it'll be a long shot in collecting, especially since she's state pay. I would just accept whatever the state gives you, cut your losses and move on. People are childish.

[Little Star75]

Originally Posted by Hunni Bee

Its legal, because it didn't mean anything. It was just something she was trying to do to hurt you. Once you termed her, she couldn't then term you back. Once you term a parent, they can agree to keep the kids there through the notice period, and turn and walk away and never come back, and its legal. The only thing they have to do is pay you based on what your contract says. That's your real issue with her...but like wdmmom said, it'll be a long shot in collecting, especially since she's state pay. I would just accept whatever the state gives you, cut your losses and move on. People are childish.

Well I'm planning on billing her whatever state doesn't pay, it's in my contract and signed by her. I really can't just let it go. If I do this with every family then I will be losing a lot of money. I already let go 2 parents and both decided not to pay me so I let go but I will not keep doing it. It's hard right now since I don't have families but one Kwim

[Little Star75]

What do you all think?

I would from now on, when taking parents on state subsidy:

Make a contract that they sign and initial in each paragraph that they agree that ANY amount the state does not pay for, to include absences, are to be paid by the parent

This amount is (whatever your amounts are).

This amount is DUE IN ADVANCE to care beginning (this way you're always paid up through the Friday of each week). This payment is NON REFUNDABLE even if parents choose not to bring their child through the final date of the termination period. NEVER take payments in arrears or you're asking for trouble. I would cut your losses this time, but learn form your mistakes.

Example: State pays you $20 per day. Your normal rates are $30 per day. The children are scheduled for 5 days each week. You charge $50 per week over and above state rates. The $50 per week is due each week on MONDAY for the WHOLE week (or you can do 2 weeks at a time for $100 or even the full $200 monthly in advance). This is step one. Now, to further complicate things. DCM/DCD decides that 2 of the days they're not bringing the child. The state does not pay for absences (our state does not), therefore, because they called off you could be out of money. No. This won't work. You make them sign something that explains how their child absence will work. Example: They miss the 2 days @ $20 each. That's $40 bucks they owe you prior to next day's drop off. This is not in place of the normal $50 they pay out of pocket, but in addition to.This kind of contract will help deter parents from acting foolish and sometimes, even weed out those who have ill intentions so that you don't take someone who won't pay you.

Lastly, state: "This amount, if not paid, will be reported to the state immediately and termination of care will be enforced immediately, until payments are caught up in full".

Something to this effect. I mean no disrespect, but a lot of people who are on state aid have an "entitlement complex" where they think that they can do no wrong and you (and everyone else) "owe" them something. A LOT of them do not want to pay you, don't take you seriously but they will get tattoos, new cars, new nails, etc. I lived it and decided state clients weren't worth all that I had to go through.

[Crystal]

Originally Posted by Little Star75

What do you all think?

I think I would let it go. I'd be upset, but I don't think, given the verbiage in your contract, that this is something you would win.

Maybe post under the taxes forum and ask Tom Copeland for his opinion....he's an attorney.

[Little Star75]

Originally Posted by Crystal

I think I would let it go. I'd be upset, but I don't think, given the verbiage in your contract, that this is something you would win.

Maybe post under the taxes forum and ask Tom Copeland for his opinion....he's an attorney.

I'm not planning to take it to court but I will sure send it to collections

[Little Star75]

Originally Posted by 502

I would from now on, when taking parents on state subsidy:

Make a contract that they sign and initial in each paragraph that they agree that ANY amount the state does not pay for, to include absences, are to be paid by the parent

This amount is (whatever your amounts are).

This amount is DUE IN ADVANCE to care beginning (this way you're always paid up through the Friday of each week). This payment is NON REFUNDABLE even if parents choose not to bring their child through the final date of the termination period. NEVER take payments in arrears or you're asking for trouble. I would cut your losses this time, but learn form your mistakes.

Example: State pays you $20 per day. Your normal rates are $30 per day. The children are scheduled for 5 days each week. You charge $50 per week over and above state rates. The $50 per week is due each week on MONDAY for the WHOLE week (or you can do 2 weeks at a time for $100 or even the full $200 monthly in advance). This is step one. Now, to further complicate things. DCM/DCD decides that 2 of the days they're not bringing the child. The state does not pay for absences (our state does not), therefore, because they called off you could be out of money. No. This won't work. You make them sign something that explains how their child absence will work. Example: They miss the 2 days @ $20 each. That's $40 bucks they owe you prior to next day's drop off. This is not in place of the normal $50 they pay out of pocket, but in addition to.This kind of contract will help deter parents from acting foolish and sometimes, even weed out those who have ill intentions so that you don't take someone who won't pay you.

Lastly, state: "This amount, if not paid, will be reported to the state immediately and termination of care will be enforced immediately, until payments are caught up in full".

Something to this effect. I mean no disrespect, but a lot of people who are on state aid have an "entitlement complex" where they think that they can do no wrong and you (and everyone else) "owe" them something. A LOT of them do not want to pay you, don't take you seriously but they will get tattoos, new cars, new nails, etc. I lived it and decided state clients weren't worth all that I had to go through.

Good points Crystal.... I agree with you this parent thinks she knows it all and told me in 2 different occasions that she takes advantage of the program by taking her dcg to daycare when they aren't allowed to that somehow she works something out with the provider, always talking how she's studying law, talks about how good she lives, she's on Housing section 8 and rents her rooms to make money, she's driving a BMW plus she has this other brand new car, has an iPhone, has a $4k LV purse, always dressed nice, you name it . This is why I'm so angry but I haven't sent her an email. I'm unsure how to word it. I would like to tell her that after reviewing the time sheets I noticed she left Thursday May 9 blank if she want to use a vacation day so I won't have to bill her.